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guillemn

macrumors member
Aug 30, 2012
53
2
My next machine will be possibly an ARM 16' mbp.
I hope my late 2013 mbp 15', to serve me well, until this one come out on the market.

I am at the same spot. I hope my Late 2013 Retina 15' holds until something new comes out.

At the moment I have been using it for working daily since 2013 with no issues. This year I changed the battery; that's all. It is starting to become little slower but for first time this year I did a clean install after so many years of upgrates.

Still was almost max out configuration at that time i7 4 cores, 16gb, 1tb ssd.

I was about to buy the 16 when it came out, but I wanted a second iteration plus wifi6. This year was it, but now ARM.... so I dont know. I guess that I can hold unless the 2013 holds, if it brokes I will get anything the day after.
 

Lesser Evets

macrumors 68040
Jan 7, 2006
3,527
1,295
Is there any MBP going to release this year? You said about an ARM MBP 13” late this year, but with the same design I think
By the rumor mill only....

New 13" with ARM by year's end.
New 16" with Intel circa October.

If Apple is serious about ARM, it would seem legit. My hope would be that they turn out a 13" ARM that is SO impressive as to blow away any doubt about going to ARM, making developers and consumers rush to the ARM side. However, this IS Apple, so I could see a neutered 13" MacBook Pro that performs on ARM as well as the previous Intel edition.

The 16" seems to be ready now, because they have all the bits and pieces ready to roll, except the rumored mini LED display, or whatever that gizmo is called. I have no interest in it. As typical, Apple will release far later than anyone expects or wants.

Whatever actually transpires, the truth is that the Mac line of products will be an annoying confluence of past and future tech as they change direction, for the next 2 years. Somewhere in 2022, the dust will settle, the second iteration of ARM Macs will arrive, and a lot of errors will be paved over. In the mean time, we're stuck in a waiting game. Mac hardware in 2022 could be truly amazing... but... this is Apple. Apple is good at falling short.
 

Falhófnir

macrumors 603
Aug 19, 2017
6,146
7,001
By the rumor mill only....

New 13" with ARM by year's end.
New 16" with Intel circa October.

If Apple is serious about ARM, it would seem legit. My hope would be that they turn out a 13" ARM that is SO impressive as to blow away any doubt about going to ARM, making developers and consumers rush to the ARM side. However, this IS Apple, so I could see a neutered 13" MacBook Pro that performs on ARM as well as the previous Intel edition.

The 16" seems to be ready now, because they have all the bits and pieces ready to roll, except the rumored mini LED display, or whatever that gizmo is called. I have no interest in it. As typical, Apple will release far later than anyone expects or wants.

Whatever actually transpires, the truth is that the Mac line of products will be an annoying confluence of past and future tech as they change direction, for the next 2 years. Somewhere in 2022, the dust will settle, the second iteration of ARM Macs will arrive, and a lot of errors will be paved over. In the mean time, we're stuck in a waiting game. Mac hardware in 2022 could be truly amazing... but... this is Apple. Apple is good at falling short.
As the first Apple Silicon notebook will supposedly be a MacBook Pro, that suggests to me the Arm MacBook Air will handily outperform the Intel 13" Pro so they needed to get that one out first. This does leave me wondering about another Intel 16", Jon Prosser suggested the next iteration would be an Arm machine, for what that's worth. If they were bothering with 10th gen chips I would really have expected them by now, probably when the 5600m graphics update dropped. Tiger Lake is around the corner by now, I expect if they're doing 'one last refresh' with Intel that's what they will aim for?
 
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Lobwedgephil

macrumors 603
Apr 7, 2012
5,792
4,757
By the rumor mill only....

New 13" with ARM by year's end.
New 16" with Intel circa October.

If Apple is serious about ARM, it would seem legit. My hope would be that they turn out a 13" ARM that is SO impressive as to blow away any doubt about going to ARM, making developers and consumers rush to the ARM side. However, this IS Apple, so I could see a neutered 13" MacBook Pro that performs on ARM as well as the previous Intel edition.

The 16" seems to be ready now, because they have all the bits and pieces ready to roll, except the rumored mini LED display, or whatever that gizmo is called. I have no interest in it. As typical, Apple will release far later than anyone expects or wants.

Whatever actually transpires, the truth is that the Mac line of products will be an annoying confluence of past and future tech as they change direction, for the next 2 years. Somewhere in 2022, the dust will settle, the second iteration of ARM Macs will arrive, and a lot of errors will be paved over. In the mean time, we're stuck in a waiting game. Mac hardware in 2022 could be truly amazing... but... this is Apple. Apple is good at falling short.

What rumors are saying a 16" Intel in October? Haven't heard of any rumors about that, but I hope their is one more update before the ARM update.
 

