I have never understood Apple's dislike for a normal pci slot? What's wrong with making your computer versatile/ugradeable?
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I have never understood Apple's dislike for a normal pci slot? What's wrong with making your computer versatile/ugradeable?
Doing a review on NETKAS "finding" of FIJI support:
What Netkas actually did was to force the MAC to use a FIJI GpuID on AMD POLARIS 11 Drivers, that's simple lame hacking, but....
what if instead insert AMD FIJI GpuID, you insert an AMD POLARIS 10 ID, further Apple double down checking you're running on a MacPRO ?
GOTCHA THE MP 7,1 is running on POLARIS-COMPATIBLE GPUs, even maybe those previously named GpuID dont belong to the Polaris 11 Family, only one should belong to Polaris 11, the other two should be Polaris 10 pro and 10 XT.
Why not ruuning on the iMac, Netkas tested Fiji on mini and iMac and the GPU didn't come up because Apple checks you are running on an Mac Pro, WHY APPLE Checks YOU ARE RUNNING ON A MAC PRO TO ENABLE POLARIS-COMPATIBLE DRIVERS ?.
What Netkas actually did was to force the MAC to use a FIJI GpuID on AMD POLARIS 11 Drivers, that's simple lame hacking, but....
what if instead insert AMD FIJI GpuID, you insert an AMD POLARIS 10 ID, further Apple double down checking you're running on a MacPRO ?
GOTCHA THE MP 7,1 is running on POLARIS-COMPATIBLE GPUs, even maybe those previously named GpuID dont belong to the Polaris 11 Family, only one should belong to Polaris 11, the other two should be Polaris 10 pro and 10 XT.
Why not ruuning on the iMac, Netkas tested Fiji on mini and iMac and the GPU didn't come up because Apple checks you are running on an Mac Pro, WHY APPLE Checks YOU ARE RUNNING ON A MAC PRO TO ENABLE POLARIS-COMPATIBLE DRIVERS ?.
because when you image search 'pci expansion', the results are :
... it looks like something from the 80s..
those aren't 'products' as far as apple is concerned and instead, some serious nerd fodder.. people wanting that type of gear are a niche within a niche.
pretty sure apple's take would be "if you want that type of stuff, go buy it.. it's available.. we think it's ugly though and not user friendly.. not something the vast majority of potential customers are interested in"
Um, no. It looks like computer parts. Like what you find inside of every device Apple makes.
Maybe it would help users to understand the MacPro if we understood who Apple thinks are their customers for it and how they categorize a professional and his/her needs.
I think he's just pointing out that you still haven't a clue and your throw every lame idea at a thread and see if it sticks approach is well, lame.
People who use Final Cut Pro X, Logic Pro, who are coding applications for iOS and for Mac.
Isn't this view putting nMP into some kind of perspective?
I don't think that's what Mark was saying.. not even close really.
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or, do the opposite..
maybe it would help if users were completely honest about their needs regarding computers.. then see if there's an apple computer to fill these needs.. odds are, an overwhelming majority of cases would be "yes, this particular apple computer will suit your needs just fine"
..because there's so much talk around here about how apple used to make the sweetest computers and whatnot.. but their current lineup, even in it's aged state, completely wrecks all of their old 'glory days' models.
which leads me to believe many people's complaints around here have nearly nothing to do with what their actual computing needs are and instead, are more about hardware for the sake of hardware.. like a hotrod/monster truck mindset as opposed to any real world usages.
there is very little you can't do on a mac these days.. and do it well.. better than you've been able to at any point prior to now.. so what gives?
---
for instance:
what do you, Jim, use computers for?
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Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, Lightroom, Bridge, Acrobat, Office, i1Profiler would be my main applications.
and all of those will work fine, great even, on a mac pro (or an imac.. or mbp.. etc).
not really sure what the problem is regarding your question :
#207
Maybe it would help users to understand the MacPro if we understood who Apple thinks are their customers for it and how they categorize a professional and his/her needs.
...
you are who apple thinks their customer is.. and they're building computers that will suit your needs well.
how is a tower design going to help you with these applications? or, what do you need in a computer to work with these programs that are unavailable on macs?
**(i'm not familiar with i1Profiler so maybe that doesn't work well on mac?)
Yes and no. Can a Mac run my applications, yes. Can a tube run them much faster than my 2009, no. Can a tube be upgraded when Apple and/or Adobe require improved hardware (my dual 1.42 G5 had to be retired due to Adobe), no.
Upgradeability
It's for profiling monitors and printers so I have accurate color reproduction.
I was happy years ago when I upgraded or updated my computer every 2-3 years. Apple goes back to that, I'm good. Apple doesn't and I'll consider Windows where computers are updated more frequently and upgradeable if they aren't.
well nothing is going to run them much faster than in 2009..
a 6,1 will.. an imac will.. an HPZ will..
but none of them will run those applications 'much' faster.
we're talking legacy code designed to utilize fast clock speed as a means to enhance performance at the same time cpu clock speed improvements have slowed to a crawl.
why not just upgrade your 2009 mac pro when apple/adobe require improved hardware?
oh.. right.
can't..
or else i feel you'd be doing exactly that.
I have a thing about updating a computer that Apple won't even support and is old tech that won't even fully take advantage of the new stuff I could put in like SSD's capable of working at 6gb/sec but restricted on old SATA speeds.
I would think that a Broadwell Xeon (or Skylake i7) would be noticeably faster than my Nahalem (not to mention the RAM speed is about 2x what I have now) PCIe is on gen 3 now.
I would think that a Broadwell Xeon (or Skylake i7) would be noticeably faster than my Nahalem (not to mention the RAM speed is about 2x what I have now) PCIe is on gen 3 now.
Yes.
This.
