The new Mac mini is almost certainly coming

[Peter_M]

The whole stationary lineup from Apple is a bit dumb at the moment. You have an over-engineered Mac Studio, with an oversized heatsink and an overly noisy fan, yet possibly (?) an underpowered PSU that holds back the M1 Ultra performance during extreme workloads afaik.

Then there's the Mac Mini, which is being neglected to maximize the sales of the more expensive Mac Studio. A Mac Mini M2 + M2 Pro lineup makes more sense for the vast majority of users. Maybe get a slightly increased heatsink and fan for M2 Pro for silent operation, but keep the same chassis. That would actually make sense, but we can't have that, can we Apple?

 

[rumz]

The whole stationary lineup from Apple is a bit dumb at the moment. You have an over-engineered Mac Studio, with an oversized heatsink and an overly noisy fan, yet an underpowered PSU that holds back the M1 Ultra performance afaik.
I don't mind Apple over-engineering a Mac, but at least give it a fitting PSU then.

Then there's the Mac Mini, which is being neglected to maximize the sales of the more expensive Mac Studio. A Mac Mini M2 + M2 Pro lineup makes more sense for the vast majority of users. Maybe get a slightly increased heatsink and fan for M2 Pro for silent operation, but keep the same chassis. That would actually make sense, but we can't have that, can we Apple?

Interesing observation about the Mac Studio Ultra. If that chip is being held back by the PSU, I wonder if they could or would shift the Studio lineup to be more analogous to the MacBook Pro (Mx Pro, Mx Max), and the ultra moves to become a base config for whatever the Mac Pro ends up being (maybe the Studio Ultra was a stop-gap until the Mac Pro becomes available). I guess it depends (partially at least) on what the Mac Pro looks like, especially in terms of pricing. (Seems like it's expected the Ultra will be available in the Mac Pro anyways-- I just wonder if they also leave it as an option in the Studio).

 

[Peter_M]

Interesing observation about the Mac Studio Ultra. If that chip is being held back by the PSU, I wonder if they could or would shift the Studio lineup to be more analogous to the MacBook Pro (Mx Pro, Mx Max), and the ultra moves to become a base config for whatever the Mac Pro ends up being (maybe the Studio Ultra was a stop-gap until the Mac Pro becomes available). I guess it depends (partially at least) on what the Mac Pro looks like, especially in terms of pricing. (Seems like it's expected the Ultra will be available in the Mac Pro anyways-- I just wonder if they also leave it as an option in the Studio).

Yes, I saw a tech video on youtube (can't remember which channel and the exact numbers unfortunately) testing the PSU, which didn't have a lot of capacity, and that most likely accounted for some slightly "underperforming" (still very fast!) scores for the Ultra vs Max system.

It seems like Apple designed the Mac Studio with a lot of thermal headroom for future Mx chips, that'll most likely require higher power usage. This makes a lot of sense though, since Apple has tended to make too thin/small products, that end up throttling and getting very hot with newer CPU/GPU-generations (like the previous Intel-based MacBook Pro model).

 

[theluggage]

You have an over-engineered Mac Studio, with an oversized heatsink and an overly noisy fan, yet an underpowered PSU that holds back the M1 Ultra performance afaik.

The noise is a fault affecting some (too many) units - a properly functioning Studio is very quiet at idle and far quieter under load than (say) an iMac or a MacBook Pro. The whine is certainly not OK and Apple need to fix their QA, but I don't think the "whine" is by design. Maybe we'll get a "whinegate" and a repair program eventually.

Don't know about the underpowered PSU on the Ultra... I suspect that Apple have just decided to run everything at lower temperatures - just speculating, but the Ultra is a physically huge chip so stress from thermal expansion and contraction could be significant.

Maybe get a slightly increased heatsink and fan for M2 Pro for silent operation, but keep the same chassis.

Anybody's guess how big the heatsink would have to be for silent operation - crudely speaking, the Pro is 2/3 of a Max so it's going to run hotter than the regular M1/M2. Then, the Pro supports significant extra ports - which the Studio chassis has room for - and I also get the impression that the Studio is more robust & repairable than the Mini, particularly by having the SSD modules socketed (you may not be able to do DIY upgrades but at least they can be replaced if they fail).

