(2019) 16" is HOT & NOISY with an external monitor! :(

[interbear]

Curious what configs you have since you have 2 of them and if you see differences between them?
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5k to 1k way more than I've seen. Can you share your iStats page? Also your 16 configuration?

Hi there. Not sure how your first quote is attributed to me, I definitely don’t have 2 16 inch MBPs and didn’t post that comment. Looking at the thread I think you meant to quote @hirondelle

On the second question, I don’t use iStats. Is it a 3rd party app? The changes I made were:

1. Reset the SMC as per Apple instructions.
2. Disabled turbo boost using Turbo Switcher Pro.
3. I switched my usb-c cable powering the MBP to one of the ports on the right hand side. I read a few articles saying that using the left hand side ports to power the MBP can cause fans to run high for some bizarre reason.
4. Full shut down and restart.

Everything else the same as usual in terms of app usage. Lid open connected to the monitor. And the experience all day yesterday was much, much better in terms of heat / fan noise.

My config is MBP 16 inch - 2.3GHz i9, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD, AMD Radeon Pro 5500M 4GB

Today I’ll enable turbo boost and see what happens.

 

[Grammar1]

The 16" MBP is not far behind in performance to the 5k iMac my wife works on (which can sustain 4GHz all day long running Cinebench and Luxmark on loop... the MBP can sustain 3.3GHz), is basically silent (with the eGPU), with Touch ID (which I love and don't want to give up, hence no clamshell) and TouchBar (which I like, but could survive without), is portable with a huge usable internal display, and is a comfortable size to carry and use on the couch.

Can you give me an external gpu recommendation for my razer?

I need to run 2x4k displays, music production, no gaming! If I go for the 5500xt do I need the 8gb or will the 4gb do??

Cheers

 

[Grammar1]

@mrmachine79 also, how were you able to upgrade the psu fan in the chroma without soldering??

M

 

[interbear]

So I enabled Turbo Boost today. Was running fine for 90 minutes until I got on a couple of Microsoft Teams calls. Woosh....fans up over 5k, noisy and temperature up to 96°C

Disabled turbo boost and everything calmed down. 30 minutes later and fans now running quietly at 2.7k and temp is 65°C. Both decreasing.

Bit ridiculous that this is necessary though.

 

[hungryghosty]

Given Windows/Android and even Apple's own IOS all have switchable battery saver/low power modes by default I have no idea why MacOS doesn't especially when probably over 90% of devices running it are portable laptops with batteries?

I must try the same test in Windows boot camp with battery saver mode enabled to see how long the battery lasts! I wonder whether it would outlast MacOS?

 

[YYD20]

So I enabled Turbo Boost today. Was running fine for 90 minutes until I got on a couple of Microsoft Teams calls. Woosh....fans up over 5k, noisy and temperature up to 96°C

Disabled turbo boost and everything calmed down. 30 minutes later and fans now running quietly at 2.7k and temp is 65°C. Both decreasing.

Bit ridiculous that this is necessary though.

Agreed, I am seeing the same results here. The machine is doing its job by removing as much heat from the processor and GPU as possible, which is why we are seeing high fan speeds at those temps.

Could this be an issue with Turbo Boost on the i9s?

Relevant Apple Stack Exchange https://apple.stackexchange.com/que...ees-hotter-when-plugged-in-on-idle-is-this-no

 

[HarryPot]

Agreed, I am seeing the same results here. The machine is doing its job by removing as much heat from the processor and GPU as possible, which is why we are seeing high fan speeds at those temps.

Could this be an issue with Turbo Boost on the i9s?

Relevant Apple Stack Exchange https://apple.stackexchange.com/que...ees-hotter-when-plugged-in-on-idle-is-this-no

96C do seems quite high.
I've been playing CPU intensive game, fans going crazy, turbo boost enabled, and temps rarely go beyond 70C. Normally stay below 65C.

I have the i7, 5300M.

 

[YYD20]

96C do seems quite high.
I've been playing CPU intensive game, fans going crazy, turbo boost enabled, and temps rarely go beyond 70C. Normally stay below 65C.

