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ipodtoucher

macrumors 68000
Sep 13, 2007
1,684
1
Cedar Park, TX
Not out of line at all. These thing should be brought up.
I myself have been lazy in that department, especially since my latest stuff has been lighting work, I typically just post the setup, but I guess I will start putting the exif as well.


touchy,

touchy,


touchy!

As far as the overreaction and saying: "oh well you might as well not burn or dodge or color correct or crop--" Hell yes, you're right. If you're going about it as horribly as most people go about HDR processing, then do us a favor and cut off your hands or destroy your keyboard and mouse.
This is getting ridiculous when grown people can't take a bit of criticism, not even directed at them individually, but at the advanced-amateur/enthusiast/semi-pro photographic community as a whole. Why can't we agree to hold ourselves to higher standards? Is that so wrong? Why should we not question the status quo?

Get over it, grow up, and get some thicker skin.

[rant]

Here's the thing, Photography is an art form, it is also a process of trial and error. To sit here and bash someone else's work is just dumb on your part. You have the right to criticize art, but only to an extent. I find HDR a digital art, because you are using a mixed media and multiple processes to manipulate a photograph. When people post in this thread they want a critique of their work, but not a complaint about how they manipulated a photo.

I'm in an art aprec. class and we have learned how to critique a work of art, but I don't remember bashing as one of the categories. We were asked to bring in a picture of an art work we didn't like, and I chose Thomas Kinkade; I really don't like his work, but I don't call his gallery and piss and moan because he still paints the same way, the way I hate.

I can understand you not liking it, but stop complaining about it. Like I said in a former post, you post many portrait shots, and Doylem posts saturated landscapes over and over again, but we don't fuss about it. Some people have a niche, so they stick to it, you do great portraits, Doylem does great landscapes (and sheep :p), and Valdore does outstanding HDRs. Some people want to try new things, so they do.

[/rant]
 

valdore

macrumors 65816
Jan 9, 2007
1,262
0
Kansas City, Missouri. USA
You were being touchy. No one has targeted you this whole time, but apparently it's something you are self-conscious about, or it wouldn't get such a rise out of you.

It's not really a "self-conscious" issue so much as it is a longstanding annoyance I have felt about what I have attempted to explicate in my prior post. I know it was never intended at me, but just because something's not hurled directly at me specifically doesn't me I won't find it irritating and be compelled to respond.

Not exactly, no. It's more like "I can't wait for this light-up shoes trend to be over"
(although, I do miss them so!)

I'm sorry, but that's just not an apt analogy at all.



I'm not commanding a greater respect for myself, if that is what you're suggesting. I'm just trying to get people to experiment a little more, test out HDR and find out what it is for, and find out what it's not for--- and then don't use it for the latter. But people have found this quick and easy way to make a WHAM BAM COLOR CONTRAST SHINY image that is just a snapshot wearing a gaudy mask, and they're sticking to it.

I don't understand why it's so wrong to ask people to innovate a little bit. I am not throwing out the baby with the bathwater; as I showed, I recognize legitimate and beautiful use of HDR processing. But the bathwater is getting dirty, and needs to be emptied out sometime...

I wasn't trying to implicate you specifically when I wrote about the too-frequent-to-be-a-coincidence aloof sneer of the more "experienced" photography and art communities. I'm talking in general on that one.

My contention throughout this whole thing has been this: most of the so-called "experienced" photographers are too quick to dismiss something new, and I'll elucidate this be saying that if I was to have listened to everyone's opinion on my rather frequent HDR experimentation and usage since I discovered it in 2006, then I wouldn't have continued my fascination with it and its uses, and gotten as adept with using it now. I see the situation as kind of like the older line of thinking as being too quick to dismiss the changes that are happening.

And, let me have this disclaimer... yeah sure, plenty of HDR photos out there suck, and so do a lot of non HDR photos too. In fact, all talented photographers take bad photos here and there, especially when they're just getting started. It's just the perception I have gotten overall, for a long, long time, of the experienced being derisive of the inexperienced and then having their asses served to them in the end. Story of human civilization, really.
 

juanster

macrumors 68020
Mar 2, 2007
2,238
0
toronto
"Get over it, grow up, and get some thicker skin."

i completely agree with that, I love getting criticism from people well more talented than me, that includes you seenew, and a lot of the stuff i get I look at it think about it and decide if it makes sense to me or not, like i said b4 Doylem has given me some great insights on lighting and composition,
and Valdore lots of tips on HDR, you asked me why I thought my subject was worth shooting, i thought it looked great and sat there and waited for a yellow cab to pass by so it could be in the background since those represent NYC pretty much and other personal reasons as well. blowing u the highlights and blocking the shadows im not going to lie i had no idea what you were talking about so i went out and read a couple of articles and stuff about it, thanks to you i learned a bunch about the subject. Many people have discouraged me from taking shots, I am juts starting to enjoy photography and love HDR at the moment so i will keep doing it. Hopefully i will get a lot better at it :). And now i know it really bothers you and a bunch of people here that beginners like me post here our sh**tty HDR tryouts, hmmmm let see.. wait... yeah no i really don;t care about that. I just wish some people get over it, grow up and get some thicker skin about it and stop bit***ng about it, I won;t stop posting them and I am sure a bunch of other beginners won;t either.

