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moldy lunchbox

macrumors 6502a
Sep 9, 2010
783
338
Sunny California
Would you say the pro is worth the premium over the air? In Canada atleast, the 16gb/512 air is $50 cheaper then the pro with just 8gb of ram.

I feel the 16gb is worth it for longevity of the device as I plan to keep it a few years atleast unless Apple really blows me away with their redesign. I’ve watched hours of YouTube and still can’t for the life of me make up my mind lol

what made you go with the pro?


I'll be completely petty here (but honest), the reason I picked the MBP over the Air is because the bottom of the display says "Pro" at the bottom of the screen instead of "Air" and that just makes me feel like more of a boss. I don't buy these things often, so when I do I want the best one. The extra battery life is valuable to me as well. And I like the Touch Bar, it's far from a killer feature, but I don't mind it. To each their own though.
 
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1BadManVan

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Original poster
Dec 20, 2009
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I'll be completely petty here (but honest), the reason I picked the MBP over the Air is because the bottom of the display says "Pro" at the bottom of the screen instead of "Air" and that just makes me feel like more of a boss. I don't buy these things often, so when I do I want the best one. The extra battery life is valuable to me as well. And I like the Touch Bar, it's far from a killer feature, but I don't mind it. To each their own though.
Haha, I value the honesty. I’m a spec geek so I’m definitely leaning towards the pro just to say I got the best they offer. It’s also why when I’m seeing these higher end gaming ultra books, it pulls me too.

I need a raise lol
 
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delsoul

macrumors 6502
Mar 7, 2014
458
717
Fair points, their partners just build some very tempting laptops lol
It was really difficult to pass on buying that matebook x pro a couple of years ago. It sold for $2100 usd or more in the rest of the world, but huawei was trying to break into the US market and selling it for $1299 I think it was. It was just an absolutely unbeatable deal. 512gb ssd, 3k touch screen, Dolby atmos speakers, i7 chip, nvidia 150mx graphics card, etc...I still love the thing but I’ve moved on back to a MacBook Pro and don’t see myself using it anymore aside from some windows only programs when needed.
 

1BadManVan

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It was really difficult to pass on buying that matebook x pro a couple of years ago. It sold for $2100 usd or more in the rest of the world, but huawei was trying to break into the US market and selling it for $1299 I think it was. It was just an absolutely unbeatable deal. 512gb ssd, 3k touch screen, Dolby atmos speakers, i7 chip, nvidia 150mx graphics card, etc...I still love the thing but I’ve moved on back to a MacBook Pro and don’t see myself using it anymore aside from some windows only programs when needed.
That’s where this new stealth 15m is tempting as hell. Tiger lake I7, 512gb ssd pcie4, Rtx 2060, 144hz 1080p panel and 3.6 lbs, all aluminum build for $1499
 
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SlCKB0Y

macrumors 68040
Feb 25, 2012
3,431
557
Sydney, Australia
What made you choose this over a windows equivalent?
Because once you go Mac you never go back. :D

Seriously though, it's the tight integration with iPhone and iPad, the intuitive and consistent interface. I'm also a *nix guy and its the only way I can get all the *nix tools I need and want AND get a lot of the commercial software I need that Linux does not have.

Plus, with the new M1 MacBook Air, I get a cooler, silent, much more battery life, more powerful "ultrabook" with a better screen and trackpad than anything else Wintel based. It's impossible to get a Wintel laptop with those attributes at any price range.

If all that wasn't enough, I also just cannot stand to use Windows.

Rtx 2060, 144hz 1080p panel

This gaming requirement you have is probably why you have asked this "why" question in the first place and is just about the only thing a Mac will not be better at. If this is a deal breaker then a Mac is just not really for you.
 
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1BadManVan

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Original poster
Dec 20, 2009
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Because once you go Mac you never go back. :D

Seriously though, it's the tight integration with iPhone and iPad, the intuitive and consistent interface. I'm also a *nix guy and its the only way I can get all the *nix tools I need and want AND get a lot of the commercial software I need that Linux does not have.

