I think I've had a change of heart on the ARM Macs.

[Budgiemac]

I can't imagine buying an 8GB RAM machine in 2021, especially since it's soldered on and can't be changed. As the 1.0 ARM Mac, it will be the first to have support dropped and be forgotten (remember the Intel Core Solo?)

For me, I have to wait for the Pro ARM Macs and hopefully a 32GB Max

yeah but they were selling 4gb macs not that long ago. the better the os gets the higher the ram will be.

 

[splifingate]

Why would you even claim that? They won‘t, coz it makes no sense

Maybe not in Your lifetimes.

"It" is a sensible outcome to a sensible need . . . Colonists on Mars (or the labourers in the platforms around Jupiter) neither need--nor need-not know--that we used to have separate (and oft-disparate) devices caretake our daily lives.

It will be visual, and it will be auditory . . . the 'OS' has [already] taken back-stage to the Data (which is all We really need to know).

Regards, splifingate

 

[staypuftforums]

The safari tabs you have open are probably the issue. Poorly designed web-sites.
If you buy the low end option (8GB RAM) then you need to use it like a low end machine.

You can't get more low end than basic web surfing. OP says he only had a few tabs open.

 

[jimmirehman]

I've created and worked on 3GB+ Large format Photoshop files on my M1 MacBook Pro with 8GB of Ram, only occasionally if i have a ton of other stuff open, including photoshop with the large file open, do i get memory issues. I think Big Sir and the M1 manages memory very well. That being said, when the new ones come out later this year, i will be upgrading to a 16GB model just to be safe and future proof.

 

[BeefCake 15]

I wonder how many of these posts come from Intel's HQ?

 

[petvas]

I wonder how many of these posts come from Intel's HQ?

You mean the OP's post?

 

[Paulo Henrique Baldassi]

I bought an Air, I opened it up and put a gelid on it so it transfers some of the heat to the shell. So I'll say that now before people say they have had a different experience to me.

will i lose the warranty if i open the mac to put the thermal pad? I Have a Air M1 too...

 

[BeefCake 15]

You mean the OP's post?

And others similar...

 

[trip1ex]

The next gpu isn't going to be a 2060 equivalent. Mac is never going to be the place for gaming.

And 8gb is fine for avg use. If you want more then buy more.

If you want an M1 laptop that doesn't throttle as much then you can buy that too. It's called the Macbook Pro.

 

[JMacHack]

I wonder how many of these posts come from Intel's HQ?

There’s many sources of FUD, maybe it’s Intel HQ, maybe it’s a few fanboys, maybe it’s actual Mac users with misguided expectations.

 

[Weisswurstsepp]

And yet I see so many posts on here complaining about why things cost so much more in the EU than in the US, why features are not available in the EU, why products are not available in the EU, etc. The more a government controls what the product is, what it can do, what is must cost, what services must be supplied with it, how long the warranty must be, how repairable it must be, etc., the more expensive the product will be and the fewer choices you will have.

The main reason many things are not available immediately in the EU has is mostly due to language. While English is the default language in the US, it isn't throughout Europe, and localizing content takes time and costs money. On the other side, here in the UK we get (almost) anything Americans get and usually in a timely manner (and that has already been the case when Britain was still an EU member), simply because Britain is an English-language country and localization is limited to minor things like adding an additional 'u' to 'color'.

Things are more expensive over here because Europe uses VAT, and while that's comparable the the US Sales Tax it's notably higher (usually somewhere in the region of between 17% to 23% depending on the country). Yes, it's more expensive than the US, but then we get a lot of benefits (longer warranty, right to resell or transfer software no matter what some EULA wants to dictate and so on), too. And then there's the GDPR which reigns in at least the more serious privacy violations by businesses.

There are certainly things which are more difficult to implement in Europe than the US (such as services which handle personal data) but for most part it's the language which is the stumbling block.

