MP 7,1 Mac Pro 8.1 - WHAT IF...

[maikerukun]

no, and the first rendering tests in Blender show that the M2 max and therefore possibly the M2 ultra will be able to compete with the nvidias.
If Apple puts money into Blender and Metal, it's to make it work.
Same thing with neural engine and Open AI.
And the same with FCP
In my opinion, it will be very good.
If the pros have to change machines every two years, because it's impossible to upgrade, the price must be very competitive.

And for the prices of PCs, if you want something really good, it's expensive too. Calculate the price of a workstation with an RTX A6000. With 384 gb of ram. Etc

Again, nobody saying AS isn't good...The Mac Studio Ultra and the M2 Max MacBook Pro's "hell even my M1 Max MacBook Pro" are fantastic machines for light work. Nobody ever contested that.

 

[AndreeOnline]

So now you know something about me and what I do

Terrifically awesome.

But let's drop the Mac Pro discussion and talk about something serious: golf!

 

[Boil]

Apple has been beta-testing the new Mac Pro for a while. I guess they have been using the normal Mac Pro case as a disguise. This might be the reason why rumors still maintain they will ship it in this case. For a long time, the rumor was that it would ship in a case only half as big. Was there no meat to that "information"?

The suggestion of the present case and maaaaybe GPU compatibility made kind of sense for the hopeful, but the normal case and no MPX compatibility and just lots of PCI slots seem sketchy.

Could have been the initial M1-series based prototype with the single PCIe slot, could have been Gurman getting the Mac Pro confused with the Mac Studio...?

As for MPX PCIe slots, I guess I will head over to the above linked post by Amethyst and see if they can deliver more insight on this...?

This makes me wonder if the 8.1 Mac Pro will have multiple SOC sockets as a means of user expandable graphics/cpu/ram. Assuming this whole thing is M2 Ultra based, then we could see at least a 1x and 2x configuration if not also a 3x and 4x version.

So a max config would have 384 GB ram, 48 total processor cores (32p and 16e cores), 152 GPU cores. The first SOC would be the main controller for the whole system. Subsequent SOCs would be used for additional CPU/GPU/media engines/NE cores. The question that I don't know is how much bandwidth is available to support PCIe slots. Could an additional PCIe controller be installed to route I/O if it's needed? Because the way I see it, if this is possible, you would only need one motherboard design for the 8.1 across all price points and configurations. Apple could still tout the advantages of its SOC architecture whilst providing some semblance of internal expandability. It still wouldn't be enough for some use cases, but would probably hit enough use cases that I could see Apple going this route.

Johny Srouji explained why Apple did not go that route with the launch of the M1 Ultra...

http://glowstickbaystudios.com

The "2D Animation / 4 kids / Hunter" clip, you show the entire round of ammo being fired from the rifle; when one fires a weapon, only the actual bullet comes out, the shell casing stays in the weapon until ejected by a reload cycle... Just saying...! ;^p

 

[maikerukun]

So, is that how the game is played?

You can blurt out any **** you want, because you know it will be deleted by moderation in the end anyway?

Few things annoys me more than walking the line, taking all kinds of **** 'on the other cheek', breaking down the arguments step by step, until the fool finally steps out of the shadows, only to have the whole process—which can be pretty tiring to be sure—deleted.

I'm very interested in having all my posts reinstated, since I stand behind every word I write. I can only assume, the same holds true for any other poster's posts that were deleted.

Were they flagged? Perhaps only remove posts that break forum rules?

??? Did I miss something?

 

[maikerukun]

Why was he suspended?

I'm lost lol. Who got suspended and where was I when it happened?

 

[prefuse07]

I'm lost lol. Who got suspended and where was I when it happened?

Yeah I am lost as well, apparently Zombie got suspended, but he did not violate any of the forum rules?

 

[maikerukun]

I'm still willing to be surprised as I'm not putting too much stock in Gurman's musings at the moment.

One thought occurred to me just now. The Apple Studio Display uses an A13 chip to drive some of it's features, but obviously there is a lot more on the chip than the display even needs. Instead of making a custom chip, there might be some firmware in conjunction with some logic on the chip that allows for certain things to be enabled/disabled.

This makes me wonder if the 8.1 Mac Pro will have multiple SOC sockets as a means of user expandable graphics/cpu/ram. Assuming this whole thing is M2 Ultra based, then we could see at least a 1x and 2x configuration if not also a 3x and 4x version.

So a max config would have 384 GB ram, 48 total processor cores (32p and 16e cores), 152 GPU cores. The first SOC would be the main controller for the whole system. Subsequent SOCs would be used for additional CPU/GPU/media engines/NE cores. The question that I don't know is how much bandwidth is available to support PCIe slots. Could an additional PCIe controller be installed to route I/O if it's needed? Because the way I see it, if this is possible, you would only need one motherboard design for the 8.1 across all price points and configurations. Apple could still tout the advantages of its SOC architecture whilst providing some semblance of internal expandability. It still wouldn't be enough for some use cases, but would probably hit enough use cases that I could see Apple going this route.

