Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up

[PurpleIsAFruit]

I read that if an iPhone SE releases next year, it's likely to move from LCD to OLED - is this true? If so I'm honestly at a loss what to do about replacing my ageing iPhone XR.

 

[jimmy_uk]

I read that if an iPhone SE releases next year, it's likely to move from LCD to OLED - is this true? If so I'm honestly at a loss what to do about replacing my ageing iPhone XR.

The newest rumours suggests Apple are still deciding between LCD and OLED. I think it depends if they are using an X or XR body. Also we're looking at 2024 for release.

An XR body is where I would place my bet but Apple may not want to give its entry phone stellar battery that competes with the Pro phones so an X body is possible as this had a small battery. I can see an X body as a strong possibility to offer a smaller iPhone to keep sales of the 14 Plus and 14PM strong if you want/need a larger screen.

There are less manufactures for LCD now so OLED maybe easier and cheaper for Apple. It would put to bed the complaints from reviewers that LCD is old tech and Iphone should be “modern” and “competitive” blah blah when compared to Android options.

I think us sensitive folk are all screwed now as I don't see Apple ever addressing the screen issues we have. There are too few of us and the suppliers of OLED and Mini-LED are chasing the cutting edge which is mainly low power consumption, thinness, higher ppi while also maintaining good colours. PWM has to be used so there is no issue for them to address.

SE 2022 and iPad 10, iPad Air M1, iPad Pro 11” 2021 M1 and 11” 2022 M2 maybe the last of the no PWM LCD options for 2023/24. (Not including iPad Mini 6 because the jelly scroll and poor quality LCD are trash). Note that none of these are flagship options and loads will also move to OLED.

(And you can tell from the tone of my reply that I'm very down on this problem. Nowhere to go now with the phasing out of LCD).

 

[Chrispy]

The newest rumours suggests Apple are still deciding between LCD and OLED. I think it depends if they are using an X or XR body. Also we're looking at 2024 for release.

An XR body is where I would place my bet but Apple may not want to give its entry phone stellar battery that competes with the Pro phones so an X body is possible as this had a small battery. I can see an X body as a strong possibility to offer a smaller iPhone to keep sales of the 14 Plus and 14PM strong if you want/need a larger screen.

There are less manufactures for LCD now so OLED maybe easier and cheaper for Apple. It would put to bed the complaints from reviewers that LCD is old tech and Iphone should be “modern” and “competitive” blah blah when compared to Android options.

I think us sensitive folk are all screwed now as I don't see Apple ever addressing the screen issues we have. There are too few of us and the suppliers of OLED and Mini-LED are chasing the cutting edge which is mainly low power consumption, thinness, higher ppi while also maintaining good colours. PWM has to be used so there is no issue for them to address.

SE 2022 and iPad 10, iPad Air M1, iPad Pro 11” 2021 M1 and 11” 2022 M2 maybe the last of the no PWM LCD options for 2023/24. (Not including iPad Mini 6 because the jelly scroll and poor quality LCD are trash). Note that none of these are flagship options and loads will also move to OLED.

(And you can tell from the tone of my reply that I'm very down on this problem. Nowhere to go now with the phasing out of LCD).

You hit the nail on the head with this one. The more I research PWM, the more I realize it's here to stay. Now that OLED is getting to the point that it is cheaper than LCD (quality LCDs, that is), it's going to be the standard going forward. Even cheaper LCDs are starting to use it, like the screen used in the Steam Deck - yet another device I can't use without a headache after 10 mins.

I thought Mini/MicroLED would save us, but it seems PWM is commonly used there as well for many of the same reasons it is used for OLEDs. So, I've purchased the M2 11' iPad Pro, iPad Mini 6, and iPhone SE 2022 knowing they will likely be the last of the LCD retina line. I'm fortunate to not be bothered by jelly scrolling so at least there's that, haha. Not that it will matter soon anyways. The sad reality is sinking in the more I research that, as far as manufacturers are concerned, PWM isn't a problem that needs to be fixed.

 

[jimmy_uk]

You hit the nail on the head with this one. The more I research PWM, the more I realize it's here to stay. Now that OLED is getting to the point that it is cheaper than LCD (quality LCDs, that is), it's going to be the standard going forward. Even cheaper LCDs are starting to use it, like the screen used in the Steam Deck - yet another device I can't use without a headache after 10 mins.

