Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[MICHAELSD]

So we're all on Zollotech watch now, right?

It doesn’t look like he gets them early, but usually users in another country will post slo-mo videos tomorrow. I’m really waiting for Notebookcheck.

The only test that matters is our own eyes, since the frequency doesn’t matter if it’s causing issues—or if it isn’t. In an ideal world there would be no headaches or migraines like using a LCD iPhone, and I do honestly go into each new iPhone expecting it to be perfectly fine.

 

[MICHAELSD]

I get surveys after pretty much every iPhone purchase. They are really detailed and I get to evaluate each model I’ve bought as well as my purchase experience. I’ve discussed pwm and its effects on my health with even the LCD models that don’t hurt me. For example, I said that I got this iPhone SE because I can’t use the Pro models anymore and I explained how pwm impacts my health and how relieved I am Apple continues to offer LCD displays on some of their phones. And I express hope I’ll eventually be able to use their OLED models like I can my Android OLED phones. 😈

Because I can use Android OLED phones, even some that had pink tint and looked awful. Yes I can sometimes feel some pwm eye strain but I don’t get alarming neurological effects and never have from an Android OLED phone. I know Android isn’t the answer for most people here. PWM is going to hurt a lot of people no matter what display it’s on.

But for me, Apple does something differently that gives me more serious repercussions than anything I’ve ever felt from an Android display.

They’re getting their panels from Samsung, whose Galaxy panels have not made me sick. THEY know they’re doing something different. They need to adjust whatever “that” is.

Does anyone else get after-purchase surveys? My husband doesn’t. I don’t think I’ve ever failed to get one. I must have signed up at some point and forgot about it.

I haven’t received any post-purchase surveys.

Apple did a lot of follow-up when iPhone X came out, but since then this has been an issue that they’ve been aware of and have been making minimal progress towards solving.

Oddly I haven’t found myself getting the same headaches watching YouTube videos on Samsung phones, but I haven’t tried purchasing one to see if it would cause the same issues in use. I do think their approaches are both different as you’ve pointed out, and Apple has a narrower PWM curve yet Samsung’s Galaxy devices oddly seem to cause less eye strain.

This generation appears to be different and perhaps more encouraging than I was expecting.

Edit: I do have to say of every hands-on video/review I’ve seen, especially the videos with close-ups of the Dynamic Island, the display appears smooth with no visible signs of flickering on camera.

 

[john g.]

slow motion just after 3:30

 

[MICHAELSD]

slow motion just after 3:30

I’m not sure that’s slow-motion, possibly just a slow pan but either way there is a clear trend that the display engine is significantly more smooth.

Good news! The flickering in Sara Dietschy’s video during Netflix at 8:05 is a comparison between iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Pro to demonstrate the difference between the notch and the Dynamic Island.

iPhone 14 appears to have the same flickering we’ve come to expect whereas iPhone 14 Pro is pretty much definitively improved with comparatively no discernible flicker.

 

[happy orchard]

It doesn’t look like he gets them early, but usually users in another country will post slo-mo videos tomorrow. I’m really waiting for Notebookcheck.

The only test that matters is our own eyes, since the frequency doesn’t matter if it’s causing issues—or if it isn’t. In an ideal world there would be no headaches or migraines like using a LCD iPhone, and I do honestly go into each new iPhone expecting it to be perfectly fine.

Right, I figured it might take Zollotech a few days, but I usually appreciate what he has to say and have found it helpful. So let's share when we find out.

I'm with you. It's our experience that's our deciding factor, and I absolutely am going into this 14PM thinking 'This could be great!!!! ....and if it's not, then I will return it and focus my attention on other things that make me happy.....and send Apple feedback!"

 

[happy orchard]

I haven’t received any post-purchase surveys.

Apple did a lot of follow-up when iPhone X came out, but since then this has been an issue that they’ve been aware of and have been making minimal progress towards solving.

Oddly I haven’t found myself getting the same headaches watching YouTube videos on Samsung phones, but I haven’t tried purchasing one to see if it would cause the same issues in use. I do think their approaches are both different as you’ve pointed out, and Apple has a narrower PWM curve yet Samsung’s Galaxy devices oddly seem to cause less eye strain.

This generation appears to be different and perhaps more encouraging than I was expecting.

Edit: I do have to say of every hands-on video/review I’ve seen, especially the videos with close-ups of the Dynamic Island, the display appears smooth with no visible signs of flickering on camera.

Love that there are that many promising videos!!! Getting more excited!

 

[happy orchard]

I’m not sure that’s slow-motion, possibly just a slow pan but either way there is a clear trend that the display engine is significantly more smooth.

