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zachz

macrumors 6502
Jun 18, 2012
272
889
When you use your iPad to do traditionally laptop things like Pages, do you miss the power/features of macOS and macOS apps?
Occasionally. I use Pages with Safari when writing papers so it's nice having the full macOS experience and bigger screen because I can have multiple windows open next to each other. But other than that the iPad works because I'm a I write my notes so usually I take my iPad to campus when things were open -- I'm curious to see how/if I'll manage using strictly an iPad now once campus opens again, hopefully it's not too tedious. Although the new iMac is under 10 pounds so I guess I could just carry that around ;)
 
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WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
Besides my M1 iMac order ... ordered a M1 MacMini. Trading-in previous machines and still got more stuff to trade-in.
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
Occasionally. I use Pages with Safari when writing papers so it's nice having the full macOS experience and bigger screen because I can have multiple windows open next to each other. But other than that the iPad works because I'm a I write my notes so usually I take my iPad to campus when things were open -- I'm curious to see how/if I'll manage using strictly an iPad now once campus opens again, hopefully it's not too tedious. Although the new iMac is under 10 pounds so I guess I could just carry that around ;)
I teach on-line using the Notes app by writing the lectures on the iPad. I probably could use the iPad alone but I USB-C the iPad to the Mac and launch QuickTime to bring up the iPad Notes on the Mac and then share my Mac screen via Zoom with the class. Sounds roundabout but it works.
 

zachz

macrumors 6502
Jun 18, 2012
272
889
I teach on-line using the Notes app by writing the lectures on the iPad. I probably could use the iPad alone but I USB-C the iPad to the Mac and launch QuickTime to bring up the iPad Notes on the Mac and then share my Mac screen via Zoom with the class. Sounds roundabout but it works.
That's a good idea. So you can share your iPad screen to your Mac via QuickTime once it's connected?
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
That's a good idea. So you can share your iPad screen to your Mac via QuickTime once it's connected?
Well, I am sharing the Note app. You just go to the QT menu File > New Movie Recording ... then I just share that app with Zoom. They see everything you write in Notes ... like a chalkboard in class.
 
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basalt5750

macrumors newbie
Jan 1, 2018
16
16
I have canceled my M1 IMac order today after one too many notifications that the 16GB RAM was insufficient on my 2019 model, I don't want to take the chance that it will still be insufficient on the new model, as that is the max available. For now I will add RAM and wait for M2 and more RAM upgrade flexibility.
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
I have canceled my M1 IMac order today after one too many notifications that the 16GB RAM was insufficient on my 2019 model, I don't want to take the chance that it will still be insufficient on the new model, as that is the max available. For now I will add RAM and wait for M2 and more RAM upgrade flexibility.
Just curious ... what is your use case?
 

basalt5750

macrumors newbie
Jan 1, 2018
16
16
Just curious ... what is your use case?
I'm not familiar with the term, I use the computer for general stuff, and photography, but no elaborate programs, I will say that the unit was a massive disappointment when new, I was ignorant of the uselessness of the hybrid drive it came with, and replacing that with SSD was the only thing that made it work tolerably well, I should have boosted the RAM while the machine was open.
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
I'm not familiar with the term, I use the computer for general stuff, and photography, but no elaborate programs, I will say that the unit was a massive disappointment when new, I was ignorant of the uselessness of the hybrid drive it came with, and replacing that with SSD was the only thing that made it work tolerably well, I should have boosted the RAM while the machine was open.
I see, it does sound like the same issue as mine with that hybrid or Fusion drive. That's why I am going to the SSD and the memory arrangement for the M1 ... I am hopeful that will clear up things. My use case is almost entirely the included Mac apps and nothing on the photography side except the Photos app and maybe the iMovie app. I am thinking everything will work in my case.
 

BasilFawlty

macrumors 65816
Jun 20, 2009
1,082
3,036
New Mexico
Well, I am sharing the Note app. You just go to the QT menu File > New Movie Recording ... then I just share that app with Zoom. They see everything you write in Notes ... like a chalkboard in class.
That’s pretty slick. I’ll have to try that!
 

4sallypat

macrumors 601
Sep 16, 2016
4,034
3,782
So Calif
Have you any experience with the M1 Mac at all before canceling the iMac ?

I have had an M1 Mini for 6 months and with a measly 8GB Unified Memory, it runs circles around my 16GB, 32GB and 64GB Intel Macs without the heat, fan noise, and throttling.

I don't know what you heard, but the M1 is not an Intel machine - far from it - it's a totally different platform.

When I get my iMac, it will replace a super toasty hot Intel Mac and run apps so fast that I never will see a spinning beach ball.
I have canceled my M1 IMac order today after one too many notifications that the 16GB RAM was insufficient on my 2019 model, I don't want to take the chance that it will still be insufficient on the new model, as that is the max available. For now I will add RAM and wait for M2 and more RAM upgrade flexibility.
 

fishkorp

macrumors 68030
Apr 10, 2006
2,536
650
Ellicott City, MD
I'm not familiar with the term, I use the computer for general stuff, and photography, but no elaborate programs, I will say that the unit was a massive disappointment when new, I was ignorant of the uselessness of the hybrid drive it came with, and replacing that with SSD was the only thing that made it work tolerably well, I should have boosted the RAM while the machine was open.
There’s a door in the back. It’ll take you less than 5 minutes to add more RAM to your 2019.

