Apple Discontinues iPhone SE, iPhone 6s and iPhone X

[Mac 128]

And yes RIP to SE. Woukd have lived that form factor with 3D Touch and advanced camera. Alas here we are.

I think it's pretty clear from the XR that Apple is planning to abandon 3D Touch. Why release what is sure to be a very successful phone and likely be around for years in very larger numbers, without a major interface option? That's only going to discourage developers from investing further into it ...

 

[eplchamps]

No more SE? Sad. Shorthsighted. Maybe they will release a new small phone? With the new Mac Mini and Pro.

When?
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How do you mean shortsighted? The SE was not bringing as much money as they wanted. Are people going to pay $600 plus for. 4 inch phone today? No they won’t. The SE can be bought for as little as $150 on prepaid right now. Apple is looking for bigger margins.

 

[dilbert99]

Do you really think Apple made this decision to actively pissoff a small part of its user base?

Of course I don't, don't be silly.

What I am saying is that Apple do not care who they piss off.
[doublepost=1536968716][/doublepost]

How do you know it's 8%? Only Apple knows for sure.

I can only go on 'reported/quoted' figures, it is the start for any interaction. How do you know its not 8%?

How do you know they are pissed?

Whenever Apple takes something away there are always a large number of people complaining. How do you know they are not pissed off?

 

[Baymowe335]

Of course I don't, don't be silly.

What I am saying is that Apple do not care who they piss off.
[doublepost=1536968716][/doublepost]
I can only go on 'reported/quoted' figures, it is the start for any interaction. How do you know its not 8%?

Whenever Apple takes something away there are always a large number of people complaining. How do you know they are not pissed off?

We don’t know. ASP points to the SE being very niche, however. You don’t have an $800 ASP with a lot of SE popularity.

Since Apple is the best company in the world at sales execution, I consider their decisions to be correct and entirely based on what will work best. They prove it every quarter.

 

[dilbert99]

We don’t know. ASP points to the SE being very niche, however. You don’t have an $800 ASP with a lot of SE popularity.

Since Apple is the best company in the world at sales execution, I consider their decisions to be correct and entirely based on what will work best. They prove it every quarter.

The iPhone Se isn’t the phone for me but Apple like you say sells a lot of phones and millions of customers will be unhappy.

Apple removing this is a business decision and Apple as you know aren’t afraid to upset customers. Why do you thing Apple is so polarizing?

Best is very subjective. You may be fine using money as your metric. I just happen to use a more customer oriented metric.

“Since Apple is the best”, hmm, I would always question someone’s views when they start sentences like that. You don’t want to live in an echo chamber.

 

[Baymowe335]

The iPhone Se isn’t the phone for me but Apple like you say sells a lot of phones and millions of customers will be unhappy.

Apple removing this is a business decision and Apple as you know aren’t afraid to upset customers. Why do you thing Apple is so polarizing?

Best is very subjective. You may be fine using money as your metric. I just happen to use a more customer oriented metric.

“Since Apple is the best”, hmm, I would always question someone’s views when they start sentences like that. You don’t want to live in an echo chamber.

I look at numbers. No comapny executes sales and selling the right product for the most profit better than Apple. None.

 

[oldmacs]

Since Apple is the best company in the world at sales execution, I consider their decisions to be correct and entirely based on what will work best. They prove it every quarter.

As they lurch further and further towards being Microsoft of the early 2000s.

Best is very subjective. You may be fine using money as your metric. I just happen to use a more customer oriented metric.

Me as well. I'd prefer an Apple that made more people happy and made a bit less than an Apple that just rakes in money.

I look at numbers. No comapny executes sales and selling the right product for the most profit better than Apple. None.

You must be a shareholder, who doesn't really care what Apple is selling as long as it makes a heap of money. Again AKA Microsoft in the bad old days. Back when Microsoft products sold pretty much because they were 'good enough'.
[doublepost=1536982519][/doublepost]

I think it's pretty clear from the XR that Apple is planning to abandon 3D Touch. Why release what is sure to be a very successful phone and likely be around for years in very larger numbers, without a major interface option? That's only going to discourage developers from investing further into it ...

Apple should have just dropped it completely from the lineup. Honestly, Apple's lack of consistency these days is ridiculous.

USB-C the standard on Macs, but still not on half the Mac range. No USB-C for iOS devices. Lightning headphones that don't work with Macs. 3D Touch on some devices and not others (yet not enabling long touch to do the same thing).

 

[dilbert99]

I look at numbers. No comapny executes sales and selling the right product for the most profit better than Apple. None.

Are you a shareholder? Everyone is entitled to their own views and thats fine, Apple is moving in a direction that is more about money and less about the customer these days which is a shame.

 

[oldmacs]

Are you a shareholder? Everyone is entitled to their own views and thats fine, Apple is moving in a direction that is more about money and less about the customer these days which is a shame.