Plus, with the new M1 MacBook Air, I get a cooler, silent, much more battery life, more powerful "ultrabook" with a better screen and trackpad than anything else Wintel based. It's impossible to get a Wintel laptop with those attributes at any price range.

If all that wasn't enough, I also just cannot stand to use Windows.



This gaming requirement you have is probably why you have asked this "why" question in the first place and is just about the only thing a Mac will not be better at. If this is a deal breaker then a Mac is just not really for you.
It’s tough one because I used to build gaming computers as a hobby but I haven’t actually touched one in about 8 years now. Got back into gaming recently but on Xbox. Just haven’t figured out if it’s worth going back to pc gaming via laptop or stick to xbox

no interest in building an actual tower, I want to stick to a laptop
 

SlCKB0Y

macrumors 68040
Feb 25, 2012
3,431
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Sydney, Australia
Got back into gaming recently but on Xbox. Just haven’t figured out if it’s worth going back to pc gaming via laptop or stick to xbox

I guess it just depends on how seriously you get back into gaming. Also, with Xbox supporting a keyboard and mouse for some time, this blurs the distinction between a console and a PC even further.

My personal opinion is that a gaming laptop is one big compromise. You compromise the laptop experience as they are larger, heavier, have pretty terrible battery life and are hot and noisy, and you compromise the gaming experience dealing with a small screen and usually a compromised keyboard compared to a desktop PC.

You've got a tough decision to make I guess!
 
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wyatterp

macrumors member
Nov 11, 2020
88
85
I bought a cheaper Dell 7390 XPS13 2-in-1 late October. But now I'm on the new MBA.

Few thoughts, form factor and touchscreen on the Dell are better - wish I had that flexibility with the MBA.

However, MBA is better in every other way. I love the no cooling fan life! Better screen and keyboard, and of course superior touchpad (Dell was good though). Dell screens are vibrant and very bright, but mine was only 1200P, so the sharpness uptick on the MBA is appreciated.

I'm fine with both OSes - hate that Mac is still terrible for installation and uninstallation. But love how easy it is to use the trackpad and multitasking and what not. I love I can fire up a game of civ vi and you just easily swipe to different apps without any fuss. Better scaling, better multi-tasking. I've gone nearly 3 days without charging when just doing normal light stuff, and with instant on - this thing has replaced my iPad Pro as well. Performance vastly better, the machine just doesn't sweat doing what I normally do (outside of a few games).

I also am a longtime iPhone user - so the integration and using my AirPods with this thing just keep it all nice and clean.
 

1BadManVan

macrumors 68040
Original poster
Dec 20, 2009
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Bc Canada
I guess it just depends on how seriously you get back into gaming. Also, with Xbox supporting a keyboard and mouse for some time, this blurs the distinction between a console and a PC even further.

My personal opinion is that a gaming laptop is one big compromise. You compromise the laptop experience as they are larger, heavier, have pretty terrible battery life and are hot and noisy, and you compromise the gaming experience dealing with a small screen and usually a compromised keyboard compared to a desktop PC.

You've got a tough decision to make I guess!
That’s definitely what’s holding me back so far, the compromise. If my job didn’t require me to be away from home so much, I would just build a proper gaming system. But I’m away 65-80 hours a week for work and have 3 kids at home. Can’t get too serious about gaming but definitely enjoy it

keyboard and mouse is something i haven’t tried yet on Xbox. Maybe that’s a good compromise to a more PC like experience.

Appreciate the response, slowly working through all this lol. Just got my 12 pro max, would definitely like to try out some more photo and video editing with it.
 

1BadManVan

macrumors 68040
Original poster
Dec 20, 2009
3,285
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Bc Canada
I bought a cheaper Dell 7390 XPS13 2-in-1 late October. But now I'm on the new MBA.

Few thoughts, form factor and touchscreen on the Dell are better - wish I had that flexibility with the MBA.

However, MBA is better in every other way. I love the no cooling fan life! Better screen and keyboard, and of course superior touchpad (Dell was good though). Dell screens are vibrant and very bright, but mine was only 1200P, so the sharpness uptick on the MBA is appreciated.