From what you said above, there’s zero reason for low memory messages with 16GB. Have you checked to see what’s using it all? You may have something running that you’re unaware of. I’d look into that if I were you.
 

basalt5750

macrumors newbie
Jan 1, 2018
16
16
Have you any experience with the M1 Mac at all before canceling the iMac ?

I have had an M1 Mini for 6 months and with a measly 8GB Unified Memory, it runs circles around my 16GB, 32GB and 64GB Intel Macs without the heat, fan noise, and throttling.

I don't know what you heard, but the M1 is not an Intel machine - far from it - it's a totally different platform.

When I get my iMac, it will replace a super toasty hot Intel Mac and run apps so fast that I never will see a spinning beach ball.
That's really good to know, I'm just being cautious, and I'm willing to wait a bit as its a major investment for me.
 

basalt5750

macrumors newbie
Jan 1, 2018
16
16
There’s a door in the back. It’ll take you less than 5 minutes to add more RAM to your 2019.

From what you said above, there’s zero reason for low memory messages with 16GB. Have you checked to see what’s using it all? You may have something running that you’re unaware of. I’d look into that if I were you.
The smaller IMac doesn't have the convenient entrance to Narnia of which you speak, and I have found no evidence that the machine is an underground server for a bond villain, I do have large photo library that the machine has never been able to index completely.
 

fishkorp

macrumors 68030
Apr 10, 2006
2,536
650
Ellicott City, MD
The smaller IMac doesn't have the convenient entrance to Narnia of which you speak, and I have found no evidence that the machine is an underground server for a bond villain, I do have large photo library that the machine has never been able to index completely.
Ah, apologies. Not sure why I assumed it was the 27”
 
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WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
Have you any experience with the M1 Mac at all before canceling the iMac ?

I have had an M1 Mini for 6 months and with a measly 8GB Unified Memory, it runs circles around my 16GB, 32GB and 64GB Intel Macs without the heat, fan noise, and throttling.

I don't know what you heard, but the M1 is not an Intel machine - far from it - it's a totally different platform.

When I get my iMac, it will replace a super toasty hot Intel Mac and run apps so fast that I never will see a spinning beach ball.
I think his was the same issue I had ... primarily with the Fusion drive. That small piece of SSD + HDD has/had a lot of speed issues especially when I used it with iCloud ... lots of spinning beachballs, etc. It works but you would need to be very very patient ... like in the old days of computing. Really, SSDs are the only way. The M1 is great. A continuation from ARM (a piece of the RISC development) --> Apple Newton to the M1 Macs. Really, CISC has a lot to overcome. Any CISC centric manufacturer is re-evaluating. Now TSMC is saying fabs will be built in the US ... that pretty much says it all since I think they are mostly RISC? Not sure. I am ditching all the CISC machines.
 
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za9ra22

macrumors 65816
Sep 25, 2003
1,441
1,931
I'm not familiar with the term, I use the computer for general stuff, and photography, but no elaborate programs, I will say that the unit was a massive disappointment when new, I was ignorant of the uselessness of the hybrid drive it came with, and replacing that with SSD was the only thing that made it work tolerably well, I should have boosted the RAM while the machine was open.

Odd. My 2015 model with fusion drive has been exceptionally good. Fast boot, functionally very smooth and quick. It has 16Gb RAM, and is used daily for photo, video and web editing, and simultaneous access to a number of network/systems security resources.
 

glenthompson

macrumors demi-god
Apr 27, 2011
2,983
844
Virginia
veOdd. My 2015 model with fusion drive has been exceptionally good. Fast boot, functionally very smooth and quick. It has 16Gb RAM, and is used daily for photo, video and web editing, and simultaneous access to a number of network/systems security resources.
What size fusion drive? The 1tb version has a much smaller SSD than the 2 and 3tb versions. My wife has the 3tb version and it runs very fast. Her use case keeps most of her data on the SSD so the hard drive isn’t accessed that often. Everyone I hear complain about the fusion drive is using a 1tb version.
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
Odd. My 2015 model with fusion drive has been exceptionally good. Fast boot, functionally very smooth and quick. It has 16Gb RAM, and is used daily for photo, video and web editing, and simultaneous access to a number of network/systems security resources.
Hmm ... maybe that's it! ... I just needed the 16 GB of ram ... so, it isn't the Fusion drive itself ? ... I only have the 8 GB base ram configuration with the fusion on my 2017 iMac. OR, maybe, it is my Wifi internet transfer speed? Oh, no if it isn't that base ram or the fusion then it IS the wifi transfer?? And I ordered the M1 iMac without ethernet! There is one other possibility that my internet service is slow ... live in a college town!
 

