Mind you, I do (rather fervently) hope that Ramsdale is not blamed for this disgraceful performance tonight and made - as a consequence - to feel even more of an exile from the first team as a consequence.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
The 2023-2024 Football Thread
- Thread starter Scepticalscribe
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
I've seen enough. ETH has got to go.
Don't hire a new permanent manager until the ownership and footballing structure is sorted out, though. This is a lost season, let it ride and play the kids without any pressure or expectations.
Don't hire a new permanent manager until the ownership and footballing structure is sorted out, though. This is a lost season, let it ride and play the kids without any pressure or expectations.
They are the best team in the US!!And I've been to a couple of USWNT matches ...
The United owners/board need to give ETH time to work things out even at the expense of United losing more games because it has to be more than a manager problem at United. The one thing many United supporters/critics have pin pointed across both home game defeats by Man City and now Newcastle is the body language of the players. City and Newcastle players were seen running after the ball, running to get into position, chasing down players, getting back to defend, putting the tackles in, putting the blocks in, tracking back to defend but when you look at the United players, only 1 or 2 players are doing this, sometimes 3. We constantly hear of United defenders being out of position and not marking the players they are supposed to be marking. They are not sticking to their areas and thus gaps form which the opposing team exploit. When United attack and lose the ball, this is where Rashford comes in for a huge amount of criticism of his game because he does not track back quick enough to help the rest of the team.
It is so obvious to see the difference in body language of United players and players of opposing teams. Opposing team players seem to be up for, putting a huge amount of effort in but this is not so with the United players and this behavior of the players is what has persistently got managers sacked.
People need to listen to the criticism words of ex manager Ralf Rangnick who would constantly complain about the goings on within United. Whilst he would not openly say what the problems were he did give hints that the problems at United were more than just with the players and much deeper within the club. When he was appointed manager at the club it was with the agreement that he becomes the clubs sporting director because that his where his experience lies but what do we see? we see him give his honest thoughts and opinions on the club which no previous manager had done before and he pays for it by not being given the sporting directors job. He told the world the clubs problems go deeper than the manager and the players and he paid for it.
Everyone knew ETH was going to find it hard at United because better managers than him have failed at the club. Also people need to remember that he came to rework the team, basically a rebuild, to try and find where the problems lie, to eradicate them and get the team back to winning ways but to that that he need's time and already people have forgotten that the team was near rock bottom when Rangnick came in to steady the ship and the next manager's job was to do a rebuilding job which would take 3-4 years, even 5 but less than two years in and people are already calling for him to be sacked. Sacking ETH will do the club no good. Every manager out there knows ETH was brought in to do a rebuild of the squad which managers know can take years to do. Results will not go their way because it's a rebuild of the squad. Rebuilds do not work in a year or 2 years but it seems that is what is being expected of ETH because now people are calling for him to be sacked. What does this say to every manager out there? That if they do not win things and get 4th league position or better even though they are being asked to rebuild the squad that they are under threat of the sack? No manager is going to work under those conditions.
It is so obvious to see the difference in body language of United players and players of opposing teams. Opposing team players seem to be up for, putting a huge amount of effort in but this is not so with the United players and this behavior of the players is what has persistently got managers sacked.
People need to listen to the criticism words of ex manager Ralf Rangnick who would constantly complain about the goings on within United. Whilst he would not openly say what the problems were he did give hints that the problems at United were more than just with the players and much deeper within the club. When he was appointed manager at the club it was with the agreement that he becomes the clubs sporting director because that his where his experience lies but what do we see? we see him give his honest thoughts and opinions on the club which no previous manager had done before and he pays for it by not being given the sporting directors job. He told the world the clubs problems go deeper than the manager and the players and he paid for it.
Everyone knew ETH was going to find it hard at United because better managers than him have failed at the club. Also people need to remember that he came to rework the team, basically a rebuild, to try and find where the problems lie, to eradicate them and get the team back to winning ways but to that that he need's time and already people have forgotten that the team was near rock bottom when Rangnick came in to steady the ship and the next manager's job was to do a rebuilding job which would take 3-4 years, even 5 but less than two years in and people are already calling for him to be sacked. Sacking ETH will do the club no good. Every manager out there knows ETH was brought in to do a rebuild of the squad which managers know can take years to do. Results will not go their way because it's a rebuild of the squad. Rebuilds do not work in a year or 2 years but it seems that is what is being expected of ETH because now people are calling for him to be sacked. What does this say to every manager out there? That if they do not win things and get 4th league position or better even though they are being asked to rebuild the squad that they are under threat of the sack? No manager is going to work under those conditions.
