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Has Apple finally given up on the MP?

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flat five said:
heh, right.
for example, I'm in the process of buying a new CNC machine this summer.. it's about 11x the cost of a 12core Mac Pro.. rent on my shop is like buying a Mac Pro every month.
the computers are the cheap part of the business equation.
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It's only the hobbyists who hang out on Macrumors bitching about the Mac Pro 6,1 who find it expensive because they are paying out of their own pockets. In fact out of the bitching seems to be done by those who never bought a new Mac Pro & have only been able to afford a used system now the prices are lower.

If you are earning money with your Mac Pro (or car or plotter or camera or CNC machine) then $100-200/month or more is peanuts compared to the income that it should be generating.
 
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flat five said:
depends on what you mean by capability. if you mean you can no longer insert and remove 4 hard drives then yes, the capability is no longer there.. so if your job is to put drives in&rout of computers all day then yes, you've been screwed over..
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Why does it have to be "put drives in&out of computers all day"? Can't it be "Install four internal hard drives? What about installing various PCIe cards? Did you forget about that aspect?

flat five said:
But I think most people view capability as what you can accomplish, content wise, on a computer... in which case, capability has either improved or side stepped.
there are, I imagine, very very few examples of 'I used to be able to do ____ on a Mac but can't anymore'.... probably no examples of that of any note.
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What you think is irrelevant. What makes you feel your thoughts override others needs? You continue to miss this one important aspect: It's not about you and what you think.
 
ITguy2016 said:
Why does it have to be "put drives in&out of computers all day"? Can't it be "Install four internal hard drives? What about installing various PCIe cards? Did you forget about that aspect?


What you think is irrelevant. What makes you feel your thoughts override others needs? You continue to miss this one important aspect: It's not about you and what you think.
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Not sure you're getting the whole forum concept, a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.
 
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Apple sending customers to competitors after its TBD discontinuance announcement sends a strong message they have left the monitor business. While this doesn't mean Apple is leaving the Mac Pro business, it certainly doesn't leave me sanguine either. Undoubtedly Apple is evaluating ( or has evaluated ) whether the revenue from an updated or new Mac Pro is sufficient to justify the costs. Clearly that's not their only decision but today's Apple is driven by stock price and profit, so any decision to update has to clear the cost/revenue hurdle. My own anecdotal observations indicate potential strong demand for a new Mac Pro.
 
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thefredelement said:
Not sure you're getting the whole forum concept, a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.
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This is not an exchange of ideas or views but rather his dictating his opinions onto others. People are saying the nMP does not meet their needs (whereas the cMP did). His (and others) response: I understand your needs better than you do. He's being dismissive of their needs based on his thoughts.

It's like Toyota doing away with all of their trucks and offering a Prius in their place (in the interest of compactness and energy efficiency because the trucks were too bulky and energy inefficient). When people say they want a truck he tells them they don't really need a truck. That all people really need is a Prius but if they need more capacity than the Prius offers they can always put on a trailer because the Prius is equipped standard with a trailer hitch. When people tell him no, this will not do he tells them "No, you really don't understand your needs...but I do...and a Prius with a trailer hitch is all you need".

EDIT: Updated the first sentence to better convey my thought.
 
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nigelbb said:
It's only the hobbyists who hang out on Macrumors bitching about the Mac Pro 6,1 who find it expensive because they are paying out of their own pockets. In fact out of the bitching seems to be done by those who never bought a new Mac Pro & have only been able to afford a used system now the prices are lower.

If you are earning money with your Mac Pro (or car or plotter or camera or CNC machine) then $100-200/month or more is peanuts compared to the income that it should be generating.
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I'm not exactly sure what you are talking about, businesses generally aren't successful by needlessly flushing money away. The price for the current Mac Pro is a joke compared to any other workstation. Is $3000 a lot overall? No, not really, but when you can get something far better for half the price... it's absurd.
 
ITguy2016 said:
Why does it have to be "put drives in&out of computers all day"? Can't it be "Install four internal hard drives? What about installing various PCIe cards? Did you forget about that aspect?


What you think is irrelevant. What makes you feel your thoughts override others needs? You continue to miss this one important aspect: It's not about you and what you think.
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because they didn't remove the ability to add drives or pcie cards and whatnot.
the capability still exists and in many ways, is far more customizable to an individual's needs.

if putting a few drives InsidE is to be considered a capability then yes, it's gone... if 'adding more storage' is the capability, then no, it's not gone.

really nothing to do with what I think or how I work or what my particular needs are.
 
WordMasterRice said:
I'm not exactly sure what you are talking about, businesses generally aren't successful by needlessly flushing money away. The price for the current Mac Pro is a joke compared to any other workstation. Is $3000 a lot overall? No, not really, but when you can get something far better for half the price... it's absurd.
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In the scheme of things it's far from absurd. Total cost of ownership of a Mac Pro is not merely the purchase price. Good residual resale value, ease of maintenance & support etc Most businesses would lease anyway so would never look at a $3K price tag. The `Mac Pro 6,1 is an amazing machine & if I was still doing video editing professionally I would lease one without question. As it is I cannot justify replacing my 2008 Mac Pro 3,1 that i did purchase new for about the equivalent of $3K.
 
flat five said:
because they didn't remove the ability to add drives or pcie cards and whatnot.
the capability still exists and in many ways, is far more customizable to an individual's needs.

if putting a few drives InsidE is to be considered a capability then yes, it's gone... if 'adding more storage' is the capability, then no, it's not gone.

really nothing to do with what I think or how I work or what my particular needs are.
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Yes, that's a capability. One which is no longer present in the nMP. Now you see why people are upset. With this will you finally stop arguing against people who want / need this capability?
 
