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I like how it reassures people to say it's not a hardware problem.

Then rollback to whatever OS X you were using before if you think it's a OS X problem, problem solved.

So far in this thread I have YET to see one guy who said "I rolled back, now my Mac is 100% working fine".

PS : on my iMac 2013 that had IR I still had it when rebooting to Windows...
 
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I like how it reassures people to say it's not a hardware problem.

Then rollback to whatever OS X you were using before if you think it's a OS X problem, problem solved.

So far in this thread I have YET to see one guy who said "I rolled back, now my Mac is 100% working fine".

PS : on my iMac 2013 that had IR I still had it when rebooting to Windows...
Yes. My Time Machine Backup is complete. I am just finding a day free so I can install El Capitan to see if the issue is related to hardware.

Interesting anecdote here is why most retina displays are showing IR more in recent months as compared to earlier.

In other case a good idea is to visit Apple store and check if display models have such behavior or if staff permits, you can check it for yourself.
 
I like how it reassures people to say it's not a hardware problem.

Then rollback to whatever OS X you were using before if you think it's a OS X problem, problem solved.

So far in this thread I have YET to see one guy who said "I rolled back, now my Mac is 100% working fine".

PS : on my iMac 2013 that had IR I still had it when rebooting to Windows...
There's a distinction to be made here. Most people I've seen talking about it either think it's a driver issue or firmware related. If it's a driver thing then rolling back to the previous OS should fix it. If it's firmware, though, rolling back to the last OS probably won't write the old firmware back onto the display controller. Swapping to Windows definitely wouldn't.

My guess is there was a firmware update for the display controller included with the High Sierra update, and that's what's causing my particular problem. The reason I think it's firmware related and not purely a bad panel is primarily because I've had lots of experience with burn in on display hardware over the years, and the symptoms I'm seeing just don't match up.
 
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There's a distinction to be made here. Most people I've seen talking about it either think it's a driver issue or firmware related. If it's a driver thing then rolling back to the previous OS should fix it. If it's firmware, though, rolling back to the last OS probably won't write the old firmware back onto the display controller. Swapping to Windows definitely wouldn't.

My guess is there was a firmware update for the display controller included with the High Sierra update, and that's what's causing my particular problem. The reason I think it's firmware related and not purely a bad panel is primarily because I've had lots of experience with burn in on display hardware over the years, and the symptoms I'm seeing just don't match up.
Exactly. High Sierra updated something customers are not aware of. That would also mean a future update would patch the bug silently.

If we cross match this issue with recent iPhone 8 displays, which stopped working with recent iOS update and later another iOS update patched the problem. That means and update CAN directly affect the display behavior.
 
in my iMac 27" 2015 (LG screen) image retention showed up after 2 years of usage, I'm currently on Sierra 10.12.6, there was no problem with image retention on El Capitan

my monitor LG 27" IPS connected to the desktop PC also has a problem with image retention (after Windows Fall update)
 
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in my iMac 27" 2015 (LG screen) image retention showed up after 2 years of usage, I'm currently on Sierra 10.12.6, there was no problem with image retention on El Capitan

my monitor LG 27" IPS connected to the desktop PC also has a problem with image retention (after Windows Fall update)

This means that Sierra is the problem then and definitely not a hardware problem, let's all downgrade to 10.11 then, thanks for the fix !
 
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in my iMac 27" 2015 (LG screen) image retention showed up after 2 years of usage, I'm currently on Sierra 10.12.6, there was no problem with image retention on El Capitan

my monitor LG 27" IPS connected to the desktop PC also has a problem with image retention (after Windows Fall update)
This means that Sierra is the problem then and definitely not a hardware problem, let's all downgrade to 10.11 then, thanks for the fix !

Are these iMacs built just for one macOS version?
Update to the next one and... IR?

Again, how is this possible? By overdriving the power to Display?
 
I was just kidding.

I think it's just that usually whenever you upgrade your OS X it's at least 1 y later (obviously).
IR usually begins after 2 years or so from my experience, thus sometimes it falls right when a new version of OS X is released.

In my case, IR began well before High Sierra, I noticed it in Sierra already. At first I thought it were just random OS X glitches so didn't bother. Then much later I started to google the issue and eventually noticed that people had it specially on the first MBP Retina quite fast (but I had it on a non retina screen anyway).