Definitely.

As if selling a 4 inch phone which might have a slightly lower profit margin is going to destroy Apple. Maybe the margins for iPhones would be *Slightly* down if it sold enough, but honestly, Apple makes so much money its not funny.

 

[Baymowe335]

As they lurch further and further towards being Microsoft of the early 2000s.



Me as well. I'd prefer an Apple that made more people happy and made a bit less than an Apple that just rakes in money.



You must be a shareholder, who doesn't really care what Apple is selling as long as it makes a heap of money. Again AKA Microsoft in the bad old days. Back when Microsoft products sold pretty much because they were 'good enough'.
[doublepost=1536982519][/doublepost]

Apple should have just dropped it completely from the lineup. Honestly, Apple's lack of consistency these days is ridiculous.

USB-C the standard on Macs, but still not on half the Mac range. No USB-C for iOS devices. Lightning headphones that don't work with Macs. 3D Touch on some devices and not others (yet not enabling long touch to do the same thing).

Microsoft wishes they were ever as good as Apple today. That said, Microsoft has always been another fantastic company. I own shares in both, but significantly more in Apple which I have no problem disclosing here...I have many times.

The iPhone is better than ever, not worse and Apple is capitalizing on the shift to mobile computing. Many are disappointed Apple doesn’t update the Mac hardware yearly too, but times have changed and Apple isn’t living in the past. Apple gave the MacBook Pro a nice update and will do the same with the Mac line soon.

Apple's mobile silicon is so good, it is the envy of the industry. The innovation there is simply stellar and I believe it’s all a plan to continue developing powerful mobile processing for AR, the next big thing. Apple is going to be ready with massive computing power some are wondering why is even in the iPhone so people can “text” faster.

 

[blackhawk526]

You'd be a perfect candidate for an SE, from your carrier if it has them, or someplace like Swappa. . .the SE is slightly taller, about 5/16" , but is narrower by about ⅛". And the SE is 1.25 oz or so lighter. And, you'd have a very upgraded security and operating system: a much safer phone. For about $200. . . .since you don't want to carry a brick around.

Thanks, took your great advice and bought a new SE today. Speedy, light, and ultra portable! 11.4.1 is perfect on it.

On another note, there may be hope after all. Sexist accusations may spur an iPhone SE 2: https://nypost.com/2018/09/14/apples-bigger-screen-iphones-are-slammed-for-being-sexist/

 

[Baymowe335]

Are you a shareholder? Everyone is entitled to their own views and thats fine, Apple is moving in a direction that is more about money and less about the customer these days which is a shame.

Consumers have spoken. Believe me, Apple wants to give you what you want...just on a massive scale. The minority of people that want small screens won’t get top priority, particularly at an iPhone event which I what September is now, and of course the other phone...the Watch.

The SE still might have its day in March 2019 when iPhone sales regulate some.

 

[oldmacs]

Microsoft wishes they were ever as good as Apple today. That said, Microsoft has always been another fantastic company. I own shares in both, but significantly more in Apple which I have no problem disclosing here...I have many times.

The iPhone is better than ever, not worse and Apple is capitalizing on the shift to mobile computing. Many are disappointed Apple doesn’t update the Mac hardware yearly too, but times have changed and Apple isn’t living in the past. Apple gave the MacBook Pro a nice update and will do the same with the Mac line soon.

Apple's mobile silicon is so good, it is the envy of the industry. The innovation there is simply stellar and I believe it’s all a plan to continue developing powerful mobile processing for AR, the next big thing. Apple is going to be ready with massive computing power some are wondering why is even in the iPhone so people can “text” faster.

Look I have always been a big Apple fan.

However, Apple is lurching towards what Microsoft was. I don't believe sales paint the complete picture of a company. I firmly believe Apple would be a better company for consumers if they had a few more options (Such as a smaller phone), even if it meant making slightly less money.

Personally, I don't think the iPhone is better than ever. iPhones upgrades used to be exciting. Now they are just a matter of what you're giving up to get the latest tech. My experience on my SE, which I believe is one of the last of the 'old school' iPhones, is better than on an iPhone X (which I have also extensively used). The new phones have too many compromises. And yeah, plenty of people are willing to make those compromises, but they do so buying Apple products because they're 'good enough', rather than excellent. People are trapped in the ecosystem and won't try anything else anyway so they're guaranteed to upgrade.

I don't think Apple is doomed in anyway. Their current strategy is great for shareholders, it keeps earning more money. However I think it is the wrong direction for actually making the best products possible, or at least making products that appeal to a range of people.
[doublepost=1536986178][/doublepost]

Consumers have spoken.

Apple have never offered an iPhone range with a proper selection of models including a 4 inch device for consumers to actually indicate their preference.

