Tablets Android tablets are dead

[jimimac71]

I don't think Nick is a nut. I've been reading his posts in this thread since the start.
Do I agree with him? Sometimes.
You want to talk nuts, there's this guy who's the richest man in the world.
I would not want his electric car or a ride in his spacecraft.
Perhaps too much money makes people stupid. I have nothing to worry about there.
Technology changes are forced changes. I feel that is Nick's point.
I have a 2015 Dell AIO. It cannot install Windows 11, because MS has forced computers to comply with TPM 2.0.
It has a 2014 Haswell CPU, which also is not good enough.
Somewhere out there in computerville, I don't want to jinx it, is a 2008 Dell PC with a dual-core (not Core 2 Duo) CPU, staying alive with Windows 7 (32-bit).
I believe it is a 64-bit CPU but was upgraded to Windows 7 from 32-bit Vista.
It still has the Windows games that were taken away in Windows 8.
Windows 11 mostly requires a 2018 or better computer.
Okay, in 2025, when Windows 10 goes EOL, it will be a 7 year lifespan. Chromebooks get that much support.
If Nick has a gun it is probably from the Civil War. <grin>

 

[Vegastouch]

I don't think Nick is a nut. I've been reading his posts in this thread since the start.
Do I agree with him? Sometimes.
You want to talk nuts, there's this guy who's the richest man in the world.
I would not want his electric car or a ride in his spacecraft.
Perhaps too much money makes people stupid. I have nothing to worry about there.
Technology changes are forced changes. I feel that is Nick's point.
I have a 2015 Dell AIO. It cannot install Windows 11, because MS has forced computers to comply with TPM 2.0.
It has a 2014 Haswell CPU, which also is not good enough.
Somewhere out there in computerville, I don't want to jinx it, is a 2008 Dell PC with a dual-core (not Core 2 Duo) CPU, staying alive with Windows 7 (32-bit).
I believe it is a 64-bit CPU but was upgraded to Windows 7 from 32-bit Vista.
It still has the Windows games that were taken away in Windows 8.
Windows 11 mostly requires a 2018 or better computer.
Okay, in 2025, when Windows 10 goes EOL, it will be a 7 year lifespan. Chromebooks get that much support.
If Nick has a gun it is probably from the Civil War. <grin>

Agree, rich people have different priorities. But you know, i can fix my cars, things around the house in the yard, sprinklers, etc..assemble things....there are a lot of things i can do but electronics? I cant fix those so when my TV starts getting faded out black areas, its done as far as im concerned and they are cheap enough to buy if you dont need the latest things. Cheaper than phones.

I also had a Canon printer that had new ink, printed like it was empty and it wouldnt work correctly on top of that. Out it went for a $70 new HP that now does what i want it to and i had to prnt some important things to mail out.

Phone tech , I dont care if i have the latest OS, latest phone, etc.... I only care that what i do have is able to run the apps, navigation and things i need it to run and isnt so slowed down i cant use it without getting peeved.

Which is why i need a new laptop or tablet that isnt slow as molasses as my current ones are. My PC is kinda slow as far as booting up and getting set to go to be ready to use and it also wont get the newest Windows so some day this will go too but im not in a hurry to change it.

But Nick....dude is kinda weird and gives that weird vibe. Thing is why KEEP repeating the same things over and over about liking old tech? Nobody cares and he isnt going to change anybody's minds about wanting new things and its been years since he has been doing it. Now he says he would rather NOT LIVE than have to use newer tech. Really? Its worth dying for? Or others dying for? I find that bizarre.

Are we really THAT into tech and social media that it effects how we feel in our lives? Hec i read about some kids teenagers and early 20's get angry about not getting enough likes. Seems silly to me.

I kinda worry about dudes like that. Today you never know who will pump you full off holes.