I like it, but the biggest issue here is it still only puts that in contention with a 2019 Mac Pro with...1 w6800x...My system would still be 4x faster than that...We need Apple to really and truly push that thing because it has to be future proof if not expandable, meaning it has to kick my machines butt to the curb with performance...

 

[maikerukun]

Terrifically awesome.

But let's drop the Mac Pro discussion and talk about something serious: golf!

Absolutely not. I love golf but I made this thread to come here and dream about what could be if only Apple would care about high end users again...I just want to feel seen...I just want to feel coddled by an Apple branded GPU that smokes a 4090. I want Tim Cook to love me again lololol.

 

[maikerukun]

Could have been the initial M1-series based prototype with the single PCIe slot, could have been Gurman getting the Mac Pro confused with the Mac Studio...?

As for MPX PCIe slots, I guess I will head over to the above linked post by Amethyst and see if they can deliver more insight on this...?



Johny Srouji explained why Apple did not go that route with the launch of the M1 Ultra...

The "2D Animation / 4 kids / Hunter" clip, you show the entire round of ammo being fired from the rifle; when one fires a weapon, only the actual bullet comes out, the shell casing stays in the weapon until ejected by a reload cycle... Just saying...! ;^p

Clients get what they pay for lol. Cut corners on my bill, I cut corners on your project lolol. They knew the rules.

 

[maikerukun]

Yeah I am lost as well, apparently Zombie got suspended, but he did not violate any of the forum rules?

Dude never said anything that violated the rules that I saw...

 

[maikerukun]

Yeah I am lost as well, apparently Zombie got suspended, but he did not violate any of the forum rules?

That really sucks. They need to undo that...hope he gets reinstated soon. Forum will be a lot less fun without him.

 

[prefuse07]

That really sucks. They need to undo that...hope he gets reinstated soon. Forum will be a lot less fun without him.

Yeah, I am thinking his honesty must've hurt some trashcan lover's feelings or something? *shrug*

Hope he comes back too -- he kept it real. We need more of that around here and less kool-aid.

 

[MacPoulet]

LMFAO just threw yourself in the middle of an ocean, huh? LOL

And then the pandemic hit…

 

[majus]

Dude never said anything that violated the rules that I saw...

I think -- and could be mistaken -- he used a word that may have been taken as a slur by someone whose sensitivity meter was set on Extreme, so they reported him. I recall seeing the word and being slightly surprised but just kept on reading. I don't remember the context.

 

[Boil]

Maybe they were reported by a member of the Parrot Anti-Defamation League...?!? ;^p

 

[AndreeOnline]

??? Did I miss something?

Yeah I am lost as well, apparently Zombie got suspended, but he did not violate any of the forum rules?

I'm not 100% sure, but it was most likely after his "discussion" with me. What I do know is that I did NOT report him. As I said a few posts back: I would very much like that whole discussion to be reinstated.

I find it extremely important that people are aware that every post you make here gets signed by your name and represents you. I don't like it when people can go off the rails and then everything gets deleted making it as if it never happened.

I can't go into the discussion, since that would be unfair due to ZombiePhysicist's suspension (he can't comment).

His last response (that I copied and saved externally in case he would edit it later) was such that my reply was simply that "I would not credit it with a response". I was not offended personally, but I deemed it pointless to continue that exchange.

 

[singhs.apps]

All this bickering is distracting. Back to topic.

So it appears that Apple’s co-star reveal, if they ever release it this year….might be the AR/VR Apple headset.

Side note : ex XSI aficionados might be happy (or sad) to learn that Fabric engine (ex ice …Maya’s Bifrost predecessor) that went kaput a few years ago was bought by …Apple.

Fabric engine was supposed to be some visual programming thing that never took off, (even if some decent sized studio, I forget the name …decided to build their pipeline around Fabric.)

With Brad Peebler leaving foundry and joining Apple (Alan Hasting is also leaving soon..maybe he will join Apple ? Who knows) that’s two 3D players ( brad and founder of Fabric + Fabric IP) and it about as 3D as it gets…

And yeah, like someone said , maybe the 2019 chassis is just to test the Mac pro prototypes. No way an ultra SOC warrants that type of a housing cage.

I have a feeling both the Mac Pro and the VR/AR might be announced together….let’s see.

 

[mattspace]

And Samsung endlessly made fun of apples removal of the headphone jack on the iPhone.

And like HP, Samsung dominate Apple in market share for their respective markets - Workstations and Smartphones.

Many would say removing that jack was the correct move, both from a technical and marketing POV.

Many people say the world is flat, NFTs are the future of Art, and Cryptocurrency is the future of finance. Many people are idiots.

The only reason to remove a headphone jack, is because it allows a zero friction non-licenced headphone ecosystem.

When competitors make fun of or criticize you it can be seen as a sign that you are doing something right. Regardless, that Mac Pro is in the past. This thread has made me even more eagerly waiting to see what Mac Pro 8 brings us

If your product is a source of jokes, there is something wrong with it, unless your product is comedy.

