Comparing 2 Operating Systems - OS X and Windows 10

[dyn]

Someone didn't do a proper job with his homework USB3.1 comes in two flavours called Gen 1 and Gen 2. Gen 1 is better known as USB3.0, Gen 2 is the "actual" USB3.1 with the 10Gbps bandwidth and being able to supply power up to 100W. The real question is...which USB3.1 do the manufacturers and OS makers (in this case Microsoft and Apple) support? I doubt that at the moment anyone supports USB3.1 Gen 2 simply due to the fact that it isn't freely available yet. USB3.1 Gen 1 is (quite obvious as this is just USB3.0 which has been supported for quite some time now).

 

[762999]

That's not the 3.1 standard for 10gbps. It's a 3.0 speed port with a type c connector. The driver for that is still XHCI 1.0.

I know that since it's clearly listed as 3.1 GEN1 on the web site. This thread shows that it's already working with asmedia 1142 (gen2)

https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-info-repository.1866301/page-2#post-21468389

 

[762999]

Someone didn't do a proper job with his homework USB3.1 comes in two flavours called Gen 1 and Gen 2. Gen 1 is better known as USB3.0, Gen 2 is the "actual" USB3.1 with the 10Gbps bandwidth and being able to supply power up to 100W. The real question is...which USB3.1 do the manufacturers and OS makers (in this case Microsoft and Apple) support? I doubt that at the moment anyone supports USB3.1 Gen 2 simply due to the fact that it isn't freely available yet. USB3.1 Gen 1 is (quite obvious as this is just USB3.0 which has been supported for quite some time now).

you're not teaching me anything! Whatever the gen, Macbook is still officially sporting usb 3.1 (even if it's gen1)

someone tested a gen2 chipset on the mac and it was working.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads...-info-repository.1866301/page-2#post-21468389

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

you're not teaching me anything! Whatever the gen, Macbook is still officially sporting usb 3.1 (even if it's gen1)

someone tested a gen2 chipset on the mac and it was working.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads...-info-repository.1866301/page-2#post-21468389

Mate, I'm the guy to talk to on the Mac Pro section about 3.1 on a Mac. I am on that discussion telling everyone about the drivers. OSX only supports 5gbps speed at the moment and has an XHCI 1.0 driver. Windows 10 is the only operating system that has built in XHCI 1.1 driver for 10gbps speed. And I have such a card in my Mac Pro.

 

[dyn]

you're not teaching me anything! Whatever the gen, Macbook is still officially sporting usb 3.1 (even if it's gen1)

Someone considers himself very important I see and it is rather distasteful...I didn't reply to you at all, I replied to @SoyCapitanSoyCapitan since he was talking about USB 3.1 and it being 10Gbps (which only goes for Gen 2, not Gen 1). That's why my post is after his and before yours

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

Too conclude the deal on USB 3.1:

Windows 10 supports it out of the box.

Windows 8.1 requires drivers from Asmedia.

OSX has no built in or third party drivers available and therefore any USB 3.1 (Gen 2) device works as a 3.0 device.

USB 3.1 Gen 1 should never have been called 3.1. It's a sham to call it that.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

Here is the driver provided by Microsoft at the top of the USB tree.

 

[dyn]

And to actually conclude it properly:

Windows 10 supports USB 3.1 Gen 1 (aka USB3.0) and Gen 2.
OS X El Capitan supports USB 3.1 Gen 1 (aka USB3.0) only.

Although I do agree that they shouldn't have turned USB3.1 into a Gen 1 and Gen 2 because it is confusing I also warn to use merely the term "USB 3.1" as this is even more confusing. It's called USB3.0/USB3.1 Gen 1 or USB3.1 Gen 2 and NOT USB3.1.

Thus the screenshot of the device manager says nothing since it only says "USB3.1" without telling which gen it is.

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

And to actually conclude it properly:

Windows 10 supports USB 3.1 Gen 1 (aka USB3.0) and Gen 2.
OS X El Capitan supports USB 3.1 Gen 1 (aka USB3.0) only.

Although I do agree that they shouldn't have turned USB3.1 into a Gen 1 and Gen 2 because it is confusing I also warn to use merely the term "USB 3.1" as this is even more confusing. It's called USB3.0/USB3.1 Gen 1 or USB3.1 Gen 2 and NOT USB3.1.

Thus the screenshot of the device manager says nothing since it only says "USB3.1" without telling which gen it is.

You made such an agreeable post and ruined it with the last sentence.