Reading the excuses forMan U's poor performance has become very, very boring. The vast majority of other fans just aren't interested. We don't care. They're crap, and that's that.
What I've noticed over the decades with Man U though, is that their fans often turn on the players/manager when things aren't going well. Sure, many clubs' fans do that, but not to the same level of vehemence as Man U fans. This, I believe, is down to the utterly toxic atmosphere that Bacon Face created at the club; the hatred for other clubs (particularly Liverpool, but also the disrespect shown to Man City and Arsenal) and the lack of tolerance for any player not playing at 100% (Beckham, Pizzagate etc). Fergie would regularly slag a player off publicly, and this gave the green light to fans to do the same. Whereas at other clubs, the fans give support regardless; you don't single out individuals and make them scapegoats, you don't boo your own team ffs. Mourinho is another to do this; things start to go wrong, he slags players off, refuses to take responsibility for himself, and loses the dressing room. A pattern repeated throughout his career (things aren't going so well at Roma these days...). A club needs to stand united, and Man Utd are anything but that. In all my time folowing Liverpool, I've only ever heard one manager being booed, and that was Roy Hodgson who was dreadful and didn't adequately respect the club, so that was fair enough. You get behind the team! Cheer them on when they're down, give them something to believe in, to fight for. Liverpool and City players always have thousands of passionate fans cheering them on, so they are rewarded massively when they win. This is the difference. Man U players are being booed constantly; why should the bother if they're getting dog's abuse from their own so-called fans? All this just shows the difference in class between Man U and other clubs. Form is temporary; class is permanent. And Man U just don't have any class.
Lol 0-3 at home to a second string Newcastle. 🤣
What I've noticed over the decades with Man U though, is that their fans often turn on the players/manager when things aren't going well. Sure, many clubs' fans do that, but not to the same level of vehemence as Man U fans. This, I believe, is down to the utterly toxic atmosphere that Bacon Face created at the club; the hatred for other clubs (particularly Liverpool, but also the disrespect shown to Man City and Arsenal) and the lack of tolerance for any player not playing at 100% (Beckham, Pizzagate etc). Fergie would regularly slag a player off publicly, and this gave the green light to fans to do the same. Whereas at other clubs, the fans give support regardless; you don't single out individuals and make them scapegoats, you don't boo your own team ffs. Mourinho is another to do this; things start to go wrong, he slags players off, refuses to take responsibility for himself, and loses the dressing room. A pattern repeated throughout his career (things aren't going so well at Roma these days...). A club needs to stand united, and Man Utd are anything but that. In all my time folowing Liverpool, I've only ever heard one manager being booed, and that was Roy Hodgson who was dreadful and didn't adequately respect the club, so that was fair enough. You get behind the team! Cheer them on when they're down, give them something to believe in, to fight for. Liverpool and City players always have thousands of passionate fans cheering them on, so they are rewarded massively when they win. This is the difference. Man U players are being booed constantly; why should the bother if they're getting dog's abuse from their own so-called fans? All this just shows the difference in class between Man U and other clubs. Form is temporary; class is permanent. And Man U just don't have any class.
Lol 0-3 at home to a second string Newcastle. 🤣
Columbus managed a solid 2-0 home win against Atlanta in the first of a best of three series in the first round of the MLS playoffs. Due to our seeding the third match, if needed, will be back in Columbus so I am cautiously optimistic. All we need in the away leg is a draw.
And you meet ‘Pool in the next round…that’s going to be a tough game for both sides.
Depends on what mood Liverpool are in. Having already beaten West Ham this season, if Liverpool can find their groove, then it might be a very long night for the Hammers. But, it's the second tier cup competition, so perhaps less certain than if it were a league game. Given that Moyes has managed precisely 0 wins at Anfield in his entire career, the odds are against him doing so now, but who knows?