All that said and done, love your last post with the "moon unit" diffuser thingy and look forward to keep seeing your portraits around..
 

cutsman

macrumors regular
Jun 1, 2006
202
0
Taken in Hong Kong with Nikon D90.

p658558357-5.jpg
 

Plymouthbreezer

macrumors 601
Feb 27, 2005
4,337
253
Massachusetts
So who here has formal training in Photography?

...Just saying... Anyway, here's mine for today...No post processing:

picture2sz6.jpg


Tripod mounted D70s with overhead lighting and Color-Aid background. I made the sculpture a few weeks back for a project.
 

seenew

macrumors 68000
Dec 1, 2005
1,569
1
Brooklyn
My contention throughout this whole thing has been this: most of the so-called "experienced" photographers are too quick to dismiss something new, and I'll elucidate this be saying that if I was to have listened to everyone's opinion on my rather frequent HDR experimentation and usage since I discovered it in 2006, then I wouldn't have continued my fascination with it and its uses, and gotten as adept with using it now. I see the situation as kind of like the older line of thinking as being too quick to dismiss the changes that are happening.

And, let me have this disclaimer... yeah sure, plenty of HDR photos out there suck, and so do a lot of non HDR photos too. In fact, all talented photographers take bad photos here and there, especially when they're just getting started. It's just the perception I have gotten overall, for a long, long time, of the experienced being derisive of the inexperienced and then having their asses served to them in the end. Story of human civilization, really.

I've never been one to dismiss anything new, media or technique-wise. Hell, I'm only 20, I am not set in my ways. I was just trying to encourage people from using post-processing as a crutch, and this whole thing got out of hand into an HDR-bash-fest. I know I am partially to blame, and I'm sorry it went this far.
It seems like we've resolved it, even though that last bit of yours sounds vaguely threatening, so I'm going to drop it for now.

I won't concede, though, that people should only be given positive feedback. That doesn't help anyone.

And now I'm off to pack. Finished finals and I'm headed home to see the folks for a few weeks. I'll be around, though, I'm sure.
 

seenew

macrumors 68000
Dec 1, 2005
1,569
1
Brooklyn
So who here has formal training in Photography?

...Just saying... Anyway, here's mine for today...No post processing:

picture2sz6.jpg


Tripod mounted D70s with overhead lighting. I made the sculpture a few weeks back for a project.

I'm in the processes of earning my undergrad degree in Photography from the Savannah College of Art and Design.

As for the photo, that's really excellent. I love the reflected pink/red from the seamless. Is this part of a series?
 

juanster

macrumors 68020
Mar 2, 2007
2,238
0
toronto
I won't concede, though, that people should only be given positive feedback. That doesn't help anyone.

totally agree, nothing frustrates me more than having someone look at one of my photographs or any other thing i do in life and say hey thats excellent phenomenal bla bla bla,, when i know it's not...
 

Plymouthbreezer

macrumors 601
Feb 27, 2005
4,337
253
Massachusetts
I'm in the processes of earning my undergrad degree in Photography from the Savannah College of Art and Design.

As for the photo, that's really excellent. I love the reflected pink/red from the seamless. Is this part of a series?
Many thanks. I actually attend Massachusetts College of Art and Design (Architecture undergrad major... Gave photo serious thought nonetheless). SCAD is a great school, but I like New England, and I'll save my money for grad at RISD or MIT. :p

Did a few tonight... My glasses, a ball-in-a-cup, and some Starbucks; I was just playing with various exposures and styles.
 

heron88

macrumors 6502
Jun 16, 2008
278
0
Here is mine for today

DSC_0527.jpg


Nikon D80 | Shutter: 1/500 | Aperture: F5.6 | Focal Length: 90mm | ISO: 100 | No Post Processing

C&C Welcome
 

Plymouthbreezer

macrumors 601
Feb 27, 2005
4,337
253
Massachusetts
i will be doing a Digital Media Arts Program starting this january , it's not all Photography, but I think i will be taking photography classes 4 hours a week as part of the program, I am pretty excited about it..
Hi... I'm not sure if we've actually conversed here on the forums before...

Anyway, after taking a look at your Flickr, I'd suggest a few things:

• Don't take so many photos, but rather, focus on taking a few really good ones. It seems you find something, and just snap a lot of shots. For example, in this photo, what is the main interest? Your composition here is lackluster at best. The "No Turns" sign is not really picture worthy, and if you were aiming for the lightboard behind it, the pole runs though it; I can't read the text behind, so is my eye not drawn to it. Same situation here.

• Line up things. In this photo, One can't help but notice the skewed buildings. Buildings aren't skewed, so it just makes the viewer feel like you were sloppy and didn't take the time to compose the shot. And "titled-artsy" isn't in vogue, last time I checked anyway.

• Make sure you take things that are visually stimulating... I fail to even raise an eyelash at shots such as this. What here were you trying to capture?