I thought Mini/MicroLED would save us, but it seems PWM is commonly used there as well for many of the same reasons it is used for OLEDs. So, I've purchased the M2 11' iPad Pro, iPad Mini 6, and iPhone SE 2022 knowing they will likely be the last of the LCD retina line. I'm fortunate to not be bothered by jelly scrolling so at least there's that, haha. Not that it will matter soon anyways. The sad reality is sinking in the more I research that, as far as manufacturers are concerned, PWM isn't a problem that needs to be fixed.

Nice, with that setup your good for the next 3-5 years.

 

[jimmy_uk]

Another interesting read about PWM (that I don't fully understand) It certainly throws some of our theories under the bus.

Is AMOLED display bad for your eyes? All you need to know about flicker and PWM​

 

[Chrispy]

For those who want a deep dive into PWM and why it likely bothers us in such strange, unpredictable ways, this is worth a read. It's long but packed with interesting information. Particularly the part that talks in detail about how our eyes deal with motion rejection and how PWM really messes with that natural mechanism. They also site sources, so you can really go down a rabbit hole if a particular part catches your interest.

Is AMOLED display bad for your eyes? All you need to know about flicker and PWM - Tech Longreads

AMOLED display can make you feel bad or cause eye strain, but why? How exactly does PWM and flicker affect your eyes and brain?

techlongreads.com

 

[Chrispy]

Another interesting read about PWM

Is AMOLED display bad for your eyes? All you need to know about flicker and PWM​

LOL! We are clearly on the same journey my friend. We both found our way to the long read, haha.

 

[happy orchard]

So, I've purchased the M2 11' iPad Pro, iPad Mini 6, and iPhone SE 2022 knowing they will likely be the last of the LCD retina line.

I have been thinking of buying the exact same line-up.

The jelly-roll things was a bit annoying, but I don't know that it bothers me the way PWM does. More annoy than bother.

I've been wondering if I should buy now while things are new and fun, or I should wait until later when I absolutely need to replace my devices.

(I'm still enjoying an iPad mini 5 and an iPad Air 3 because they are the last of the white-bezeled generation. And I have 12.9 Pros from the pre-PWM days.)

 

[Chrispy]

I have been thinking of buying the exact same line-up.

The jelly-roll things was a bit annoying, but I don't know that it bothers me the way PWM does. More annoy than bother.

I've been wondering if I should buy now while things are new and fun, or I should wait until later when I absolutely need to replace my devices.

(I'm still enjoying an iPad mini 5 and an iPad Air 3 because they are the last of the white-bezeled generation. And I have 12.9 Pros from the pre-PWM days.)

I may have overdone it a bit getting them all at once, lol. I'm still waiting on the SE since that's going through some kind of weird supply issue at the moment. I was always curious about the iPad Mini, so when it went on sale (and still is I'm pretty sure) for $100 off I jumped on it. The 11" M2 is more a work device and has directly replaced my 10.5" but with the much nicer keyboard. Plus, I think I now have an irrational fear these things are just going to vanish without warning one day, which I realize is completely ridiculous with how many Apple devices are out there in the wild, haha.

 

[happy orchard]

Another interesting read about PWM (that I don't fully understand) It certainly throws some of our theories under the bus.

Is AMOLED display bad for your eyes? All you need to know about flicker and PWM​

This was great: thanks for sharing!

 

[happy orchard]

I may have overdone it a bit getting them all at once, lol. I'm still waiting on the SE since that's going through some kind of weird supply issue at the moment. I was always curious about the iPad Mini, so when it went on sale (and still is I'm pretty sure) for $100 off I jumped on it. The 11" M2 is more a work device and has directly replaced my 10.5" but with the much nicer keyboard. Plus, I think I now have an irrational fear these things are just going to vanish without warning one day, which I realize is completely ridiculous with how many Apple devices are out there in the wild, haha.

OMG I have that fear, too!

But then I try to think that these devices usually make it to the refurbished store, so until they're there, maybe I/we don't need to panic...?

I've been seeing the $100 off on the mini and been considering it, too. Tempted. Very tempted.

I like the 12.9 for work more than the 11, but at some point, the lag will catch up, and I'll likely move to the 11" M2. I've been seeing the M1 on sale, too, but I thought might as well get the M2 because longevity seems a legitimate argument in my/our case.

So I'm presuming that you have the new iPads now: how are they???

Also, any work on the 2022 Air and its possible PWM or other...yucky, yeah I'm gonna say yucky features?

 

[Chrispy]

OMG I have that fear, too!

But then I try to think that these devices usually make it to the refurbished store, so until they're there, maybe I/we don't need to panic...?