Last night, Moyes defeated Arsenal for the first time (not sure whether it was the first time in his entire career, but it was certainly the first time since he took over the reins as manager at West Ham.
Sometimes, changes can take place.
I have been reading a little more about this.
Not only did Australia pull out, withdrawing from submitting a possible bid, (and the World Cup was due to be hosted by a country from either Asia, or Australasia/Oceania) - thereby leaving Saudi Arabia's bid as the sole remaining bid to host the competition, but, two other things are also worthy of attention, or worth noting.
Firstly, the date of the bid was brought forward (quite unexectedly, according to reports), and secondly, the window during which bids could be submitted was limited to a mere 25 days.
This does leave an unpleasant taste.
It’s so blatant it’s mystifying how they think we don’t know what has happened.
Agreed.
Not even remotely subtle, not even attempting - or pretending - to be subtle.
Winter, early darkness in the evenings, (now that the clocks have gone back), the cold, the wind, the rain......this is all depressing enough.
Which is why I don't know why I have been depressing myself still further by reading online reviews - accounts, analysis - about Kai Havertz.
Which is why I don't know why I have been depressing myself still further by reading online reviews - accounts, analysis - about Kai Havertz.
I would say the same for your boys. We’ll see what kind of team Klopp goes for. Probably the Kelleher in goal again and Quansah coming in for Virgil.
ETH is going to be sacked in my opinion. A number of papers have picked up on the Times article reporting that 'senior sources' within United are looking at managers to replace ETH. There is also another article doing the rounds in the paper saying that two United directors are discussing about getting a replacement for ETH, and now we see that United have issued a statement saying they stand by ETH.
You know what? United have done this for EVERY manager they have sacked. The manager has a poor run of form, suddenly the 'out' voices get higher, United issue a public statement saying they back the manager but a few poor results later the manager is sacked. The EXACT same has now just happened with ETH. He is having a bad run of form, fans are calling for him to be sacked, the club issue a statement backing the manager and then a few months later the manager is sacked (not yet but you know what I mean). It is history repeating itself.
Also people need to be aware that sponsors will have performance clauses in their contract that United must hit and the contract is written in such a way that a) the sponsor can withhold money if certain performance are not met and/or b) there is a 'compensation' clause which forces United to pay the sponsor x amount of money if certain performance targets are not met. Such clauses are a very common feature in contracts, you see them everywhere.
This is why in my opinion ETH will get sacked if the team does not start to win games.
You look at the current rate managers get sacked, it is usually 2 to 3 years. Very very rarely is a manager allowed to get themselves out of trouble like they used to do and in my opinion it is down to contracts and the performance clauses within them. Club owners cannot afford to allow a manager to get themselves out of trouble because they would be hit financially hard by performance clauses in the contracts.
You know what? United have done this for EVERY manager they have sacked. The manager has a poor run of form, suddenly the 'out' voices get higher, United issue a public statement saying they back the manager but a few poor results later the manager is sacked. The EXACT same has now just happened with ETH. He is having a bad run of form, fans are calling for him to be sacked, the club issue a statement backing the manager and then a few months later the manager is sacked (not yet but you know what I mean). It is history repeating itself.
Also people need to be aware that sponsors will have performance clauses in their contract that United must hit and the contract is written in such a way that a) the sponsor can withhold money if certain performance are not met and/or b) there is a 'compensation' clause which forces United to pay the sponsor x amount of money if certain performance targets are not met. Such clauses are a very common feature in contracts, you see them everywhere.
This is why in my opinion ETH will get sacked if the team does not start to win games.
You look at the current rate managers get sacked, it is usually 2 to 3 years. Very very rarely is a manager allowed to get themselves out of trouble like they used to do and in my opinion it is down to contracts and the performance clauses within them. Club owners cannot afford to allow a manager to get themselves out of trouble because they would be hit financially hard by performance clauses in the contracts.
Can you verify this? Such contracts will be so secret, and very few individuals will actually know all their terms (board members, the lawyers, very few else). I know that an individual sportsperson can have such performance related clauses, but clubs like Man U have enormous pulling power, and will almost certainly be pulling the strings when it comes to sponsorship deals. There will be no shortage of brands only to willing to have their names on shirts etc. I'm curious to know how you can be so confident in such an assertion.