WC7

macrumors 6502
Dec 13, 2018
427
318
What size fusion drive? The 1tb version has a much smaller SSD than the 2 and 3tb versions. My wife has the 3tb version and it runs very fast. Her use case keeps most of her data on the SSD so the hard drive isn’t accessed that often. Everyone I hear complain about the fusion drive is using a 1tb version.
Oh, just read this. That's what I have: the 1 TB fusion drive. So, it still may be that drive that is the issue(?).
 

za9ra22

macrumors 65816
Sep 25, 2003
1,441
1,931
Hmm ... maybe that's it! ... I just needed the 16 GB of ram ... so, it isn't the Fusion drive itself ? ... I only have the 8 GB base ram configuration with the fusion on my 2017 iMac. OR, maybe, it is my Wifi internet transfer speed? Oh, no if it isn't that base ram or the fusion then it IS the wifi transfer?? And I ordered the M1 iMac without ethernet! There is one other possibility that my internet service is slow ... live in a college town!

There are a whole bunch of possibilities, but you can at least do some basic tests to see where the problem is most likely.

Some thoughts....

Firstly, there is nothing wrong with 8Gb RAM, but the important thing to remember is that the more RAM, the more apps can be open at any given time without slowing the system, so try using the system with the fewest apps/windows open. Also, as macOS has been updated, it gets bigger and bigger, so uses more and more RAM just for itself.

Wifi and internet speeds can be tested reasonably easily with online speed tests, and you might have two possible issues: firstly your internet service, if DSL will be very slow anyway, and if cable you may be suffering 'choking' just because of the amount of data traffic on the node that provides service to you (there can be a large number of different customers sharing a single node, which is why cable is usually quote as '...up to...' speeds). Secondly, your wifi access point/router may be running slowly. This can happen if it's relatively old, or if there are a number of others using it.

1Tb fusion drives have relatively small SSD components in comparison to 2 and 3 Tb units, but while they are not as data efficient as the larger drives, are usually sufficient unless the drive itself is getting very full. The 1Tb drives do have a reputation for relatively slow performance compared to the larger drives but this would normally only be particularly notable if you were doing a lot of large-file saves, or running a large number of apps at the same time - this latter is important because like other systems, Macs use the hard drive as temporary storage, known as 'caching' or 'paging', which happens more and more as more apps are open and less memory is available.

Even if the SSD part of the fusion drive isn't enough, the rest of the drive is a standard 7200rpm unit, which for normal purposes isn't all that bad in performance, but can hit the system badly with caching/paging because the hard drive is a great deal slower than the system's in-built RAM.

One point I think you made was that you saw a lot of speed issues when accessing iCloud - beachballing. While that could be a drive issue, it likely isn't because even a slow laptop drive can throughput more data than a typical wifi+cable internet, which means that I would doubt the drive is the sole culprit.

If I owned a Mac that was performing as seemingly badly as this, I would back it up using (preferably SuperDuper or CarbonCopyCloner) and then restore it to 'as new', before reinstalling apps and data form the backup. If nothing else, this would help remove the possibility that macOS has been compromised by data errors.
 
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4sallypat

macrumors 601
Sep 16, 2016
4,034
3,782
So Calif
Hmm ... maybe that's it! ... I just needed the 16 GB of ram ... so, it isn't the Fusion drive itself ? ... I only have the 8 GB base ram configuration with the fusion on my 2017 iMac. OR, maybe, it is my Wifi internet transfer speed? Oh, no if it isn't that base ram or the fusion then it IS the wifi transfer?? And I ordered the M1 iMac without ethernet! There is one other possibility that my internet service is slow ... live in a college town!
It's not the RAM - my 2012 and 2019 iMacs both have base 8GB RAM and that is not the issue - it's the spinning HDD inside that slows everything down.

Why Apple kept putting spinning HDD or silly Fusion drives behooves me!

What I did to vastly speed up the iMacs: external Thunderbolt SSDs.

Both machines are fitted with these SSD on the Thunderbolt ports and boots OS from them. I then wiped and formatted the internal drive as non bootable APFS drive for storage / archive use.

Now they are screamingly fast - much better than the silly spinning internal drive.

For my 2019 iMac - LaCie TB SSD w/ TB3-2 adapter:
IMG_6792.jpg
 
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za9ra22

macrumors 65816
Sep 25, 2003
1,441
1,931
Why Apple kept putting spinning HDD or silly Fusion drives behooves me!

I would hazard a guess and say that they did this because SSDs were prohibitely expensive at the larger end of the storage scale, but that the inclusion of even a relatively small SSD gave the system much better general performance than would otherwise have been the case.

Which has certainly been my experience. I wouldn't say that my 2015 iMac is astonishingly rapid, but it is more than adequate, so the fusion drive technology has worked perfectly well for me.

By the way, I suspect 'behoove' isn't quite the word you were looking for.
 
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