iPad Pro The end of the iPad era for me, the dawn of M1 era

[KittyKatta]

In my country people in general do not have that much tablets. It is just tablets are in the middle of the line. People have smartphones because that's given, they need desktop or laptop (depending on their needs) and then the tablet is seen as some luxury item that you buy if you can afford it. As a result it does not get used that much to be accepted and embraced.

I wonder how differently people around the world would think if the iPads shipped with a Smart Keyboard.

I see people all the time doing overly-complicated tasks on a phone or carrying a heavy computer to do things that are so basic. So it’s kinda sad because for so many people there’s this perfectly awesome tool that they’ll never consider because of it’s ”luxury toy” reputation and insane keyboard pricing.

 

[secretk]

I wonder how differently people around the world would think if the iPads shipped with a Smart Keyboard.

I see people all the time doing overly-complicated tasks on a phone or carrying a heavy computer to do things that are so basic. So it’s kinda sad because for so many people there’s this perfectly awesome tool that they’ll never consider because of it’s ”luxury toy” reputation and insane keyboard pricing.

Could be indeed. What kind of tasks do you see people doing with laptops where you don't find it necessary?

I have been on the other side. I quite often find bottlenecks or issues with the iPad workflow and when I start posting here, I quite often receive the answer that I am power user. And I am like "No, I am not.". I have never considered myself a power user you know. Now yes I am former Software Developer, now team lead of DEV team but I use my work laptop for work and such activities. I do not use my personal laptop for anything complicated honestly. I use it mostly for web browsing, YouTube watching and skype with friends. I also sometimes hook it up to an external monitor to watch movies while reading books or texting with friends. Sometimes I also process batch of RAW photos and do the occasional file transfers with my SSD but honestly nothing unique or complicated.

That in theory should be doable on tablet and iPad and it is but I do not like the experience. I do not want to spend a whole day on small screen (my laptop is 15.6 inch), I need to be able to run multiple background processes (like watching YouTube video while chatting with a friend on skype without stopping the video) and iPads with keyboards are not lappable to the point of texting with friends for hours in bed. My laptop gives me more stability in bed. Laptops also have long changing cord so I can even use it in bed while being powered.

 

[rui no onna]

I wonder how differently people around the world would think if the iPads shipped with a Smart Keyboard.

I see people all the time doing overly-complicated tasks on a phone or carrying a heavy computer to do things that are so basic. So it’s kinda sad because for so many people there’s this perfectly awesome tool that they’ll never consider because of it’s ”luxury toy” reputation and insane keyboard pricing.

There are websites that still don't work on iPads, though. Plus you've got pirated software in other countries because people just can't afford that $300 one-time Office license or $100 Office 365 annual subscription. Torrents, etc. are more prevalent, too.

When your annual salary is just $5000 or less (I believe that's how much my cousin makes at a call center) and you've got rent, food, kids' tuition, etc. to worry about, Apple stuff is pretty expensive.

 

[AutomaticApple]

people just can't afford that $300 one-time Office license or $100 Office 365 annual subscription. Torrents, etc. are more prevalent, too.

What about OpenOffice/LibreOffice?

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I only use an iPad for personal consumption. Browsing the web, social media, YouTube, FaceTime. I don’t really need a laptop to do those things. I have a Dell workstation laptop for work but that’s all it is used for. The iPad is ideal for my personal needs and I can’t ever see myself going back to a laptop at home.

 

[spiderman0616]

I only use an iPad for personal consumption. Browsing the web, social media, YouTube, FaceTime. I don’t really need a laptop to do those things. I have a Dell workstation laptop for work but that’s all it is used for. The iPad is ideal for my personal needs and I can’t ever see myself going back to a laptop at home.

