iPhone XS Max Is the mobile reception on the xs Max even worse than iPhone X ?

[JPack]

FCC tests phones for radiation and interference compliance. They're not anandtech testing for quality and speed.

1. FCC doesn't do the testing. The reports are supplied by UL on behalf of Apple.

2. The testing costs $10,000 and is far more comprehensive than what Anandtech can do.

3. Radiated power is correlated with antenna gain and signal strength. There is no situation where having lower radiated power and lower gain are beneficial to signal strength.

The XS and XS Max have an objectively poorer performing antenna. It is significantly worse than iPhone 8 and X. How this translates to dropped calls or lower transfer rates is TBD.

 

[vinegarshots]

1. FCC doesn't do the testing. The reports are supplied by UL on behalf of Apple.

2. The testing costs $10,000 and is far more comprehensive than what Anandtech can do.

3. Radiated power is correlated with antenna gain and signal strength.

Field Test showed nearly equal signal strength on my XSMax and 7Plus, which doesn't seem to make sense re: #3 point above, unless Im missing something (and I say nearly because the Max actually showed a little bit higher strength)

 

[jtrue28]

What a cluster. And here we sit with Apple not saying a GD thing. 7 days and counting.

 

[vinegarshots]

What a cluster. And here we sit with Apple not saying a GD thing. 7 days and counting.

Nah, if you want a REAL cluster, you need to go back to the gen 1 Xbox360 RRoD days...
[doublepost=1538088315][/doublepost]

View attachment 789781 My test results all done at my kitchen table. All 3 phones were on iOS 12. Really also odd is that the 8 was running extremely slow as well. The older 6S Plus was clearly the champ here. A restore as new did help the 8 but not the Max. I also have an IPad Pro 9.7 that had had zero issues and runs as usual on LTE. The iPad has not been updated.

Honestly, I think that it’ll come out that there is both a software or firmware problem as well as hardware issues.


And....look at me, I saved my Memoji and still have it. LOL

Hmmm...your 8 is slower than normal because its only getting a 3G signal instead of LTE. And your Max only got a LTE signal twice out of 5 tests (others were 3G like the 8). That is weird!

 

[Nhwhazup]

My test results all done at my kitchen table. All 3 phones were on iOS 12. Really also odd is that the 8 was running extremely slow as well. The older 6S Plus was clearly the champ here. A restore as new did help the 8 but not the Max. I also have an IPad Pro 9.7 that had had zero issues and runs as usual on LTE. The iPad has not been updated.

Honestly, I think that it’ll come out that there is both a software or firmware problem as well as hardware issues.

I posted the speed tests to this forum showing 4 Apple devices at my house. 3 of the 4 were normal LTE download speeds for us at 3 - 4. I know pitiful but normal. The Max was running at between .12 and .14 download and yes that is a decimal point.

Others have also posted their screen tests.

At the Apple store they did a restore as new and didn’t seem surprised when it still tested extremely low. They didn’t even try to talk me out of a return.

And I can honestly say, I really like the Max and still want another as soon as this issue has been addressed and I stand a good chance of getting a phone that works.

And as I’ve said before, I’m not a troll.

And....look at me, I saved my Memoji and still have it. LOL

 

[aka777]

Did you actually read their LTE test parts 1 through 15? Or are you going to keep acting clueless?

I love it when people mention stuff they have no idea about but assume their gut feelings are the equivalent of experience. I have decades of experience in wireless, so I know what these FCC reports are and more importantly what they're for.

 

[Wags]

And if wasn't a major problem the engineering team wouldn't be trying hard to get there hands on devices with wifi and cellular issues

Sounds like they could pretty much just walk into any store and just get any random iPhone.

 

[aka777]

View attachment 789781 My test results all done at my kitchen table. All 3 phones were on iOS 12. Really also odd is that the 8 was running extremely slow as well. The older 6S Plus was clearly the champ here.

Thanks for sharing. Ideally, the speed tests need to run at the same time.

What I find interesting is that the 6s is faster, as it's physically not possible based on the chipset it's using. It literally does not support 256QAM or 4x4 MIMO or CA of any sort. The very tech that makes an Xs LTE data xx times faster.

 

[madKIR]

I'm not sure how you would come to the conclusion that because your phone works, everyone else is suffering from mass delusion. And if you'd read this thread, it's not about speedtests, it's about dropped calls and signal loss.

The poll is now running at almost 44% of users experiencing worse signal.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/iphone-xs-xs-max-signal-poll.2142585/

The wiwavelength posted that the upcoming XR with the old antenna design performed far better in tests than the XS/XS Max. That is objective, verifiable data.
https://www.wiwavelength.com/2018/09/iphone-xr-trades-4x4-mimo-for-greater.html?m=1
https://www.wiwavelength.com/2018/09/iphone-xs-and-xs-max-mostly-fail-to.html

You're making it into some kind of us-vs-them fight when it's just about people wanting their phone to work. To believe that it's an android conspiracy is both tribalistic and bizarrely paranoid.

So it looks like Apple could not deliver a proper 4x4 MIMO antenna design this year. They had to catch up to the competition and fell short. The X/Xr design is more reliable signal wise.