XHCI 1.1 is the 3.1 Gen 2 driver and my card is Asus USB dual port 3.1 Gen 2. Device Manager would not show a driver for a device that isn't installed.

This describes the revisions of the XHCI spec

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/XHCI#xHCI_1.1

 

[dyn]

Just saying that you are using the wrong screenshot to proof your point. Now if it said USB3.1 Gen 2...

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

Just saying that you are using the wrong screenshot to proof your point. Now if it said USB3.1 Gen 2...

I know this is the internet where people want to be right all the time but sometimes you really got to act like a real world person. XHCI 1.1 is USB 3.1 Gen 2 and if the Wikipedia article with links to Intel white papers, my hardware, my driver, my experience with my computer, and my screenshot aren't good enough evidence then nothing will work for you. It's called cognitive dissonance.

 

[762999]

Someone considers himself very important I see and it is rather distasteful...I didn't reply to you at all, I replied to @SoyCapitanSoyCapitan since he was talking about USB 3.1 and it being 10Gbps (which only goes for Gen 2, not Gen 1). That's why my post is after his and before yours

sorry! my bad!

 

[Ethosik]

- Microsoft is not advertising that it can automatically detect all the peripherals on the market. Non-oem computers are coming with Windows and their drivers pre-installed. If you decide to re-install it yourself, it's expected at some point to install drivers. They support generic peripherals and that's it.

- Native support for USB 3.0 is not included due to delays in the finalization of the standard. So why expect do you expect them to support natively something that was not finished at the time?

My point is, there should be some way to provide standard USB drivers. At least make the USB 3 ports act like USB 2 or something.

What would I have to do if I had no DVD drive in the computer (which most are leaving out these days)? Forced to update to Windows 10 before I re-install?

 

[dyn]

I know this is the internet where people want to be right all the time but sometimes you really got to act like a real world person.

You seem to fit that description perfectly due to failing to understand what somebody is actually trying to say.

XHCI 1.1 is USB 3.1 Gen 2 and if the Wikipedia article with links to Intel white papers, my hardware, my driver, my experience with my computer, and my screenshot aren't good enough evidence then nothing will work for you. It's called cognitive dissonance.

The problem is that your screenshot doesn't add anything or proof anything. It doesn't say which generation USB3.1 is supported. The only thing it says is ASMedia and version 1.10. You have to be in the know to understand that currently only ASMedia has USB3.1 chips that support both Gen 1 and Gen 2. And you have to guess that version 1.10 means 1.1 (1.10 is higher than 1.1, it's what comes after 1.9) AND that this is the version number of the XHCI version instead of the actual driver/hardware itself.

You are so desperately trying to convince people that you are using evidence that isn't very sound. Now you can either keep insulting people like you are doing now or you can follow the advice that is given and next time actually use a screenshot that says more than the one you've used here. Also understand that one should not use generic terms like USB3.1 but specify them especially since Apple has the MacBook that comes with a USB3.1 Gen 1 port that uses the USB Type-C connector. Blame the USB-IF for creating all this mess since they named it, just don't add more confusion.

 

[Ethosik]

You seem to fit that description perfectly due to failing to understand what somebody is actually trying to say.


The problem is that your screenshot doesn't add anything or proof anything. It doesn't say which generation USB3.1 is supported. The only thing it says is ASMedia and version 1.10. You have to be in the know to understand that currently only ASMedia has USB3.1 chips that support both Gen 1 and Gen 2. And you have to guess that version 1.10 means 1.1 (1.10 is higher than 1.1, it's what comes after 1.9) AND that this is the version number of the XHCI version instead of the actual driver/hardware itself.

You are so desperately trying to convince people that you are using evidence that isn't very sound. Now you can either keep insulting people like you are doing now or you can follow the advice that is given and next time actually use a screenshot that says more than the one you've used here. Also understand that one should not use generic terms like USB3.1 but specify them especially since Apple has the MacBook that comes with a USB3.1 Gen 1 port that uses the USB Type-C connector. Blame the USB-IF for creating all this mess since they named it, just don't add more confusion.

How are people adding more to the confusion? I am confused already. I thought there was just USB 3.0 and USB 3.1 and that was it.

 

[dyn]

The problem is that there are 2 kinds of USB3.1:

• Gen 1: this is just USB3.0
• Gen 2: the actual USB3.1 with the 10Gbps of bandwidth

So which one does someone mean when they talk about "USB3.1" ?