Good news! The flickering in Sara Dietschy’s video during Netflix at 8:05 is a comparison between iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Pro to demonstrate the difference between the notch and the Dynamic Island.

iPhone 14 appears to have the same flickering we’ve come to expect whereas iPhone 14 Pro is pretty much definitively improved with comparatively no discernible flicker.

Omg I see that. I see the more flickering in the 14 and less 14P/M --- yay yay yay.

I'll calm down my excitement later. Right now I'm just going to be excitedly hopeful

 

[Mr.Simple]

But was this not the same case with iPhone 13 and Pro/Max that the Pro shows not such flicker on slow motion like the iPhone 13?

 

[Mr.Simple]

I have found this article from asia over google search. They say that the iPhone 14 Pro uses the same 480 Hz PWM frequency like previous generation

è¹ææ£å¼è§£ç¦iPhone14 Proè¯æµï¼æå4800Wåç´ âéé±çåéâï¼_ææºç½æç½

ï¼å¾æºï¼ç½é®ç§æï¼æ|å¯å°èµè®¯9æ14æ¥21:00ï¼ä¹å°±æ¯ä»æ9ç¹éãè¹ææ£å¼è§£ç¦äºææåªä½è¯æµæºçæ°æ®ï¼åæ°ç å大Vçâå½±è§é£é£âãâç½é®ç§æâãâéææ³½âé½å¡ç¹åå¸äºææ°çiPhone14ç³»åè§é¢ã

3g.163.com

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

I have found this article from asia over google search. They say that the iPhone 14 Pro uses the same 480 Hz PWM frequency like previous generation

è¹ææ£å¼è§£ç¦iPhone14 Proè¯æµï¼æå4800Wåç´ âéé±çåéâï¼_ææºç½æç½

ï¼å¾æºï¼ç½é®ç§æï¼æ|å¯å°èµè®¯9æ14æ¥21:00ï¼ä¹å°±æ¯ä»æ9ç¹éãè¹ææ£å¼è§£ç¦äºææåªä½è¯æµæºçæ°æ®ï¼åæ°ç å大Vçâå½±è§é£é£âãâç½é®ç§æâãâéææ³½âé½å¡ç¹åå¸äºææ°çiPhone14ç³»åè§é¢ã

3g.163.com

Well son of a bitch

The iPhone 14 Pro series are all top-of-the-line with Samsung
LTPO material, the brightness is 400nit higher than that of the iPhone 13 Pro, reaching a peak brightness of 1600nits! This
I said that the block screen is the most conspicuous display in the mobile phone industry this year. There is no one, is it not too much? But in terms of eye protection, it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation.
PWM dimming, all of you here if your eyes are flickering
Sensitive: please buy Huawei 1440Hz high frequency PWM machine directly

 

[MICHAELSD]

Omg I see that. I see the more flickering in the 14 and less 14P/M --- yay yay yay.

I'll calm down my excitement later. Right now I'm just going to be excitedly hopeful

Could this be it? I'm already planning to keep it, making up my mind on a case...

 

[MICHAELSD]

Well son of a bitch

The iPhone 14 Pro series are all top-of-the-line with Samsung
LTPO material, the brightness is 400nit higher than that of the iPhone 13 Pro, reaching a peak brightness of 1600nits! This
I said that the block screen is the most conspicuous display in the mobile phone industry this year. There is no one, is it not too much? But in terms of eye protection, it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation.
PWM dimming, all of you here if your eyes are flickering
Sensitive: please buy Huawei 1440Hz high frequency PWM machine directly

I would take this with a grain of salt.

Admittedly I do think there is probably still some degree of flickering, but these sites are notoriously inaccurate at measuring PWM rates.

Edit: I'd like to share another video I came across of someone describing their PWM experience, which can become severe enough to feel like a flu or even to impact performance at everyday activities. I think it's probably accurate that we're becoming more PWM-sensitive over time due to these devices, as I'm even having difficulty using a 14" Mini-LED MacBook Pro without discomfort.

Stop using PWM to modulate brightness on displays.

 

[5105973]

Well son of a bitch

The iPhone 14 Pro series are all top-of-the-line with Samsung
LTPO material, the brightness is 400nit higher than that of the iPhone 13 Pro, reaching a peak brightness of 1600nits! This
I said that the block screen is the most conspicuous display in the mobile phone industry this year. There is no one, is it not too much? But in terms of eye protection, it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation.
PWM dimming, all of you here if your eyes are flickering
Sensitive: please buy Huawei 1440Hz high frequency PWM machine directly

I’m not buying a Huawei. I’ll just keep on with my SE and 11. See if the SE rumors are true and we get one based on the XR.

I’m keeping the 14 Pro Max regardless. If this camera isn’t the piece of junk my 13 Pro camera was, then it will be the new family camcorder. I’ll continue to consume content on my SE3 and 11 and my S22 Ultra.