 

[jimimac71]

Nick is not the first person for me to know of who might be a bit different.
My old pal Bert would make Nick seem normal.
I’m probably a nut job, I prefer “off the rails.”
I can’t fix much of anything. I’m a jack of all trades, master of none.
I find my iPad to be more bulletproof than Android and possibly Chrome OS.
There are times I need my computer for things my iPad either can’t do or I don’t know how.
While I know how to edit audio with Audacity, I can also edit audio reel tape with a razor blade. That’s way more fun. I can slip cue a phonograph record. Raise your hand if that does not compute.
I love records and tape. Digital audio is so boring.
I miss my old reel tape and cassette decks.
Also prefer rim/idler drive record players over belt or direct drive.
Lastly, if you have a CD that skips, you do remember CDs, keep in mind, unlike a phonograph record, CDs track from the inside out.
One more. CDs are CLV. They spin slower the larger the disc space grows.
See, Nick ain’t loco.
Hey Nick! Tell the kiddos what three on the tree means.

 

[Vegastouch]

Nick is not the first person for me to know of who might be a bit different.
My old pal Bert would make Nick seem normal.
I’m probably a nut job, I prefer “off the rails.”
I can’t fix much of anything. I’m a jack of all trades, master of none.
I find my iPad to be more bulletproof than Android and possibly Chrome OS.
There are times I need my computer for things my iPad either can’t do or I don’t know how.
While I know how to edit audio with Audacity, I can also edit audio reel tape with a razor blade. That’s way more fun. I can slip cue a phonograph record. Raise your hand if that does not compute.
I love records and tape. Digital audio is so boring.
I miss my old reel tape and cassette decks.
Also prefer rim/idler drive record players over belt or direct drive.
Lastly, if you have a CD that skips, you do remember CDs, keep in mind, unlike a phonograph record, CDs track from the inside out.
One more. CDs are CLV. They spin slower the larger the disc space grows.
See, Nick ain’t loco.
Hey Nick! Tell the kiddos what three on the tree means.

But are you willing to say this is a world with tech you don't want to live in?

Most can roll with the punches.

I haven't used a CD in years. Used to burn many of them and make my own.

My most recent car don't have a CD player and when I replace the stock unit in my other vehicle soon, it won't have one either. Just use Bluetooth, radio , XM or USB flash with audio on it to get by which is better imo.

 

[jimimac71]

But are you willing to say this is a world with tech you don't want to live in?

Most can roll with the punches.

I haven't used a CD in years. Used to burn many of them and make my own.

My most recent car don't have a CD player and when I replace the stock unit in my other vehicle soon, it won't have one either. Just use Bluetooth, radio , XM or USB flash with audio on it to get by which is better imo.

I don't like rolling with the punches.
I use to make cassettes and good old 8-tracks.
I would rather have my good old days back.
You are reading too much into what Nick said.
I don't want to live in this technology world either.
I want to live in the past but can't.
Where's my Delorean? See imagine.
I also want a new drug that won't make me sick.

 

[sracer]

But are you willing to say this is a world with tech you don't want to live in?

Most can roll with the punches.

I haven't used a CD in years. Used to burn many of them and make my own.

My most recent car don't have a CD player and when I replace the stock unit in my other vehicle soon, it won't have one either. Just use Bluetooth, radio , XM or USB flash with audio on it to get by which is better imo.

I've been a techie when tech was downright prehistoric. I've been a software for over 45 years and counting. But I'm not someone who is drawn to the latest shiny bauble simply because it is new.

I have some attachments to older tech. Some of that is caused by sentimentality, but it also accompanied by a practicality that goes along with that. Newer isn't always better.

While I refuse to purchase digital-only media, I DO use free streaming services and rip my personal physical media so that I can stream it.

But I think considering what place, if any, old tech has, is a great conversation to have.

 

[Vegastouch]

I've been a techie when tech was downright prehistoric. I've been a software for over 45 years and counting. But I'm not someone who is drawn to the latest shiny bauble simply because it is new.

I have some attachments to older tech. Some of that is caused by sentimentality, but it also accompanied by a practicality that goes along with that. Newer isn't always better.

While I refuse to purchase digital-only media, I DO use free streaming services and rip my personal physical media so that I can stream it.

But I think considering what place, if any, old tech has, is a great conversation to have.

OK, well I'm not attracted to the next best thing either, as I've said. I'm not a young guy anymore either but unless I'm wrong, I don't think Nick is a older guy either. If he is then I guess it makes sense how he feels but he don't have to cram it down our throats with every post.
I also think the late seventies and eighties were better than today as far as politics and everybody being offended by every little thing but I'm not afraid to embrace today's things either.

