Great. Many of my family would agree with you. They have used Macs, they like Macs, but they don't hang out in Mac Pro forums complaining that Apple doesn't make gaming rigs.
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MP 7,1 New MP - it's not for you. So who is it for?
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Great. Many of my family would agree with you. They have used Macs, they like Macs, but they don't hang out in Mac Pro forums complaining that Apple doesn't make gaming rigs.
Yes, both the monitor and 7,1 for photography. Cannot wait to have them in the studio.
My point was that if the argument is that the new Mac Pro is a failure:
- Current sales seemingly disprove that.
- Future sales are unknown, but you can't rush to a judgement either way. If I can't say that the Mac Pro is going to continue selling, you can't say that it won't keep selling.
My pricing was solely for the CPU, I made no attempt to match the two systems spec for spec.
If the Z6 doesn't meet your needs there's always the Z8.
Apple has done an admirable job of initially offering compelling specifications for a good price (i.e. value). Key word there is initial. The value tends to diminish over time as Apple doesn't discount their products nor update them. They let them get stale while barely adjusting the price. The 2013 Mac Pro was a prime example, I cannot believe this system didn't see a single update (or did the offer a 2TB SSD?) in the six years it was offered. They made one price adjustment during that time.
All that said I'm not sure this price comparison is anything to write home about. The Z6 and Z8 are over two years old and both utilize technology which was current at the time. The processors used in the 2019 Mac Pro weren't available when these systems were released. So like for like comparisons may not make a lot of sense. What I can tell you is if you're looking to spec a Z6 or Z8 at the levels of the 2019 Mac Pro then the prices on HPs web site are very likely not going to be what you'll pay.
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What are the current sales figures for it? Also keep in mind the last Mac Pro was released six years ago. You think there might be a little bit of demand for something a little more current?
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The difference is contacting HP for such a configuration is likely to wipe out that difference. Contacting Apple? Unlikely they'll cut you a discount.
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What have you been doing prior to Tuesday?
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Games places don't really use the Mac platform unless they're doing mobile. Audio departments have them but that probably covers it save for a few laptops here and there and perhaps some toy for the boss.
You might encounter branded workstations in larger studios where they just shop at Dell for bulk orders but they'll be outfitted with consumer GPUs. Most places I've been at had their systems assembled from consumer parts by local shops.
I imagine in VR you're never going to see this machine take off. Support for the platform is going to lag behind big time.
Bubble sales don't mark success or failure.
The G4 cube had long lead times at introduction - but we all know how badly that turned out.
You are "rushing to judgement" based on bubble sales.
Very true - the Mac Pro isn't a gaming computer.
I don't know why people keep bringing up gaming computers when there are companies that make both Ryzen, Threadripper, and Eypc workstations for 1/3 to 1/2 the price that provide both superior performance and a real upgrade path.
And people who say it’s going to fail are rushing to judgement based on nothing.
In since we’re all just talking out of our butts in this thread... My guess is that Apple never sold that many Mac Pros to the xMac crowd. Most of the xMac crowd probably just ended up buying PCs at half the cost. I personally know a lot of Mac users who did just that.
The assumption that Apple abandon a large section of users may be completely flawed. There is no evidence that Apple sold a lot of Mac Pros, at double the cost to a comparable PC, to the xMac crowd anyway. They might be building a Mac Pro aimed exactly at the large majority of Mac Pro customers.
The MacPro is For 3 Customers Imagine 3 different Characters.
#1. The Super ultra rich who spend $50,000 as easily as we spend $5.00
#2. The dentist daughter who wants to be a Youtuber but buys all the best equipment and doesn’t even know how to edit videos
#3. The “creator” Someone who has Video And Editing Skill and actual Work on a Semi-Pro self taught level who can afford it. It’s the same guy who takes his Corvette to the “track” cuz he has a RaceCar now.
Added 3 For Fun
#4. Tax Professionals Who Can claim this as a Business Expense and get it Free, It’s the Same Guy using Section 179 of the IRS Code and claiming his Tesla Model X as a Business vehicle (I tried)
#5. Private Universities they will probably claim it on their taxes, as educational equipment For Research As part of some Grant. (This is what I’m doing using Grant Money If I get the Grant)
#6. YouTubers Clout Chasers who Buy one Make a few Videos Unboxing it keep it for a few Week making tons of Video they slowly trickle out but Return it for a Refund within the Return period.
Actual Professionals who have been trained and educated and are Industrial Who work in Hollywood Film studios Don’t need Mac Pro, because their companies have Million Dollar Server Farms or Quaddro Cards which cost $30,000 Each or HP Servers which cost $40,000 to start. These True Professionals are already trainEd on Sony Refernce monitors like the Sony BVM E250A which costs $23,000 for a 25” Version So the Pros already have the best equipment.
So a $8,000 34” XDR Display Vs a 25” Sony 4K OLED Refernce monitor at $23,000 sounds like a deal.
or a Mid Config $15,000 MacPro sounds like a deal vs, a Base HP workstation starting at $40,000 dollars.
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Your reply is complete nonsense. The only reasonable thing that you said was "we’re all just talking out of our butts".
You have just described OIST - Okinawa institute of science and Technology. You are spot on.
