Who has or is planning to get an electric car / EV Talk

[quagmire]

My buddy just picked up a 70th anniversary edition. Very nice car. Pictures never quite capture the proportions correctly. Seeing it live is something else.

I drove it at NCM Motorsports park. Absolute blast. Looks amazing and the sound of the engine is to die for.

I am extremely late to the game. I am on 3 dealers waitlist hoping my number gets called around 2026-2028 if it gets called at all. I refuse to pay the current ridiculous ADM's on the car. The 3 dealers waitlist's are MSRP. If the ADM's come down( and they will because the Z06 is a massed produced car) to something reasonable( $10-$15K over), I may consider it. But same time I need to be able to order the car the way I want it.

We will see if it is in my cards.

 

[JT2002TJ]

What is the argument against the center pad? We have buttons on the steering wheel for volume, speed control, distance following, voice navigation and voice climate control ( although I have the climate set to run everything automatically ). The only time I touch the screen is for movies or making the car fart.

I think it is simply in their current vehicles, if you just removed the button and threw in a touch screen they would have a point. This is NOT the case with Tesla's. The entire UI was designed so you wouldn't need to interact with the UI while driving, it wasn't an afterthought.

In my opinion, anyone who says the NEED more physical buttons than what is on the Model 3/Y, has not had a Model 3/Y and setup their profile. Once their profile is setup, they would see they don't need these buttons...

 

[Apple fanboy]

I think it is simply in their current vehicles, if you just removed the button and threw in a touch screen they would have a point. This is NOT the case with Tesla's. The entire UI was designed so you wouldn't need to interact with the UI while driving, it wasn't an afterthought.

In my opinion, anyone who says the NEED more physical buttons than what is on the Model 3/Y, has not had a Model 3/Y and setup their profile. Once their profile is setup, they would see they don't need these buttons...

You really do believe that don’t you? That doesn’t make it right though.
But I’ll never buy a Tesla whilst they have their current design so I guess I’ll not find out.

 

[JT2002TJ]

You really do believe that don’t you? That doesn’t make it right though.
But I’ll never buy a Tesla whilst they have their current design so I guess I’ll not find out.

Doesn't make me wrong either...

It really is a you have to try it before you can knock it type thing. The same way some people can't get over the range anxiety until they actually have an EV. You have to really and truly immerse yourself in the Tesla UI to see that the lack of buttons is a nonissue.

I still stand by what I believe even after being corrected, about the Voice Commands not actually being part of the car.

I don't use voice commands much since most of the features are automatic, and I don't have to change them. I do use it at home to fold and unfold the side view mirrors. I use the mirrors to back into my driveway and into my garage, the auto fold feature for home, folds it before I get into the garage. I also don't lock my car in the garage, so they wont automatically fold.

When I do use the voice commands, I haven't had any issues. Mainly for setting destinations for GPS. My Audi (2008) and Ram's (2015) VC are GARBAGE...

 

[Apple fanboy]

Doesn't make me wrong either...

It really is a you have to try it before you can knock it type thing. The same way some people can't get over the range anxiety until they actually have an EV. You have to really and truly immerse yourself in the Tesla UI to see that the lack of buttons is a nonissue.

I still stand by what I believe even after being corrected, about the Voice Commands not actually being part of the car.

I don't use voice commands much since most of the features are automatic, and I don't have to change them. I do use it at home to fold and unfold the side view mirrors. I use the mirrors to back into my driveway and into my garage, the auto fold feature for home, folds it before I get into the garage. I also don't lock my car in the garage, so they wont automatically fold.

When I do use the voice commands, I haven't had any issues. Mainly for setting destinations for GPS. My Audi (2008) and Ram's (2015) VC are GARBAGE...

Nope. I can knock it without trying it. Cars should have physical buttons. Phones should not.

 

[diamond.g]

Nope. I can knock it without trying it. Cars should have physical buttons. Phones should not.

Because I don't have it, can you control CarPlay without touching the screen?