Might have been easier to notice on High Sierra but if that's the case my guess would be that it's just because time had passed.

My guess is if it affects all screens (doubt it else Apple would have reacted... Most likely only people who HAVE IR are posting about it, making it as if it was widespread), I'll start to notice it in 10.15 in my case (since I just bought a iMac Pro), then will prolly blame 10.15 like people here blame High Sierra...

So far so good but my iMac Pro is only 3 months old.

But one thing I might agree with people here is I think it's related to heat (but maybe again it's a coincidence) : I had no sign of IR for 3 years until I started to do lots of video editing/encoding and thus stress the iMac a lot almost 12h a day.

So it's possible that the iMac Pro might not have this issue since it uses a completely different cooling system.

But one guy here says that his LG screen has the issue too so... might be not the case after all and just time passing...
 
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I haven't had any image retention on my 2017 iMac but it does appear to be a common problem with the panels that Apple are using in their MacBook Pros and iMacs. My 2015 iMac, which was replaced by Apple with this one, developed it within six months after I purchased it – it was originally refurbished, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was refurbished from a previous owner that had the same problem!

I've not had a high-end display before like the iMac has, so I can't really compare it against a third party high-end display but if anything, it should the lower quality displays that cost less to produce exhibiting these kinds of issues. It's just not right for a high-end machine to have a problem like this, despite the nature of IPS panels.

Has anyone experienced IR with third party displays that somewhat match the quality of the panels on the iMac? It can't just be iMacs and MacBook Pros that exhibit this problem the most across the industry.

What's certain is this is not caused by software.
 
I haven't had any image retention on my 2017 iMac but it does appear to be a common problem with the panels that Apple are using in their MacBook Pros and iMacs. My 2015 iMac, which was replaced by Apple with this one, developed it within six months after I purchased it – it was originally refurbished, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was refurbished from a previous owner that had the same problem!

I've not had a high-end display before like the iMac has, so I can't really compare it against a third party high-end display but if anything, it should the lower quality displays that cost less to produce exhibiting these kinds of issues. It's just not right for a high-end machine to have a problem like this, despite the nature of IPS panels.

Has anyone experienced IR with third party displays that somewhat match the quality of the panels on the iMac? It can't just be iMacs and MacBook Pros that exhibit this problem the most across the industry.

What's certain is this is not caused by software.
Retina displays on Macs have Apple specific design. The panels are driven by custom timing controller.

I have used many professional grade IPS panels which cost over $1K sometimes. But never had any IR. However the IPS glow and light bleed problems are across the industry.

Newer high end OLED TVs are also suffering from burn-in type problems. I guess the problem is pixels being too close to each other. The high dpi is playing some role here. High end doesn't mean problem free in todays industry.

Look at the attached photo of iMac 5K display I took. There isn't enough room between pixels.

Another interesting aspect of IR on macs is the retention is kept even of you completely power off the iMac. I do not understand why a moving screen saver can cure IR as well as changing background or moving objects around. While it retains the image for days even if there is no power.
c8699550aa2a149cc1b02c59a067833f.jpg
 
I think it's just a perfect example of why this whole thinner obsession just doesn't add up when designing desktop and indeed laptop computers with chips that get hot and need ventilation

I honestly have never looked at my 5k and thought - great mac but i just wish it was 2 mm slimmer !!

Lighter maybe , smaller bezel , thinner chin , but thinner case ? nah

Maybe when we've all transitioned to arm chips it'll stop being an issue
 
Is there any cleaning instruction on how to remove the dust from inside the imac 5k ?
Stupid APPLE glued the screen on, so I do not want to remove the screen to get to all internal parts.
Older iMacs had magnetic screen attachments. But surely glue is 30ct cheaper for greedy Tim Dick and his shareholders.

Is it sufficient to vacuum the bottom vents and then the grill on the back above the RAM slots?
 
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I think it's just a perfect example of why this whole thinner obsession just doesn't add up when designing desktop and indeed laptop computers with chips that get hot and need ventilation

I honestly have never looked at my 5k and thought - great mac but i just wish it was 2 mm slimmer !!

