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tlindaas

macrumors newbie
Mar 15, 2008
21
10
If you have full control in your environment then I guess it is relatively safe. But in my experience with self-built NVMe enclosure is that some of them are subject to lose connection with the host Mac, I don’t know if it has to with the quality of the cable, the port, or the board / controller, macOS lose the drives without proper eject. Therefore I never use them as sole storage for important data. But of course more reliable hardware exists, I just happen to have chosen worse ones.
Ok. My SSDs are internally mounted in a Mac Pro 2010.
 
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Chancha

macrumors 68020
Mar 19, 2014
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Ok. My SSDs are internally mounted in a Mac Pro 2010.
There are undoubtedly extra points of failure for external connections. These NVMe enclosures are usually bus powered also, where power issue I believe is the major cause of losing connection.

But back to the topic; Disk Utility has been able to put together software stripped RAID0 out of any mounted logical volume. Two or more TB NVMe drives can be fused this way.
 

F-Train

macrumors 68020
Apr 22, 2015
2,272
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NYC & Newfoundland
These NVMe enclosures are usually bus powered also, where power issue I believe is the major cause of losing connection.


There are exceptions. Netstor makes this wall-powered enclosure for two M.2 SSDs: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...usa_netstor_na611tb3_thunderbolt_3.html/specs

I believe that it also makes one for four, although B&H doesn't appear to sell it.

I talk about repurposing an enclosure for an external GPU in this new thread: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...2-external-storage-read-write-speeds.2340127/

The PCIe slot in the GPU enclosure is the same kind of slot that @tlindaas has in his Mac Pro.
 
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Chancha

macrumors 68020
Mar 19, 2014
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There are exceptions. Netstor makes this wall-powered enclosure for two M.2 SSDs: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...usa_netstor_na611tb3_thunderbolt_3.html/specs

I believe that it also makes one for four, although B&H doesn't appear to sell it.

I talk about repurposing an enclosure for an external GPU in this new thread: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...2-external-storage-read-write-speeds.2340127/

The PCIe slot in the GPU enclosure is the same kind of slot that @tlindaas has in his Mac Pro.
Yes I replied in your thread also, that’s an interesting route but also somewhat niche.

For laptop use, bus-powered makes all the sense. For desktop use, PCI cards probably makes more sense than anything external. But in the case of Mac Studio, it is a desktop but it has no slots… therefore having a PCI enclosure with guaranteed power stability has a major benefit there.
 

F-Train

macrumors 68020
Apr 22, 2015
2,272
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NYC & Newfoundland
Yes I replied in your thread also, that’s an interesting route but also somewhat niche.

Yes. However, there are a fair number of people with 2018 Mac minis outfitted with an external GPU. Some who are moving to an M1 Mac may be attracted to the idea of repurposing their GPU enclosure.

Which other thread did you reply to?
 
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Chancha

macrumors 68020
Mar 19, 2014
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Yes. However, there are a fair number of people with 2018 Mac minis outfitted with an external GPU. Some who are moving to an M1 Mac may be attracted to the idea of repurposing their GPU enclosure.

Which other thread did you reply to?
The thread where you asked to repurpose your eGPU enclosure but started the question on U.2 SSD.

It turns out a PCIe enclosure housing NVMe SSD may make a lot of sense with the Mac Studio now, as we discuss the reliability of the bus-powered ones.
 

F-Train

macrumors 68020
Apr 22, 2015
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The thread where you asked to repurpose your eGPU enclosure but started the question on U.2 SSD.

It turns out a PCIe enclosure housing NVMe SSD may make a lot of sense with the Mac Studio now, as we discuss the reliability of the bus-powered ones.

Got it. Yes, as the new thread linked in post #78 says I'm going with M.2. I think that U.2 involves unnecessary complications including availability of the SSDs.

I think that there are three issues with most of the enclosures that are being used. You've identified one, the fact that most of them are bus-powered. As you suggest, this may be why people frequently report disconnects.

The second arises from the fact that most of these DIY enclosures are very small and quickly get very hot. I think that they're an invitation to throttling. That is less of an issue with a PCIe slot in a tower computer, and I don't expect any heat issue with the Asus GPU enclosure.

Also, most if not all of the enclosures available on Amazon, which are what most people are buying, will only take one SSD.
 
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tlindaas

macrumors newbie
Mar 15, 2008
21
10
There are exceptions. Netstor makes this wall-powered enclosure for two M.2 SSDs: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...usa_netstor_na611tb3_thunderbolt_3.html/specs

I believe that it also makes one for four, although B&H doesn't appear to sell it.

I talk about repurposing an enclosure for an external GPU in this new thread: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...2-external-storage-read-write-speeds.2340127/

The PCIe slot in the GPU enclosure is the same kind of slot that @tlindaas has in his Mac Pro.
Just to be clear, my SSD drives are not connected to the PCIe slots, but to the normal hard drive slots. I use these: https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MMP35T25/
 
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DPUser

macrumors 6502a
Jan 17, 2012
988
304
Rancho Bohemia, California
My plan for Audio use, yet to be tested as my Mac Studio is still on its way:

2 x 1TB SATA SSDs in USB3 enclosures serving Virtual Instrument Sample Data

1 x 1TB NVMe PCIe SSD in OWC Express TB enclosure for Project Data

3 x 8TB Seagate External USB3 HDs for Time Machine, Project Daily Direct Backup and Project Archive

Everything, including the Mac Studio, goes in a machine closet, so noise is not an issue. Hoping the External USB3 cases will allow the SATA SSDs to perform properly. I will have 2TB internal storage available and will be able to use that for audio-related data as necessary.
 

tlindaas

macrumors newbie
Mar 15, 2008
21
10
Regarding SSDs that disconnects unexpectedly: Is this a USB enclosure problem exclusively, or it Thunderbolt enclosures also affected?
 