 

[Apple fanboy]

Because I don't have it, can you control CarPlay without touching the screen?

On my car yes. The I drive is an interface for navigating the menus.
Or you could try Siri!

 

[diamond.g]

On my car yes. The I drive is an interface for navigating the menus.
Or you could try Siri!

Interesting, I had the impression that CarPlay interaction required using the touchscreen. Nice of Apple to allow alternatives.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

It really is a you have to try it before you can knock it type thing. The same way some people can't get over the range anxiety until they actually have an EV.

People keep saying about range anxiety and I have concerns. On Wednesday I was told I had to be in Hull for a 9.30 meeting the following morning. I left at 4.45am to get there for 9.30am and had to drive 241 miles with a very short comfort break. Could I have done this in the average EV? My average speed was 70-80 mph.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Nope. I can knock it without trying it. Cars should have physical buttons. Phones should not.

lol. Sooo.... Do you have to look at each key as you type on your phone without physical buttons? Or does muscle memory work there?

 

[JT2002TJ]

People keep saying about range anxiety and I have concerns. On Wednesday I was told I had to be in Hull for a 9.30 meeting the following morning. I left at 4.45am to get there for 9.30am and had to drive 241 miles with a very short comfort break. Could I have done this in the average EV? My average speed was 70-80 mph.

With my Tesla, (depending on if it is cold enough where you need heat) I think I could make it. Also, for your small comfort break, you could stop at a location with a super charger, and in about 15-20 minutes, you could have added about 50% charge. So maybe it would have cost you 10 extra minutes. But you 100% would have had to fully charge during your meeting (45-50 mins at a supercharger) for the trip back, assuming another 15-20 minute stop on the way back.

So, in all, yes, but it would have added about an hour to your entire trip assuming there is a super charger near your destination, and you are staying there for at least an hour.

But, yes, you would have needed an EV with a longer range, which right now are trucks (Ford lighting/Rivian/Hummer), Tesla (any), or Lucid (any). For the range/price, the model 3/Y is the best option for this use case.

Level 4 chargers are coming, these will significantly reduce charging times even from current L3 super chargers.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Interesting, I had the impression that CarPlay interaction required using the touchscreen. Nice of Apple to allow alternatives.

It does, but it is NOT a good user experience without touchscreens. You have to take your eyes off the road when you navigate, and it takes a lot of time to find/control what you are doing.

 

[SalisburySam]

Is there train service between the two locations? I’d have preferred to avoid the drive altogether, take a train the night before, enjoy a good night’s sleep and breakfast, and arrive at the meeting refreshed and fully alert. Then train home. But that’s me, and my assumptions that the train service exists.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Is there train service between the two locations? I’d have preferred to avoid the drive altogether, take a train the night before, enjoy a good night’s sleep and breakfast, and arrive at the meeting refreshed and fully alert. Then train home. But that’s me, and my assumptions that the train service exists.

This is a good option, but I think he/she has a fair point in their post. They need to see if an EV would fit their use case. If an EV is going to replace an ICE, we need to really understand what the limitations are.

I think the best way is to think about your Net time. If you have EV charging at home and/or work, your time saved getting gas monthly will be less than the time added for occasional trip that requires mid trip supercharging. I save 15-30 minutes per week not having to go get gas, so close to 2 hours per month. So if I go on a trip, I have many hours saved before the start of my trip.

Now, if someone is regularly traveling more than 200 miles per day, an EV might not be a good option for them, with the current EV ranges.

 

[panjandrum]

Now, THIS is interesting: https://www.motorauthority.com/news...more-of-its-ev-concept-set-for-april-15-debut

Looks like more info tomorrow. Lancia would be right up at the top of my list (if they can focus on the glory-days of the Stratos) as a company that might build an electric car I would actually be interested in.

Ultimately I wish more companies were focusing on series-hybrids. An elegant solution to so many of the drawbacks of full electrics (at this point.) Allows for cars that are far lighter than a full electric, and yet are functionally identical in terms of pollution for the majority of their usage. The ICE generator can be optimized in ways that an ICE can't be in a traditional car or parallel hybrid, further reducing the negative aspects of an ICE in the first place. The single disadvantage is slightly more complexity.