 

[pshufd]

Things are more expensive over here because Europe uses VAT, and while that's comparable the the US Sales Tax it's notably higher (usually somewhere in the region of between 17% to 23% depending on the country). Yes, it's more expensive than the US, but then we get a lot of benefits (longer warranty, right to resell or transfer software no matter what some EULA wants to dictate and so on), too. And then there's the GDPR which reigns in at least the more serious privacy violations by businesses.

One minor note: some states don't have sales taxes at all and it varies among the states that do have one.

We have shoppers from out-of-state and even other countries visit for shopping (and tourism).

 

[trip1ex]

Things are more expensive over here because Europe uses VAT, and while that's comparable the the US Sales Tax it's notably higher (usually somewhere in the region of between 17% to 23% depending on the country). Yes, it's more expensive than the US, but then we get a lot of benefits (longer warranty, right to resell or transfer software no matter what some EULA wants to dictate and so on), too. And then there's the GDPR which reigns in at least the more serious privacy violations by businesses.

longer warranty etc doesn't come out of the VAT tho right? Warranty would be provided by Apple not government? So I imagine you not only pay a higher tax but Apple charges more to cover the extra warranty etc.

 

[Weisswurstsepp]

One minor note: some states don't have sales taxes at all and it varies among the states that do have one.

We have shoppers from out-of-state and even other countries visit for shopping (and tourism).

I know that not all states have a sales tax (for example CA, where I spent a lot of time pre-COVID, does have it) and that for someone from Europe the mix of state and local sales taxes can be quite confusing, especially the cash register shock when you find out the price on the label on the shelf isn't necessarily the price you have to pay at checkout

longer warranty etc doesn't come out of the VAT tho right? Warranty would be provided by Apple not government? So I imagine you not only pay a higher tax but Apple charges more to cover the extra warranty etc.

Yes and no. There are two kinds of warranty (note that this is about business with consumers, not business to business!):

1. Manufacturer warranty which is completely voluntary (i.e. a manufacturer can freely decide if a warranty is placed upon a product and under what conditions), although if granted then the warranty terms become legally binding (so a manufacturer can't just promise a warranty and then later decline to fulfill it if a claim is within the warranty's constraints)

2. Seller warranty which is regulated by law and mandatory (some countries use a different term than warranty, for example in Germany it's "Gewaehrleistung" while manufacturer warranty is "Garantie"). Seller warranty originates from the contract between buyer and seller and stipulates that the item has to be of merchandisable quality (requires goods to be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose) so it serves for a time that such a product can reasonably be expected to work. If a specific specimen of that product does fail prematurely then (if evidence to the contrary is absent, e.g. there are no signs of misuse of that item) there's the assumption that the failure is because the item in question was not of merchandisable quality, in which case the seller is required to either repair the item or replace it with a same or similar one at no cost to the buyer.

Like sales tax in the US, seller warranty is handled differently across EU countries. Some put a short time limitation on the assumption that a product failed because it was not of merchandisable quality (in some countries like Germany it's 6 month, after that it's up to the buyer to prove that a failure was caused because the product quality wasn't up to scratch, and the overall seller warranty coverage is capped at 2 years after the original sale), others (like the former EU member UK) work on an assumption of how long a similar item could be reasonably expected to last (so for example a washing machine which dies after 25 months would be considered to be of unsatisfactory merchandisable quality and would need to be repaired/replaced by the seller).

Seller warranty not only covers physical goods but also electronic ones (i.e. software downloads).

It should also be noted than the EU doesn't recognize implied contracts such as the US does where a sale contract between buyer and seller implies another contract between buyer and manufacturer (think shrink-wrap licenses). Unless such a constellation is explicitly stated in the contract between buyer and seller (i.e. the manufacturer becomes a contract signee and both parties are aware of this when closing the sale) then only a contract between buyer and seller exists. For this reason, shrink-wrap licenses and EULAs are generally meaningless in the EU unless they were explicitly part of the original contract (which, at least for physical goods sold through 3rd party shops, they rarely are). For the same reason, general software sales (where you buy a physical copy of some software in a 3rd party shop) in the EU have generally been not grants of a license to use but sales of goods (although with the advent of software vendor operated web stores and SaaS this has shifted somewhat). And even where an EULA becomes part of a legal contract they are limited in what they can stipulate (for example, arbitration is a no-no). Which means in the EU no EULA can prevent you from transferring your OEM Windows copy from one computer to another one, or to sell on your legally bought software.