A bunch of us sucked it up and bought base or mid-range Mac Pros and upgraded them over the years. Reasonable starting prices allowed us to do that.
its a misguided way for them to feel superior. i never understood the fascination with the pc gaming crowd routinely mocking apple users who, on the whole, don't care or even think of gaming (this is in general i'm talking about)
yet pc gaming people are routinely butthurt (especially with those mac vs pc ads way back). i can only imagine they come on apple forums and spew nonsense unsolicited because of a deep inferiority complex.
the funny thing is in the real world, i know several people who use a macbook and have build their own for pc for various thing such as gaming or content creation. they don't go on forums or harass mac or pc users, so i'm gonna assume its a vocal minority.
that said, i think the pc gaming community as a whole is quite toxic with an air of fake superiority because they can build computers with standard parts. i used to build a lot of pc back in high school (while using a macbook pro for school) and i encountered a lot of people like that. i left the community and honestly am surprised/not surprised that its the same way. after working in academic engineering labs that use mac pros or linux boxes, i'm just saving enough money to buy my own mac pro for some DL research i do.
Apple offers a business discount. Just register your company online at Apple.
Just remember....
You can’t use you USA business account to outfit your overseas office with a Mac Pro
I have received such discount before. But it was a tiny amount of discount.
The BS is pretty entertaining at times. First they **** on console users, then they **** on prebuilt buyers, then they **** on people who "have too much RGB" or "buy water coolers" or "buy air coolers" or nvidia vs amd vs intel.
Ultimately it's a pretty small minority that does that, and I'd guess based on the number of "built my first rig" posts I see on reddit that the DIY PC community is absolutely booming right now.
There are some really ugly circlejerks in the mac community too, particularly on this forum. In the mac pro category I keep seeing "prove to me that you deserve to own a mac pro!" posts lol. Those are about as cringey as the "people who buy a prebuilt don't deserve a computer" people.
This is a very good point. I bought my base Mac Pro 6,1 when it first came out for $3K, and then spent another $1.5K to upgrade it over the last 5 years. I think it can last another 5 years for my intended uses; i.e., photography post processing, machine learning, deep learning, and data science prototyping work. (For real and large scale ML/DL/DS work, no Mac Pro is suitable anyway. Think AWS and GCP!)
What I have problems with Apple are the following:
1. Historically, the base Mac Pro was sold between $2.5K and $3K. This allowed Apple enthusiasts to get a Mac Pro and upgrade over time. I switched from Windows desktop, laptop, Android phone and tablets to Apple counterparts and its eco system 5+ years ago. Then in 2019, Apple decided that I am not their targeted customer anymore. I'm screwed with my investment in Apple products.
2. Is this a wise decision for Apple to target only very high end personal computing users (e.g., video editing, small business/studio owners, etc.)? With a starting price of $6K, some users of my market space would find other solutions. Almost all my photography apps (e.g., Lightroom, Photoshop, On1, Luminar, Portrait Pro, Topaz, Nik, and DX0) can run reliably on Windows nowadays. I'd rather get a new $5K camera and a $3K desktop than a $8K Mac Pro. Note that I have spent around $50K on my photography items for my hobby in the last 5 years. At the same time, it is not likely that I am willing to spend $8-9K on a desktop computer.
Only time will tell if the current Mac Pro pricing strategy will make it. Apple is known for being creative. But not all creative things can make it business wise. At any rate, my current beefed-up Mac Pro 6,1 will likely out last the new Mac Pro 7,1 lifecycle. I'll see if the future Mac Pro 8,1, if it ever comes out, will make sense for my intended use.
Lol yeah there is a lot of gate keeping. my real question is if you're using your computer for its intended purpose...where do you find the time to denigrate other people's use cases?
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this is my approach also. i plan on installing arch and putting a 7nm nvidia gpu (whenever theyre released) to run new DL models. once i want to scale them, ill prob use my works clusters
Well it's pretty much all agreed that many of us wanted Mac Pro whilie others wanted "Mac Industrial".
Previously, they offered more on Mac Pro side, but with 7,1, Apple has abandoned to offer only Mac Pro as real professional model only.
Lack of enthusiasm compared to previous Mac 1,1~5,1 and even 6,1 is obviously evident in this forum. Of course there are still some who can afford and welcome the introduction, but then, 6,1 also did same.
There must be bunch of us like me who wanted a modular mac that's spiritually successor to 5,1, and not satisfied by the price of 7,1. What are you going to do? wait it out with 5,1 for another generation?
Previously, they offered more on Mac Pro side, but with 7,1, Apple has abandoned to offer only Mac Pro as real professional model only.
Lack of enthusiasm compared to previous Mac 1,1~5,1 and even 6,1 is obviously evident in this forum. Of course there are still some who can afford and welcome the introduction, but then, 6,1 also did same.
There must be bunch of us like me who wanted a modular mac that's spiritually successor to 5,1, and not satisfied by the price of 7,1. What are you going to do? wait it out with 5,1 for another generation?
Has Apple ever marketed the Mac Pro to enthusiasts or people other than those using the Mac Pro to do their jobs? I haven't seen any such marketing, but it might exist, and it would be illuminating to see it.