I still feel that the entire 'all electric' trend just isn't well thought-out, but is instead more of a knee-jerk reaction, and that it is ultimately detrimental in some ways. Full electric limitations (cost, range, charging times, weight, etc.) mean that many people do not consider them viable, and for valid reasons. (Example: My weekend ski-trips alone; through back-country with zero EV charging points anywhere along the route or at the destinations, in extremely cold temperatures, is a huge road-block to me buying a full-electric, even if someone made one I actually liked. But if series-hybrids were common I could easily buy one tomorrow that would suit my purposes.)

I would have preferred a well-though-out approach to the next-generation of cleaner cars, rather than the all-too-common approach humanity takes of flailing about wildly and hoping for the best.

 

[JT2002TJ]

Now, THIS is interesting: https://www.motorauthority.com/news...more-of-its-ev-concept-set-for-april-15-debut

Looks like more info tomorrow. Lancia would be right up at the top of my list (if they can focus on the glory-days of the Stratos) as a company that might build an electric car I would actually be interested in.

Ultimately I wish more companies were focusing on series-hybrids. An elegant solution to so many of the drawbacks of full electrics (at this point.) Allows for cars that are far lighter than a full electric, and yet are functionally identical in terms of pollution for the majority of their usage. The ICE generator can be optimized in ways that an ICE can't be in a traditional car or parallel hybrid, further reducing the negative aspects of an ICE in the first place. The single disadvantage is slightly more complexity.

I still feel that the entire 'all electric' trend just isn't well thought-out, but is instead more of a knee-jerk reaction, and that it is ultimately detrimental in some ways. Full electric limitations (cost, range, charging times, weight, etc.) mean that many people do not consider them are not being considered as viable, and for valid reasons. (Example: My weekend ski-trips alone; through back-country with zero EV charging points anywhere along the route or at the destinations, in extremely cold temperatures, is a huge road-block to me buying a full-electric, even if someone made one I actually liked. But if series-hybrids were common I could easily buy one tomorrow that would suit my purposes.)

I would have preferred a well-though-out approach to the next-generation of cleaner cars, rather than the all-too-common approach humanity takes of flailing about wildly and hoping for the best.

The current EVs on the market are not supposed to replace the current Hybrids on the market. Hybrids exist, in almost every line (sedan, SUV, Trucks). There even are battery supplemented full ICE vehicles which is another form of Hybrid (BWM e's, FCA's e models). There are plenty of well established Hybrids out there.

Eventually EV technology and charging networks will be good enough to fill the void between ICE/Hybrids and current EVs. But even as an EV owner, I can admit we aren't there yet for everyone. A lot more people can benefit from full EV than are ready to admit it, but still are a subset of people that need ICE/Hybrids.

Just like when Hybrids started, it took time to get from where they were to where they are, EVs need the same. It's just going to take time. You have to start somewhere.

 

[Apple fanboy]

lol. Sooo.... Do you have to look at each key as you type on your phone without physical buttons? Or does muscle memory work there?

I don’t use my phone whilst driving so not really worth the comparison. I never said touchscreens were not a good idea on a phone. But a terrible idea if it’s your only interface on a car.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Now, THIS is interesting: https://www.motorauthority.com/news...more-of-its-ev-concept-set-for-april-15-debut

Looks like more info tomorrow. Lancia would be right up at the top of my list (if they can focus on the glory-days of the Stratos) as a company that might build an electric car I would actually be interested in.

Ultimately I wish more companies were focusing on series-hybrids. An elegant solution to so many of the drawbacks of full electrics (at this point.) Allows for cars that are far lighter than a full electric, and yet are functionally identical in terms of pollution for the majority of their usage. The ICE generator can be optimized in ways that an ICE can't be in a traditional car or parallel hybrid, further reducing the negative aspects of an ICE in the first place. The single disadvantage is slightly more complexity.