 

[nephipower]

Yes they asked me to do it . They want these devices so they can track down the problem . They are telling me it's not a software issue. I am back to my Iphone 7

Apple has been doing this for years and it is called an engineering capture. That way they can test and troubleshoot with exact hardware that has been problematic from a user.

This is necessary to help diagnose whether it is a hardware or software issue.

 

[jlevy73]

I have 2 XS Max in my house both on Verizon. Compared to my X, in good reception zones, XS max has much improved speeds. I'm seeing over 100MB down vs 60-70 for the X. One of my XS Max does get much faster wifi speeds then other. Not sure what's up there, but running at the same time one hits the max of 300MB down while the other is closer to 200 down. The biggest issue is in areas of poor reception, which is exactly the same issue I had with the X. For example, coming out of an elevator where there is no reception, my phone will grab a 3G connection and stay there unless I toggle airplane made off and on. At my house where my reception was lousy with the X, nothing has improved on the XS. Still get 1-2MB down. I'm not sure I have a reception issue as much as Verizon just sucks where I live. Really wish I could move to T-mobile but they are even worse where I live.

 

[nephipower]

I said this earlier but I am going to reiterate things again.

You guys seem to be spending a lot of time and energy arguing whether it is an Intel vs Qualcomm modem issue or a bad antenna design. The fact of the matter is that NO ONE here, including myself, is qualified to definitively say whether the issue is caused by bad hardware, software, or a combination of the hardware and software working together.

Personally, despite it having a less performant antenna design I feel like it is more a software issue because as many have reported Airplane mode, Restart, or Reset Network Settings temporarily fixes the issue. If it was completely antenna design problem then it wouldn't work at all.

However, frankly we are wasting a lot of time posting here how many bars you have and how fast are your speedtests. While helpful to see if you are experiencing major performance degradation you should really be focusing your energy on working with AppleCare support. This is what I am doing.

The best way to solve the problem is to work with AppleCare to get the baseband profile installed which enables debug logging for cellular.
https://developer.apple.com/bug-reporting/profiles-and-logs/

Then you will need to reproduce the issue and create a sysdiagnose which compresses a bunch of logs together. Then get these files over to support who then send the files to engineering. It is only then that engineering can finally take a look at the hard data and dig through 1000s of lines of logs to try and figure out what is the root cause.

Then after root cause is found then they can work on writing and testing a code fix.

Spend less time doing speed tests and more time working with AppleCare to gather logs to send to Engineering!

 

[Nhwhazup]

Nah, if you want a REAL cluster, you need to go back to the gen 1 Xbox360 RRoD days...
[doublepost=1538088315][/doublepost]

Hmmm...your 8 is slower than normal because its only getting a 3G signal instead of LTE. And your Max only got a LTE signal twice out of 5 tests (others were 3G like the 8). That is weird!

Absolutely bizarre I agree. This is why I think it’s a combination of software and hardware problems. The LTE signal earlier in the day for the Max was not at my house but downtown. We have always had LTE signal at the house. The Max actually only got the 3G download speed ever at the house. I totally thought initially it was all software related as the Max and 8 were both on iOS 12. I had to swap my Sim back to the 6S Plus to see that it was the only phone in the house with LTE. The Plus also on iOS 12. Believe me I was trying to figure it all out in hopes of getting a fix for it. Apple ran all their tests on it and could definitely see how slow it was on LTE in their store. They weren’t able to fix it.

The other thing with the Max was that I could do a hard reset and get LTE for like 3 minutes and then it would revert to showing 4G but only test at 3G.
[doublepost=1538091296][/doublepost]

Thanks for sharing. Ideally, the speed tests need to run at the same time.

What I find interesting is that the 6s is faster, as it's physically not possible based on the chipset it's using. It literally does not support 256QAM or 4x4 MIMO or CA of any sort. The very tech that makes an Xs LTE data xx times faster.

I know nothing about the chipset or 4x4 MIMO - not that technical. These are actual test results. They are what they are. I did capture all these to bring in to show Apple. They didn’t even look at them, only the Max which they clearly could see had an issue that they couldn’t fix at this point. Thus the return.

The test results for the 6S Plus were a couple of minutes delayed as I had to swap the Sim to it and fire it up. And faster? I wouldn’t say the results are fast at all but at least getting LTE and not 3G.

 

[Packers1958]

I love it when people mention stuff they have no idea about but assume their gut feelings are the equivalent of experience. I have decades of experience in wireless, so I know what these FCC reports are and more importantly what they're for.

Staying at a Holiday Inn doesn't make you an expert.

 

[JoeyD74]

I’ll just say, for reasons I don’t know, in areas without great reception my max sucked. It would constantly drop calls or not get any service. If I’m in the city of anywhere that had good signal it was perfect.

 

[athand]

I’ll just say, for reasons I don’t know, in areas without great reception my max sucked. It would constantly drop calls or not get any service. If I’m in the city of anywhere that had good signal it was perfect.

Unfortunately that's exactly how a low performant antenna behaves...

