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macOS 13: All The Little Things

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I am appalled that Apple chose to use switches instead of checkboxes in the new System Settings application. Switches are horribly alien on a Desktop environment, not legible with certain accent colours and adds an extra layer of delay while activating. I hate to see these horrible GNOME design choices make their way into macOS.

Apple UI designers should go back to the basics, and re-read the Mac OS 8 Human Interface Guidelines all over again.
 
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elptdbi3lYI said:
Strangest thing is how they use switches instead of checkboxes
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That's hilarious, because those switches actually fly in the face of Apple's Human Interface Guidelines (HIG) you attached.

Hopefully the switches are just temporary (and actually, hoping System Settings as a whole is just temporary and will be tweaked considerably during beta, because right now, it feels like a lazy port) and Apple will find a way to re-incorporate checkboxes.

It also conflicts with other settings/preference dialogs, such as Finder > Preferences; that dialog still uses checkboxes. Way to be (in)consistent, Apple.
 
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KoolAid-Drink said:
Okay, so I was able to get it installed and up/running. I was most curious about the new System Settings app (System Preferences' replacement), and while initially I wanted to be positive and give it a chance, unfortunately, I am not impressed. It's basically iOS now, and the submenus are awful and hard on the eyes. The great visual trackpad pane is now all text; no "demonstration". It's pitiful, honestly.

View attachment 2014777
^ This is Accessibility — not too bad upon first sight, BUT...

View attachment 2014782
^ This is the display submenu of Accessibility. It's horrid. Hard on the eyes, too "wordy" without visual indicators, meh.

Also, there does not seem to be a way to rotate between desktop wallpapers anymore. Edit: Nevermind, you can still do that. You do have to 'select' a folder, or cluster, then click the "i" button, then it'll allow you to rotate, etc. It just isn't clear upfront.

Specifically in regards to System Settings, ugh. I really don't like how they went with the lowest common denominator, especially there was nothing wrong with the previous configuration. It might have been a bit dated, but it was much easier on the eyes and more "tight".

Edit: Added a screenshot of trackpad settings to show what I mean when I mentioned trackpad settings and no more demonstrations.
View attachment 2014808
^ This is Ventura. Now, compare and contrast...
View attachment 2014809
^ In Monterey, here's what it looks like - very user-friendly and easy on the eyes, right?

Hopefully this is just beta and they'll tweak SP to make it more... I don't know, maybe less iOS-like? Especially with the submenus.
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I agree -- this iteration is awful. I hope they switch back to the old system preferences (not likely).
 
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No more WindowServer?
Screenshot 2022-06-07 at 22.24.48.png
 
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Apple Knowledge Navigator said:
View attachment 2015371
How? There's a search bar right at the top. Each setting type is categorised clearly and makes use of the horizontal space of the Mac's screen, which is its default orientation. The icons are also clear.

The new System Settings is designed for vertical scanning and scrolling per iPhone and iPad.

It's just another example of Apple trying to converge iOS and macOS and not thinking about the fundamentals; that macOS is a pointer experience first.
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If you need the search bar to not get lost, then that’s a pretty clear sign that you have bad UI.

Needing to scan items both left to right and too to bottom is bad UX.

It’s incredibly inefficient.

It looks pretty, but it it’s bad UX.

I haven’t tried the new settings, but scanning a list top bottom is much easier than having to scan icons both ways.
 
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@Kimcha
If they had just taken the overview from the old settings and put them in the sidebar and left everything else as it was, it would've been the perfect updated. But they redid everything, and now the content is very very bad.

Before every prefpane had it's own size, one would be wider or taller as needed. But now the width is fixed, as it's just a list of settings from top to bottom. No additional content like in the Trackpad or MagicMouse settings where it shows what each setting does.

In short: Using a sidebar to switch between prefpanes is great, but the content of the panes changed a lot, and it's really really bad.
 
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Diskutant said:
@Kimcha
If they had just taken the overview from the old settings and put them in the sidebar and left everything else as it was, it would've been the perfect updated. But they redid everything, and now the content is very very bad.

Before every prefpane had it's own size, one would be wider or taller as needed. But now the width is fixed, as it's just a list of settings from top to bottom. No additional content like in the Trackpad or MagicMouse settings where it shows what each setting does.

In short: Using a sidebar to switch between prefpanes is great, but the content of the panes changed a lot, and it's really really bad.
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Yeah, you might have a point there.

It’s probably not the perfect redesign.