I have the i7, 5300M.

My CPU hasn't reached 96C like @interbear. My highest temp over the past week is 81C with TurboBoost enabled, where the average operating temp is ~70C with TurboBoost disabled. @interbear and I are both running i9's with the 5500M, compared to the i7 and 5300M you are running. My guess is the CPU is gets hot from when TurboBoost is activated, and and the fans kick in to remove as much heat to not sacrifice performance, which is why Apple Support is saying this is "by design". It seems the "hot and noisy" issue is noticeably more present in the i9 configurations.

So is this an i9 TurboBoost issue, a 5500M GPU driver issue, both, or neither?

Not sure if this will help anyone, but I came across this thread on the Apple Discussion site regarding High WindowServer CPU usage in Catalina: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251272591

 

[HarryPot]

So is this an i9 TurboBoost issue, a 5500M GPU driver issue, both, or neither?

Not sure if this will help anyone, but I came across this thread on the Apple Discussion site regarding High WindowServer CPU usage in Catalina: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251272591

What is the ambient temp in the room you are?
My idle temp is 50-55C when in a hot room. Below 45C when in a cool room.

 

[YYD20]

What is the ambient temp in the room you are?
My idle temp is 50-55C when in a hot room. Below 45C when in a cool room.

73F, normal air conditioned room

 

[HarryPot]

73F, normal air conditioned room

Definitely not hot.
Either the i9 and 5500M are way hotter and the MBP can't handle it, or something else is wrong.

 

[jagooch]

Disconnecting the eGPU takes a few seconds, and can be annoying if you configured all your apps to use the eGPU. But most of my apps still use the iGPU and/or dGPU. I only configure Unity explicitly to run on the eGPU, and macOS sometimes decides to run other apps on the eGPU (mainly "helper" processes).

If you often have unfinished graphics work at the end of the day running on the eGPU, and you normally just shut the lid and go, and then the next day plug in and resume right where you left off, it would be annoying.

I often unplug at the end of the day and take the computer from my desk to the couch to keep working. I'm not always working in Unity, but if I am it's not a big deal to quit. I still think even with the quirks, this is as good as it's going to get with the 16" MBP, and that's still my pick vs 13" MBP or Mac Mini or iMac.

The 16" MBP is not far behind in performance to the 5k iMac my wife works on (which can sustain 4GHz all day long running Cinebench and Luxmark on loop... the MBP can sustain 3.3GHz), is basically silent (with the eGPU), with Touch ID (which I love and don't want to give up, hence no clamshell) and TouchBar (which I like, but could survive without), is portable with a huge usable internal display, and is a comfortable size to carry and use on the couch.

I still have my old Dell monitors, and I tested the my Macbook Pro temperatures and GPU power usage with them connected to the eGPU (dual DisplayPort ) and the Razer Core X eGPU enclosure connected to my Macbook Pro via TB3.

I was impressed that:
* With 2 external displays connected , GPU( RX 5700 XT ) power stayed at ~ 2W and the fans stayed under 2k rpm.
* With 2 external displays and the built-in display connected , GPU( RX 5700 XT ) power stayed at ~ 4W and the fans stayed under 2k rpm.
* Without the GPU, GPU (Radeon 5500M) power draw is 18-22W. The 2 cooling fans go to max rpms. with is around ~5400 rpm for the left fan, and I don't remember the right fan speed. It's hard to hear anything over the fans.


I'd love to do the same test with the Blackmagic eGPU since I have 2 24" LG Ultrafine 4K displays. While I would get a much less powerful GPU for the money, I would keep the convenience of controller brightness, volume, and use of USB-C ports.

Unfortunately, it's on backorder with Apple with estimated of mid-August. There are a few on eBay but they tend to go for $1100 .

Anyway, using an eGPU is a work around to the heating problem, as long as the displays are connected to the eGPU.