I'm fine with both OSes - hate that Mac is still terrible for installation and uninstallation. But love how easy it is to use the trackpad and multitasking and what not. I love I can fire up a game of civ vi and you just easily swipe to different apps without any fuss. Better scaling, better multi-tasking. I've gone nearly 3 days without charging when just doing normal light stuff, and with instant on - this thing has replaced my iPad Pro as well. Performance vastly better, the machine just doesn't sweat doing what I normally do (outside of a few games).

I also am a longtime iPhone user - so the integration and using my AirPods with this thing just keep it all nice and clean.
That last paragraph is what’s been drawing me to the mac. I have the AirPods, iPhone and an iPad, it feels like it’s the final piece to the puzzle. Just trying to justify its value in my Apple fleet lol

thanks again guys
 

SlCKB0Y

macrumors 68040
Feb 25, 2012
3,431
557
Sydney, Australia
If my job didn’t require me to be away from home so much, I would just build a proper gaming system. But I’m away 65-80 hours a week for work
If you are away from home that much and want to game, maybe this would actually be a point in the gaming laptop column if you get any significant amount of downtime (Eg, if you're staying away overnight in hotels etc). If this is your use case it would be a good way to get your gaming time in so you can optimise your time at home with the family.

I might have missed which gaming laptop you are considering, but if your usage of the laptop for work involves client meetings, they usually aren't very conservatively designed and look somewhat unprofessional. ?
 

1BadManVan

macrumors 68040
Original poster
Dec 20, 2009
3,285
3,446
Bc Canada
If you are away from home that much and want to game, maybe this would actually be a point in the gaming laptop column if you get any significant amount of downtime (Eg, if you're staying away overnight in hotels etc). If this is your use case it would be a good way to get your gaming time in so you can optimise your time at home with the family.

I might have missed which gaming laptop you are considering, but if your usage of the laptop for work involves client meetings, they usually aren't very conservatively designed and look somewhat unprofessional. ?
One that has caught my eye currently is the msi stealth 15m. All aluminum build, i7 tiger lake, pci-e gen 4 ssd, Rtx 2060 at just over 3 and a half pounds. Issue is that it’s so new that I can’t find any reviews on it to find the “but” lol
 

dmccloud

macrumors 68040
Sep 7, 2009
3,142
1,899
Anchorage, AK
One that has caught my eye currently is the msi stealth 15m. All aluminum build, i7 tiger lake, pci-e gen 4 ssd, Rtx 2060 at just over 3 and a half pounds. Issue is that it’s so new that I can’t find any reviews on it to find the “but” lol

I have the Stealth GS65, which runs a 9th gen i7 with 16GB RAM, 500GB M.2 SSD, and a 1660Ti videocard. One thing I will tell you is that while it is easy to upgrade the RAM on the Stealth, upgrading the SSD sucks because it's on the keyboard side of the motherboard instead of the bottom where your RAM is located. This means you have to completely disassemble the computer and remove the motherboard in order to get to the M.2 slots. It is a time consuming process and requires you to keep track of a LOT of screws, ribbon connectors, and antennas.
 

SlCKB0Y

macrumors 68040
Feb 25, 2012
3,431
557
Sydney, Australia
One that has caught my eye currently is the msi stealth 15m. All aluminum build, i7 tiger lake, pci-e gen 4 ssd, Rtx 2060 at just over 3 and a half pounds. Issue is that it’s so new that I can’t find any reviews on it to find the “but” lol
That looks really good and it has a pretty conservative design.
 

Captain Trips

macrumors 68000
Jun 13, 2020
1,860
6,355
I bought an M1 MBP for the same reasons I have bought every other Mac in the past:
  • They just work (although I did not buy a MacBook with the butterfly keyboard)
  • I prefer Mac OS over Windows. Windows 10 is nice, but not as good as Mac OS
  • I truly enjoy my Mac hardware and the Mac OS
 

Yebubbleman

macrumors 603
May 20, 2010
6,024
2,617
Los Angeles, CA
Maybe but that would be leaving out Apple’s customer support. This just isn’t available with a Windows laptop.