 

[Boil]

Don't know about the underpowered PSU on the Ultra... I suspect that Apple have just decided to run everything at lower temperatures - just speculating, but the Ultra is a physically huge chip so stress from thermal expansion and contraction could be significant.

The 370W PSU in the Mac Studio is not enough for the 180W M1 Ultra SoC...?

Then, the Pro supports significant extra ports - which the Studio chassis has room for - and I also get the impression that the Studio is more robust & repairable than the Mini, particularly by having the SSD modules socketed (you may not be able to do DIY upgrades but at least they can be replaced if they fail).

The port configuration on the current 2018 Intel Mac mini would indicate that the mini chassis has the room for the extra ports the M2 Pro SoC supports...?

 

[CWallace]

Why would it be limited to two TB4 ports, when the M1 Pro MacBook Pro has three TB4 ports...?

I am presuming it will be in the same case as the current Mac mini.

If Apple develops an all new case for a "Mac mini Pro", then add $100-200 to the price, which brings it even closer to the base price of a Mac Studio and decreases the "breathing room" such a machine has to exist.

 

[Boil]

I am presuming it will be in the same case as the current Mac mini.

If Apple develops an all new case for a "Mac mini Pro", then add $100-200 to the price, which brings it even closer to the base price of a Mac Studio and decreases the "breathing room" such a machine has to exist.

Why would they need to develop a new chassis...?

The current 2020 ASi M1 Mac mini has X amount of ports...

The current 2018 Intel i5/i7 Mac mini has X amount of ports...

The interior standoffs and such may change, but the exterior of the chassis would stay the same, excepting that a few more holes for ports are punched out...

Apple does not need an entirely new chassis for a M2 Pro Mac mini, they just need to adjust a few things on the existing chassis; you now, just like they did when they went from the 2018 Intel i3 Mac mini to the 2020 ASi M1 Mac mini...

Here is an alternative view though...

What if Apple keeps the Mac mini to the Mn SoCs, switches the Mac Studio from Mn Max/Mn Ultra to Mn Pro/Mn Max, and the ASi Mac Pro becomes the chassis for the Mn Ultra/Mn Extreme...?

Meaning the M1 Ultra Mac Studio was simply a placeholder because Apple was not ready with the ASi Mac Pro yet...?

 

[CWallace]

The whole stationary lineup from Apple is a bit dumb at the moment.

IMO, it's arguably better now than it has been for some time.

You have an over-engineered Mac Studio, with an oversized heatsink and an overly noisy fan, yet an underpowered PSU that holds back the M1 Ultra performance afaik. I don't mind Apple over-engineering a Mac, but at least give it a fitting PSU then.

The PSU is fine. I am not 100% sure MaxTech's "power consumption" tests are accurately portraying what is going on. IMO, Apple is reducing the max power consumption of the M series SoC not due to insufficient power or cooling, but to keep them running cool enough so that fan noise is minimized.

Then there's the Mac Mini, which is being neglected to maximize the sales of the more expensive Mac Studio.

The Mac mini has been "neglected" to maximize sales of the more expensive iMac since the day after it was released in 2005. It has always been at the bottom rung of the "Good | Better | Best" Mac product matrix.

The Mac mini's original purpose was to make entering or switching to the macOS ecosystem as cheap as possible so its performance was intentionally capped to support that role and that philosophy has generally been in play.

 

[CWallace]

Here is an alternative view though...

What if Apple keeps the Mac mini to the Mn SoCs, switches the Mac Studio from Mn Max/Mn Ultra to Mn Pro/Mn Max, and the ASi Mac Pro becomes the chassis for the Mn Ultra/Mn Extreme...?

Meaning the M1 Ultra Mac Studio was simply a placeholder because Apple was not ready with the ASi Mac Pro yet...?

IMO, the Mac Studio and Apple Studio Display were meant to replace the high-end iMac 5K BTO configurations (i7/i9 | 5700/57000XT) and the iMac Pro in the product lineup.