I totally get that mentality. For me personally, there was something about the combination of the iPhone 12 Pro Max and the M1 Mac lineup that made me realize that I don’t need an iPad Pro for consumption when I have this nice big iPhone that’s more like a small tablet, and I don’t need an iPad Pro for creation when I have the M1 Mac that lasts twice as long on a charge, *runs all my favorite iPad apps with no issues, and runs circles around my 15” 2019 MBP as far as overall performance.

*Yes, I realize there’s work to do with the iPad app compatibility, but I think it will get much better very quickly.

 

[kristalsoldier]

What about OpenOffice/LibreOffice?

Interesting...do these open source apps work on the iPad? Never really thought about trying them out.

 

[rui no onna]

What about OpenOffice/LibreOffice?

Even if those work, people aren't using them. Heck, they're already running pirated Windows. Pirated Office isn't much of a stretch after that.

Interesting...do these open source apps work on the iPad? Never really thought about trying them out.

Last I checked, they're not even available for iOS. I think the LibreOffice had it on their to-do list at one point but nothing ever came from it.

 

[kristalsoldier]

Even if those work, people aren't using them. Heck, they're already running pirated Windows. Pirated Office isn't much of a stretch after that.




Last I checked, they're not even available for iOS. I think the LibreOffice had it on their to-do list at one point but nothing ever came from it.

Ok. Thanks.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I totally get that mentality. For me personally, there was something about the combination of the iPhone 12 Pro Max and the M1 Mac lineup that made me realize that I don’t need an iPad Pro for consumption when I have this nice big iPhone that’s more like a small tablet, and I don’t need an iPad Pro for creation when I have the M1 Mac that lasts twice as long on a charge, *runs all my favorite iPad apps with no issues, and runs circles around my 15” 2015 MBP as far as overall performance.

*Yes, I realize there’s work to do with the iPad app compatibility, but I think it will get much better very quickly.

Indeed, I think we all find a combination that works for us. I’ve moved away from carrying a bulky iPhone and went to a standard iPhone 12 (non Pro) last time around. The screen is big enough for me on the move and handles all my work and personal tasks. My 2017 iPad provides a big enough screen for the rest when I’m at home. I was thinking of upgrading it as it’s now over 3 years old but I felt like I’d be doing that for the sake of it seeing as it still does everything I need. Not really sure I’d need a Pro when I only do basic consumption tasks on it anyway. My wife has two MacBooks and an 27” iMac, but I’ve never really used Macs so struggle when I’m so used to PC. Macs can’t do what I need for my work and my only real Apple usage is iPhone, watch, and iPad.

 

[Mackilroy]

I totally get that mentality. For me personally, there was something about the combination of the iPhone 12 Pro Max and the M1 Mac lineup that made me realize that I don’t need an iPad Pro for consumption when I have this nice big iPhone that’s more like a small tablet, and I don’t need an iPad Pro for creation when I have the M1 Mac that lasts twice as long on a charge, *runs all my favorite iPad apps with no issues, and runs circles around my 15” 2019 MBP as far as overall performance.

*Yes, I realize there’s work to do with the iPad app compatibility, but I think it will get much better very quickly.

Running iPad apps on macOS seems mostly pointless, especially if they're apps made for touch. I could see the use with games macOS doesn't have, or perhaps apps such as Overcast, but for the most part, why buy an app that's optimized for a touch screen and then use it on a device without one?

 

[spiderman0616]

Running iPad apps on macOS seems mostly pointless, especially if they're apps made for touch. I could see the use with games macOS doesn't have, or perhaps apps such as Overcast, but for the most part, why buy an app that's optimized for a touch screen and then use it on a device without one?

it's good for when you're in a pinch and nothing more than that, for now. But I do think it will get better.

 

[secretk]

it's good for when you're in a pinch and nothing more than that, for now. But I do think it will get better.

Sometimes also price. Like I was left with the impression that LumaFusion is cheaper than Final Cut Pro. It might make sense for people that are not video editors pros but still want something more than iMovie.