I no longer follow international mens football; a) it's generally below the standard of the best club football, and b) it's as corrupt as hell, so I do not wish to validate such dodgy shenanigans. I didn't watch a single WC2022 game for this reason.
I think that you are conflating (or confusing) two different things.
A footballer's main contract is with the club he (or, in the future, she) signs for, and then, there are bonuses, and sponsorship deals.
However, while that main contract is between the player and the club, a sponsorship deal (unless it is a club deal, such as the stuff - a slogan, or a logo, - that appears on the team's shirts) is between the company that does the sponsorship and the individual player.
There may be performance clauses in that, but those performance clauses affect the player, not the club, unless a specific contract has been signed with the club, (such as a shirt deal).
Thus, a potential problem - or issue - here is that players are answerable - in financial terms - to the many who pay them, rather than simply and solely the club that pays their (often grossly inflated) weekly wages.
However, individual sponsorship deals, even individual sponsorship contracts with performance clauses - the deals signed with individual players - are not a determining factor in whether a manager remains in place, because they have been signed with a particular player, not a club.
I think you have misunderstood my post. I am talking about club sponsorship not player sponsorship.
I thank some of you for your reflections and genuine support of Womens Football, ♥️ to you great guys!
I'm also certain that it only can expand your general awareness of Football - at least so I have heard from other guys.
But you know what, Reddit have a BIG Womens Soccer - https://www.reddit.com/r/WomensSoccer/ - community, very inspiring, I might learn some new things myself. Definitely a win win for me! Off I go.
I'm also certain that it only can expand your general awareness of Football - at least so I have heard from other guys.
But you know what, Reddit have a BIG Womens Soccer - https://www.reddit.com/r/WomensSoccer/ - community, very inspiring, I might learn some new things myself. Definitely a win win for me! Off I go.
We are clearly getting to a point where ETH seems destined for the chop - whether the current state of things is primarily his fault or not. With a new part-owner coming on board change seems inevitable, even if it is only change for change’s sake.
Last edited:
Please look in here occasionally at least - I found your posts interesting, and even if we don’t post as often about women’s football it’s definitely on my radar, and I hope to see the game continue to grow.
I was watching an interview Neville did recently with some football fan youtuber and he made a very interesting point about Ratcliffe and his money contribution to the club. He was basically saying that Ratcliffe will not put his money into a venture where he is told to take a back seat, he will want to be involved and thus he was saying that Ratcliffe will have written into the terms of the contract of sale (buying 25% of United) that he would want to have control of specific areas of the club and that he wants to be given full control of the club in x amount of years. Neville was saying that if the Glazers said no to any of that then it would make perfect sense for Ratcliffe to walk away with his money because he is a business man at the end of the day and he would want to make sure he has some say, control and power within the club. 25% is considered small but it is still large enough for Ratcliffe to demand some concessions from the Glazers.
Remember, Neville is a club owner himself and thus he knows about how club ownership works.
![[IMG]](/proxy.php?image=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.fotmob.com%2Fimage_resources%2Flogo%2Fteamlogo%2F8427_small.png&hash=90aaf44fe907ab01ecfa01e2e8207dd5 "[IMG]")
vs
![[IMG]](/proxy.php?image=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.fotmob.com%2Fimage_resources%2Flogo%2Fteamlogo%2F10163_small.png&hash=5a95320661aaf1802d0d9efc2809aeb6 "[IMG]")
@Lioness~ I post all the time about my beloved, and incredibly dysfunctional, SHEFFIELD WEDNESDAY to very little notice most of the time. I do get a few likes here and there and a few comments from time to time.
Please hang in there with us!
Last edited:
No we understood; we're just curious as to how you seem to know this. Have to say I've never heard of any club sponsorship deal involving performance related clauses. Would reflect too well on a brand if they withdrew sponsorship because a team were a bit crap. Kind of goes against the whole ethos of support. plus there's all the legal stuff, that ties things together. Such things are very, very difficult to get out of. Be good if you could explain your working on this.