I'm definitely starting to give credence to the theory that Apple has basically abandoned the Mac Pro, and will simply continue selling the current model until the volume drops to a point below break even for carrying it. The more time that goes by, the more the Mac Pro seems like the Thunderbolt Display -- a zombie product. The more time that goes by, the more you think that if they were going to update it they probably would have done it by now.

I'm not saying that's what has happened necessarily, I could be, and hope that I am wrong. However, it's been long enough now that entertaining that idea is not unreasonable.
 
WordMasterRice said:
I'm not exactly sure what you are talking about, businesses generally aren't successful by needlessly flushing money away. The price for the current Mac Pro is a joke compared to any other workstation. Is $3000 a lot overall? No, not really, but when you can get something far better for half the price... it's absurd.
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The part you're not considering is things like SW not everyone is like Adobe that will let you switch to PC if you own a Mac license.

My office has been Mac since time eternal so for me to switch is going to kill my budget which isn't all that generous to begin with. For me it will mean less tyvec less foam core, less 60" paper, less ink, less other paper stock, less stock photos and graphics, no additional training and on and on. The initial cost of the change to a Windows based system is no inconsequential the question is not changing penny wise and pound foolish. I need to figure out what I'm going to do by this time next year so I can get quotes in and try to get it added to the FY18 budget so I can reduce my budget pain. Apple has never given a road map and that was OK because there was alway a Power Mac or Mac Pro on the offer while that still exists I'll need to factor in "other". I have the advantage of having HP and Dell here and a contract with them for our server stuff as well as other work stations we also have an Apple business account and rep, I've known them all a long time so I'll be able to go to them with what I need and get an out the door price but those prices are concerning.

Like I said earlier my plotter was 11k it has 12 ink holes a 700 per, the computer really in itself isn't the expensive part.
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ITguy2016 said:
Yes, that's a capability. One which is no longer present in the nMP. Now you see why people are upset. With this will you finally stop arguing against people who want / need this capability?
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This is the one thing I've always sort of agreed with F5 about..it's vastly more convenient to put HD's in the box and leave the externals as archive and bulk storage. After I got over the F5 is dum stage I realized that smallish internal and storage external is how I've always used my laptops (though for a different reason) so it's not that big of a deal to carry that over. Where I disagree with him is on my desktop I ALWAYS want my scratch internal no matter if an TB drive is just as fast. So I'm kind of in the middle here
 
lowendlinux said:
This is the one thing I've always sort of agreed with F5 about..it's vastly more convenient to put HD's in the box and leave the externals as archive and bulk storage. After I got over the F5 is dum stage I realized that smallish internal and storage external is how I've always used my laptops (though for a different reason) so it's not that big of a deal to carry that over. Where I disagree with him is on my desktop I ALWAYS want my scratch internal no matter if an TB drive is just as fast. So I'm kind of in the middle here
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F5 is entitle to his opinion. However he needs to keep in mind it is just that: An opinion. Personally I see little benefit to having a sleek, small form factor when this is the result:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mac-pro-rising.1979012/page-13#post-23067041

This seems fairly representative of anyone using external storage with their Mac Pro. The small size of the Mac Pro is lost here.
 
ITguy2016 said:
F5 is entitle to his opinion. However he needs to keep in mind it is just that: An opinion. Personally I see little benefit to having a sleek, small form factor when this is the result:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mac-pro-rising.1979012/page-13#post-23067041

This seems fairly representative of anyone using external storage with their Mac Pro. The small size of the Mac Pro is lost here.
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And he expresses as his opinion..

No one answered his question earlier about what finished product they could produce on the cMP that they cannot on the nMP and I thing the reason is there is none.

I want a box with slots, I want to swap cards, I want to build my way, I want flexibility, so I build my stuff at home. Whern I'm at work I need (notice the change) to get stuff done on a time line and I need to get it done everyday without fail. My MP at work has all the things people here talk about two optical drives, 4 hard drives, as much RAM as a SP Mac Pro will take and various ever changing PCI cards but moving more macro I could do all those things with a nMP I would just have to buy differently.

This is actually why I started my thread that got deleted because I wanted to know HOW people switched platforms but it wasn't worded effectively.
 
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lowendlinux said:
And he expresses as his opinion..
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Then why argue with others about theirs? Might as well argue about which color is the best color.

lowendlinux said:
No one answered his question earlier about what finished product they could produce on the cMP that they cannot on the nMP and I thing the reason is there is none.
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What can one haul in a truck which one cannot haul with a Prius and a trailer?
 
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lowendlinux said:
I'll leave you to ponder the engine, the lack of a frame for towing heavy weight, the lack of mirrors for large trailers, and on an on..

But yes some will need trailers for their nMP
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Sounds like a perfect analogy. You didn't think I picked the Prius at random did you?
 
nigelbb said:
It's only the hobbyists who hang out on Macrumors bitching about the Mac Pro 6,1 who find it expensive because they are paying out of their own pockets. In fact out of the bitching seems to be done by those who never bought a new Mac Pro & have only been able to afford a used system now the prices are lower.

If you are earning money with your Mac Pro (or car or plotter or camera or CNC machine) then $100-200/month or more is peanuts compared to the income that it should be generating.
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exactly right.
I try to upgrade annually on my hardware [except Mac Pro obviously.....] and maybe lose 50% of the original cost. However if you look at in a slightly different way, the money generated from the computer it is an extremely low cost tax deductible tool
 
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