 

[spiderman0616]

Sometimes also price. Like I was left with the impression that LumaFusion is cheaper than Final Cut Pro. It might make sense for people that are not video editors pros but still want something more than iMovie.

I have it on my M1 MBA. I used LumaFusion a lot on my iPad Pro and it actually works well on Mac too. I’d rather do that than pay $300 for Final Cut.

 

[Robbosan]

iPads are just a bigger iPhone to me, not saying that's bad. I have a 27" 5K iMac, M1 air, 2018 11" iPad 4G and iP 12. All have their uses.
Having a office at home the iMac is the heavy lifter. M1 air gives me better uses around the house and outside verandah, and finally a apple laptop with no heat. The 11" pro is a office Tv, use it in bed and for work photos/maps on the road for work.
12 is a phone/camera.

I also prefer trackpads don't use a mouse.

 

[Deliro]

I have it on my M1 MBA. I used LumaFusion a lot on my iPad Pro and it actually works well on Mac too. I’d rather do that than pay $300 for Final Cut.

Right, I don't get the "I don't see the point" type of posts. I'd rather have that option than not. I run several iOS apps, notably my EufyCam app that controls my security cameras at my house. Works fine on my Mac when no other option for me exists.

 

[spiderman0616]

Right, I don't get the "I don't see the point" type of posts. I'd rather have that option than not. I run several iOS apps, notably my EufyCam app that controls my security cameras at my house. Works fine on my Mac when no other option for me exists.

Same—I have Dark Noise and Good Sudoku installed and they both run great. I really only need some odds and ends as far as iPad apps. Everything else has a Mac version or functionality in Safari.

 

[Mackilroy]

Right, I don't get the "I don't see the point" type of posts. I'd rather have that option than not. I run several iOS apps, notably my EufyCam app that controls my security cameras at my house. Works fine on my Mac when no other option for me exists.

For me, it’s from two points of view: you get a worse experience because you aren’t using the platform it was made for; and there’s likely software available that already does the job. I’m not saying it shouldn’t be done or has no value, merely that if you’re using an app that actually takes advantage of touch, there’s little reason to want it for a desktop OS that doesn’t have touch as an input (the part about touch is key, I am not referring to all tablet/phone apps).

 

[subjonas]

Yep I tend to see more laptops as cars and tablets as bikes/public transportation etc. I guess it also depends on price and overall culture. In my country people in general do not have that much tablets. It is just tablets are in the middle of the line. People have smartphones because that's given, they need desktop or laptop (depending on their needs) and then the tablet is seen as some luxury item that you buy if you can afford it. As a result it does not get used that much to be accepted and embraced.

I think it’s kind of like that for a lot of people in the US too. After all, the iPad was introduced as an “in between” device.

iPad functionality has grown, but the fact is and probably will be for the foreseeable future—it’s still a simplified version of desktop software. That is actually both its disadvantage and its draw: a device with software specifically designed to handle common tasks with as little extra functionality and overhead as possible. A device for the “everyperson”. But that meant it wasn’t as robust as what people were accustomed to. To try to convince people to replace their robust device with a less robust device, even if it’s functional enough, is likely a tough sell for most. What do people gain out of it? The iPad does have great selling points, like a more intuitive experience for common tasks, more portability without the keyboard, pencil input, a back camera, cellular option... BUT “more intuitive” isn’t as compelling of a selling point if one is already comfortable with their current software (which most people probably are), and I think most people need their keyboards for productivity so portability is kind of a wash, and, if needed, the other things can be accomplished via a phone and analog tools, which are ubiquitous.

If the iPad was priced way lower than laptops then that would be a completely different story. There are few more obvious advantages/stronger incentives than lower price, if any. But the pricing is pretty much the same too. The pros have gotten as expensive as decent laptops, and cheap laptops have gotten as cheap as the standard iPad.

In light of all that, I really just see two groups who would take the plunge—the technologically frustrated, and the tech enthusiast who understands that all their tech needs are within the iPad’s wheelhouse. But it doesn’t seem like those add up to the majority.