 

[hojx]

How are people adding more to the confusion? I am confused already. I thought there was just USB 3.0 and USB 3.1 and that was it.

I'm understanding it as:

1. USB 3.0 = USB3.1 Gen 1 (5Gbps)
2. USB3.1 Gen 2 (10GBps)

Type-C refers to the shape of the port itself.

 

[Ethosik]

I'm understanding it as:

1. USB 3.0 = USB3.1 Gen 1 (5Gbps)
2. USB3.1 Gen 2 (10GBps)

Type-C refers to the shape of the port itself.

Right, so why not just say USB 3.0 and USB 3.1?

The type of connectors doesn't really matter. There is Type A, Type B, Mini A, Mini B, Micro A and Micro B already

 

[SoyCapitanSoyCapitan]

If tech journalists saw his discussion and how some people were refusing to acknowledge the Windows XHCI 1.1 compliant driver and my USB 3.1 hardware were all present and functional in my system it would be the most hilarious thing on the Internet for a week. PC enthusiasts would be laughing at Mac users all day and night.

 

[762999]

My point is, there should be some way to provide standard USB drivers. At least make the USB 3 ports act like USB 2 or something.

What would I have to do if I had no DVD drive in the computer (which most are leaving out these days)? Forced to update to Windows 10 before I re-install?

I understand your point. Personally, all my motherboards have 2x USB2 ports in the back, the others are usb3. It's also possible to inject drivers into the image (before installing).

 

[azpc]

I spent the last two evenings working with Windows 10. Wow! What an improvement.

Apple better start paying more attention to OSX.

Windows 10 in many ways has surpassed OSX (Lion - Yosemite) in ease of use, reliability and speed. Right now it is ahead of El Capitan in these same areas.

With 200 billion in the bank and with Macs being Apple's second best selling product, there is no excuse for Apple ignoring the Mac.

Windows 10 is amazingly fast. My Mom's old Toshiba laptop with an i3 processor completes tasks with the same programs faster than my 27 inch i7 iMac. This should not be!

What should Apple do? Focus on Speed, Reliability, Ease of Use. I know El Capitan is making progress towards these areas and that is good. However, Microsoft is gaining fast and may have actually passed Apple.

Microsoft definitely has an edge in customization. Unlike Apple's Stickers campaign, Windows 10 allows you to customize the operating system, not patch your Mac with a sticker.

Come on Apple don't let Microsoft beat you!

I posted a few ideas for improvement here:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/what-new-features-would-you-like-to-see.1903102/

 

[azpc]

I installed Windows 10 in Bootcamp on my MBP. It's extremely fast, no lags whatsoever (unlike Yosemite), the Edge browser opens instantaneously. I had no hardware issues, everything worked well using the old Bootcamp drivers. It has some things which are clearly inspired by OS X (e.g. the new system settings panel = System Preferences; the Task View = Mission Control; the new notification center). It is designed to work on both laptops and tablets with the interface adapting to each device, something I wish Apple did with OS X. It's a good operating system and to be honest it makes OS X look a little bit dated.

Agreed! What an Amazing improvement. Apple better spend some of that $200 billion and assign more engineers to OSX.

The Mac is Apple's second most profitable product. It is almost unbelievable how Apple ignores it.

 

[762999]

Windows 10 is amazingly fast. My Mom's old Toshiba laptop with an i3 processor completes tasks with the same programs faster than my 27 inch i7 iMac. This should not be!

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/what-new-features-would-you-like-to-see.1903102/

I'm curious, what are those tasks you're talking about? and in what ways you're 27 is slowing you down?

 

[762999]

Yesterday I tried the XBox app (Windows 10). When I entered my xbox account it automatically converted my Windows login account from local to MSN. I rebooted my pc and found out that I couldn't login with the old account and I had to use my MSN passport. I found a way to revert back but every features bundled in the OS is about controlling and getting all your information.

For me the other unwanted feature is that by default, it joins your machine to a p2p network to share patches and updates with other windows owner publicly on the Internet. You can disable it but by default it consumes bandwidth without people knowing.

I still think it's a great achievement for Windows, but it only make me enjoy the Mac more!

 

[azpc]

I'm curious, what are those tasks you're talking about? and in what ways you're 27 is slowing you down?

Shutdown, startup, LibreOffice, Firefox, Picasa etc.

My 27 inch iMac is no slouch, however, Lion-Yosemite is no match to Windows 10 when it comes to speed. Hopefully, El Capitan fixes this speed deficit.