Plenty of customers who would choose a smaller phone if they could will choose bigger phones as they're stuck in the ecosystem and they'll make a compromise. Doesn't mean that the bigger screen is the part of the phone they actually want.

 

[klch]

just went to ebay and bought myself a iPhone SE, thanks Tim!

 

[noraa]

Look I have always been a big Apple fan.

However, Apple is lurching towards what Microsoft was. I don't believe sales paint the complete picture of a company. I firmly believe Apple would be a better company for consumers if they had a few more options (Such as a smaller phone), even if it meant making slightly less money.

Personally, I don't think the iPhone is better than ever. iPhones upgrades used to be exciting. Now they are just a matter of what you're giving up to get the latest tech. My experience on my SE, which I believe is one of the last of the 'old school' iPhones, is better than on an iPhone X (which I have also extensively used). The new phones have too many compromises. And yeah, plenty of people are willing to make those compromises, but they do so buying Apple products because they're 'good enough', rather than excellent. People are trapped in the ecosystem and won't try anything else anyway so they're guaranteed to upgrade.

I don't think Apple is doomed in anyway. Their current strategy is great for shareholders, it keeps earning more money. However I think it is the wrong direction for actually making the best products possible, or at least making products that appeal to a range of people.
[doublepost=1536986178][/doublepost]

Apple have never offered an iPhone range with a proper selection of models including a 4 inch device for consumers to actually indicate their preference.

Plenty of customers who would choose a smaller phone if they could will choose bigger phones as they're stuck in the ecosystem and they'll make a compromise. Doesn't mean that the bigger screen is the part of the phone they actually want.

Herein lies the problem. If Apple were to offer additional iPhone choices (such as a smaller phone), there would be those who complain that Apple is offering too many choices and they need to simplify their product lines (there are already many on this forum who have complained about just a thing). Apple doesn't offer as many choices and a more simple product line... And well people complain.

As far as iPhone upgrades not being exciting, speak for yourself. The iPhone X upgrade was amazing, if not a bit expensive. Of course the XS isn't as exciting, as the S series never really have been.

But, if I had to choose between an iPhone SE and an iPhone X, I'd pick the X in a heartbeat.

 

[dilbert99]

Consumers have spoken. Believe me, Apple wants to give you what you want...just on a massive scale. The minority of people that want small screens won’t get top priority, particularly at an iPhone event which I what September is now, and of course the other phone...the Watch.

The SE still might have its day in March 2019 when iPhone sales regulate some.

I don't want a small screen, but neither do I want a massive screen, I am happy with the size of my iPhone 6 body.
And it is disingenuous to say that customers have spoken.
Customers have been complaining at a lot of Apple decisions, remember the complaints about gluing everything in, soldering ram and ssds in, discontinuing products like aperture, the final cut debacle, no new macs for over 3 years (ie ones without screens), taking away headphone jack, sd card slot and every other slot you can think of. The list is long.

Be under no illusion that Apple thinks about shareholders first and customers second.

 

[oldmacs]

Herein lies the problem. If Apple were to offer additional iPhone choices (such as a smaller phone), there would be those who compassion that Apple is offering too many choices and they need to simplify their product lines (there are already many on this forum who have complained about just a thing). Apple doesn't offer as many choices and a more simple product line... And well people complain.

Apple already offers a confusing product lineup

7, 7+,8,8+,Xs, Xs Max and Xr. At least smaller phones have some sort of easy to recognise distinction.

But, if I had to choose between an iPhone SE and an iPhone X, I'd pick the X in a heartbeat.

And I'd choose an SE in a heartbeat. Always enjoyed going back to my SE after work.

As far as iPhone upgrades not being exciting, speak for yourself. The iPhone X upgrade was amazing, if not a bit expensive. Of course the XS isn't as exciting, as the S series never really have been.

Also speak for yourself. Not everyone thinks your way either.

 

[noraa]

I don't want a small screen, but neither do I want a massive screen, I am happy with the size of my iPhone 6 body.
And it is disingenuous to say that customers have spoken.
Customers have been complaining at a lot of Apple decisions, remember the complaints about gluing everything in, soldering ram and ssds in, discontinuing products like aperture, the final cut debacle, no new macs for over 3 years (ie ones without screens), taking away headphone jack, sd card slot and every other slot you can think of. The list is long.

Be under no illusion that Apple thinks about shareholders first and customers second.

You realize most shareholders (myself included) are customers.

Fortunately, I doubt any Apple execs spend much time reading forums - especially the Macrumors forums - or make decisions based on the inane crap some people post here.

 

[dilbert99]

Herein lies the problem. If Apple were to offer additional iPhone choices (such as a smaller phone), there would be those who complain that Apple is offering too many choices and they need to simplify their product lines

How many phones do you think that Apple offers at the moment? You are making up artificial problems to match a point of view.
How many different cars does Ford make?
How many different types of coke can you buy?

