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ssd swap - high usage of Terabytes Written
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How do you know they put MLC SSDs to Macbooks M1? It's very likely they put TLC SSDs to Macbook Pros 256 GB from Kioxia.
Because if the TBW is 600 TB then it will last for 50 years?
That’s a good number. My intel MBP I use for work has 1.5TB after a month. I use it for 8hrs, 5 days a week. I don’t even do photo/video editing.
If you remain concerned about this as you near the end of your 3 year coverage you can now extend Apple Care beyond that.
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Perhaps that will change in the next 30 months or so.
If not, then as you approach the end of your coverage, re-evaluate the situation at that time with whatever new information has become available and decide the appropriate course of action. Maybe sell/trade for a new system, maybe keep the current one.
IMHO folks are unnecessarily worrying about something that might be a problem in the future that Apple might not address if it turns out to have the impact folks today fear it might.
Or have a bunch of people actually had an SSD failure already? Not just reading numbers from a tool? I've not been following closely.
I believe under Europes' warranty system, you would have a good chance at a claim against them if the SSD died in that timeframe.
Not really. 2 years warranty because that's required (at least here in Germany).
But: after 6 months the customer has to prove that the issue was caused by a manufacturer' fault and not because of "wrong" usage. In the first 6 months it's the other way round.
Apple still gives only 1 year of "Apple Warranty" here. If the SSD fails after 2.5 years, you're as screwed as everywhere else.
JMHO anyone buying one of these first Apple Silicon models ought to be buying Apple Care and thus have three years coverage. Apple hasn't had the best track record. I considered it as part of the cost of jumping on the M1 train now.
I believe that is offered in Germany, yes?
Yup. You can get AppleCare here. Up to 3 years in total. So that means after 3 years and 1 day you're screwed.
Sounds like with every other company? Well, the main issue are the ridiculous repair prices with Apple if something fails. If anything fails on that machine after 3 years, it's almost as expensive to repair as buying a new machine. It's like the machine has just 3 pars: Logic board, display unit and top-case (with trackpad, keyboard and trackpad, also must be paired to the M1/T2 with special Apple Software so TouchID or the TouchBar works).
They do the same **** with batteries. If your top case has more than just minor cosmetic issues, they often charge you the full price of a new top-case instead of just the battery fee (which is around 200 bucks).
And back to topic: We don't know what NAND chips Apple built into the machines. It could be anything from MLC to cheap QLC (although my money is on 3D TLC NAND).
And for those comparing it to a Samsung PRO NVMe: Apple doesn't use any Samsung NAND in these modesl. It's WD/Sandisk or Kioxia (Toshiba). And Apple has, extremely likely, not used expensive DC grade NAND but regular consumer NAND like in every SSD you can buy of the shelf (but charge rip-off prices for them).
Well... I don't care right now. a) I'm not buying a Gen 1 model and paying money for being their guinea pig and b) we cannot do anything against it anyway. Time will tell whether there is a mass dying of M1 machines after 2-3 years or not. Until then: Please use your machines normally so we get valid long-term data
Exactly this, and that is like the expected minimum.
A study was done and 256GB consumer SSDs under constant stress were shown to keep going with no issues even after 2PB+ writes, in 2015.
2PB is more than three times 600TB... so writing a TB a month is “my SSD will outlast me and my grandchildren’s children” territory. Aka nothing to worry about
Only if you screw yourself by not bothering to actually do something like review the situation near the end of the three year coverage period.
Maybe it'll develop into a real issue with actual instances of failed SSDs?
- then maybe Apple will have created some sort of repair program,
- or maybe they won't.
Maybe it'll turn out to be a non-issue with no failures and all the worry was for nothing.
It should be pretty clear which way it is when we're 30-33 months from now. Folks can then decide to sell/trade to a new system at that time.
If it turns out to be a real issue, it would heavily devalue the machines. Who wants to buy a "broken" device?
How so? I’ve reduced my writes from ranges of 350-500GB a day to 25-50GB a day, while having the exact same workflow and doing all the things i’ve always done and more on the exact same M1 8/256 MBP.we cannot do anything against it anyway. Time will tell whether there is a mass dying of M1 machines after 2-3 years or not. Until then: Please use your machines normally so we get valid long-term data
There is physically no chance my SSD will die due to writes in the lifetime of this macbook.
Things can be done and have been done in this thread to pretty much fix this issue completely. Some people are reporting positive things about the 11.4 beta in regards to writes.
There really is nothing flawed about these M1 machines from a hardware standpoint
I don't WANT it to die in 3 years, based on good evidence I don't BELIEVE it will die in 3 years, and I also have a high degree of CONFIDENCE that if there ultimately was an unexpected issue that caused premature death, Apple would make it good. I am personally so confident of the above, that I am not even considering AppleCare. However, all that notwithstanding, if it unexpectedly died in 3 years, I would have no regrets. This machine has given/is giving/will continue to give MUCH MORE usefulness and pleasure than the $333/year for 3 years will cost me. (Less than the cost of 2 Starbucks/week)!
Sure, if it turns out to be a real issue and if Apple doesn't have some repair/replacement program in place.
While possible, I anticipate that scenario being a low probability.
Plus in the US one presently can extend AC+ beyond three years and perhaps that will continue and be expanded to other places.
The point is folks will have options. Sure, the three year ownership cost may be higher than originally anticipated, but nobody ought to be buying a depreciating tool based on expected future resale value. Take a guess what the Intel Mac resale is gonna look like in three years.
It still gives people a bad feeling. Nobody likes to use an expensive device they might plan to keep for longer time and having the feeling every tab or everything you will drastically shorten it's lifespan. Whether it's true or not. Humans are not rational, even though economics studies always assume they're.
Don't need to wait three years. They're already garbage for most cases. And guess what. They're especially low on devices with Apples "features" that reduce longevity (Butterfly keyboard, 2011 AMD GPU, 2016 flex cable).Take a guess what the Intel Mac resale is gonna look like in three years.
As I said: I don't own an M1 and right now have no incentive to buy one for the time being. I just bought a specced out 16" last year which's values is already worse than halved and has its own set of issues I now have to deal with.
Sure, though folks can either sit and stew in their worry or they can choose not to.
That choice may involve abandoning or eschewing the platform for a while despite no evidence of actual early failures, or they can choose not to worry about it until it's time to worry about it.
A wise person once told me: You're as happy as you choose to be.
Side note - past basic economics, the field does get into human irrational responses. c.f. behavioral economics
Yup. This is why, when the M1's came out and I realized I sold my 2018 MBP15 and early 2020 MBA and consolidated to an M1 MBP ASAP. Looking now it seems wholesale prices @ CashForYourMac/MacMeAnOffer are down 1/3 from even late November, which reaffirms my choice. (I hadn't spec'd the MBA with enough SSD for it to carry the full load as a sole system, which was an error on my part)
With performance of AP0256Q about half of other TLC SSDs I wouldn't be surprised if the Q stands for QLC.
Wait. I thought the M1 SSDs where so extremely fast? The one in the 16" is only fast in benchmarking. When doing real world stuff it's pretty slow and barely reaches 500MB/s. Either the T2 is not that great of and SSD controller or Apple used subpar NAND chips..
The M1 SSD is super slow. I don't know how anyone ever accomplishes anything at all with these things.
Yes, I'm being sarcastic.
Result is from just now on my M1 MBP w/ 1TB SSD.
I'm referring to real world usage and not benchmarks. Apps are super slow to launch while watching the icon bounce several times. Some blame that on apps phoning home to Apple but that doesn't explain the ~2x slower boot time.