Actually can't wait til they perfect the driverless car but I won't be needing to go to work by then. Is going to be a while til it's the norm.

 

[jimimac71]

My Nokia T20 is not great as a tablet. Wi-Fi is wonky.
I live in California, the heart of fire danger.
The T20 has an FM tuner and the back camera has a flash.
The radio works okay and the flash can operate as a flashlight.
A $180 (on sale) emergency device.
My iPad is still best overall.
A new model will have a faster CPU and double the 32 GB storage.
Only the latest model has 64 GB.
The only reason for me to own an Android tablet is features not on iPad and in my cheap price range.
I don’t drive, for the same reason I don’t have a smartphone. Eyesight is wonky too. Not in favor of a smart car until it can drive accident free in New York City.

 

[ljckennedy]

I have both. I prefer the android tablet by far. IOS seems designed for luddites which is probably good business, but makes it frustrating for techies.

 

[jimimac71]

Luddite? Do I look like a textile worker?
I have no knowledge about iOS. That's the iPhone. iPad OS is supposed to be different.
I'm not a techie either.
From the beginning of time, Apple products were simple to use. If you could find the power switch, you were halfway there.
I've had more issues with Android over time than iPad OS.
Too many Google Play Store apps, or even APKs, are simply not compatible. Some iPad apps are stupid in design, but can install on my iPad.
While I like having a tablet, it isn't a necessity anymore. Would like to see Windows 11 before buying it on a new machine, but that's 3 years out.
If I were a techie, it would be Linux all the way.
I don't believe I'd like Mac OS now, having knowledge all the way back to Leopard. The big cat OS versions were the best. I didn't understand Mac OS 9 very well, but loved the look.

 

[Vegastouch]

Luddite? Do I look like a textile worker?
I have no knowledge about iOS. That's the iPhone. iPad OS is supposed to be different.
I'm not a techie either.
From the beginning of time, Apple products were simple to use. If you could find the power switch, you were halfway there.
I've had more issues with Android over time than iPad OS.
Too many Google Play Store apps, or even APKs, are simply not compatible. Some iPad apps are stupid in design, but can install on my iPad.
While I like having a tablet, it isn't a necessity anymore. Would like to see Windows 11 before buying it on a new machine, but that's 3 years out.
If I were a techie, it would be Linux all the way.
I don't believe I'd like Mac OS now, having knowledge all the way back to Leopard. The big cat OS versions were the best. I didn't understand Mac OS 9 very well, but loved the look.

iPad isnt different, both use iOS.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I have both. I prefer the android tablet by far. IOS seems designed for luddites which is probably good business, but makes it frustrating for techies.

I think ‘Luddite’ is completely the wrong word there mate to be fair lol. That is clearly not the case at all.

 

[jimimac71]

iPad isnt different, both use iOS.

Not so:
https://www.apple.com/ipados/ipados-15/

 

[Vegastouch]

Not so:
https://www.apple.com/ipados/ipados-15/

That tells me nothing but it is basically the same OS. Do a Google search instead of that. The iPad just has some added variances for business.

https://www.42gears.com/blog/ipados-vs-ios-whats-the-difference/

iPadOS vs iOS Are Far More Alike Than Different​

There are many similarities between iPadOS and iOS whether you're comparing them for use at home or in the office. They run most of the same apps and have nearly identical aesthetics. Most importantly, businesses can manage both via Apple Business Manager or Apple School Manager. Additionally, you can utilize mobile device management (MDM) solution such as SureMDM developed by 42Gears if you want to use iPhones and iPads for business purposes. With SureMDM, you can manage, secure, and monitor a variety of other devices including Android phones, Windows laptops, MacOS desktops, and MacOS PCs outside of the Apple ecosystem.

 

[jimimac71]

Too much tech information.
The two operating systems are different enough or Apple would not have gone to the effect of creating something called iPad OS. It started with Safari defaulting to desktop mode. I believe the dock is different, but again, I do not have an iPhone. Small but different changes.
Hopefully, Android 12L will be different than Android 12.