Look at it from another point of view, what if Apple only made a 10" phone, would you complain? Personally I wouldn't buy an SE because it is too small for my liking, that doesn't mean that I would force my views on other customers.
[doublepost=1536987749][/doublepost]

You realize most shareholders (myself included) are customers.

Fortunately, I doubt any Apple execs spend much time reading forums - especially the Macrumors forums - or make decisions based on the inane crap some people post here.

Yes I realize, I also believe in giving people choice. Why should other customers be disadvantaged because of your point of view?

Look at history, it has not been kind to people with narrow points of view.

Would you rather this site was an echo chamber?

I remember being such a fan of Apple, watching every minute of every keynote, now they just grate on me.

 

[noraa]

Apple already offers a confusing product lineup

7, 7+,8,8+,Xs, Xs Max and Xr. At least smaller phones have some sort of easy to recognise distinction.

Thanks for proving my point. Adding a smaller phone would just confuse the lineup even more. (Not that the current lineup is at all confusing...But whatever)

And I'd choose an SE in a heartbeat. Always enjoyed going back to my SE after work.

I really do empathize with those who want a smaller iPhone, but Apple's choice to eliminate the SE is not even remotely close to a sign that Apple is losing (has lost) its way. Apple eliminated the 17" MacBook Pro almost 10 years ago, to many people's dismay. And yet...

Also speak for yourself. Not everyone thinks your way either.

Never said otherwise... That's kinda the point.

 

[dilbert99]

Definitely.

As if selling a 4 inch phone which might have a slightly lower profit margin is going to destroy Apple. Maybe the margins for iPhones would be *Slightly* down if it sold enough, but honestly, Apple makes so much money its not funny.

I should sell my company shares and convert them to Apple shares.

 

[oldmacs]

Thanks for proving my point. Adding a smaller phone would just confuse the lineup even more. (Not that the current lineup is at all confusing...But whatever)

The current lineup is confusing. Multiple same sized screens that look nearly identical, then some of it is differentiated by price on screen size and some of it isn't.

A smaller phone makes far more sense than selling all variants of the 7 and 8 at the same time. There is far more differentiation.

I really do empathize with those who want a smaller iPhone, but Apple's choice to eliminate the SE is not even remotely close to a sign that Apple is losing (has lost) its way. Apple eliminated the 17" MacBook Pro almost 10 years ago, to many people's dismay. And yet...

Never said specially that eliminating the SE was Apple loosing its way. Its a whole host of things in a lot of areas. The SE is just one example of it.

And again making heck tonnes of money is not my singular metric for how well company is doing.

 

[noraa]

How many phones do you think that Apple offers at the moment? You are making up artificial problems to match a point of view.
How many different cars does Ford make?
How many different types of coke can you buy?

Look at it from another point of view, what if Apple only made a 10" phone, would you complain? Personally I wouldn't buy an SE because it is too small for my liking, that doesn't mean that I would force my views on other customers.
[doublepost=1536987749][/doublepost]
Yes I realize, I also believe in giving people choice. Why should other customers be disadvantaged because of your point of view?

Look at history, it has not been kind to people with narrow points of view.

Would you rather this site was an echo chamber?

I remember being such a fan of Apple, watching every minute of every keynote, now they just grate on me.

*sigh* I should learn that a lot of forum members don't respond well to logic.

The argument regarding Apple offering too many offerings vs. not enough is to simply point out the catch-22 that Apple is in. They offer a lot of options, it's too many. Not a lot of options, it's not enough. Right now they do have a lot of options, just not the option YOU want.

This place is already an echo chamber filled with an absurd amount of pessimism. I'm just trying to add a bit of logic to it all - though failing at it at the moment.

 

[dilbert99]

Thanks for proving my point. Adding a smaller phone would just confuse the lineup even more. (Not that the current lineup is at all confusing...But whatever)

Why make the point about others and a confusing lineup then?

I really do empathize with those who want a smaller iPhone,

It doesn't come over that way

but Apple's choice to eliminate the SE is not even remotely close to a sign that Apple is losing (has lost) its way. Apple eliminated the 17" MacBook Pro almost 10 years ago, to many people's dismay. And yet...

And yet what? Apples bottom line is not a measure of how many customers they have pissed off. It just shows they have enough customers that like the iPhone. I could say that 100% of people breathing air will die, that doesn't mean that air is dangerous.

 

[oldmacs]

The argument regarding Apple offering too many offerings vs. not enough is to simply point out the catch-22 that Apple is in. They offer a lot of options, it's too many. Not a lot of options, it's not enough. Right now they do have a lot of options, just not the option YOU want.

It isn't about too many or too few offerings, it is about differentiation.

Apple's current lineup is not well differentiated. A smaller version of the iPhone Xr for example would be a good differentiation.