 

[jaduffy007]

View attachment 921785
My CPU hasn't reached 96C like @interbear. My highest temp over the past week is 81C with TurboBoost enabled, where the average operating temp is ~70C with TurboBoost disabled. @interbear and I are both running i9's with the 5500M, compared to the i7 and 5300M you are running. My guess is the CPU is gets hot from when TurboBoost is activated, and and the fans kick in to remove as much heat to not sacrifice performance, which is why Apple Support is saying this is "by design". It seems the "hot and noisy" issue is noticeably more present in the i9 configurations.

So is this an i9 TurboBoost issue, a 5500M GPU driver issue, both, or neither?

Not sure if this will help anyone, but I came across this thread on the Apple Discussion site regarding High WindowServer CPU usage in Catalina: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/251272591

Indeed..reading recent posts here, I'm left wondering if "this an i9 TurboBoost issue, a 5500M GPU driver issue, both, or neither?" I'll have a new eGPU in 10 days, which should shed some light on this.
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I still have my old Dell monitors, and I tested the my Macbook Pro temperatures and GPU power usage with them connected to the eGPU (dual DisplayPort ) and the Razer Core X eGPU enclosure connected to my Macbook Pro via TB3.

I was impressed that:
* With 2 external displays connected , GPU( RX 5700 XT ) power stayed at ~ 2W and the fans stayed under 2k rpm.
* With 2 external displays and the built-in display connected , GPU( RX 5700 XT ) power stayed at ~ 4W and the fans stayed under 2k rpm.
* Without the GPU, GPU (Radeon 5500M) power draw is 18-22W. The 2 cooling fans go to max rpms. with is around ~5400 rpm for the left fan, and I don't remember the right fan speed. It's hard to hear anything over the fans.


I'd love to do the same test with the Blackmagic eGPU since I have 2 24" LG Ultrafine 4K displays. While I would get a much less powerful GPU for the money, I would keep the convenience of controller brightness, volume, and use of USB-C ports.

Unfortunately, it's on backorder with Apple with estimated of mid-August. There are a few on eBay but they tend to go for $1100 .

Anyway, using an eGPU is a work around to the heating problem, as long as the displays are connected to the eGPU.

You're giving me hope with those numbers. I ordered a 5700XT / Razor Core X Chroma...arrives June 14th.

 

[lukelol]

Got my eGPU setup!
Razor Core X Chroma + ASRock AMD Radeon VII + MSI Prestige PS341WU
GPU rail now drawing 5 - 6.5 Watts (it seems with an eGPU, the onboard GPU is enabled by default?)
Fan speed < 1900 RPM
Fans on the eGPU are spinning but very quiet.
Nice to have just one cable for power + monitor.
Talked myself into a high-end GPU with the expectation I'd learn some Machine Learning + some light gaming.

Only just set it all up, but so far I'm quite happy to have my mac back to idle.
P.S. How much has "Temp Monitor" / VIMI Studios made off users of this thread?

 

[Dhock_Holiday]

Got my eGPU setup!
Razor Core X Chroma + ASRock AMD Radeon VII + MSI Prestige PS341WU
GPU rail now drawing 5 - 6.5 Watts (it seems with an eGPU, the onboard GPU is enabled by default?)
Fan speed < 1900 RPM
Fans on the eGPU are spinning but very quiet.
Nice to have just one cable for power + monitor.
Talked myself into a high-end GPU with the expectation I'd learn some Machine Learning + some light gaming.

Only just set it all up, but so far I'm quite happy to have my mac back to idle.
P.S. How much has "Temp Monitor" / VIMI Studios made off users of this thread?

If you run the Macbook in clamshell mode is the iGPU disabled?

 

[lukelol]

If you run the Macbook in clamshell mode is the iGPU disabled?

Hmm... Oddly, I'm seeing 2 to 5 watts of usage on the GPU rail in clamshell mode (with the monitor connected to the [external] eGPU)
Using gfxCardStatus to attempt to force the discrete graphics card off (integrated graphics + eGPU only) results in the message "You can't switch to Integrated Only while the following items are running: External Display, displaypolicyd"

I suspect the discrete graphics card is in-use for communication with the eGPU?

