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When I can get 32 GiB of RAM, a 2 GiB Quadro card, hot swappable batteries, internal 4G radios and two or three disks in un-Apple laptops - it does make the MBP look like amateur hour.

why does a comparison need to be made with other manufacturer's products to determine professional_ity?

if i read you correctly, this pro computer you describe above (32gb ram, quadro,etc) will lose its professional title next year when you can get 64ram and 4gb gpu..
is that right? or will it still be just as professional as it was on the day you got it?
 
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Don't know how accurate it is, haven't seen it on Macrumors so possibly not very

http://www.pcper.com/news/Processors/Rumor-Apple-Use-Custom-AMD-SoC-Next-Gen-iMac

yet another rumour of iMac with AMD APU's With Apple seemingly moving towards iGPU's on mini, iMac and Laptops then whilst the AMD CPU part is slower, CPU speed isn't increasing that much generation to generation and may be "Fast Enough" for Apple

Such a move would very likely kill of Nvidia's chances of getting back in for a while.

Why would Apple use AMD APUs when their AX chips in their iOS devices are probably far better, especially moving forward, than whatever AMD can possibly be cooking up?
 
Why would Apple use AMD APUs when their AX chips in their iOS devices are probably far better, especially moving forward, than whatever AMD can possibly be cooking up?

Because the architect behind Zen worked closely with Apple on two Ax chips and probably gave them an inside peak at what AMD will be able to offer them (performance, exclusive deals, manufacturing, discounts) if they have a close relationship.
 
Well as some have speculated, and there is a lot of evidence, Apple is gradually moving all consumer computers to system on chip and there will probably be iOS laptops and base model iMacs after the iPad Pro matures. OS X will probably be at the high end top model iMacs and MBP only. Mac Pro will probably be dropped because the best iMac will do it all and is updated more often.

OS X will die in that future.. after few years it is no more.. the eleventh OS would have come.. macOS.
Then we'd have tvOS, watchOS, phoneOS and macOS.. and perhaps carOS. iPads, laptops and desktops are all Macs.

And the nightmarish part: macOS could come without terminal and all software installation goes trough AppStore. You have access to user folders only. App development for Mac is done like to iOS today. On virtual machine and through App Store. openGL and openCL have only legacy support. Swift and Metal only are approved from dev account...

Have a good night-mares..
 
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Why would Apple use AMD APUs when their AX chips in their iOS devices are probably far better, especially moving forward, than whatever AMD can possibly be cooking up?

AX chips? Why? Over half of the iMac line up is on SoC right now..... with Intel. It is only the 27" models that have dGPUs at this point.

That article is goofy quoting on how Apple has switched over to AMD for GPUs. The majority of the Mac line up is on Intel now; not AMD ( or Nvidia).

Now if a Zen APU is performance and cost competitive with an Core i5/i7 model might Apple switch. Yep. Is that likely to happen in the Mac Pro space? No. Is that likely to happen in the near term future on other Mac products? No.

Unless AMD has radically changed direction again ....
"... Desktop users will be happy to know that the first Zen processor out the door will be AMD’s high-end desktop CPU (AMD was very deliberate in this, it’s not an APU). AMD will be aiming high and then cascading Zen down into APUs and lower-end products. ..."
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9231/amds-20162017-x86-roadmap-zen-is-in

Makes a lot of sense. Get the less complex GPU-less CPU out the door first and start making more money. AMD moves to a larger more complicated CPU+GPU design later. Systems with a CPU that needs a discrete GPU won't necessarily hurt AMD ( they'll get a fraction of dGPU sales ). Reducing limited Intel iGPU sales ( HD 4600 and equivalent ) would be a step forward for AMD.

The only maximum highly SoC in an iMac is the "educational" model with a MBA SoC in it. Highly unlikely there is a win in that iMac without there also being a win in the MBA. Apple is saving money on buying in larger volume. The iMac line up is too broad and diverse for a "console gamer box" APU to have any traction.

It is reasonably likely that AMD and Apple are working on a prototype. Minimally it would put Intel on notice.