 

[skywalkerr69]

I’ve had my xs max for a day and so far the crappy Verizon lte that I got with my iPhone X is still crappy on my xs max. Not a difference at all.

 

[starbucks1222]

Awful compared to my 8+. It’s been a week and I am beyond frustrated with my service issues. I didn’t have any issues with my 8+.

 

[dominiongamma]

Awful compared to my 8+. It’s been a week and I am beyond frustrated with my service issues. I didn’t have any issues with my 8+.

Agree I’m hoping this will be a iOS update

 

[michael31986]

That's what I am seeing

Is this the norm

 

[maccuser]

I didn't believe it when I first read it on macrumors and didn't think it would be this bad (compared to iPhone X). But I have the iPhone Xs max and the phone drops LTE like I have not seen since I switched to Verizon from Sprint 5 years ago. I haver not had a dropped call on Verizon's LTE and this happened today. I don't understand how a bigger phone which should have bigger antennas would have a weaker signal that my iPhone X which I just sold on eBay.

Anybody know if the modem can affect the antenna signal? or is this a problem with the design? Isn't the design pretty much the same as iPhone X? Apple claimed that the phone should hold onto signal better due to the new technologies, how ironic

It would be nice if Apple could issue an statement and tell us if they are working on a fix. Some of these issues prob can get considerably better with software update.
[doublepost=1538102643][/doublepost]

I have 2 XS Max in my house both on Verizon. Compared to my X, in good reception zones, XS max has much improved speeds. I'm seeing over 100MB down vs 60-70 for the X. One of my XS Max does get much faster wifi speeds then other. Not sure what's up there, but running at the same time one hits the max of 300MB down while the other is closer to 200 down. The biggest issue is in areas of poor reception, which is exactly the same issue I had with the X. For example, coming out of an elevator where there is no reception, my phone will grab a 3G connection and stay there unless I toggle airplane made off and on. At my house where my reception was lousy with the X, nothing has improved on the XS. Still get 1-2MB down. I'm not sure I have a reception issue as much as Verizon just sucks where I live. Really wish I could move to T-mobile but they are even worse where I live.

exactly what I have been experiencing, for some reason it doesn't hold onto the signal (I haven't noticed any WIFI issues)
[doublepost=1538102759][/doublepost]I don't understand how getting a replacement would solve this issue for some.. all the phones have intel modem and same antenna design. That being said I have not had any wifi issues but the phone def can't hold LTE compared to iPhone X. 100% accurate.

 

[SpaceMonkey9]

I had some problems with my Max preferring 2ghz on my home SSID, even with band steering turned on and 2ghz power set to low, but that seems to have improved with newer beta firmware for the APs.

But I’ve noticed some iMessages have gone through as texts instead in areas where that’s never happened before.

Finally had some time tonight to borrow my old 6s plus from my wife and did some side by side Speedtests in various places around the house.

Any thoughts regarding the results?

 

[touchstoned]

I've had the phone for two days, and so far it's getting better reception than my AT&T iPhone 7 (intel modem). Although that phone had much worse reception than my iPhone 6S which had a Qualcomm Modem. It has lost connection a few times and reception is by no means stellar, but it's adequate. I think it's about the same performance as my iPhone 6 with a Qualcomm modem. It's still worse than my old 6S but it does have better bandwidth when reception is excellent.

I will be keeping my iPhone XS Max but I am still disappointed in the Intel modem. Shame on Apple for sourcing such garbage components. They could easily pay to design their own.

 

[decypher44]

Apple really needs to come out with some kind of statement.

I wonder if MR, iMore, The Verge etc are following up with Apple. Everyone said they were waiting for a response. Do they go after a response after getting nothing for a week?

 

[madKIR]

I didn't believe it when I first read it on macrumors and didn't think it would be this bad (compared to iPhone X). But I have the iPhone Xs max and the phone drops LTE like I have not seen since I switched to Verizon from Sprint 5 years ago. I haver not had a dropped call on Verizon's LTE and this happened today. I don't understand how a bigger phone which should have bigger antennas would have a weaker signal that my iPhone X which I just sold on eBay.

Anybody know if the modem can affect the antenna signal? or is this a problem with the design? Isn't the design pretty much the same as iPhone X? Apple claimed that the phone should hold onto signal better due to the new technologies, how ironic

It would be nice if Apple could issue an statement and tell us if they are working on a fix. Some of these issues prob can get considerably better with software update.
[doublepost=1538102643][/doublepost]
exactly what I have been experiencing, for some reason it doesn't hold onto the signal (I haven't noticed any WIFI issues)
[doublepost=1538102759][/doublepost]I don't understand how getting a replacement would solve this issue for some.. all the phones have intel modem and same antenna design. That being said I have not had any wifi issues but the phone def can't hold LTE compared to iPhone X. 100% accurate.

The antenna design in the Xs is different from the X: the X chassis could only support 2x2 MIMO. The Xs was redesigned to support 4x4. However, it looks like Apple’s design in this department was not quite ready, hence the issues due to weaker signal. I think Apple was forced to deliver it since the competition has had the standard available for a year.
Unfortunately, I don’t think we’ll see any drastic improvements here until the next version is released next year.