Well, maybe that's a bit too curt.
Flat five - I was referring to you saying it looked like it was a bunch of 1980s parts. I simply meant that for pros, who quite often see these parts or things like them when they replace a hard drive, add in PCI slot based cards, change memory, etc., that these aren't obsolete parts. They are what make your computer run.
Just curious - what's the flat five reference? I think of a flat four as the engine from old Porsches and Volkswagens. Is a flat five a variant?
Best wishes!
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yeah.. i get that.. completely.
but my point was that apple didn't view them as 'products'..
apple can't market those things.. nobody can.. that's why they're falling to the wayside.
even a pro would rather have their equipment looking sweet and working easily instead of some hobbled together science project looking thing requiring screwdrivers and soldering irons or whatever.
if you don't care about any of that stuff then you're so far in the minority, even amongst peers, that you should be able to recognize "hey, i'm representing about 1% of pro users.. maybe less.. so let me at least state this up front"
http://flat5.net/about-2/what-does-flat5-mean
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Hmmm, pci cards are not nerd fodder. Professionals need them. Alot of independent record studios use mac pros with pro tools and hdx cards. Those cards go into pci slots. Where are you going to put them in an iMac? If you are doing high level audio or video, pci slots are a must. Apple makes fine consumer level computers but I find it disturbing Apple has abandon the professional market. During the dark days it was the high end pro market that kept Apple relevant and now to turn it's back on them/us is sad...
If there’s one thing F5 is a bit silly on, it’s that he tries over and over again to have reasonable discussions with people who insist on keeping their heads buried in the sand.
His point is right on target, and it’s kind of hard to believe that some of you aren’t being disingenuous in not understanding it… or maybe just too stuck in the bubble… his point is that expansion cards are a thing of the past that was generally reserved for hardware geeks anyway. 95% of the expandable tower computers sold were never upgraded by the original owner. If the general computer buying public was so enamored with expansion cards, the computer industry would be embracing them rather than moving towards closed, non-expandable (internally), compact, low energy devices that will never be opened except for serving. That goes for workstations as well.
Even 90% of the people here who insist that they “need” expansion slots don’t need them at all. As F5’s exchange with JimGoshorn indicates, there are plenty of Macs that will suit him just fine - it’s not that he needs expansion slots, it’s that he feels on principle that he should be able to upgrade individual components of the computer and not have to buy a new one when he wants better performance. So, as has been pointed out dozens of times in dozens of threads, Apple has zero intention of serving that market. If that’s the computer you want, go buy the parts, or a Dell or HP or whatever the frack you want while you still can… a decade from now, expansion cards will be a thing of the past.
Seriously, when are you people going to give up on this and move the frack along? You all pretend to be "professionals", but you're really just tinkerers and hobbyists and those who make so little money being a “professional” that you can’t afford a few grand for the equipment you insist is vital to your livelihood. You chide others as though they don't belong at the grown-ups table yet you act like a bunch of temperamental children who didn't get their way. It's been over 2 1/2 years of endless whining for fracks sake.
His point is right on target, and it’s kind of hard to believe that some of you aren’t being disingenuous in not understanding it… or maybe just too stuck in the bubble… his point is that expansion cards are a thing of the past that was generally reserved for hardware geeks anyway. 95% of the expandable tower computers sold were never upgraded by the original owner. If the general computer buying public was so enamored with expansion cards, the computer industry would be embracing them rather than moving towards closed, non-expandable (internally), compact, low energy devices that will never be opened except for serving. That goes for workstations as well.
Even 90% of the people here who insist that they “need” expansion slots don’t need them at all. As F5’s exchange with JimGoshorn indicates, there are plenty of Macs that will suit him just fine - it’s not that he needs expansion slots, it’s that he feels on principle that he should be able to upgrade individual components of the computer and not have to buy a new one when he wants better performance. So, as has been pointed out dozens of times in dozens of threads, Apple has zero intention of serving that market. If that’s the computer you want, go buy the parts, or a Dell or HP or whatever the frack you want while you still can… a decade from now, expansion cards will be a thing of the past.
Seriously, when are you people going to give up on this and move the frack along? You all pretend to be "professionals", but you're really just tinkerers and hobbyists and those who make so little money being a “professional” that you can’t afford a few grand for the equipment you insist is vital to your livelihood. You chide others as though they don't belong at the grown-ups table yet you act like a bunch of temperamental children who didn't get their way. It's been over 2 1/2 years of endless whining for fracks sake.
You have an Imac - have you tried to do this?
There are many issues with external PCIe expansion, especially over T-Bolt. Some drivers and hardware assume local PCIe slots, and choke on the extra switch and bridge layers when using external. Others have bandwidth/latency constraints, and may work fine on a Cubix PCIe extpansion, but choke on T-Bolt. Others have no code to deal with hot removal/insertion - and you get a visit from Colonel Pannique if a cable drops (and Apple still hasn't added a latching mechanism to T-Bolt sockets and cables) or you plug something new in.
It would be nice if external PCIe expansion worked as well as you and Apple marketing think that it does....
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Are you laughing at the grammatical slip? ("fracks sake" instead of "frack's sake")
no.. laughing just at 'frack' in and of itself.
frack's frack fracking frack'n fracks muthafracka .. nothing to do with it.
...
i chuckled when i read it.. shouldn't of made an LOL post about it though.
way blown out of proportion already.
: )
frack's frack fracking frack'n fracks muthafracka .. nothing to do with it.
...
i chuckled when i read it.. shouldn't of made an LOL post about it though.
way blown out of proportion already.
: )
Yes they are and no they don't. There's like 1% of computing tasks that NEED expansion slots. You might be forced into buying new software and equipment, but that's how it goes sometimes.
Just finished watching BSG a few days ago. ;-)