Lighter maybe , smaller bezel , thinner chin , but thinner case ? nah

Maybe when we've all transitioned to arm chips it'll stop being an issue

Exactly. No one would have cared if iMac was 2mm thicker or may be 10mm. It's a desktop PC and made to run all day, trying to make it thin for the sake of aesthetic at the cost of overheating or IR makes no sense. Despite being a great computer and joy to use. But sometimes, there can be too much of something and in this case it's the obsession with making everything thin.

No one is going to cut vegetables with their macs :)
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Is there any cleaning instruction on how to remove the dust from inside the imac 5k ?
Stupid APPLE glued the screen on, so I do not want to remove the screen to get to all internal parts.
Older iMacs had magnetic screen attachments. But surely glue is 30ct cheaper for greedy Tim Dick and his shareholders.

Is it sufficient to vacuum the bottom vents and then the grill on the back above the RAM slots?

Blowing air or vacuum to get the dust out from ducts and fan is pretty normal maintenance. However we are all suffering from same problem, my 5K iMac also has dusty spots near bottom corners. I think someone managed to take apart the display and clean it, but that would require special tools + a replacement glue strip to put it back together.

Also there is no way to get to the fan without completely disassembling the iMac. Vacuum or pressured air is your only option to clean the fan and RAM slots. Just remember, do not blow air into the bottom intakes.
 
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my 2017 iMac still does not show any hints of image retention.


My 2017 iMac which is barely used is showing signs.
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My guess is there was a firmware update for the display controller included with the High Sierra update, and that's what's causing my particular problem.
For your own particular problem perhaps its a software issue but I can say, with complete 100% certainty, that the displays Apple uses in the iMac are just horrible panels. As I've said I've owned a 2012, 2014 and 2017 iMac and they all developed retention. Moreover, I went through multiple panels with the 2014, and the retention persisted in Windows also meaning it wasn't software related.
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I was just kidding.

I think it's just that usually whenever you upgrade your OS X it's at least 1 y later (obviously).
IR usually begins after 2 years or so from my experience, thus sometimes it falls right when a new version of OS X is released.

In my case, IR began well before High Sierra, I noticed it in Sierra already. At first I thought it were just random OS X glitches so didn't bother. Then much later I started to google the issue and eventually noticed that people had it specially on the first MBP Retina quite fast (but I had it on a non retina screen anyway).

Might have been easier to notice on High Sierra but if that's the case my guess would be that it's just because time had passed.

My guess is if it affects all screens (doubt it else Apple would have reacted... Most likely only people who HAVE IR are posting about it, making it as if it was widespread), I'll start to notice it in 10.15 in my case (since I just bought a iMac Pro), then will prolly blame 10.15 like people here blame High Sierra...

So far so good but my iMac Pro is only 3 months old.

But one thing I might agree with people here is I think it's related to heat (but maybe again it's a coincidence) : I had no sign of IR for 3 years until I started to do lots of video editing/encoding and thus stress the iMac a lot almost 12h a day.

So it's possible that the iMac Pro might not have this issue since it uses a completely different cooling system.

But one guy here says that his LG screen has the issue too so... might be not the case after all and just time passing...

I am intimately familiar with the retention problem, having experienced it for 6 years on 3 iMacs and 6+ panels in total.

The issue is the panels apple uses, and the retina ones are made by LG, which if you buy their standalone 5k display also has retention issues:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/image-retention-lg-5k-owners-help-needed.2038477/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/lg-ultrafine-4k-ghosting-burn-in.2021478/

If you search the forums it looks like there are LOTS of angry people with this LG monitor and the iMac (especially the 2012-2014 maybe since they're older) who are angry about this issue. I myself have lurked on the forum for a long time and have followed this issue closely, but then I only signed up because I got into PowerPC.