Ryox

macrumors 6502a
Oct 27, 2007
547
21
UK
I’m guessing the next 16” refresh will be ARM and the current 2019/20 is the last intel we get of this model?
 

DanMan619

macrumors regular
Dec 30, 2012
213
157
Los Angeles, CA
I think an Intel 16" MBP refresh late this year is possible since i believe there is a 10th gen chip that could go in it, but i'd be equally not surprised if there isn't one and the next 16" MBP is the ARM one in 2021. The 10th gen Intel chip that would go in it is essentially the exact same chip as the 9th gen just barely better boost speeds, Wifi 6 capability and i believe slightly faster RAM support. So i could see Apple also saying screw it and just skipping it or deciding to do a quiet refresh. There's no real leaks/rumor that says there will be another Intel 16" MBP but just going off past pattern and refresh cycles there should be. If there is one coming late in the year, i suppose it's possible we're still a couple weeks from seeing any leaks of it, but i'm not sure where we are in the usual cycle. If it was coming i feel like there'd be some rumblings of it by now but i don't know. That's kinda all we have to go on at the present.
 
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Corncab44

macrumors regular
Jun 22, 2020
233
62
Would love a 16 inch refresh with intel in the next few months. I'd buy that, especially if there was any improvement in the GPU power draw issue. I'd like the last model that let sme run bootcamp.
 

smoking monkey

macrumors 68020
Mar 5, 2008
2,364
1,509
I HUNGER
I think an Intel 16" MBP refresh late this year is possible since i believe there is a 10th gen chip that could go in it, but i'd be equally not surprised if there isn't one and the next 16" MBP is the ARM one in 2021. The 10th gen Intel chip that would go in it is essentially the exact same chip as the 9th gen just barely better boost speeds, Wifi 6 capability and i believe slightly faster RAM support. So i could see Apple also saying screw it and just skipping it or deciding to do a quiet refresh. There's no real leaks/rumor that says there will be another Intel 16" MBP but just going off past pattern and refresh cycles there should be. If there is one coming late in the year, i suppose it's possible we're still a couple weeks from seeing any leaks of it, but i'm not sure where we are in the usual cycle. If it was coming i feel like there'd be some rumblings of it by now but i don't know. That's kinda all we have to go on at the present.

I wouldn't imagine any leaks for a small update. It will be a quiet refresh at best. If they do release something in a few months, it could mean the 16 arm might not be released until July-October 2021. If there is no quiet refresh we could be looking at a March/April 16 arm. I'm hoping for March April as my 2013 15 is still doing fine, but it's been EOLed (I think) and that means no more parts kept at Apple for it.
 
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DanMan619

macrumors regular
Dec 30, 2012
213
157
Los Angeles, CA
I wouldn't imagine any leaks for a small update. It will be a quiet refresh at best. If they do release something in a few months, it could mean the 16 arm might not be released until July-October 2021. If there is no quiet refresh we could be looking at a March/April 16 arm. I'm hoping for March April as my 2013 15 is still doing fine, but it's been EOLed (I think) and that means no more parts kept at Apple for it.

Mine is a late 2013 15" as well. Apple considers ours "Vintage" but not "Obsolete" yet. We still get hardware service! So if something's up with yours at some point in the near future, do take it in. Service will just depend on part inventory but they would be able to order a part if needed. https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201624 By Apple's definition, the 7 year mark after a product is no longer sold (which i would assume would be one year after release, so that'd be late 2014 for us) is the Vintage-Obsolete cutoff point. So we have till late 2021 till we're Obsolete i believe.

I think you have a point though. With the possible late 2020 16", i totally could see it being a small enough refresh (literally just the CPU basically, are there even new AMD GPUs that could go in it? I'm not very familiar with their release schedule at all) that it slips under the radar and just gets a site update and a blog post/one sheet press release. I agree with your assessment of no refresh means early 2021 ARM 16" MBP and a late 2020 Intel 16" MBP refresh means late 2021 ARM 16" MBP.
 
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NickYanakiev

macrumors 6502
Sep 12, 2016
433
299
I sent my recently purchased 13" Macbook Pro (i5 10th gen, 512GB 16GB RAM) back to Apple yesterday.

Would have hated being unable to react if the ARM model is markedly better.
 
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NickYanakiev

macrumors 6502
Sep 12, 2016
433
299

I had issues with True Tone on the laptop and decided to get a refund, rather than have Apple swap it for a new one.
The price was great as I have an education discount (got free AirPods too) but I am not in a hurry and would rather wait until October to see what the deal with the new laptops is.
 

danano

macrumors member
Dec 3, 2017
33
19
I am also running a late 2013 15" MBP, waiting to replace it with possibly the last and greatest Intel-based MBP. Today Intel released a lot of info on its new Tiger Lake processor series. Which Tiger Lake processor would Apple be likely to use for the new 16" MBP of my dreams? Any guesses as to a possible time frame, or even likelihood of such a machine?
 