Watching people try to post-hoc justify the trashcan with rose tinted glasses, it's eerily reminiscent of the huge wave of "genuine fan blogs" that came out after Disney bought Lucasfilm, positing the Star Wars prequels weren't so bad in retrospect, and were just as good as the original films.

 

[mattspace]

I'm still willing to be surprised as I'm not putting too much stock in Gurman's musings at the moment.

One thought occurred to me just now. The Apple Studio Display uses an A13 chip to drive some of it's features

If you think the Apple Studio Display was not going to to use the A13 chip to apply Apple's CSAM detection and reporting regime to everything you view on your Mac, I have a bridge to sell you. Smart TVs already do this, phoning home to report comparisons of screen pixel hashes to known movies / tv shows for viewer household profiling.

 

[mattspace]

All this bickering is distracting. Back to topic.

So it appears that Apple’s co-star reveal, if they ever release it this year….might be the AR/VR Apple headset.

As someone who has used VR for doing real work, work that needed VR and was unsuitable for a flat screen (designing a 30 foot tall walk-under marionette sculpture that went on stage during a theatre production at a major national arts venue), I'm highly skeptical of claims about Apple's headsets. Right now I put them in the same league as Apple making a car.

The inescapable physics of VR, is that pro-level VR requires very high end graphics. If you look around you'll see that the current high end headsets demand more than even an RTX4090 can provide. The tools, and workload expectations will always expand to push the cutting edge, as long as the cutting edge is moving forward, and the cutting edge will continue to move forward, because everyone apart from Apple has a vested interest in that.

VR is still GPU constrained, and headsets are still accelerating their resolution demands.

The venn diagram of "good for first-person-shooter games" and "good for VR" is a single circle, because the FPS game is first & foremost an embodiment experience.

I have a feeling both the Mac Pro and the VR/AR might be announced together….let’s see.

I would expect VR on Apple platforms to follow broadly the same pattern as gaming on Apple platforms - development is done on Windows, because Apple will have too small a market to provide sufficient seats to support the development of anything significant, and because Apple's computers are both overpriced, and underserved by 3d / gaming centric production tools.

What Apple could bring to VR, or could have brought back when they were competent at it, was consistent UI for things like file browsers, open / save dialogues etc. But again, I see no evidence that Apple retains the working knowledge of why they did things in the past, to judge from what's happened to macOS post-catalina.

 

[AndreeOnline]

If you think the Apple Studio Display was not going to to use the A13 chip to apply Apple's CSAM detection and reporting regime to everything you view on your Mac, I have a bridge to sell you.

Sounds like a good deal. How much do you want for it?

 

[singhs.apps]

VR is still GPU constrained, and headsets are still accelerating their resolution demands.

True. As owner of two headsets, I can attest that visual fidelity is one of the key aspects of the VR experience. Early days yet, in the scheme of things..but it HAS promise.

That’s why I said co-star in my post. Apple may well have it untethered if it ever releases an XR headset (and rightly so)
But it maybe the likes of Mac pros that provide the the GPU grunt, relaying the feed wirelessly.

It’s a tough one to crack.

Also thinking the ‘no longer rumoured to be in consideration mx Extreme chip’ might turn out to be an ultra communicating with a GPU (essentially other half of the extreme would be a GPU accelerator)..or an MPX module.

 

[Boil]

Also thinking the ‘no longer rumoured to be in consideration mx Extreme chip’ might turn out to be an ultra communicating with a GPU, essentially other half of the extreme would be a GPU accelerator...

This is just a remix on the "one regular SoC & one GPU-specific SoC connected via UltraFusion to make a GPU-heavy Mn Ultra SoC" idea...

...or an MPX module.

How would that work with UMA RAM, if there is a M2 Ultra SoC & a MPX (GP)GPU, because part of the MPX is the PCIe connection, which breaks the UMA...

 

[singhs.apps]

This is just a remix on the "one regular SoC & one GPU-specific SoC connected via UltraFusion to make a GPU-heavy Mn Ultra SoC" idea...

Which is a remix of some earlier epiphany . Basically I was repeating myself.

How would that work with UMA RAM, if there is a M2 Ultra SoC & a MPX (GP)GPU, because part of the MPX is the PCIe connection, which breaks the UMA...

By being a separate compute card with its own onboard ram/vram, communicating over proprietary/PCI-e interface. Apple could design it to saturate gen4/5 bandwith…and make its Ram accessible to the Soc and vice versa.
But the one ‘half as pure GPU for the extreme’ seems more likely.

 

[MacPoulet]

I wonder if we'd see the Mac Pro at NAB this April. If we did, then maybe it would be a sign that the focus is once again the video market...

My biggest hope though is a name change. I'd love them to bring back the PowerMac name instead of the Mac Pro. Heck, I'd be happier if they got rid of the MacBook Pro name and called that a PowerBook again too. Neither is gonna happen, but one can dream.