Tl;dr: while Europeans pay more due to VAT which is higher than the sales tax in the US they also get a lot more rights and protection than US consumers. But no, seller warranty isn't "funded" by VAT, the warranty is a legal obligation put onto commercial sellers who sell to consumers.

 

[trip1ex]

I know that not all states have a sales tax (for example CA, where I spent a lot of time pre-COVID, does have it) and that for someone from Europe the mix of state and local sales taxes can be quite confusing, especially the cash register shock when you find out the price on the label on the shelf isn't necessarily the price you have to pay at checkout




Yes and no. There are two kinds of warranty (note that this is about business with consumers, not business to business!):

1. Manufacturer warranty which is completely voluntary (i.e. a manufacturer can freely decide if a warranty is placed upon a product and under what conditions), although if granted then the warranty terms become legally binding (so a manufacturer can't just promise a warranty and then later decline to fulfill it if a claim is within the warranty's constraints)

2. Seller warranty which is regulated by law and mandatory (some countries use a different term than warranty, for example in Germany it's "Gewaehrleistung" while manufacturer warranty is "Garantie"). Seller warranty originates from the contract between buyer and seller and stipulates that the item has to be of merchandisable quality (requires goods to be as described, of satisfactory quality and fit for purpose) so it serves for a time that such a product can reasonably be expected to work. If a specific specimen of that product does fail prematurely then (if evidence to the contrary is absent, e.g. there are no signs of misuse of that item) there's the assumption that the failure is because the item in question was not of merchandisable quality, in which case the seller is required to either repair the item or replace it with a same or similar one at no cost to the buyer.

Like sales tax in the US, seller warranty is handled differently across EU countries. Some put a short time limitation on the assumption that a product failed because it was not of merchandisable quality (in some countries like Germany it's 6 month, after that it's up to the buyer to prove that a failure was caused because the product quality wasn't up to scratch, and the overall seller warranty coverage is capped at 2 years after the original sale), others (like the former EU member UK) work on an assumption of how long a similar item could be reasonably expected to last (so for example a washing machine which dies after 25 months would be considered to be of unsatisfactory merchandisable quality and would need to be repaired/replaced by the seller).

Seller warranty not only covers physical goods but also electronic ones (i.e. software downloads).

It should also be noted than the EU doesn't recognize implied contracts such as the US does where a sale contract between buyer and seller implies another contract between buyer and manufacturer (think shrink-wrap licenses). Unless such a constellation is explicitly stated in the contract between buyer and seller (i.e. the manufacturer becomes a contract signee and both parties are aware of this when closing the sale) then only a contract between buyer and seller exists. For this reason, shrink-wrap licenses and EULAs are generally meaningless in the EU unless they were explicitly part of the original contract (which, at least for physical goods sold through 3rd party shops, they rarely are). For the same reason, general software sales (where you buy a physical copy of some software in a 3rd party shop) in the EU have generally been not grants of a license to use but sales of goods (although with the advent of software vendor operated web stores and SaaS this has shifted somewhat). And even where an EULA becomes part of a legal contract they are limited in what they can stipulate (for example, arbitration is a no-no). Which means in the EU no EULA can prevent you from transferring your OEM Windows copy from one computer to another one, or to sell on your legally bought software.

Tl;dr: while Europeans pay more due to VAT which is higher than the sales tax in the US they also get a lot more rights and protection than US consumers. But no, seller warranty isn't "funded" by VAT, the warranty is a legal obligation put onto commercial sellers who sell to consumers.

yeah but I wouldn't associate VAT with the rights and protection of consumers because you're not paying higher taxes to get a longer warranty.

IN other words, it doesn't cost more in taxes for the government to set a law demanding a 2 yr warranty vs a 1 yr warranty from sellers.