The most comfortable display I ever used besides those on the 6,7,8 pluses was the OLED display on my Pixel 3XL. It has terrible issues with black crush but it was easy to read on. It was a lousy piece of hardware though. It would cut off calls.

 

[DJTaurus]

So most users here had no issues with 12 pro ?

 

[happy orchard]

So most users here had no issues with 12 pro ?

I did.

My worst was the X. My least worst was the 13. This consistent sort of progress makes me hopeful.

 

[jimmy_uk]

Well son of a bitch

The iPhone 14 Pro series are all top-of-the-line with Samsung
LTPO material, the brightness is 400nit higher than that of the iPhone 13 Pro, reaching a peak brightness of 1600nits! This
I said that the block screen is the most conspicuous display in the mobile phone industry this year. There is no one, is it not too much? But in terms of eye protection, it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation.
PWM dimming, all of you here if your eyes are flickering
Sensitive: please buy Huawei 1440Hz high frequency PWM machine directly

Ugh.

"it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation"
But notebookcheck has the PWM recorded at 510 for the 13 Pro. Are any of these recordings accurate?
Either way, it signals that the display has not had a PWM frequency bump. 😞

 

[PwmMen]

So most users here had no issues with 12 pro ?

I have no problems whatsoever with the iPhone 12 Pro. I couldn't use any of the other devices, at least not any longer. My iPhone 14 Pro arrives tomorrow and I hope it's better. If not, I'll stick with the iPhone 12 Pro, which I'm very happy with.The iPhone 12 Pro has a lower frequency, but the software that drives the display appears to be different. So I hope that Apple will go in that direction again with the iPhone 14 Pro.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

Ugh.

But notebookcheck has the PWM recorded at 510. Are any of these recordings accurate?
Either way, it signals that the display has not had a PWM frequency bump. 😞

View attachment 2063176

Aren’t those the 13 series?

 

[jimmy_uk]

Aren’t those the 13 series?

Yes - sorry I was replying to the part of their comment "it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation".
I've edited my original response.

 

[AJAAY]

I have no problems whatsoever with the iPhone 12 Pro. I couldn't use any of the other devices, at least not any longer. My iPhone 14 Pro arrives tomorrow and I hope it's better. If not, I'll stick with the iPhone 12 Pro, which I'm very happy with.The iPhone 12 Pro has a lower frequency, but the software that drives the display appears to be different. So I hope that Apple will go in that direction again with the iPhone 14 Pro.

It’s crazy we can all have very different experiences with the same phone.

After using the 12 pro, I wanted to gouge my own eyes out with a dull object. It’s was worse than the X for me.

 

[dstow]

Counting down the minutes till zollotech confirms the sum of all fears

 

[Expos of 1969]

And to add to the problem (at least in my case), I just read some comments from some people who have suffered eye burning and headaches from the Samsung Galaxy S22, after having had no problems with the Galaxy S10e (my current phone). Is no phone safe now?

 

[MICHAELSD]

Ugh.

"it is the same 480Hz low frequency as the previous generation"
But notebookcheck has the PWM recorded at 510 for the 13 Pro. Are any of these recordings accurate?
Either way, it signals that the display has not had a PWM frequency bump. 😞

View attachment 2063176

I don't think the measurement is fully accurate.

I won't rule out the possibility of rates being the same as the previous generation, as iPhone 14 having a similar 610Hz rate would explain why videos are able to pick up on the flicker compared to the a more normalized ~ 480Hz on iPhone 14 Pro which should line up with some filming rates.

It is odd that Notebookcheck measured 510Hz for iPhone 13 Pro when other publications measured 480Hz, but I think that Notebookcheck is the most accurate source.

I do believe there is more to the story for iPhone 14 Pro, and we may see the PWM rate change at higher brightnesses.

 

[kargurin]

And to add to the problem (at least in my case), I just read some comments from some people who have suffered eye burning and headaches from the Samsung Galaxy S22, after having had no problems with the Galaxy S10e (my current phone). Is no phone safe now?

I cannot use the S21 or S22. I posted this a couple of years ago....my Note 10+ vs the Pro Max 12 (which I returned). The Note 10 has a PWM of 250 Hz while the Pro Max 12 is 226 Hz. This was a slo mo recording of each from an ipad and while the frequencies are close to one another the recordings look quite different......there is more going on than just the frequency.

 

[Expos of 1969]

I cannot use the S21 or S22. I posted this a couple of years ago....my Note 10+ vs the Pro Max 12 (which I returned). The Note 10 has a PWM of 250 Hz while the Pro Max 12 is 226 Hz. This was a slo mo recording of each from an ipad and while the frequencies are close to one another the recordings look quite different......there is more going on than just the frequency.

So what are you using now? I would be happy with a old style phone just for calls and texts but now you need to be able to handle apps and other things just to function with banks etc.