It's available on Windows laptops. Just not the kind that you stroll into a Costco or a Best Buy and buy. And actually, it's even better as they'll send a tech out next day TO YOUR HOUSE and repair the machine then and there. Apple does not offer such services.

The value of good customer service only becomes apparent if there is a problem. From my experience, Apple support is usually very quick in offering satisfactory solutions. Can't say it the same for Dell or Lenovo.
Dell and Lenovo both offer decent support, just not on consumer machines. You have to buy one of their business systems, but the warranty support is usually better than AppleCare. Certainly their level 1 staff is way more on point.
My job is a cyber security specialist, I have to deal with pcs everyday. It's almost ruined technology for me, when I get home the last thing I want to do is look at windows. Apple aren't always perfect when it comes to OS issues but its a nice change for me to use Mac compared to a pc. It keeps my interest in tech alive.

Apple has a track record of one in every three macOS releases doesn't suck. So long as I wait a month, I've never had any such issues with Windows 10 releases. I disliked 1709 a bit. 1809 had its famous re-release, but was pretty much fine thereafter. I've had minor Hyper-V issues with 1903 and 1909, but other than that, it's been pretty smooth as far as the QC is concerned. Compare that to the nonsense that was High Sierra and Catalina, and you'd think that hell had frozen over and the roles were reversed!

The thought of ever using another Intel laptop is revolting to me. Loud, obnoxious, inefficient, yuck! :)

And I'm sure you were using them gleefully as recently as six months ago! ?

I bought an M1 MBP for the same reasons I have bought every other Mac in the past:
  • They just work (although I did not buy a MacBook with the butterfly keyboard)
  • I prefer Mac OS over Windows. Windows 10 is nice, but not as good as Mac OS
  • I truly enjoy my Mac hardware and the Mac OS
Did you use Catalina? How about High Sierra? I understand that this is a Mac forum and that most people here are just naturally biased against Windows, but saying that macOS is better when it is clearly suffering from QC issues (let alone ones that Microsoft has a better handle on by far) is the epitome of reality distortion field!
 

Captain Trips

macrumors 68000
Jun 13, 2020
1,860
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Did you use Catalina? How about High Sierra? I understand that this is a Mac forum and that most people here are just naturally biased against Windows, but saying that macOS is better when it is clearly suffering from QC issues (let alone ones that Microsoft has a better handle on by far) is the epitome of reality distortion field!

Yes, I have used Catalina on my 2014 Mac mini (4 GB memory, 512 GB SSD I upgrade) for about 7 months now and High Sierra on my 2010 MacBook Pro 17" that I bought used in August of this year.. I haven't had any problems with either one.

I typically use the following software on a regular basis on all of my actively used Macs (2010 MBP, 2014 mini, 2020 M1 MBP):
  • Safari, 4 - 8 tabs
  • Citrix Workspace
  • Mail
  • Music
  • News
  • Xcode (including the iPhone / iPsd simulator) and IntelliJ [only on the Mac mini and M1 MBP, not the 2010 MBP]
  • LibreOffice
  • Notes
  • TextEdit
  • Finder
Not the heaviest of loads, but it has worked just fine fro me, thank you, even though I only have 4 GB of memory.

I have used DOS and Windows computers since 1988 (work and personal use), Linux computers since 1997 (personal use) and Macs since about 2002 (personal use).

I am not a Mac-only person. I just have a lot of computer experience (working in IT since 1989) and I know what I like. :^)

And I did call out the butterfly keyboard problem - Apple is a company made up of imperfect human beings (none of us are perfect) and so they do have products that people, including me, do not like for whatever reason.

And the reality distortion field / bias on these forums isn't limited to pro-Apple people.
 

leman

macrumors Core
Oct 14, 2008
19,521
19,677
Dell and Lenovo both offer decent support, just not on consumer machines. You have to buy one of their business systems, but the warranty support is usually better than AppleCare. Certainly their level 1 staff is way more on point.