 

[dmccloud]

Try running an alternative browser to see if memory usage is better.

I run Safari with often hundreds of tabs, and it loves to suck up my RAM, regardless of architecture and OS version.

My bandaid solution is to check activity monitor and look in your memory tab sort by memory used. You might be shocked by the consumption of RAM by various tabs, especially over time (Gmail). Usually this is a memory leak of some kind.

Since I have lots of tabs opened up it's a hassle to identify the specific window, but I get by by going into the Safari debug menu and turning on Debug -> Misc. Flags -> Show Web process ID in Page Titles.

This means you can find the PID from Activity Monitor in the Safari title.

This helps because Activity Monitor is not apple scriptable, but now that we have the PID to show in Safari's window title, we can manually input the RAM hogging pages into an applescript to manipulate Safari, using Script Editor.

Compile this into an app and put it in your dock. Check your activity monitor for pages that keep growing in RAM usage and run the applescript to bring the offending safari page to the front and close it, or copy pasta into a fresh tab to start the RAM hog cycling over again.

set question to display dialog ("Find Safari tab whose name includes:") default answer ""
set searchpat to text returned of question

tell application "Safari"
    --
    -- *** Step 1. get a list of all tabs that match "searchpat" ***
    set winlist to every window
    set winmatchlist to {}
    set tabmatchlist to {}
    set tabnamematchlist to {}
    repeat with win in winlist
        if (count of tabs of win) is not equal to 0 then # ignore spurious windows with no tabs
            set tablist to every tab of win
            repeat with t in tablist
                if (searchpat is in (name of t as string)) or (searchpat is in (URL of t as string)) then
                    set end of winmatchlist to win
                    set end of tabmatchlist to t
                    set end of tabnamematchlist to (id of win as string) & "." & (index of t as string) & ".  " & (name of t as string)
                end if
            end repeat
           
        end if
    end repeat
    --
    -- *** Step 2. open the desired matching tab ***
    if (count of tabmatchlist) = 1 then
        set whichtab to (item 1 of tabnamematchlist)
        my openTab(whichtab)
    else if (count of tabmatchlist) = 0 then
        display notification "No matches"
    else
        set whichtab to choose from list of tabnamematchlist with prompt "The following tabs match, please select one:"
        if whichtab is not equal to false then
            my openTab(whichtab)
        end if
    end if
end tell

on openTab(whichtab)
    tell application "Safari"
        set AppleScript's text item delimiters to "."
        set tmp to text items of (whichtab as string)
        set w to (item 1 of tmp) as integer
        set t to (item 2 of tmp) as integer
        set current tab of window id w to tab t of window id w
        set index of window id w to 1
        -- this code is an essential work-around to activate a specific window ID in Mojave
        tell window id w
            set visible to false
            set visible to true
        end tell
    end tell
end openTab
tell application "Safari"
    activate
end tell

Do you know if this script could be altered to work with another browser (i.e., Firefox or Edge) as well?

 

[dmccloud]

They don’t need to do it now. Remember. M1 is STILL a beta chip for Mac, no matter how long it has been for iOS devices. Designing a good chip is very difficult.

After the transition period ends, apple can suddenly pull the plug and flip the switch so macOS becomes a glorified iOS with no advanced feature people love today. I’d love to see how people reacts to all of that.

The beta was the Developer Transition Kit that used an A12z inside the chassis. Apple has gone on record as stating that Mac OS and iOS/iPadOS will continue to be separate entities going forward, so your "predictions" regarding the Mac becoming a glorified iPad makes no sense, especially given that the Mac still lacks a touchscreen, which is the PRIMARY interface method on both the iPad and iPhone. The use cases for the Mac are significantly different from the iPad and iPhone to the point at which unifying the OSes makes no sense from any perspective.

 

[Ethosik]

You know, circa 2009-2015, it was a pretty decent platform for casual gaming.

Mac is still a perfect platform for casual gaming. I use it all the time. I don't need my $2,500 custom built gaming PC for Stardew Valley or Factorio.