 

[mrmachine79]

Hmm... Oddly, I'm seeing 2 to 5 watts of usage on the GPU rail in clamshell mode (with the monitor connected to the [external] eGPU)
Using gfxCardStatus to attempt to force the discrete graphics card off (integrated graphics + eGPU only) results in the message "You can't switch to Integrated Only while the following items are running: External Display, displaypolicyd"

I suspect the discrete graphics card is in-use for communication with the eGPU?

I've not found a way to completely and totally disable the dGPU even when the eGPU is connected. But its generally just used for windowserver and draws 0-6W unless you run a GPU intensive app on it.

I let macOS decide which GPU to run all apps on and I leave my internal display set as the primary display. Apps will launch on the GPU(s) connected to the primary display by default, and I want most apps to run on the iGPU or dGPU to avoid having to quit them when disconnecting the eGPU.

I only explicitly set GPU intensive apps (like Unity) to use the eGPU to keep the internal heat and power use down.

I've found that the gSwitch app is better than gfxCardStatus. It's basically the same thing but gives better info about greedy and hungry (for GPU) apps, and auto switching works a bit better.

But I find that even when the display is connected via eGPU, neither of these apps will disable the dGPU. Both of these apps will revert back to auto switching when any display is connected.

You don't actually need these apps, though. If you NEVER want to use the dGPU, run "sudo pmset -a gpuswitch 0" in terminal. This will disable the dGPU, even when an external display is directly connected (you will just get a blank screen). You can revert to default with "sudo pmset -a gpuswitch 2".

However, I've found that performance was degraded by running everything on the iGPU, and this also tells me that a 13" with only iGPU and half the CPU cores would not be better for me.

With dGPU disabled I could avoid excessive iGPU use by setting the external display via eGPU as primary to launch all apps on eGPU, but then it's annoying to disconnect and quit all those apps, and you have to relaunch after reconnecting as well, and all your apps get moved to the other window on connect.

So all that is why I believe having the eGPU to avoid excess power draw and keep internal temps low and available power for the CPU high, but only actually using the eGPU sparingly when needed for GPU intensive apps, and otherwise allowing macOS to run apps on iGPU and dGPU as it sees fit, is the best setup and minimises the annoyances when connecting and disconnecting the eGPU.
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I'd love to do the same test with the Blackmagic eGPU since I have 2 24" LG Ultrafine 4K displays. While I would get a much less powerful GPU for the money, I would keep the convenience of controller brightness, volume, and use of USB-C ports.

You can control brightness on some external displays with the app brisync. Not sure about volume, I just use the internal speakers which are great. The Razer Core X Chroma also has USB-A ports. But I believe the Blackmagic is the only eGPU that can drive a TB3 display. And it is reported to be inaudible (18dB) unless you put your ear right next to it. And it's not upgradeable. But since I don't actually need GPU performance, and just have an eGPU to work around the excessive power draw, the Blackmagic would be the best option even if technically a downgrade.

 

[mrmachine79]

Can you give me an external gpu recommendation for my razer?

I need to run 2x4k displays, music production, no gaming! If I go for the 5500xt do I need the 8gb or will the 4gb do??

I'm no GPU expert. I can only speak to why I chose the card I chose, the Sapphire Pulse RX 5500 XT and the Razer Core X Chroma:

- Current generation architecture and 7nm process for compatibility, support, power consumption and heat generation.
- Reviews said it was quiet at idle (fans off) and under load (<=40dB).
- Comparable performance level to the internal dGPU.
- 100W power delivery (the 16" MBP has a 94W power supply and most other eGPUs and monitors provide max 87W).
- 4x USB-A ports.

I don't know for sure, but I don't think 8GB is necessary just to drive the displays. But if you're gaming or doing other graphics work, 8GB might help. I don't actually need GPU performance, so even a downgrade to 580X in the Blackmagic would have been fine. And the Blackmagic would have been even better, if it had been available and similarly priced because:

- Supports TB3 displays or daisy chain other TB3 devices.
- Practically silent.