If AMD gets more competitive with Intel's offerings with Zen then the move of OS X to AX makes even less sense. If there are two healthy suppliers why give that up? Some hand wavy "more control for more control sake" is just that hand waving. If Apple can get more bang for the buck from Intel/AMD they will stick with it. If that dual source falters then it is would be time for a move. But as long as it is working it doesn't buy much if anything to take on Intel as a full time competitor in the classic PC CPU space. ( doing that hasn't done wonders long term for AMD and Apple isn't particularly in better shape to do so. )

P.S. just for some substantive Mac Pro content ..... There is little to indicate that Zen is going to be very competitive with the Xeon E5 product line. So Opteron probably isn't going to get alot more traction very fast. They may get incrementally more competitive but over the next 1-2 years, it is doubtful that will make a difference in a Mac Pro CPU design bake-off.
 
OS X will die in that future..

All software and hardware dies off over time.

after few years it is no more.. the eleventh OS would have come.. macOS.

OS X 10.11 ( 11 is shipping now. )

Is Apple going to get rid of the 'X' ( and '10.' prefix) any time soon? Highly likely not.

Windows is dropping suffixes... Apple is in now worse position product naming wise.

Then we'd have tvOS, watchOS, phoneOS and macOS.. and perhaps carOS. iPads, laptops and desktops are all Macs.

Smoking something if think the a iPads is now or will ever be marketed as a Mac. iOS is going to stay.
OS X and Macs may fade over time as a product line as consumed at the lower end by iOS devices. Similar to how iPod (no iOS variants) are slowly fading over time.
 
Because the architect behind Zen worked closely with Apple on two Ax chips and probably gave them an inside peak at what AMD will be able to offer them (performance, exclusive deals, manufacturing, discounts) if they have a close relationship.

Eh? This about as detached from reality as you can get.

AMD sells x86 CPUs. So how unlikely is it that they don't talk to x86 System vendors about their product line ups via non disclosure agreement discussions? Very unlikely. AMD may not win Mac CPU design bake-offs but that doesn't mean they aren't trying or that Apple isn't looking at them at all.

That has diddly squat to do with an architect's job history. That is just specious hand waving.

The design objectives for Zen and the current and future AX line up are substantially different. Zen has to make a major jump just to get into the equivalence performance zone with Intel let alone surpass the competition in any significant way. Just because the AX implementations turned out OK doesn't mean that the Zen design will turn out equally as well. It takes far more than just one person to implement these designs. Take one player and put him on another team does not mean the new team performs in the same way as the old one did. Zen could be on the 'right track' but whether AMD as gotten it effectively implemented is an open question.
 
Smoking something if think the a iPads is now or will ever be marketed as a Mac. iOS is going to stay.
OS X and Macs may fade over time as a product line as consumed at the lower end by iOS devices. Similar to how iPod (no iOS variants) are slowly fading over time.

If laptops and ipads are ever going to marry.. it will happen. But anyway, this was just a nightmare.. right?
 
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Eh? This about as detached from reality as you can get.

AMD sells x86 CPUs. So how unlikely is it that they don't talk to x86 System vendors about their product line ups via non disclosure agreement discussions? Very unlikely. AMD may not win Mac CPU design bake-offs but that doesn't mean they aren't trying or that Apple isn't looking at them at all.

That has diddly squat to do with an architect's job history. That is just specious hand waving.

The design objectives for Zen and the current and future AX line up are substantially different. Zen has to make a major jump just to get into the equivalence performance zone with Intel let alone surpass the competition in any significant way. Just because the AX implementations turned out OK doesn't mean that the Zen design will turn out equally as well. It takes far more than just one person to implement these designs. Take one player and put him on another team does not mean the new team performs in the same way as the old one did. Zen could be on the 'right track' but whether AMD as gotten it effectively implemented is an open question.

AMD is working on x86 and ARM SoCs

''AMD may not win Mac CPU design bake-offs but that doesn't mean they aren't trying or that Apple isn't looking at them at all.''

I don't know who you are talking to because I said Apple is not only looking at them but actively taking part in AMD's progress.
 
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Why would Apple use AMD APUs when their AX chips in their iOS devices are probably far better, especially moving forward, than whatever AMD can possibly be cooking up?

Because no one wants to port all their Mac software to ARM.

x86 on iOS is way more likely. Xcode already supports x86 iOS compiles.

I don't know about AMD, but the AX stuff is not better than Intel's on laptops or desktops.
 