So in my opinion, the iPad is in a tough spot if Apple really wants it to replace the laptop for the majority. Even if it CAN, it needs to find a very compelling reason that would convince them to trade in their robust laptops.

And the jury is still out on whether or not it can. There are so many people in the world and so many use cases. Obviously Apple knows better than me, but I wonder if any company can truly know. I wonder if Apple simply made the wrong bet. As I’ve said many a time, only time will tell.

But it’s also possible Apple is aiming high but would be just as content with the iPad being a secondary device for most. They still get the sales either way, but maybe not as many of the more profitable iPad pro sales.

 

[rui no onna]

I think it’s kind of like that for a lot of people in the US too. After all, the iPad was introduced as an “in between” device.

iPad functionality has grown, but the fact is and probably will be for the foreseeable future—it’s still a simplified version of desktop software. That is actually both its disadvantage and its draw: a device with software specifically designed to handle common tasks with as little extra functionality and overhead as possible. A device for the “everyperson”. But that meant it wasn’t as robust as what people were accustomed to. To try to convince people to replace their robust device with a less robust device, even if it’s functional enough, is likely a tough sell for most. What do people gain out of it? The iPad does have great selling points, like a more intuitive experience for common tasks, more portability without the keyboard, pencil input, a back camera, cellular option... BUT “more intuitive” isn’t as compelling of a selling point if one is already comfortable with their current software (which most people probably are), and I think most people need their keyboards for productivity so portability is kind of a wash, and, if needed, the other things can be accomplished via a phone and analog tools, which are ubiquitous.

If the iPad was priced way lower than laptops then that would be a completely different story. There are few more obvious advantages/stronger incentives than lower price, if any. But the pricing is pretty much the same too. The pros have gotten as expensive as decent laptops, and cheap laptops have gotten as cheap as the standard iPad.

In light of all that, I really just see two groups who would take the plunge—the technologically frustrated, and the tech enthusiast who understands that all their tech needs are within the iPad’s wheelhouse. But it doesn’t seem like those add up to the majority.

So in my opinion, the iPad is in a tough spot if Apple really wants it to replace the laptop for the majority. Even if it CAN, it needs to find a very compelling reason that would convince them to trade in their robust laptops.

And the jury is still out on whether or not it can. There are so many people in the world and so many use cases. Obviously Apple knows better than me, but I wonder if any company can truly know. I wonder if Apple simply made the wrong bet. As I’ve said many a time, only time will tell.

But it’s also possible Apple is aiming high but would be just as content with the iPad being a secondary device for most. They still get the sales either way, but maybe not as many of the more profitable iPad pro sales.

True. One thing we saw with COVID is a lot of people who have been using iPads already had to buy desktops and laptops for work/study from home because the iPad even with keyboard simply isn't robust enough.

 

[Deliro]

True. One thing we saw with COVID is a lot of people who have been using iPads already had to buy desktops and laptops for work/study from home because the iPad even with keyboard simply isn't robust enough.

I did the opposite. Maybe out of boredom. I was locked down and went all in with a IPP 12.9 with MK and pencil. I tried to make it work. And for the most part it did do most of what I wanted. But it was inefficient and I found myself frustrated when trying to work with multiple apps. I’d end up hopping on my windows desktop and I prefer to use that strictly for gaming and not productivity for several reasons.

I’m back to the MB world. And now am appreciating my iPad for what it does best. I’m selling off my MK and probably keeping the iPad. But I may also unload it if I find myself not using it much. It is a great device though.