If you actually need improved GPU performance for some specific GPU intensive apps or gaming, then just get whatever compatible card has the level of performance you need and stick it in the Core X. I think even the biggest cards should fit inside.
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@mrmachine79 also, how were you able to upgrade the psu fan in the chroma without soldering??

M

Here's an earlier post where I described how I wired it up without soldering: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...r.2211747/page-68?post=28510030#post-28510030

 

[Grammar1]

I don't know for sure, but I don't think 8GB is necessary just to drive the displays. But if you're gaming or doing other graphics work, 8GB might help. I don't actually need GPU performance, so even a downgrade to 580X in the Blackmagic would have been fine. And the Blackmagic would have been even better, if it had been available and similarly priced because:

- Supports TB3 displays or daisy chain other TB3 devices.
- Practically silent.

Thanks that makes sense.

My Chroma just arrived but I'm thinking of sending it back and trying to source a blackmagic since like you I don't need the gpu performance. If the 85w power delivery turns out to be enough it'll be a truly one cable solution. Shame they're impossible to get hold of now as the price is basically the same.

Edit - Just realised the base Blackmagic egpu only has a single HDMI port.. expensive to add a second thunderbolt display that can daisychain my thunderbolt audio interface to. Jesus it never ends

 

[limo79]

I have a lot your respect to all your findings but do you really think that you can decrease power / current draw demand for AMD GPU chip by mumbo jumbo software tricks? You want to reduce GPU power from almost 20W to 6W level? Really? This is possibly FAD (functions as designed) and that is why Apple cannot and it will not fix it. They can possibly modify GPU BIOS to cut GPU/mem frequencies but this is not effective at all all. Only way is to cut GPU blocks but possibly GPU is not so configurable or you need a different hardware revision of GPU where part of GPU is blocked using pullup/down resistors. They will not disable TurboBoost because they need to have a good results in tests and benchmars (marketing). Not after a performance problems of 2019 MBP 15". So do not want to ruin your hope but Apple maybe address this issue in next MBP edition but it is not an easy task possibly due to ancient OSX core architecture (this OS is modern only in theory) that need a total core software revoluton or serious hardware design change. Keep in mind that Apple possibly like Dell does not limit TDP CPU performance so it is limited mainly by heatsink ability to dissipate heat. They will not limit TDP like in LG Gram ultrabook with Intel 10th Ice Lake G7 CPU where to avoid thermal and noise issues performance was cut almost half even below Intel 620 HD level (btw which is not make a sense to use Ice Lake but helps to reduce complaints about heat and noise from the customers).

If you want to have several devices on your desk it is much better to have a simple setup like iMac (but it is horribly slow due to one of the worst OSX release called Catalina). Yeah it is not mobile but having zillions of boxes, cables and switches it is totally what we want to avoid when we buy Apple products. Also using different custom switching tools that are not in OSX is boring in my opinion. It is totally against simplicity and ease of use. Even if you love Macs when you want to handle problems use software tricks it is much better and efficient to buy some Windows 10 laptop when you have an ability to modify a lot of driver and firmware settings. In OSX it is seriously reduced so it is like hitting a rock.

What I suggest is to compare this wattage results with some Windows 10 laptops with comparable GPU from AMD / NVIDIA. If GPU power demand is similar plugging the same amount of monitors and res we can eliminate GPU hardware / firmware implementation problem and possibly OS. I wonder what are the results in latest Razer or Lenovo Extreme Gen 2 but Dell XPS is possibly much more close to Apple due to CPU perf strategy. If the result will be close to 18-20W on XPS then we need to focus on heatsink mass (weight and size). In Apple laptops heatsink with heatpipe has low mass so this is a probably a reason of your problems since it transfers heat quickly. Less mass = more airflow (fan speed ) we need to recompensate low heatsink mass effect. Possibly it is ideal for short burst CPU/GPU spikes (high current draw in short moment) but not for a longer load time.