I know this all sounds harsh... But I spend everyday - hours each day - looking at art, parsing though it, exploring the esthetics of our world and surroundings. I am not an expert, but us who come from the "aloof art" background usually do know a tad about how things look. This doesn't mean that everyone else doesn't; but to dismiss one trained in the field is a blatant show of ignorance.

My art gets torn to shreds too (anyone who has gone to art school will vouch for this), but that's what I learn from, so I don't mind.
 

juanster

macrumors 68020
Mar 2, 2007
2,238
0
toronto
Hi... I'm not sure if we've actually conversed here on the forums before...

Anyway, after taking a look at your Flickr, I'd suggest a few things:

• Don't take so many photos, but rather, focus on taking a few really good ones. It seems you find something, and just snap a lot of shots. For example, in this photo, what is the main interest? Your composition here is lackluster at best. The "No Turns" sign is not really picture worthy, and if you were aiming for the lightboard behind it, the pole runs though it; I can't read the text behind, so is my eye not drawn to it. Same situation here.

• Line up things. In this photo, One can't help but notice the skewed buildings. Buildings aren't skewed, so it just makes the viewer feel like you were sloppy and didn't take the time to compose the shot. And "titled-artsy" isn't in vogue, last time I checked anyway.

• Make sure you take things that are visually stimulating... I fail to even raise an eyelash at shots such as this. What here were you trying to capture?

I know this all sounds harsh... But I spend everyday - hours each day - looking at art, parsing though it, exploring the esthetics of our world and surroundings. I am not an expert, but us who come from the "aloof art" background usually do know a tad about how things look. This doesn't mean that everyone else doesn't; but to dismiss one trained in the field is a blatant show of ignorance.

My art gets torn to shreds too (anyone who has gone to art school will vouch for this), but that's what I learn from, so I don't mind.

great thanks a lot for looking thru my stuff, and the c&c is much appreciated. I will absolutely take some notes before I go out shooting....

ALso i forgot to change the permissions on those pictures you were looking at you were looking at my family NY vacation pictures(i use flickr to back up all of my pics) not that it makes a difference anyways, what you just said applies to all of the ones i would have left for everyone to see..
once again thx for taking the time to cc..
 

Plymouthbreezer

macrumors 601
Feb 27, 2005
4,337
253
Massachusetts
great thanks a lot for looking thru my stuff, and the c&c is much appreciated. I will absolutely take some notes before I go out shooting....

ALso i forgot to change the permissions on those pictures you were looking at you were looking at my family NY vacation pictures(i use flickr to back up all of my pics) not that it makes a difference anyways, what you just said applies to all of the ones i would have left for everyone to see..
once again thx for taking the time to cc..
No problem. You do have some great shots too, so don't give up (but obviously you know that)!

I've done things like that too, making "private" shots public... It's one of those "woops" moments. :eek:
 

juanster

macrumors 68020
Mar 2, 2007
2,238
0
toronto
No problem. You do have some great shots too, so don't give up (but obviously you know that)!

I've done things like that too, making "private" shots public... It's one of those "woops" moments. :eek:

lol yeah, happens wayyyyy too often to me , pretty much everytime i upload stuff to flickr...
 

valdore

macrumors 65816
Jan 9, 2007
1,262
0
Kansas City, Missouri. USA
It seems like we've resolved it, even though that last bit of yours sounds vaguely threatening, so I'm going to drop it for now.

I assure you there was no intent to threaten you.

I won't concede, though, that people should only be given positive feedback. That doesn't help anyone.

Well I kind of agree for the most part - and I guess I should reiterate that I'm not trying to say that criticism should be verboten, I'm just saying that for awhile now I've perceived an irrational backlash from some people against all HDR, just in my frequent, regular participation in photography websites for the past few years I've been doing this regularly.


And now I'm off to pack. Finished finals and I'm headed home to see the folks for a few weeks. I'll be around, though, I'm sure.

How thankful I am to be done with college and all its assorted unpleasantness. I studied finance and I'd rather drill a hole through the side of my head than go through that again.
 

LittleCanonKid

macrumors 6502
Oct 22, 2008
420
113
This thread is much more interesting when there are pictures
Nice to see that you're contributing. ;) (I kid, I kid.)

Another old shot from awhile ago. I took two shots out the door during a downpour and this is the one that turned out. The color scheme is very boring but I still like how it turned out.

IMG_6838_resizedpng.png


Edit: Thought I should throw in some of the basic EXIF data.

Canon Rebel XT, 1/400 (shutter priority), ISO 1600, f/8, 80-200mm f/4.5-5.6 lens at 200mm
 

juanster

macrumors 68020
Mar 2, 2007
2,238
0
toronto
wowo that's pretty noiseless for iso 1600 in the xt, I ve tried many times and can never get anywhere close to this..
 

LittleCanonKid

macrumors 6502
Oct 22, 2008
420
113
That's what I thought too, but it's really the subject of the photo that masks it well. I've got some ISO 1600 shots where it really shows... this one turned out good though :confused:
 
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