I've been seeing the $100 off on the mini and been considering it, too. Tempted. Very tempted.

I like the 12.9 for work more than the 11, but at some point, the lag will catch up, and I'll likely move to the 11" M2. I've been seeing the M1 on sale, too, but I thought might as well get the M2 because longevity seems a legitimate argument in my/our case.

So I'm presuming that you have the new iPads now: how are they???

Also, any work on the 2022 Air and its possible PWM or other...yucky, yeah I'm gonna say yucky features?

I would have loved to go with the 12.9 this time for my work iPad. That extra space and bigger keyboard would be really nice to have. But Apple had to go and ruin it, haha. Also, the deals on the M1 11" aren't nearly as good as the M1 12.9" so that also pushed me to the M2. Completely overkill for what I need, but I figure if this really is the last retina LCD iPad, may as well get the extra performance overhead for five years down the road.

I have been using the iPad Mini 6 for a few weeks now and I'm absolutely in love with it. I use it mostly for gaming and reading in landscape mode, so I rarely encounter the jelly scroll issue. When I do use it in portrait orientation, I'm usually reading something static so I don't really care. Still, it's something that shouldn't be there and shame on Apple for just accepting that as "good enough". So, while it doesn't annoy me, do be aware it's very much there and it is noticeable. But there's no PWM and I get zero eye strain using it, so I'm happy.

The 11" I've had for about a week and it's been great. No issues to report at all. The screen is just as wonderful and easy on my eyes as the 10.5", but with a slightly better contrast ratio. You wouldn't be able to tell without both side by side. It's very much the iPad screen I've grown to know and love, unchanged just how I like it, haha.

I haven't looked at the iPad Air much. I wouldn't think it would have PWM since it's a retina LCD, but you never know these days. It didn't make my consideration list due to the weird storage options. 64 GB isn't enough, but going up to 256 puts you in iPad Pro price territory.

 

[john g.]

After reading that article and realizing that the SE4 might not even happen anytime soon, or if it does, it might be OLED, I resolve to hold onto my 11 and I ordered an SE 2022 with more storage and I’m trading in my SE 2020. I’m just gonna ride this out. Unless a bunch of you try out the 14 plus and think that it is somehow different, I’m pretty convinced that the 14 and the 15 for that matter are no goes for me.
It’s a pity because I really could’ve used the 14 pro series cameras for my business. But if I can’t even look at the screen, they are useless to me.

Edit: So much for my resolve

I decided to pause that idea and I’m going to hear what people say about the 14+ but will likely try one myself. Then I will know that I’ve exhausted my 14 phone options.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

After reading that article and realizing that the SE4 might not even happen anytime soon, or if it does, it might be OLED, I resolve to hold onto my 11 and I ordered an SE 2022 with more storage and I’m trading in my SE 2020. I’m just gonna ride this out. Unless a bunch of you try out the 14 plus and think that it is somehow different, I’m pretty convinced that the 14 and the 15 for that matter are no goes for me.
It’s a pity because I really could’ve used the 14 pro series cameras for my business. But if I can’t even look at the screen, they are useless to me.

I am going to re-try the 14PM first now that my chiropractor has my headaches and symptoms at bay. If that doesn't work out I will try the 14 Plus. My 11 is on the fritz big time. Choosing to have the battery replaced proved to be a huge mistake on my end.

 

[happy orchard]

I would have loved to go with the 12.9 this time for my work iPad. That extra space and bigger keyboard would be really nice to have. But Apple had to go and ruin it, haha. Also, the deals on the M1 11" aren't nearly as good as the M1 12.9" so that also pushed me to the M2. Completely overkill for what I need, but I figure if this really is the last retina LCD iPad, may as well get the extra performance overhead for five years down the road.

I have been using the iPad Mini 6 for a few weeks now and I'm absolutely in love with it. I use it mostly for gaming and reading in landscape mode, so I rarely encounter the jelly scroll issue. When I do use it in portrait orientation, I'm usually reading something static so I don't really care. Still, it's something that shouldn't be there and shame on Apple for just accepting that as "good enough". So, while it doesn't annoy me, do be aware it's very much there and it is noticeable. But there's no PWM and I get zero eye strain using it, so I'm happy.

The 11" I've had for about a week and it's been great. No issues to report at all. The screen is just as wonderful and easy on my eyes as the 10.5", but with a slightly better contrast ratio. You wouldn't be able to tell without both side by side. It's very much the iPad screen I've grown to know and love, unchanged just how I like it, haha.