 

[Syther101]

So I've been following this thread for a while. You can check my history for my previous updates but in short I had a Dell monitor, experienced the high wattage issue. As already discussed I think this is a limitation of the AMD GPU architecture. I then got a new "compatible" monitor. Managed to reduce wattage, but a new lagging issue was introduced.

I have just managed to solve the laggy UI on the new Asus monitor with the most bizarre of fixes. Which make it look very much like a driver issue causing the lag. It might also explain why some users are feeling lag in Chrome / Safari, as I too was experiencing this, but it also resolved by the trick demonstrated.

I have documented the issue and resolution in the video below. If you do watch, I advise watching in HD if possible as it's hard to see the difference in scrolling. But I can assure it's there. I'll be trying to capture a better screen recording on the lag later tonight, which I'll be submitting to Apple as a bug report.

 

[jagooch]

If you want to have several devices on your desk it is much better to have a simple setup like iMac (but it is horribly slow due to one of the worst OSX release called Catalina). Yeah it is not mobile but having zillions of boxes, cables and switches it is totally what we want to avoid when we buy Apple products. Also using different custom switching tools that are not in OSX is boring in my opinion. It is totally against simplicity and ease of use. Even if you love Macs when you want to handle problems use software tricks it is much better and efficient to buy some Windows 10 laptop when you have an ability to modify a lot of driver and firmware settings. In OSX it is seriously reduced so it is like hitting a rock.

It depends on the user's needs. For me, I switch out computers at my workstation. I have a personal laptop and work laptop (employer owned ) that share the displays, speakers, ethernet, etc . The way it works is when I start work , I unplug the thunderbolt dock from my personal Macbook Pro , and plug it into my employer's Macbook Pro. I has have to press switch my BT mouse/keyboard as well, but I have Logitech peripheral that can switch between 3 computers with some button presses.

I also plug my gaming PC into the workstation on occasion, but usually that stays in the living room.

I can't switch between computers with an iMac. The display hardwired to the iMac and cannot be connected to another computer.

What I suggest is to compare this wattage results with some Windows 10 laptops with comparable GPU from AMD / NVIDIA. If GPU power demand is similar plugging the same amount of monitors and res we can eliminate GPU hardware / firmware implementation problem and possibly OS. I wonder what are the results in latest Razer or Lenovo Extreme Gen 2 but Dell XPS is possibly much more close to Apple due to CPU perf strategy. If the result will be close to 18-20W on XPS then we need to focus on heatsink mass (weight and size). In Apple laptops heatsink with heatpipe has low mass so this is a probably a reason of your problems since it transfers heat quickly. Less mass = more airflow (fan speed ) we need to recompensate low heatsink mass effect. Possibly it is ideal for short burst CPU/GPU spikes (high current draw in short moment) but not for a longer load time.

No need for a Windows computer since I have multiple Macbook Pro's. My 2017 Macbook Pro with a Radeon GPU ( I forget the model ) draws 5W power when connected to dual displays, vs my 2019 Macbook Pro that draws 20W.

The issue is definitely specific to my 2019 Macbook Pro. I've also connected my Mac Mini to the same displays with very low GPU power draw, but it doesn't have a Radeon GPU build in, only the Intel graphics chip.

So I've been following this thread for a while. You can check my history for my previous updates but in short I had a Dell monitor, experienced the high wattage issue. As already discussed I think this is a limitation of the AMD GPU architecture. I then got a new "compatible" monitor. Managed to reduce wattage, but a new lagging issue was introduced.

I have just managed to solve the laggy UI on the new Asus monitor with the most bizarre of fixes. Which make it look very much like a driver issue causing the lag. It might also explain why some users are feeling lag in Chrome / Safari, as I too was experiencing this, but it also resolved by the trick demonstrated.

I have documented the issue and resolution in the video below. If you do watch, I advise watching in HD if possible as it's hard to see the difference in scrolling. But I can assure it's there. I'll be trying to capture a better screen recording on the lag later tonight, which I'll be submitting to Apple as a bug report.

See above, in my tests , using a different AMD GPU , but still AMD, had a much lower power draw and the Macbook Pro didn't overheat.