Folks have been complaining about the iMac being an AIO and forcing them to replace their perfectly-fine 5K display every 2-3 years to get another perfectly-fine 5K display because they want/need a better CPU and/or GPU. So now they can buy that 5K display and keep it for a decade while replacing the Mac Studio connected to it over time with updated models. Or they can buy a different display better-optimized for their needs (larger display area, gaming, color-accuracy, HDR video, etc.) and pair it with the Mac Studio rather then being forced to accept Apple's display choice (the 27" 5K EDR screen).

 

[Boyd01]

The Mac mini has been "neglected" to maximize sales of the more expensive iMac since the day after it was released in 2005. It has always been at the bottom rung of the "Good | Better | Best" Mac product matrix.

IMO, the 2012 i7 quad-core and 2018 i7 hex-core Mini's were closer to the "Better" rung when they were introduced (at least in terms of RAM and CPU if not graphics).

 

[EugW]

The 370W PSU in the Mac Studio is not enough for the 180W M1 Ultra SoC...?

The claims the Mac Studio PSU is too small don’t make much sense.

The port configuration on the current 2018 Intel Mac mini would indicate that the mini chassis has the room for the extra ports the M2 Pro SoC supports...?

Yup. Plus the M1 mini is largely just empty space.

In the tear downs the M1 Mac mini motherboard is ridiculously small compared to the Mac mini chassis.

 

[gusping]

The claims the Mac Studio PSU is too small don’t make much sense.


Yup. Plus the M1 mini is largely just empty space.

In the tear downs the M1 Mac mini motherboard is ridiculously small compared to the Mac mini chassis.

View attachment 2089025

The current M1/Intel chasis could surely take an M1/M2 Pro. The i7 Intel chip is 65w TDP, right? Plus, now the motherboard is smaller, there is room for a bigger fan anyway.

 

[Santabean2000]

The current M1/Intel chasis could surely take an M1/M2 Pro. The i7 Intel chip is 65w TDP, right? Plus, now the motherboard is smaller, there is room for a bigger fan anyway.

An M2 Pro with extra USB C/Thunderbolt ports, 24GB RAM and sufficient cooling to keep it whisper-quiet please. Come Apple, make me happy!

 

[Peter_M]

The 370W PSU in the Mac Studio is not enough for the 180W M1 Ultra SoC...?


The port configuration on the current 2018 Intel Mac mini would indicate that the mini chassis has the room for the extra ports the M2 Pro SoC supports...?

I see, then the PSU shouldn't a bottleneck. I think the YouTube channel casting doubt on the ultra's PSU was Max Tech, so that's what you get for listening to "youtubers".

 

[crowe-t]

Does anyone think Apple will announce a new Mini this month? I'm in desperate need of a new Mini and can't wait much longer.

 

[pshufd]

Does anyone think Apple will announce a new Mini this month? I'm in desperate need of a new Mini and can't wait much longer.

The latest I've heard is new MacBook Pros and the heavy discounting at Best Buy and Amazon on those models is a good indication that we'll get those. The M2 <Pro> mini is a maybe. I have seen no discounts, other than up to $100 off at the online places, that would indicate that a new mini will come this month. I just checked the store and my sweet spot (16 GB 256 or 512) are sold out but they have the base mini. They did have some 16/512 models yesterday.

If you don't need 24 GB or if the M1 mini meets your needs, why not now?

 

[EugW]

The latest I've heard is new MacBook Pros and the heavy discounting at Best Buy and Amazon on those models is a good indication that we'll get those. The M2 <Pro> mini is a maybe. I have seen no discounts, other than up to $100 off at the online places, that would indicate that a new mini will come this month. I just checked the store and my sweet spot (16 GB 256 or 512) are sold out but they have the base mini. They did have some 16/512 models yesterday.

IMO, it seems Best Buy tends to put stuff on sale when they think a new model may be coming. Often times, that new model comes, but often times it does not.

For example, I remember this one personally, because it led to a purchase for me: This happened back with the iPad Air 2, which was released in 2014. Before the 2015 fall release season, Best Buy reduced prices significantly for the yearly update, and this allowed me to buy one for a heavy discount. However, that yearly update didn't happen so they raised prices back up a couple of weeks later. The iPad Air 2 wasn't discontinued until 2017.

If you don't need 24 GB or if the M1 mini meets your needs, why not now?

I'd be pissed if I bought a M1 mini now for just $100 off and a new model came out next month, even if the M1 was sufficient.