We are a business customer for both Dell and Lenovo. My experience with Lenovo was atrocious while Dell was generally unhelpful (but the technician did their job alright). The only Lenovo laptop (a Thinkpad of some sort) we ever bought to run experiments broke down after couple of months, it took them two weeks to diagnose it after which they refused a warranty repair claiming user fault and charged us a fee of $150 for "laptop disposal". We had to threaten them with legal action :rolleyes:
 

Yebubbleman

macrumors 603
May 20, 2010
6,024
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Los Angeles, CA
Yes, I have used Catalina on my 2014 Mac mini (4 GB memory, 512 GB SSD I upgrade) for about 7 months now. I haven't had any problems.

Consider yourself lucky then. Most people (both on and off these forums) have hated it due to insane glitchiness even on 10.15.7.

I typically use the following software on a regular basis:
  • Safari, 4 - 8 tabs
  • Citrix Workspace
  • Mail
  • Music
  • News
  • Xcode (including the iPhone / iPsd simulator) and IntelliJ
  • LibreOffice
  • Notes
  • TextEdit
  • Finder
Not the heaviest of loads, but it has worked just fine fro me, thank you, even though I only have 4 GB of memory.

I have used DOS and Windows computers since 1988 (work and personal use), Linux computers since 1997 (personal use) and Macs since about 2002 (personal use).

I am not a Mac-only person. I just have a lot of computer experience (working in IT since 1989) and I know what I like. :^)

And I did call out the butterfly keyboard problem - Apple is a company made up of imperfect human beings (none f us are perfect) and so they do have products that people, including me, do not like for whatever reason.

And the reality distortion field / bias on these forums isn't limited to pro-Apple people.
No, but the pro-Apple people are the least informed and most loud of the subset of people on here that have a bias, as evidenced by how anti-Windows this thread (and several others just like it) are.
 

Yebubbleman

macrumors 603
May 20, 2010
6,024
2,617
Los Angeles, CA
We are a business customer for both Dell and Lenovo. My experience with Lenovo was atrocious while Dell was generally unhelpful (but the technician did their job alright). The only Lenovo laptop (a Thinkpad of some sort) we ever bought to run experiments broke down after couple of months, it took them two weeks to diagnose it after which they refused a warranty repair claiming user fault and charged us a fee of $150 for "laptop disposal". We had to threaten them with legal action :rolleyes:
Lenovo has had a **** time with 8th Gen Intel Thunderbolt 3 laptops on the ThinkPad side. But, getting things repaired by them has never been difficult. As for Dell, I personally have a Latitude with ProSupport Plus. It's like someone gave me AppleCare and injected it with steroids. The level 1 people are not horrible; I usually get someone based in North America, and I can get them at my door next business day ready to repair my laptop if need be. Totally wonderful! HP could use some work in this regard, I'll admit.
 

Captain Trips

macrumors 68000
Jun 13, 2020
1,860
6,355
No, but the pro-Apple people are the least informed and most loud of the subset of people on here that have a bias, as evidenced by how anti-Windows this thread (and several others just like it) are.

No one group of people are there least informed. The reason you see people, including me, posting about how we prefer MacOS over Windows is because of the topic of this conversation.

Conversely, there are plenty of people in other conversations about MacOS issues or Mac hardware problems who probably come across as biased or negative, even though they have valid concerns and are justified in what they are saying and how they are saying it.
 

Yebubbleman

macrumors 603
May 20, 2010
6,024
2,617
Los Angeles, CA
No one group of people are there least informed. The reason you see people, including me, posting about how we prefer MacOS over Windows is because of the topic of this conversation.

Conversely, there are plenty of people in other conversations about MacOS issues or Mac hardware problems who probably come across as biased or negative, even though they have valid concerns and are justified in what they are saying and how they are saying it.
I have found that most people who are biased for or against Windows or Mac are doing so because they do not have enough experience with whichever one they're biased against to appreciate what's actually good about it. At the end of the day, they both do 99% the same things and have minimal layout differences that, at worst, take some adjusting to get used to. Most people on here vent about the Registry not even knowing what it does, why it's there, or what about it actually sucks. They just do it because it's the cool thing to do here.
 
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