I am content with the fact that Apple WILL NOT fix this issue, because they DO NOT care about the Mac, we can see that easily:

1. AVOID the iMac because they all have LG panels with a crippling flaw that causes image retention
2. AVOID the MacBook Pro because the keyboard is terrible, keys easily die, and the hinge makes annoying pop noises
3. AVOID the mac mini because it hasn't been updated in years
4. AVOID the mac pro because it hasn't been updated in years

We can see where Apple's priorities really are... The iPhone X and iPad Pro are fantastic. The Mac not so much. This year Apple is bringing iOS app support to MacOS, iOS 12/13 bring a lot of multitasking and desktop features to iOS. In 2020 they're moving the Mac from Intel to ARM. Apple didn't train their employees how to provide support to the iMac Pro whereas in the past they always did much better.

In the next 2-5 years Apple will kill the Mac off completely. MacOS is 20 years old, and hardly any effort is being put into improving MacOS or Mac hardware.
 
Haven't seen any image retention on my 2017, and I can sometimes sit there for two hours with the basically white-box Mail app open.
 
For some strange reason the IR on my iMac has reduced quite a bit recently. I was playing around with color profiles a few days back if that makes any difference. This is exactly why I think software has some role in the issue.

Also yesterday I found a nifty App on AppStore, "DeskCover". It's free and what it does is put a color overlay on your desktop except the active window. Those with severe IR problems can use a white overlay whicu can be enabled or disabled using a hotkey.
 
For some strange reason the IR on my iMac has reduced quite a bit recently. I was playing around with color profiles a few days back if that makes any difference. This is exactly why I think software has some role in the issue.

Also yesterday I found a nifty App on AppStore, "DeskCover". It's free and what it does is put a color overlay on your desktop except the active window. Those with severe IR problems can use a white overlay whicu can be enabled or disabled using a hotkey.

It's not a software problem. Please don't try to convince yourself otherwise. If you use the display, it will develop the problem over time. What you may have found is software based solutions to make a hardware problem less noticeable. You could achieve a similar result by never having the same window in the foreground for more than 10 minutes at a time. In other words, by changing the way you use your computer: it does not alter the fact it is a hardware problem.

What you do about that is your choice, but to me, Apple have a responsibility to fix it and to do so entirely at their own expense. I got mine replaced, and I would suggest you try and do the same. The issue is PERMANENT and WILL REOCCUR no matter how much you, Apple or someone else tries to convince you otherwise.

How many times do we have to repeat this for everyone to get the message: we have BEEN THERE, DONE THAT AND IT DOES NOT WORK.
 
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It's not a software problem. Please don't try to convince yourself otherwise. If you use the display, it will develop the problem over time. What you may have found is software based solutions to make a hardware problem less noticeable. You could achieve a similar result by never having the same window in the foreground for more than 10 minutes at a time. In other words, by changing the way you use your computer: it does not alter the fact it is a hardware problem.

What you do about that is your choice, but to me, Apple have a responsibility to fix it and to do so entirely at their own expense. I got mine replaced, and I would suggest you try and do the same. The issue is PERMANENT and WILL REOCCUR no matter how much you, Apple or someone else tries to convince you otherwise.

How many times do we have to repeat this for everyone to get the message: we have BEEN THERE, DONE THAT AND IT DOES NOT WORK.
No you misread my post. I am not denying it as software only problem however it does play some role.

The App I mentioned is a separate tip which I found later, it will not fix the issue but a good productivity app nonetheless.

What I am saying is the IR is reduced in last few days which is a random event and sometimes it gets worse.
 
I did some researching on this topic since my 2012 has been very bad lately. Many signs point to this being Metal(2?) related, Metal 2 being released with High Sierra.

I turned off metal, restarted, and my IR hasn't been nearly as bad, and the 'lines' haven't reappeared thus far.

Here are the terminal commands to disable Metal and see if it helps any:

Code:
sudo defaults write /Library/Preferences/com.apple.CoreDisplay useMetal -boolean no

sudo defaults write /Library/Preferences/com.apple.CoreDisplay useIOP -boolean no

Perhaps Metal 2 was stressing the GPU too much in our Macs and causing this problem.
 
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All of these comments speaking how the issue is related to Metal is a big facepalm, the screen burn in develops over the time and it's just a coincidence to match the timing when a new Metal version is released. It's like saying "My screen is broken, I hope the next macOS release fixes the issue." All LCD screens develop image retention or burn in however you wanna call it, some more intensive than others, I think it's something people just need to get used to since there's no magical powder that can be applied to fix image retention.
 
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