However, it comes down to just how urgent the need is. Is it a mission critical need like not being able to do any work at all, or is it just because you have an existing old Intel model that is becoming somewhat too slow for your needs? If the former, I'd buy. If the latter, I'd wait.

I'm continuing to wait with my 2014 Core i5 Mac mini with 8 GB RAM as a business app machine. Actually, in my case it works fine, but it does sometimes lag a bit, and it can't play back 4K HEVC video. (I sometimes play videos in the background as I do paperwork.)

 

[saulinpa]

Does anyone think Apple will announce a new Mini this month? I'm in desperate need of a new Mini and can't wait much longer.

There are many that think a new mini is coming every day of the year.

With delivery times still showing one to three days for custom orders my guess is a new one won't be announced in the next week.

You can buy one at the online Apple Store then you have 14 days to tell them you are going to return it and another 14 to actually get it back to them. Or wait until November when they usually announce an extended return policy of a week into the new year.

 

[pshufd]

IMO, it seems Best Buy tends to put stuff on sale when they think a new model may be coming. Often times, that new model comes, but often times it does not.

This happened back with the iPad Air 2, which was released in 2014. Before the 2015 fall release season, Best Buy reduced prices significantly for the yearly update. However, that yearly update didn't happen so they raised prices back up. This allowed me to buy one for a heavy discount in 2015. The iPad Air 2 wasn't discontinued until 2017.

I'd be pissed if I bought a M1 mini now for just $100 off and a new model came out next month, even if the M1 was sufficient.

However, it comes down to just how urgent the need is. Is it a mission critical need like not being able to do any work at all, or is it just because you have an existing old Intel model that is becoming somewhat too slow for your needs? If the former, I'd buy. If the latter, I'd wait.

Apple now has the supply chain excuse and I think that they've had to make launch decisions late in the game the past two years. The rumors are MacBook Pros likely and mini maybe so that's where my thinking would be. I could use another mini myself or it would be nice to replace my mini with a Studio but I'm making do with the mini and a 2014 maxed out 27 inch iMac which handles my office stuff during the day because my production runs on the mini. 24 GB of RAM would have allowed me to not have to partition my workflows on two machines. I can manage, and even if I couldn't, I could just use my M1 Pro MacBook Pro in my office as opposed to a pure laptop.

For me, I'll just wait. If they do launch an M2 mini, then I'll have additional options. Get an M1 mini because there would hopefully be bigger discounts; get an M2 mini to run alongside the M1 mini; or get a 24 GB M2 mini to replace the M1 mini; or get an M2 Pro mini to replace the mini and the iMac.

If the device makes you money, then get one right now. If not and you have options, then wait. I have options but that's because I keep my older systems around as backup systems.

 

[crowe-t]

IMO, it seems Best Buy tends to put stuff on sale when they think a new model may be coming. Often times, that new model comes, but often times it does not.

For example, I remember this one personally, because it led to a purchase for me: This happened back with the iPad Air 2, which was released in 2014. Before the 2015 fall release season, Best Buy reduced prices significantly for the yearly update, and this allowed me to buy one for a heavy discount. However, that yearly update didn't happen so they raised prices back up a couple of weeks later. The iPad Air 2 wasn't discontinued until 2017.


I'd be pissed if I bought a M1 mini now for just $100 off and a new model came out next month, even if the M1 was sufficient.

However, it comes down to just how urgent the need is. Is it a mission critical need like not being able to do any work at all, or is it just because you have an existing old Intel model that is becoming somewhat too slow for your needs? If the former, I'd buy. If the latter, I'd wait.

I'm continuing to wait with my 2014 Core i5 Mac mini with 8 GB RAM as a business app machine. Actually, in my case it works fine, but it does sometimes lag a bit, and it can't play back 4K HEVC video. (I sometimes play videos in the background as I do paperwork.)

My current Mac Mini is a 2009 model with OS 10.6.8. I can't even get on to most web sites. I know I'm way behind but finances kept me with this Mini for a while. I don't think I can go far enough forward on an OS upgrade and it's such an old machine.

I'd hate to buy an M1 Mini now and then in a few weeks newer models are announced. I believe Apple makes announcements in October. I'll wait a couple more weeks and then I have to order something.