I haven't looked at the iPad Air much. I wouldn't think it would have PWM since it's a retina LCD, but you never know these days. It didn't make my consideration list due to the weird storage options. 64 GB isn't enough, but going up to 256 puts you in iPad Pro price territory.

We have the same brain.

Yes, I was looking at deals for the M1 11" and, while they were sometimes somewhat nice, thought might as well go the M2. We might need that extra year that gets us.

I forgot that the jelly scroll was only in portrait. That's positive. I can live with that. Likely I will update when I'm ready to give up my white-bezeled 5. And yeah, isn't it fun to get a new device and have it not hurt, like this is what apple fun used to be like!

I'm kinda stoked about the 11". I'm not giving up my 12.9s until they give up on me. But I'm happy to think I'll have at least a pro device that I/we can use int he future.

I'm also with you on the 64 jump to 256 in the Air. That also got me going, why bother when I can just get the Pro.

Also, I've not talked about it much here, but I have issues with the fingerprint sensors. Long story short, my fingertips 'change' frequently enough that I have to redo my fingerprints on devices way too frequently. (Like once a month--and once a week during winter.) So I'm less keen on even the SE2022, but I'll use that if I have to if my 11 fades away. Another reason to like the Pros for me though is definitely FaceID.

I'm glad you've found new additions to your orchard to enjoy. Sorry, it's not the uber-cool phone, but new gear can be so fun. Enjoy.

 

[happy orchard]

I am going to re-try the 14PM first now that my chiropractor has my headaches and symptoms at bay. If that doesn't work out I will try the 14 Plus. My 11 is on the fritz big time. Choosing to have the battery replaced proved to be a huge mistake on my end.

Maybe keep your eyes out on the refurbished store. I'm thinking about trying to find a spare 11 because who knows when we'll get a Face ID with LCD again...ever.

Also, yep, I'm trying the 14PM again. Trying to not overthink it for a bit. Just use it for a couple weeks and then reflect. Do I reach for it? Do I not reach for it? Are my headaches any different/frequent? Just live and see.

Good luck. Keep me/us posted.

 

[john g.]

Plus, I think I now have an irrational fear these things are just going to vanish without warning one day, which I realize is completely ridiculous with how many Apple devices are out there in the wild, haha.

This is why I ordered the 2022 SE with a step up in storage.
Edit: Cancelled my order. Might give the 14+ a try before completely giving up on the 14 series

 

[Ac1d 8urn]

After reading that article and realizing that the SE4 might not even happen anytime soon, or if it does, it might be OLED, I resolve to hold onto my 11 and I ordered an SE 2022 with more storage and I’m trading in my SE 2020. I’m just gonna ride this out. Unless a bunch of you try out the 14 plus and think that it is somehow different, I’m pretty convinced that the 14 and the 15 for that matter are no goes for me.
It’s a pity because I really could’ve used the 14 pro series cameras for my business. But if I can’t even look at the screen, they are useless to me.

I will likely be trying a 14 plus soon, I'll report back here if/when I do. It didn't bother my eyes in best buy today so I'm hopeful 🤞

 

[nadiamo]

Let us know how you get on.

Well, I had two days on this new iPhone 14 now. I have to say it has been a much better experience comparing to 14 Pro.

- With 14 Pro, the screen was way too bright for me from the beginning no matter what setting I put it on. It took me a while to get used to the bright white background/letters, but then I think that eventually led to dizziness and eye fatigue. 14 is way better. Right now I have the RWP at 30%, True Tone on(might turn this off as well see how it goes. I actually liked it off on my 11), auto-brightness, awareness off.
- Also I don't know how to describe it, but when I had the 14 pro, every time I looked at 14 pro screen, there's a tightness around my temples for a few seconds. But this has NOT been the case with the regular 14. Fingers crossed!
- So with 14, it felt different than my 11(and it still does whenever I go back to the 11). My eyes felt slightly strained but honestly I had little sleep for the past two days and still fighting a sinus infection, so I don't want to say it's 100% due to the new 14.
- I'm also more careful this time with playing the phone in dark at night.

So far I'm feeling hopeful that I might finally be able to upgrade my old 11(main complain is the 64gb storage, and screen turns darker whenever the phone gets hot) again. I will continue to report back before my 14 days are up.

 

[Chrispy]

This is why I ordered the 2022 SE with a step up in storage.