 

[Vegastouch]

Too much tech information.
The two operating systems are different enough or Apple would not have gone to the effect of creating something called iPad OS. It started with Safari defaulting to desktop mode. I believe the dock is different, but again, I do not have an iPhone. Small but different changes.
Hopefully, Android 12L will be different than Android 12.

Stop, it's basically the same OS, just has some variances. Google it if you don't believe it.

 

[jimimac71]

Stop, it's basically the same OS, just has some variances. Google it if you don't believe it.

Why? I really don’t care if your opinion is different from mine.
I’m right. For that matter, so is Nick.
To quote Louis Armstrong, “End of story.”
To quote Chet Atkins, “Respect your elders.”

 

[Vegastouch]

Why? I really don’t care if your opinion is different from mine.
I’m right. For that matter, so is Nick.
To quote Louis Armstrong, “End of story.”
To quote Chet Atkins, “Respect your elders.”

Its not really my opinion, but believe what you want. I posted a link. Not my fault you don't want to read it.

 

[jimimac71]

Its there and I posted it, if you want to learn something but believe what you want.

I don’t need to learn something I can’t understand.
If you’re correct, then tvOS is the same as iOS.
Except for the M1 iPads, the innards are the same.
I’ll believe as I wish.
Since this is off topic anyway, stick a fork in me, I’m done.

 

[Vegastouch]

I don’t need to learn something I can’t understand.
If you’re correct, then tvOS is the same as iOS.
Except for the M1 iPads, the innards are the same.
I’ll believe as I wish.
Since this is off topic anyway, stick a fork in me, I’m done.

Got it, and that's cool but let me just say what the biggest differences are in simple terms.

On the iPad you can do split screen which means using more than 1 app at the same time, like read your email while also watching or listening to YouTube.
And you can also use a iPen ( don't know what Apple actually calls it) on the iPad.

Both these things Android has allowed on both for years. Apple is still catching up. Not a dig, just a fact.

Also there are iPad only apps as they are optomised for their screen sizes and won't work on both devices like most do.

Thus they can call it iPad OS because iPhone can't do those things. Otherwise, it's pretty much the same.

 

[jimimac71]

I've been using tablets since 2017 and the new has worn off. I live in an area where evacuations can happen do to fire. I want something portable I can evacuate with. Otherwise, my desktop is easier to use.
I have 3 tablets that all have specific abilities. Samsung has built-in GPS without the need for cellular. Nokia has FM radio and back camera flash for flashlight. iPad has ease of use, now that I'm comfortable with it.
Too bad notebook computers don't have any of these abilities.
And don't say, just get a phone.
Until people stop doing everything with their phones, all tablets are doomed except to people who require them.

 

[nickdalzell1]

For the record, I'm 43 years old. But I've had a fondness for older tech that I got from my great grandparents. Old things always amazed me (especially flip clocks!)

But that said, we were improving each upgrade cycle up until 2015 then the 'upgrades' became downgrades. removing features, making phones too large, adding cameras no one asked for, and making the UI look like it's from the 1980s.

If the 'changes' were actual improvements I'd be all for them! So far, we stopped making smartphones amazing and having variety and now just stay homogenized, everything looks the same, every screen must be 6"+ for some reason, and taking away features like headphone jacks and expandable storage became normal somehow.

It would make sense in 1996! Today we have the tech to pull off amazing stuff yet all we do is making every UI boring and blinding white, and make phones that are massive downgrades in usability (how hard was the old 'slide to unlock?' how is swiping up without a visual cue an improvement? What about those annoying gestures? what was so wrong with hardware buttons?)

I mean come on! we had reasons to upgrade each time. The Samsung Galaxy SII introduced NFC, turn-by-turn navigation. The SIII had smart stay (screen stays on when looking at it), an amazing lockscreen effect, notification LED, and a 720p display. The S4 added an IR blaster, 5" full HD display, Allshare Play, smart scroll, and a much better camera. The S5 had the most features of any smartphone PERIOD to this day: Water proofing but still removable battery, Heart Rate sensor, fingerprint sensor, IR blaster, USB 3.0 + Fast Charge, optional wireless charging back.

For iPhones:

3GS first 3G iPhone, iPhone 4S, added Siri, 4G connectivity, touch ID. iPhone 6S, VoLTE support, 3D touch.