 

[Ethosik]

You are comparing a larger device with the smaller ones. No 13" retina intel Macbook Pros ship with discrete GPU. They all have integrated intel graphics. The same with Macbook Airs. The larger 16" Macbook Pro should be compared to its future Apple Silicon replacement. The larger form obviously allow faster and/or extra components.

It's like complaining the Macbook air has integrated GPU and not as fast as a PC tower with nVidia RTX 3090...

Not to mention a $1,600 Dell laptop uses Intel integrated graphics too.

 

[pshufd]

Mac is still a perfect platform for casual gaming. I use it all the time. I don't need my $2,500 custom built gaming PC for Stardew Valley or Factorio.

I'm using my 2015 MacBook Pro for watching videos. It keeps me warm when it's cold. These things must generate a lot of heat with gaming.

 

[Ethosik]

You can't get more low end than basic web surfing. OP says he only had a few tabs open.

This isn't the 90s anymore. Websites can be more intensive than Word these days.

 

[pshufd]

I've seen Firefox using 6 GB of RAM on my system. That shouldn't be a problem on the M1 systems though; unless there's something about the page or something running in the background. I can diagnose performance problems but the vast majority of people can't and that's a problem. Hard to tell without a reproducer.

 

[Shirasaki]

The beta was the Developer Transition Kit that used an A12z inside the chassis. Apple has gone on record as stating that Mac OS and iOS/iPadOS will continue to be separate entities going forward, so your "predictions" regarding the Mac becoming a glorified iPad makes no sense, especially given that the Mac still lacks a touchscreen, which is the PRIMARY interface method on both the iPad and iPhone. The use cases for the Mac are significantly different from the iPad and iPhone to the point at which unifying the OSes makes no sense from any perspective.

2007 iPhone release Steve Jobs famously said stylus sucks. Now we have Apple Pencil, basically an advanced stylus. He kept saying smaller iPhone holding in one hand only made sense. Now we have 6.7” iPhone that is more popular than iPhone mini. Nothing is carved on stone and worshipped like bible. I believe Apple is just not ready for a hybrid sort of devices yet cause they probably haven’t figured out to build one that meets their high standard. Once timing is correct, things will change.

 

[One2Grift]

I wonder how many of these posts come from Intel's HQ?

Oh it's not just Intel's astroturfers, the astros will be from Facebook and others. Microsoft was shown to have done it years ago (they were the first I knew of but very unlikely the actual first). If public opinion can be swayed, the powerful will use it (I'd be shocked if Apple and Google and others don't have or had their own at one time or another). The average user does themselves a favor to consider that. Take 30 seconds to click on a poster's name to quickly review the past posting to see 'what's up' (if they are nothing but anti Apple posts on an Apple board, that should tell you something. If on a public posting board they have their previous posts hidden, that tell you something). Purely anti apple posters are many (some likely under multiple user names) and therefore my ignore list is many .

Unfortunately it seriously mires what should be one of the greatest buying feedback loops for us consumers/users. Customers able to get together en masse to provide valuable product and services feedback. Yet the astro methods have ruined so many, for example, of the Amazon ratings (and it's not just astros, lots of 'Im on a mission because I hate ___' do too). Ultimately, for the big companies it does virtually nothing to them. Apple will announce results in 3 weeks and very likely crushed earnings. That astro and hater crap only hurts us consumers by muddling the buying picture. Worse, if I or someone else has an actual problem and post it regarding our purchased Apple or Google or Samsung or whatever product, everyone is justified in assuming it's just astro/hater nonsense and skip over it.

 

[One2Grift]

I'm using my 2015 MacBook Pro for watching videos. It keeps me warm when it's cold. These things must generate a lot of heat with gaming.

That's hilarious but true. I don't have an older MB Pro but expect it's similar to my old HP laptop. That thing barely fit in any carrying case I could find. A capable device in its time that awesomely doubled as a heater (and if having trouble sleeping it provided great ambient room fan noise )