I learned after hitting the storage limit on both my 2017 iPad Pro and XR to step up one level from base. Went with 256 on both the Mini 6 and iPad Pro 11 this time, and stepped up to 128 on the SE. I thought 64 would be plenty back when I got my older devices, but I held onto them a lot longer than I expected. The XR especially. So this time I'm planning ahead!

 

[john g.]

I learned after hitting the storage limit on both my 2017 iPad Pro and XR to step up one level from base. Went with 256 on both the Mini 6 and iPad Pro 11 this time, and stepped up to 128 on the SE. I thought 64 would be plenty back when I got my older devices, but I held onto them a lot longer than I expected. The XR especially. So this time I'm planning ahead!

I feel so up and down sometimes. I just put the pause on the SE order because I want to see what people say about the 14+ and most likely try it out for myself first. Then I will feel like I exhausted all possibilities. Then hopefully the SE will be there for me to order as a known quantity. I agree with you though I have a 64 gig and 128 is a better sweet spot

 

[loby]

This. It is likely due to PWM dimming. All prior iPhones did not use PWM, rather, a constant current dimming technique. When you see 'flicker free' desktop monitors, this is what they are referring to. Some people are very sensitive to PWM flicker. All OLED phones use PWM except for the LG V30 (edit- it also uses PWM but barely noticeable). While this display is far worse than Samsung OLED + iPhone X, I have to give LG credit for doing it right.

I am slightly sensitive to PWM flicker but the iPhone X is far less fatiguing than the Pixel 2 (non-XL, Samsung OLED) that I had. It has to do with the frequency + brightness level the manufacturers set for PWM, which I can't even start to explain, but the gist is the higher the frequency, the better it is on the eyes / less noticeable. Any experts / people who know much more about this feel free to chime in. PWM is a big problem I have with OLED phones. Had my LG V30 not had horrible banding and blotching I would've kept it and not gotten the X.

Had to go back to my old Apple 2009 matted monitor as my 4k started to bother me (came from a thunderbolt monitor and the glare eventually got to me too). Spend a lot of time for work etc. on screens, so as I get older, my eyes get strained easily with the bright 4k screens or glossy finish.

To my surprise, the old monitor looks great and I don't have the issue with strain. Small text doesn't look as sharp as the 4k, but acceptable. Works well with my M1 MacBook Pro 2021 with and HDMI adapter to DVI.

 

[john g.]

Well, I had two days on this new iPhone 14 now. I have to say it has been a much better experience comparing to 14 Pro.

- With 14 Pro, the screen was way too bright for me from the beginning no matter what setting I put it on. It took me a while to get used to the bright white background/letters, but then I think that eventually led to dizziness and eye fatigue. 14 is way better. Right now I have the RWP at 30%, True Tone on(might turn this off as well see how it goes. I actually liked it off on my 11), auto-brightness, awareness off.
- Also I don't know how to describe it, but when I had the 14 pro, every time I looked at 14 pro screen, there's a tightness around my temples for a few seconds. But this has NOT been the case with the regular 14. Fingers crossed!
- So with 14, it felt different than my 11(and it still does whenever I go back to the 11). My eyes felt slightly strained but honestly I had little sleep for the past two days and still fighting a sinus infection, so I don't want to say it's 100% due to the new 14.
- I'm also more careful this time with playing the phone in dark at night.

So far I'm feeling hopeful that I might finally be able to upgrade my old 11(main complain is the 64gb storage, and screen turns darker whenever the phone gets hot) again. I will continue to report back before my 14 days are up.

That sounds encouraging. Please do give feedback. I am considering trying the plus version.

 

[happy orchard]

This is why I ordered the 2022 SE with a step up in storage.
Edit: Cancelled my order. Might give the 14+ a try before completely giving up on the 14 series

You cancelled your SE?! Why? Couldn’t you still get it and hold on to it while trying out the 14s?

…okay I read more posts and saw more that you wrote. I get it. Still think it would be okay to have the SE as backup. But it likely won’t go anywhere for at least a few months (and probably longer), so you’re not likely missing your only chance.

It’ll be fun to see how your next experiment goes. Good luck!

 

[john g.]

You cancelled your SE?! Why? Couldn’t you still get it and hold on to it while trying out the 14s?

…okay I read more posts and saw more that you wrote. I get it. Still think it would be okay to have the SE as backup. But it likely won’t go anywhere for at least a few months (and probably longer), so you’re not likely missing your only chance.

It’ll be fun to see how your next experiment goes. Good luck!

Thanks. It’s kind of my version of sleeping on it.