Sarajiel

macrumors newbie
Aug 12, 2020
18
10
I am also running a late 2013 15" MBP, waiting to replace it with possibly the last and greatest Intel-based MBP. Today Intel released a lot of info on its new Tiger Lake processor series. Which Tiger Lake processor would Apple be likely to use for the new 16" MBP of my dreams? Any guesses as to a possible time frame, or even likelihood of such a machine?

The official launch date/event for Tiger Lake CPUs will be Sept. 2nd. This week were basically just a string of virtual press events about the upcoming Xe graphics and innovations of Intel's next iteration of their 10mm process.

Judging from the known leaks and rumors Tiger Lake U will probably be available in Q4/2020 and the H-series chips are supposedly shipping in Q2/2021. Unless Intel actually ships these new SKUs in volume for a couple of weeks already, I wouldn't expect too many systems before the holiday season. Depending on how bad Intel's chaos really is, we might only see a couple of halo/flagship devices like the XPS 13 before the end of the year.

So far it seems that the H-series Tiger Lake chips will only have a relatively small raw performance advantage over Comet Lake-H at much better power efficiency. However we will most likely only see a Comet Lake-H MBP 16" within a couple of weeks as a filler machine until Apple releases the various new AS based MBPs around the next WWDC.
 

Corncab44

macrumors regular
Jun 22, 2020
233
62
The official launch date/event for Tiger Lake CPUs will be Sept. 2nd. This week were basically just a string of virtual press events about the upcoming Xe graphics and innovations of Intel's next iteration of their 10mm process.

Judging from the known leaks and rumors Tiger Lake U will probably be available in Q4/2020 and the H-series chips are supposedly shipping in Q2/2021. Unless Intel actually ships these new SKUs in volume for a couple of weeks already, I wouldn't expect too many systems before the holiday season. Depending on how bad Intel's chaos really is, we might only see a couple of halo/flagship devices like the XPS 13 before the end of the year.

So far it seems that the H-series Tiger Lake chips will only have a relatively small raw performance advantage over Comet Lake-H at much better power efficiency. However we will most likely only see a Comet Lake-H MBP 16" within a couple of weeks as a filler machine until Apple releases the various new AS based MBPs around the next WWDC.

Interesting. To be clear, when are you saying you expect the next 16" MBP refresh?
 

Sarajiel

macrumors newbie
Aug 12, 2020
18
10
Since I don't have any insight in Apple's supply chain, I can only give you my estimate based on deduction from already known product information, credible rumors and past release patterns which put's it somewhere in Sept. 2020, maybe Oct. in case they also go for the new generation AMD GPUs.
 

Corncab44

macrumors regular
Jun 22, 2020
233
62
Since I don't have any insight in Apple's supply chain, I can only give you my estimate based on deduction from already known product information, credible rumors and past release patterns which put's it somewhere in Sept. 2020, maybe Oct. in case they also go for the new generation AMD GPUs.

Seems like we would have heard something if it was that soon. I was thinking November (when it came out in 2019) if at all. I'm planning to buy the last Intel 16 inch so I'm hoping sooner rather than later.
 
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flur

macrumors 68020
Nov 12, 2012
2,391
1,174
Just how reliable are the rumors that the next 13" (or 14") will be ARM? I ask as I need my Windows VM, so I'm trying to sort if I need to buy the current model or if I can wait for the next one. I'm thinking at this point that maybe I order the current one just before the new ones are announced and then, if the new one has an Intel chip, I send it back and buy the new one.
 

Sarajiel

macrumors newbie
Aug 12, 2020
18
10
Just how reliable are the rumors that the next 13" (or 14") will be ARM?

Well, rumors will always be rumors. ?

However you can take a step back and try to look a the bigger picture. By that I mean looking at the industry in general and look at the available information of upcoming products. Since Intel dropped a lot of marketing material and technical background information about their upcoming Xe graphics products in the lap of journalists this week, you can clearly see what they talked about and what they NOT talked about. Just by using Intel's own product projections and roadmaps, you will notice that the Tiger Lake parts with Xe graphics are still quite a bit away.