There were reasons to upgrade then. Today? every phone looks just like every other phone. too big to use one handed, has to have multiple cameras (why? who asked for it? Where was the demand?), no touch ID, no buttons at all so gestures that still make no sense are forced, not just on iOS but on Android as well so you can't escape it. All the things that made a smartphone such as removable battey, IR blaster, expandable storage are gone, along with headphone jacks. All the UI has been boring since iOS 7, showing zero signs of getting better.

I mean what point is there in upgrading? All I'd get is a phone I hate that has less features than my Galaxy SII yet costs a lot of money ($1000+) What will I even get other than a downgrade with a UI I hate, that can't be fully skeuo'd, and obviously not designed for me.

We had phones at one time that had sliding keyboards, flip screens (see Kyocera Echo), gamepads (Sony Xperia Play) and the fracking cool T-Mobile Sidekick. I mean why must they all be boring now? Why did the innovation have to just up and stop ~ 2015 and not improve since?


FYI Yes, I know what 3 on the tree is. And no, I still grind gears trying to drive one! I never could figure out what position means what. Last truck I attempted to drive with one was a '59 Chevrolet Apache and I found out the hard way what going accidentally to reverse from 2nd does!

 

[Heat_Fan89]

For the record, I'm 43 years old. But I've had a fondness for older tech that I got from my great grandparents. Old things always amazed me (especially flip clocks!)

But that said, we were improving each upgrade cycle up until 2015 then the 'upgrades' became downgrades. removing features, making phones too large, adding cameras no one asked for, and making the UI look like it's from the 1980s.

If the 'changes' were actual improvements I'd be all for them! So far, we stopped making smartphones amazing and having variety and now just stay homogenized, everything looks the same, every screen must be 6"+ for some reason, and taking away features like headphone jacks and expandable storage became normal somehow.

It would make sense in 1996! Today we have the tech to pull off amazing stuff yet all we do is making every UI boring and blinding white, and make phones that are massive downgrades in usability (how hard was the old 'slide to unlock?' how is swiping up without a visual cue an improvement? What about those annoying gestures? what was so wrong with hardware buttons?)

I mean come on! we had reasons to upgrade each time. The Samsung Galaxy SII introduced NFC, turn-by-turn navigation. The SIII had smart stay (screen stays on when looking at it), an amazing lockscreen effect, notification LED, and a 720p display. The S4 added an IR blaster, 5" full HD display, Allshare Play, smart scroll, and a much better camera. The S5 had the most features of any smartphone PERIOD to this day: Water proofing but still removable battery, Heart Rate sensor, fingerprint sensor, IR blaster, USB 3.0 + Fast Charge, optional wireless charging back.

For iPhones:

3GS first 3G iPhone, iPhone 4S, added Siri, 4G connectivity, touch ID. iPhone 6S, VoLTE support, 3D touch.

There were reasons to upgrade then. Today? every phone looks just like every other phone. too big to use one handed, has to have multiple cameras (why? who asked for it? Where was the demand?), no touch ID, no buttons at all so gestures that still make no sense are forced, not just on iOS but on Android as well so you can't escape it. All the things that made a smartphone such as removable battey, IR blaster, expandable storage are gone, along with headphone jacks. All the UI has been boring since iOS 7, showing zero signs of getting better.

I mean what point is there in upgrading? All I'd get is a phone I hate that has less features than my Galaxy SII yet costs a lot of money ($1000+) What will I even get other than a downgrade with a UI I hate, that can't be fully skeuo'd, and obviously not designed for me.

We had phones at one time that had sliding keyboards, flip screens (see Kyocera Echo), gamepads (Sony Xperia Play) and the fracking cool T-Mobile Sidekick. I mean why must they all be boring now? Why did the innovation have to just up and stop ~ 2015 and not improve since?


FYI Yes, I know what 3 on the tree is. And no, I still grind gears trying to drive one! I never could figure out what position means what. Last truck I attempted to drive with one was a '59 Chevrolet Apache and I found out the hard way what going accidentally to reverse from 2nd does!

IIRC, “Slide to Unlock“ is what caused Apple to go after Samsung in a copycat infringement lawsuit. There’s nothing wrong with liking old tech. Unfortunately, today we live in a microwave society so change is required for the sake of change because if nothing changes their customers get bored rather quickly and move onto something else.