That being said, I think the reason the old settings have remained unchanged for so long despite being flawed, means that it’s not a straight forward problem to solve.

Perhaps apple decided that findability of settings and consistency is more important than the compromises you listed.
 
I wonder which VPN system macOS Ventura supports, in Monterey it's L2TP via IPSec, Cisco IPSec, and IKEv2. Some of them are really old and really shouldn't be used anymore but you'll never know.
 
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tehabe said:
I wonder which VPN system macOS Ventura supports, in Monterey it's L2TP via IPSec, Cisco IPSec, and IKEv2. Some of them are really old and really shouldn't be used anymore but you'll never know.
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Well, I'm cleanly running NORDLynx at the moment.
 
ponzicoinbro said:
BS. You’re just making things up.

The classic one has been around for 21 years for a reason. It’s damn good. If it wasn’t it would have changed much earlier.

This new one is Apple making the mistake of following the competitors instead of remaining the best.
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No I am not.
It needed a refresh. Apple also copied their own iPadOS as well.
 
MarineBand5524 said:
It is. I hate, hate HATE IT.
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I really do think Apple intended to find a compromise between iOS Settings and the old System Preferences, but unfortunately, they went mostly with iOS elements for System Settings, down to the organization structure and sliders. The way things are presented in iOS makes sense, because they're fit for a smaller screen footprint and simple finger scrolling, and most settings are simplified and "dumbed down", but in macOS, settings are much more complex and require far more visualization, which the old System Preferences happily provided in a way that was easy on the eyes. In other words, Apple tried too hard to apply what was "tried and true" in iOS/iPadOS and applied them to a much larger, more complex OS designed for computers. As a result, sub-menus with more complex settings are too textual and heavy on the eyes. The UI is too simple, too bland to offer the flexibility that System Preferences once offered. And the sliders, don't even get me started. They honestly just don't belong on the Mac, and fly in the face of Apple's own Human Interface Guidelines for the Mac. Yes, System Preferences was dated and had issues of its own, but I'd say it worked overall pretty well.

Apple really shouldn't have tried an one-size-fits-all concept here; it's lazy and downright insulting to the Mac platform. News.app, Stocks.app, Home.app, etc being simplified and iOS-like is one thing, but System Settings deserve better, IMHO.

I would say, in the spirit of compromise, the organizational structure is good. An easy way to fix this would be to tweak it so that things are more clearly categorized and better sized, and to bring back the trackpad demos (and other visuals). Those were the pinnacle of Apple simplicity and their old "easy to understand/use" philosophy. Perhaps category text should be bigger and more prominent, and perhaps more icons.

I know there's a way Apple can make this work — bringing the simplicity of iOS settings to the Mac to help unfamiliar users be better acquainted with the OS, while keeping Mac settings rich in context and the UI more Mac-like, more user friendly. My hope is that determined and clear feedback will trickle up during the beta process, similar to the Safari debacle last year.

You can tell I'm passionate about this! 😅
 
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Takuro said:
Following up on the Stage Manager stuff:

I see some people reporting a flat / head-on view of the window groups and some reporting it has the 3D / angled look like in the keynote. Curious as to who is seeing which design, and are you on Intel or Apple Silicon?
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I see the angled view by default. I see the flat view if I drag the in-focus window close to the left of the display. Intel.
 
Stage Manager desperately needs a keyboard shortcut. I don't want it enabled most of the time, but I could easily see it being a replacement for Hide Others (cmd-shift-H) for me
 
redpandadev said:
Settings -> General -> Login Items

This new System Settings app is a disaster.
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The other dumb thing about Login Items, not just the location of it, but that it just displays a toggle now. You can’t easily remove apps and processes from there.

I have one Login Item showing ‘Unknown Daemon’. At least let me remove this **** instead of showing me a toggle or let me right click on it so I can find out what it is in the Finder.

All these stupid changes in Sys Prefs for no good reason.
 
funkypepper said:
I am appalled that Apple chose to use switches instead of checkboxes in the new System Settings application. Switches are horribly alien on a Desktop environment, not legible with certain accent colours and adds an extra layer of delay while activating. I hate to see these horrible GNOME design choices make their way into macOS.

Apple UI designers should go back to the basics, and re-read the Mac OS 8 Human Interface Guidelines all over again.
Click to expand...

It’s bizarre. The more I look at the toggles and scrolls bars in Sys Prefs the more I believe someone from Microsoft was hired to port the Windows Settings app.
 
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