 

[ateslik]

I spent a wonderful two and a half hours on the phone with Apple support yesterday. The rep advised me to take it in to the store so they could physically "remove the driver hardware and put in a new one". I explained to her that a driver is software written for the kernel to communicate with the hardware device and that there was nothing physical to fix. Sweet jeebus.

She asked me to run diagnostic on boot (hold D) and of course that didn't reveal any problem. She said it was because I was using third party hardware and they couldn't support that. (??) Then she wanted me to run in recovery mode (cmd+R) because she wanted to check the disks (???). Recovery mode wanted to change my AppleID password. Hell no. At that point I said I was done and ended the call.

I'm going to exchange this for the new 13" that people have reported doesn't have these issues. I'm done.

 

[limo79]

My 2017 Macbook Pro with a Radeon GPU ( I forget the model ) draws 5W power when connected to dual displays, vs my 2019 Macbook Pro that draws 20W.

The issue is definitely specific to my 2019 Macbook Pro. I've also connected my Mac Mini to the same displays with very low GPU power draw, but it doesn't have a Radeon GPU build in, only the Intel graphics chip.

See above, in my tests , using a different AMD GPU , but still AMD, had a much lower power draw and the Macbook Pro didn't overheat.

You do not have a problem on old MBP 2017 since it has approx. 35W TDP GPU (AMD Radeon Pro 560) vs 65W TDP GPU (AMD Radeon Pro 5300M) / 85W TDP in case of 5500M. Even if we talk about TDP this gives some imagination about how much heat you need to dissipate and even with much lower 7nm process current draw is still inreasing because more GPU power require more internal blocks and power supply / current draw. Consumers complaint about MBP GPU performance. Apple implemented modern GPUs (middle range) to deliver what customers want and this is final effect. Without such cooling like in new XPS 17" or Huawei MateBook X Pro there is no chance to handle it but new MBP is 2kg now so there is no any chance that Apple decide to increase laptop weight again while most of modern mobile workstations are now even about 1.4kg or 1.8kg.

 

[mrmachine79]

No need for a Windows computer since I have multiple Macbook Pro's. My 2017 Macbook Pro with a Radeon GPU ( I forget the model ) draws 5W power when connected to dual displays, vs my 2019 Macbook Pro that draws 20W.

I suspect the problem still exists in there older machines with older Radeon graphics, but high speed on those older models ran at a lower frequency and therefore used less power and generated less heat so it was less noticeable.

The end result may be the same. No problem until 2019 model. But this would indicate it is working as designed and not a bug. It's just a bad design.
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So I've been following this thread for a while. You can check my history for my previous updates but in short I had a Dell monitor, experienced the high wattage issue. As already discussed I think this is a limitation of the AMD GPU architecture. I then got a new "compatible" monitor. Managed to reduce wattage, but a new lagging issue was introduced.

I have just managed to solve the laggy UI on the new Asus monitor with the most bizarre of fixes. Which make it look very much like a driver issue causing the lag. It might also explain why some users are feeling lag in Chrome / Safari, as I too was experiencing this, but it also resolved by the trick demonstrated.

I have documented the issue and resolution in the video below. If you do watch, I advise watching in HD if possible as it's hard to see the difference in scrolling. But I can assure it's there. I'll be trying to capture a better screen recording on the lag later tonight, which I'll be submitting to Apple as a bug report.

Looks like that older style preference is able to force apps to use the iGPU even when the dGPU is enabled. More interesting is that it seems the higher power draw is actually required for some displays to maintain acceptable performance.

I was unable to get the old style preference to display for me. But it'd be great if you could confirm that the app is running on dGPU with bad performance and iGPU with good performance.

In Activity Monitor with an eGPU connected, I get a new GPU

tab ("Window > processes, by GPU" in the menu). This option is greyed out for me without the eGPU connected, but it shows hierarchically which processes are running on which GPU. I couldn't find a way to enable this feature without the eGPU connected.

Could you run `pmset -g` in Terminal and see if the value of `gpuswitch` changes when you select "better for battery life"?