 

[CWallace]

Does anyone think Apple will announce a new Mini this month? I'm in desperate need of a new Mini and can't wait much longer.

I do believe the odds are decent for Apple to announce a refresh of the current model with an M2 replacing the M1. Then again, the mini makes up such a tiny percentage of Mac sales, Apple is content to let it lie stale for years so it might skip M2 entirely and next be refreshed with M3.

Any other configuration (M2 Pro, for example) is unlikely, IMO.

 

[EugW]

Apple now has the supply chain excuse and I think that they've had to make launch decisions late in the game the past two years. The rumors are MacBook Pros likely and mini maybe so that's where my thinking would be. I could use another mini myself or it would be nice to replace my mini with a Studio but I'm making do with the mini and a 2014 maxed out 27 inch iMac which handles my office stuff during the day because my production runs on the mini. 24 GB of RAM would have allowed me to not have to partition my workflows on two machines. I can manage, and even if I couldn't, I could just use my M1 Pro MacBook Pro in my office as opposed to a pure laptop.

For me, I'll just wait. If they do launch an M2 mini, then I'll have additional options. Get an M1 mini because there would hopefully be bigger discounts; get an M2 mini to run alongside the M1 mini; or get a 24 GB M2 mini to replace the M1 mini; or get an M2 Pro mini to replace the mini and the iMac.

? Your 2014 iMac supports 32 GB RAM.

My current Mac Mini is a 2009 model with OS 10.6.8. I can't even get on to most web sites. I know I'm way behind but finances kept me with this Mini for a while. I don't think I can go far enough forward on an OS upgrade and it's such an old machine.

I'd hate to buy an M1 Mini now and then in a few weeks newer models are announced. I believe Apple makes announcements in October. I'll wait a couple more weeks and then I have to order something.

That machine will run a patched version of 10.13 High Sierra pretty well, at least if you install an SSD and have sufficient RAM (4 GB bare minimum, but 6-8 GB preferred).

However, why aren't you running at least 10.11 El Capitan?

 

[pshufd]

? Your 2014 iMac supports 32 GB RAM.


That machine will run a patched version of 10.13 High Sierra reasonably well, at least if you install an SSD and have sufficient RAM (4 GB bare minimum, but 6-8 GB preferred).

However, why aren't you running at least 10.11 El Capitan?

Yup, the 2014 iMac is maxed out: i7, 32 GB RAM, 500 GB SSD, 4 GB GPU. It's running Big Sur which is the last supported version of macOS on this system. I picked it up for $500 last year. It is really nice for office stuff and I run a Windows VM on it from time to time. The $500 alone is less than picking up a Dell Ultrasharp 27 inch 4k monitor.

Update: Ooops - I see that there was a 1 TB SSD option so it wasn't completely maxed out but close enough. Going from 500 to 1,000 was $500 or $1/GB and I guess that the company that owned it didn't think that it was a good value, particularly when they could just hang an external off of it.

 

[EugW]

Yup, the 2014 iMac is maxed out: i7, 32 GB RAM, 500 GB SSD, 4 GB GPU. It's running Big Sur which is the last supported version of macOS on this system. I picked it up for $500 last year. It is really nice for office stuff and I run a Windows VM on it from time to time. The $500 alone is less than picking up a Dell Ultrasharp 27 inch 4k monitor.

I guess I misunderstood but you said you wouldn't need to split your workload if you could run 24 GB RAM.

Anyhow, your quote makes it look like I'm talking about El Capitan or patched High Sierra for your 2014 iMac.

 

[pshufd]

I guess I misunderstood but you said you wouldn't need to split your workload if you could run 24 GB RAM.

Anyhow, your quote makes it look like I'm talking about El Capitan or patched High Sierra for your 2014 iMac.

I run browser, email, notes, calendar and a bunch of other things on the iMac during the day. If I had 24 GB of RAM, I could run it all on the mini. I have a Windows desktop on my secondary desk and it has 128 GB of RAM so I could run my Windows VM on that system. I would have to walk over to my other desk to do that though. I use less than half the RAM on the iMac when I'm not running the VM. The rest is used for cache.

I hit reply and it put the other stuff in there so I just responded to it. I just saw the first query and answered it and then saw the second.