F-Train

macrumors 68020
Apr 22, 2015
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NYC & Newfoundland
My plan for Audio use, yet to be tested as my Mac Studio is still on its way:

2 x 1TB SATA SSDs in USB3 enclosures serving Virtual Instrument Sample Data

1 x 1TB NVMe PCIe SSD in OWC Express TB enclosure for Project Data

3 x 8TB Seagate External USB3 HDs for Time Machine, Project Daily Direct Backup and Project Archive

Everything, including the Mac Studio, goes in a machine closet, so noise is not an issue. Hoping the External USB3 cases will allow the SATA SSDs to perform properly. I will have 2TB internal storage available and will be able to use that for audio-related data as necessary.

I use Logic and have about 2TB of sample libraries. Consequently, I'm sorting out the same issues. A question... With a 2TB internal drive, why are you using a 1TB external drive for project data, which I assume means your DAW session?
 

Chancha

macrumors 68020
Mar 19, 2014
2,244
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Regarding SSDs that disconnects unexpectedly: Is this a USB enclosure problem exclusively, or it Thunderbolt enclosures also affected?
Both. The power issues are to do with the USB-C specs and circuitry than to do with the data side of it.
 

mcnallym

macrumors 65816
Oct 28, 2008
1,207
932
Well ordered the storage which is why kept to 512gb internal

Highpoint ssd7204 nvme card installed in sonnet echo express se IIIe
WD black sn750 1TB x 2
WD black sn750 2tb x 2

Going to detach the 2nd disk slot on some older sonnet sata ssd cards and fit two more 2tb Samsung sata ssd for some bulk storage that don’t need immediate access too.

Will be enough for what actively working on.

Works out less then the Apple internal upgrade and will be available to attach to any Mac not just with the studio.
 

F-Train

macrumors 68020
Apr 22, 2015
2,272
1,762
NYC & Newfoundland
This afternoon, I ordered a replacement for the Mac Studio/Max that I got from an Apple store on March 18th. I decided to bring more storage inboard and went with a 2TB internal SSD. The delivery estimate is June 27-July 11, so I have lots of time to think about rejigging the plan for outboard storage :)
 

albertjs

macrumors member
Feb 18, 2018
55
43
Quick update: I just changed all the cables from Thunderbolt3 to Thunderbolt4, now read/write speeds have improved!! Amazing :D

Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 15.05.33.png
 
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tlindaas

macrumors newbie
Mar 15, 2008
21
10
Quick update: I just changed all the cables from Thunderbolt3 to Thunderbolt4, now read/write speeds have improved!! Amazing :D

Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 15.05.33.png
That is fast! But I wonder why the read speed is lower with 4 drives than with 2 (with 2 drives you had a read speed of 5,800 mb/s.)
 

albertjs

macrumors member
Feb 18, 2018
55
43
Sorry I was wrong, with 2 drives the 5,800 mb/s was only for write speed, read was 3,900 mb/s. So it makes sense the improved speeds!
 

tlindaas

macrumors newbie
Mar 15, 2008
21
10
Sorry I was wrong, with 2 drives the 5,800 mb/s was only for write speed, read was 3,900 mb/s. So it makes sense the improved speeds!
Ok, I see. If you have the time, and could test read/write speeds with both 1, 2, 3 and 4 Thunderblades in RAID 0, it will be easy to calculate the speed increase percentage for each additional drive. These numbers at least I am very interested in seeing!
 

albertjs

macrumors member
Feb 18, 2018
55
43
Ok, I see. If you have the time, and could test read/write speeds with both 1, 2, 3 and 4 Thunderblades in RAID 0, it will be easy to calculate the speed increase percentage for each additional drive. These numbers at least I am very interested in seeing!
Ok I will!!
 

albertjs

macrumors member
Feb 18, 2018
55
43
Ok, I've been investigating a bit. The first 2 Thunderblade units I bought last year have inside Aura P12 Pro disks, and the 2 Thudnerblade units I bought last week have inside Aura Pro IV disks... In OWC website you can see that the new Aura Pro IV disks are much more faster... see attached images. I am not sure now if my bottleneck is due to mix both type of disks... maybe if I had the 4 units with the Aura Pro IV disks, I would get even higher read/write speed results... Although we are still limited to the max speed you can get via Thunderbolt4 ports, so I am not sure if I would benefit or not, or the bottleneck is just the Thunderbolt4 limitations... any thoughts??
Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 17.06.37.png
Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 17.06.37.png
Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 17.07.17.png
Captura de Pantalla 2022-04-04 a las 17.07.49.png
 

Chocomonsters

macrumors regular
May 22, 2007
166
45
I want to see a matching TB4/USB4 storage expansion chassis that could hold numerous storage devices:
  • M.2 NVMe SSDs (scratch disk)
  • 2.5" SATAIII SSDs (project/media files)
  • 3.5" SATAIII HDDs (Time Machine)
I think you will be disappointed by NVMe as scratch disk. You will be capped by TB4 speed.
 

Mr Screech

macrumors 6502
Mar 2, 2018
260
264
NVMe TB3 enclosure as bootdisk.
10Gbe Synology NAS to allocate a few TB's as general cache.
USB3 sata SSD as daily active project backup.
 

Dutch60

macrumors regular
May 18, 2019
221
80
External storage for Mac Studio? Well, if I buy such a Studio, I' ll certainly keep my 2 Lacie d2 external harddrives (Professional and Thunderbolt). What?? No SSD?? Yes, no SSD....yet. Didn't find any problems with even working from these external harddrives (working on images). Are they vulnerable. Ofcourse. In time they will then probably be replaced by SSD.
 
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