After reading a couple more articles today, it seems that the rumored release windows I mentioned in my earlier post were quite spot on. There is still the possibility that Intel trolled the journos and the Sept. 2nd launch will not just be a typical paper launch, but a hard launch with many notebooks from all the larger OEMs available on launch day. Although that seems unlikely since some journalists specifically mentioned in their articles that they don't have seen any signs of review units whith Tiger Lake CPUs at all. Usually those machines would be on the way to them right now.
There are also not many reported retailer gaffes by listing SKUs early yet. I think someone claimed to have seen a low end HP laptop somewhere, but didn't provide screenshots.
Just as a reminder, it took roughly 3 months to actually see Ice Lake-U notebooks in the stores after the CPU "launch" and those were a few halo products by Dell (XPS 13 2-in-1) and Lenovo (something Yoga-branded).

On the other hand look at Apple's strategic interest in making that transition happen as smooth as possible. They committed themselves to a two year transition period which pretty much means that they don't have many products that would be refreshed multiple times during that period. While I get the hope that we see Tiger Lake-U machines, and personally I'd want a 14" MBP with 3.5k Mini-LED display ideally in a 6c/12t config for myself, it doesn't make much sense for them to delay the introduction of Apple Silicon in one of their most popular Mac product lines.

Keep also in mind that Tiger Lake brings a lot of minor improvements like USB4 to the table. It's much easier for Apple to differentiate the two competing architectures if end-users have some clear marketing pointers why they should buy a new notebook. In today's market of over-engineered consumer devices many users don't really care about the CPU architecture inside anymore as long as the comparison of marketing checkpoints convinces them that the new device is "better" and Safari feels snappier.
All the folks who actually care about raw performance, power-efficiency and other in-depth aspects of their purchases are pretty much a minority in the Apple eco-system.
 
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ctjack

macrumors 68000
Mar 8, 2020
1,566
1,576
Just how reliable are the rumors that the next 13" (or 14") will be ARM? I ask as I need my Windows VM, so I'm trying to sort if I need to buy the current model or if I can wait for the next one.
If the next one will be Intel, then refresh will be only around next May or Summer 2021. Because only at that time Intel 11th gen will be available in Apple laptops. Intel will introduce new chips by the end of this year and it takes additional 5-6 months for Apple to actually implement them in a new laptop as opposed to Windows machines, which probably will ship with new chips from Jan-Feb 2021.
So even if the next refresh will be Intel, then you will end up waiting 9-11 months until new MBP.
If next refresh is ARM, then we may see it until the end of the year, but without redesign.
 
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gadgetfreaky

macrumors 65816
Oct 28, 2007
1,405
532
The official launch date/event for Tiger Lake CPUs will be Sept. 2nd. This week were basically just a string of virtual press events about the upcoming Xe graphics and innovations of Intel's next iteration of their 10mm process.

Judging from the known leaks and rumors Tiger Lake U will probably be available in Q4/2020 and the H-series chips are supposedly shipping in Q2/2021. Unless Intel actually ships these new SKUs in volume for a couple of weeks already, I wouldn't expect too many systems before the holiday season. Depending on how bad Intel's chaos really is, we might only see a couple of halo/flagship devices like the XPS 13 before the end of the year.

So far it seems that the H-series Tiger Lake chips will only have a relatively small raw performance advantage over Comet Lake-H at much better power efficiency. However we will most likely only see a Comet Lake-H MBP 16" within a couple of weeks as a filler machine until Apple releases the various new AS based MBPs around the next WWDC.
so intel has been a hot mess for days but that is a rather skeptic timeline on H class.
source?
 

moxxey

macrumors regular
Feb 27, 2011
220
19
What rumors are saying a 16" Intel in October? Haven't heard of any rumors about that, but I hope their is one more update before the ARM update.

There has been snippets of info suggesting a new MBP 16" is coming and a timescale of September/October, but will be a minor update. One rumour has it including the new T3 chip though.

I reckon Apple will save all its design changes to the ARM transition, including the big panel update.
 

Corncab44

macrumors regular
Jun 22, 2020
233
62
There has been snippets of info suggesting a new MBP 16" is coming and a timescale of September/October, but will be a minor update. One rumour has it including the new T3 chip though.

I reckon Apple will save all its design changes to the ARM transition, including the big panel update.
Where have you seen rumors for these dates? Id love to pick up a new one that soon but have seen no evidence.
 

applesed

macrumors 6502a
Jun 25, 2012
533
340
It would be odd to go a full year and change without an update but they probably don’t want to put anymore intels in circulation than they need to..
 

DCIFRTHS

macrumors 65816
Jan 25, 2008
1,309
656
There has been snippets of info suggesting a new MBP 16" is coming and a timescale of September/October, but will be a minor update. One rumour has it including the new T3 chip though.

I reckon Apple will save all its design changes to the ARM transition, including the big panel update.
Any additional info regarding the T3 chip? I haven’t heard anything, or seen any threads.

Edit: I did a search and found a few mentions of the T3, but nothing more than brief mentions.
 
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