Because no one wants to port all their Mac software to ARM.

x86 on iOS is way more likely. Xcode already supports x86 iOS compiles.

I don't know about AMD, but the AX stuff is not better than Intel's on laptops or desktops.

Apple's A9 chip is within striking range of many of Intel's lower-power offerings, and purely from a processor standpoint an iPhone is now faster than a Macbook in many benchmarks. I don't think it behooves Apple to switch from Intel, and I'm certainly not recommending it any time soon—but considering how lackluster AMD's processor lineup has been, especially since the Core i generation/their Bulldozer debacle, I'd say Apple would rather switch to something it controls and which is ahead of the competition rather than switch from Intel to AMD.
 
Apple's A9 chip is within striking range of many of Intel's lower-power offerings, and purely from a processor standpoint an iPhone is now faster than a Macbook in many benchmarks.

And it doesn't run any Mac software. It needs to be way more than striking distance to be worth it. And while Rosetta was workable on Intel, a similar thing won't be workable on ARM. Ports are also much more complicated. Everyone started with Intel code because they supported Windows. Adobe just had to port their Intel optimizations they already had from Windows to Mac. No one has ARM optimizations for their big desktop apps waiting to save the day in an ARM transition. There is no ARM optimized version of Photoshop CS that Adobe could just dust off.
 
Apple's A9 chip is within striking range of many of Intel's lower-power offerings, and purely from a processor standpoint an iPhone is now faster than a Macbook in many benchmarks. I don't think it behooves Apple to switch from Intel, and I'm certainly not recommending it any time soon—but considering how lackluster AMD's processor lineup has been, especially since the Core i generation/their Bulldozer debacle, I'd say Apple would rather switch to something it controls and which is ahead of the competition rather than switch from Intel to AMD.

Even if it was better than any Intel CPU, you'd have to rewrite all or big part of your software due to the fact that you can't just recompile any but the most high level of code. Cross compiling isn't a panacea.
 
And the nightmarish part: macOS could come without terminal and all software installation goes trough AppStore.

at that point, "apple abandoned their pros" becomes a true statement.. you typically don't buy professional software through the app store.. like you don't find this in the apple app store:

Screen Shot 2015-10-21 at 9.47.01 PM.png

..and there are reasons for that.


idk, apple would need to work out some sweet deals and/or be more lenient with their rules towards these types of software companies with regards to app store sales.

and it's basically a fight apple can't win (apple vs much of the pro software sector).. the software companies just tell apple to piss off and the user pretty much has to follow the software company.
 
but sometimes the mindless fan service from that is blinding.

problem is, you possibly- and surely others.. place someone in the mindless fan category based on differing opinions and differing perspectives

personA- "thunderbolt is st00pid :mad:"
personB- "thunderbolt is sweet"

personA "@personB.. you're a mindless lemming jumping off a cliff into a big sea of sugar water :eek:o_O:mad:"
personB "dork"
 
You hit the nail on the head. As a longtime fan I am actually glad Apple is going through such a golden era with iOS and iPhone, but sometimes the mindless fan service from that is blinding. And this is coming from a fan who has been burned by Apple on more than one occasion.

I'd also encourage people to go here leave feedback here: https://www.apple.com/feedback/

Part of the problem are certain users who live here solely to disparage every modern Apple product and it's tiresome. You know who you are and frankly it's sad that you spend so much time pouring anger into a forum about products you don't and will never own. We get it, the discontinued Mac Pros are the 24k gold relics of a bygone era and the others now own Windows workstations that are "real computers."

We need to split this forum into two parts:

2013 Mac Pro Owners
Disgruntled Vintage Mac Pro & Ex-Mac Pro Owners
 
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Part of the problem are certain users who live here solely to disparage every modern Apple product and it's tiresome. You know who you are and frankly it's sad that you spend so much time pouring anger into a forum about products you don't and will never own. We get it, the discontinued Mac Pros are the 24k gold relics of a bygone era and the others now own Windows workstations that are "real computers."

We need to split this forum into two parts:

2013 Mac Pro Owners
Disgruntled Vintage Mac Pro & Ex-Mac Pro Owners

Suggesting to silence/censor 'disgruntled vintage mac pro' users only proves that Apple's 'soldered everything' approach is a legit problem.

#backfired
 
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