 

[abhi182]

I have been flip floppin on this...
I purchased a number of ipads (incl gen2 pro) over the years but they never quite got much usage other than maybe some occasional browsing and I would always end up using a macbook 90% of the time

This changed sometime ago. when i replaced my macbook 12 with a 13” MBP ...
Around the same time , I got the ipad pro 11 (2018) - and even though mentally justifying the price for that keyboard folio was difficult - I decided to give it a try

The usage pattern changed completely soon after - I found myself using the ipad pro almost all the time while the macbook mostly sat unused
Probably a result of the fact that the MBP felt a lot heavier , hotter yet slower than the ipad - while the ipad with a KB folio came quite close to a laptop replacement - at least for single window work

Recently got the M1 macbook and now I find myself reaching out for it more than I do for the ipad

I do think I have found a good balance though - The M1 MB runs cool, zippy and is light enough to carry around the house - and the full OS is much better than iOS for doing anything even slightly involving

Yet the ipad pro + KB is lighter and more convenient for media consumption, casual browsing, pulling up recipes etc..

PS: Also wanted to call out a ”feature“ that some may be find a bit icky. The ipad/kb combo feels a lot more rugged/less prone to damage in the more spill prone zones of the house e.g. the kitchen and washroom
I always feel comfortable using the ipad in such places but not at all with the MB...

 

[secretk]

I think it’s kind of like that for a lot of people in the US too. After all, the iPad was introduced as an “in between” device.

iPad functionality has grown, but the fact is and probably will be for the foreseeable future—it’s still a simplified version of desktop software. That is actually both its disadvantage and its draw: a device with software specifically designed to handle common tasks with as little extra functionality and overhead as possible. A device for the “everyperson”. But that meant it wasn’t as robust as what people were accustomed to. To try to convince people to replace their robust device with a less robust device, even if it’s functional enough, is likely a tough sell for most. What do people gain out of it? The iPad does have great selling points, like a more intuitive experience for common tasks, more portability without the keyboard, pencil input, a back camera, cellular option... BUT “more intuitive” isn’t as compelling of a selling point if one is already comfortable with their current software (which most people probably are), and I think most people need their keyboards for productivity so portability is kind of a wash, and, if needed, the other things can be accomplished via a phone and analog tools, which are ubiquitous.

Just a note (which is more like personal opinion). I do not even find iPadOS more intuitive. It is not. There is a lot of fragmentation and the Settings app themselves are really a hot mess. Maybe it is intuitive for people that use just 5 % of it and this way it is easy to remember. This is not how I like to use my "toys". I like to use them as much as possible. Once I go to this road, I actually find the system quite complex and unintuitive. I have issues remembering all of the gestures and available settings. Sometimes gestures are even getting mixed - like the gesture to show the dock is too similar to the one to see all open apps.

If the iPad was priced way lower than laptops then that would be a completely different story. There are few more obvious advantages/stronger incentives than lower price, if any. But the pricing is pretty much the same too. The pros have gotten as expensive as decent laptops, and cheap laptops have gotten as cheap as the standard iPad.

There are even decent laptops (not Macs, but Windows) that are cheaper than iPad Pros.

In light of all that, I really just see two groups who would take the plunge—the technologically frustrated, and the tech enthusiast who understands that all their tech needs are within the iPad’s wheelhouse. But it doesn’t seem like those add up to the majority.

So in my opinion, the iPad is in a tough spot if Apple really wants it to replace the laptop for the majority. Even if it CAN, it needs to find a very compelling reason that would convince them to trade in their robust laptops.

And the jury is still out on whether or not it can. There are so many people in the world and so many use cases. Obviously Apple knows better than me, but I wonder if any company can truly know. I wonder if Apple simply made the wrong bet. As I’ve said many a time, only time will tell.

But it’s also possible Apple is aiming high but would be just as content with the iPad being a secondary device for most. They still get the sales either way, but maybe not as many of the more profitable iPad pro sales.

Yeah, we would never know what Apple plans to do. Maybe they indeed realized that they made the wrong bet and this is why they now have M1 Mac. Who knows? I think that Apple would like the iPad to be more than just secondary device, this is why they market it this way. For me however this approach/strategy has the opposite effect. It makes me question even more the iPad as a computer replacement thing. Especially considering the price of the device that does put it into category of lots of good Windows laptops.