 

[jimimac71]

I don’t care for the flat look of iOS/iPad OS.
The change seems to come from the flat look from Mac OS.
I’m not familiar with anything older than Android 9.
My first Amazon tablet is based on something older but the OS doesn’t resemble true Android.
Funny thing, people don’t like Amazon Fire OS.
What’s the difference between that and Android coming with tons of Google apps?
My Samsung tablet upgraded the OS but called it a UI update.
From 9 to 10 to 11, there was no difference to me and I didn’t even know Android had updated.
If Android was like Linux, it would be possible to make a different looking OS easier. There are over 100 top Linux versions on DistroWatch.
Only Open Source can do that.
You can’t tweak Windows or Mac, or anything Apple.
Linux can have the features the builder wants.
Linux doesn’t have to do what Big Tech tells them to.
A Linux tablet could be a tablet with choice.
No Microsoft, Apple, or Google deciding for the user.
My favorite was the VW Bug 4 speed manual transmission.
2nd gear was left and back. 4th gear was right and back.
Reverse was in the middle and back, difficult to find by mistake.
I’m not so sure cars are any different than technology.
Now, the big deal is electric car charging time and battery mileage.
There was a time when the next new automobile had something so new, you wanted it. Lots of chrome, not the Google kind. Bigger with a smoother ride.
With tech, it’s just keeping up with others.
EDIT:
I see where Nokia is releasing a T10, an 8 inch tablet. It will have Android 12 and their phones mostly come that way as well. Does anyone here have Android 12 yet?

 

[nickdalzell1]

IIRC, “Slide to Unlock“ is what caused Apple to go after Samsung in a copycat infringement lawsuit. There’s nothing wrong with liking old tech. Unfortunately, today we live in a microwave society so change is required for the sake of change because if nothing changes their customers get bored rather quickly and move onto something else.

How was that a lawsuit? The filing happened in re: the Galaxy SII, but I have an SII and it has no visual slide cue like the old iPhone OS did. It was a pretty flat UI lockscreen for 2011, and just had the clock and date, wallpaper, and 'swipe screen to unlock'.

IMO the iPhone iOS6-down had a much superior slide to unlock screen, complete with a visual indicator of where to slide. Anyone of any age, including grandparents could use it easily. I remember my grandmother got confused after iOS 7 because her slide to unlock 'slider' went missing and she never adapted.

I remember as a kid I got bored with things easily as well, but eventually I grew up and realized how stupid that is and gained a concept that my great grandfather lived with "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

I still find it surprising that adults still fall victim to a mindset that should have died off once they became teens. But since most modern phones/tablets are pretty barren and boring I find no surprise there. Harder to be bored with a Sidekick or the original Motorola RAZR, or the Sony Xperia Play.

I even find older Nintendo consoles more fun to play. Wii, Wii-U, DSi, etc. There isn't that kind of fun to be had on the Switch and there's no amazing feeling like I got when I first saw Super Mario World on demo of the then-new 'Super Nintendo.'

It's just like everyone got used to boring, flat, dull, clinical. I cannot get used to it. I fight it. I just picked up Zelda:Breath of the Wild for the Wii-U, and someone asked me 'You still play on Wii-U?' and I just said "yea, I prefer the interface, the UI, the design more".

When I said I'd rather not live in a dystopian future I meant that I'd never be truly happy or want to live in a world of boring dull UI, everything looking exactly the same, (no individuality) and everything being rented/subscription-based (and controlled by the corporations) instead of owning it. That's a world I feel would be hell to live in. Sadly, that vision of the World Economic Forum's 'you'll own nothing and be happy' is coming true no matter how often I protest it.


They'd have a hard time coming after my purchased DVDs, Blu-Rays, Vinyl, Cassettes, and games, or phones/tablets though. I'll always find homebrew methods to keep them alive. I just outright refuse to participate in 'modern' society. I cannot justify the constant consumption, constant upgrades, and resources depleted to sustain that. I often say the movies "They Live" as well as "Idiocracy" are documentaries. Unfortunately, many have used them as models for future lifestyles instead of taking them as warnings.