I am not saying that it does not work for some people but it does not work for me. And I wonder how many people can go by only with iPads.

 

[spiderman0616]

I think it’s kind of like that for a lot of people in the US too. After all, the iPad was introduced as an “in between” device.

iPad functionality has grown, but the fact is and probably will be for the foreseeable future—it’s still a simplified version of desktop software. That is actually both its disadvantage and its draw: a device with software specifically designed to handle common tasks with as little extra functionality and overhead as possible. A device for the “everyperson”. But that meant it wasn’t as robust as what people were accustomed to. To try to convince people to replace their robust device with a less robust device, even if it’s functional enough, is likely a tough sell for most. What do people gain out of it? The iPad does have great selling points, like a more intuitive experience for common tasks, more portability without the keyboard, pencil input, a back camera, cellular option... BUT “more intuitive” isn’t as compelling of a selling point if one is already comfortable with their current software (which most people probably are), and I think most people need their keyboards for productivity so portability is kind of a wash, and, if needed, the other things can be accomplished via a phone and analog tools, which are ubiquitous.

If the iPad was priced way lower than laptops then that would be a completely different story. There are few more obvious advantages/stronger incentives than lower price, if any. But the pricing is pretty much the same too. The pros have gotten as expensive as decent laptops, and cheap laptops have gotten as cheap as the standard iPad.

In light of all that, I really just see two groups who would take the plunge—the technologically frustrated, and the tech enthusiast who understands that all their tech needs are within the iPad’s wheelhouse. But it doesn’t seem like those add up to the majority.

So in my opinion, the iPad is in a tough spot if Apple really wants it to replace the laptop for the majority. Even if it CAN, it needs to find a very compelling reason that would convince them to trade in their robust laptops.

And the jury is still out on whether or not it can. There are so many people in the world and so many use cases. Obviously Apple knows better than me, but I wonder if any company can truly know. I wonder if Apple simply made the wrong bet. As I’ve said many a time, only time will tell.

But it’s also possible Apple is aiming high but would be just as content with the iPad being a secondary device for most. They still get the sales either way, but maybe not as many of the more profitable iPad pro sales.

I sometimes wonder if Steve Jobs marketed the iPad into a corner with his original messaging. It spent a long time just being that in between device, and to this day, that’s what most people still consider it to be.

I personally happen to disagree and think the iPad Pro with MK is a fantastic productivity machine, but that’s neither here nor there—most iPad buyers out in the world seem to still look at it as only for reading and watching Netflix, and that unfortunately may not ever change.

I would think Apple is probably well aware of this, which is why they haven’t taken iPadOS and turned it into a full blown desktop OS. Most iPad owners probably don’t want that.

 

[Mackilroy]

Yeah, we would never know what Apple plans to do. Maybe they indeed realized that they made the wrong bet and this is why they now have M1 Mac. Who knows? I think that Apple would like the iPad to be more than just secondary device, this is why they market it this way. For me however this approach/strategy has the opposite effect. It makes me question even more the iPad as a computer replacement thing. Especially considering the price of the device that does put it into category of lots of good Windows laptops.

It doesn’t seem logical to say that iPads were the wrong bet, so they introduced Macs based on the same silicon. They have significantly different interfaces - neither has a chance of being a complete replacement for the other without a redesign of the OS.

I know a lot of people who buy expensive computers whose capabilities they never, ever use. An iPad or Chromebook would suit just as well. iPads are also useful out in the field for various business tasks, whether in engineering, sales, underwater science (I’ve encountered all three). If people expect the iPad to completely replace everything a traditional computer does in a similar manner, they’re always going to be disappointed. If they take advantage of the unique interface instead of trying to go back to the mouse/keyboard paradigm, I think they’ll be more productive.