I still feel that the entire 'all electric' trend just isn't well thought-out, but is instead more of a knee-jerk reaction, and that it is ultimately detrimental in some ways. Full electric limitations (cost, range, charging times, weight, etc.) mean that many people do not consider them are not being considered as viable, and for valid reasons. (Example: My weekend ski-trips alone; through back-country with zero EV charging points anywhere along the route or at the destinations, in extremely cold temperatures, is a huge road-block to me buying a full-electric, even if someone made one I actually liked. But if series-hybrids were common I could easily buy one tomorrow that would suit my purposes.)

I would have preferred a well-though-out approach to the next-generation of cleaner cars, rather than the all-too-common approach humanity takes of flailing about wildly and hoping for the best.

I think hybrids can work in some user cases when full EV does not. But it was never something I wanted. I would not want two different drive trains to potentially go wrong. Plus the continued maintenance costs I was keen to avoid.

 

[Tagbert]

I don’t use my phone whilst driving so not really worth the comparison. I never said touchscreens were not a good idea on a phone. But a terrible idea if it’s your only interface on a car.

I think the most reasonable car UI is physical buttons for common tasks that you do while driving with touch controls for non-driving functions like settings. There will be some things that could go either way but most will fit into those buckets. I use CarPlay via touch while driving but the main functions I use then are just play/pause and skip. I can choose to do those only when the roadway is clear.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I think the most reasonable car UI is physical buttons for common tasks that you do while driving with touch controls for non-driving functions like settings. There will be some things that could go either way but most will fit into those buckets. I use CarPlay via touch while driving but the main functions I use then are just play/pause and skip. I can choose to do those only when the roadway is clear.

Agree 100% on the physical buttons for common tasks. It's safer than touchscreens. As others have said how can it be illegal to touch an iPhone screen whilst driving but not a touchscreen? Its exactly the same thing!

 

[Tagbert]

I think hybrids can work in some user cases when full EV does not. But it was never something I wanted. I would not want two different drive trains to potentially go wrong. Plus the continued maintenance costs I was keen to avoid.

The engines in plug-in hybrids have an easy life. They are not used often and when they are used they mostly run at a steady moderate rpm to power the drivetrain. Maintenance costs are low due to the low mileage that is put on them. On my Volt, it keeps track of run time and calculates a life for oil and lets you know when it is time for an oil change. About 18-20 months seems to be about typical right now. This is not a case where 2 drive trains are twice as likely to need servicing.

 

[Apple fanboy]

The engines in plug-in hybrids have an easy life. They are not used often and when they are used they mostly run at a steady moderate rpm to power the drivetrain. Maintenance costs are low due to the low mileage that is put on them. On my Volt, it keeps track of run time and calculates a life for oil and lets you know when it is time for an oil change. About 18-20 months seems to be about typical right now. This is not a case where 2 drive trains are twice as likely to need servicing.

I'm sure they are less taxed than stand alone ICE. Just wasn't something I needed or wanted. For others though I can see the appeal.

 

[pshufd]

One of the people in our housing community got an EV - Ford Mustang. I have to say that it looks a lot nicer in person than in pictures. This housing community has 180 households and isn't the best for EV charging.

It was charging in his driveway and it looks like he drilled a hole through a glass slider in the basement to run a cable to the charging port. I would have expected an electrician to put in another circuit along with a port in the wall to provide power for a cleaner, professional look. I do not know if this is 120v or 240v as I suppose it's possible that the cord just runs to a standard AC outlet.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the winter as we have very cold temps, freezing rain and we can get a lot of snow. This person does not have a garage.

I'm mildly curious if this is even up to building codes.

And I really hope that the person isn't a renter.

 

[pshufd]

I'm sure they are less taxed than stand alone ICE. Just wasn't something I needed or wanted. For others though I can see the appeal.

I really like the concept of the Volt and wonder why we don't have more vehicles of that kind.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

The engines in plug-in hybrids have an easy life. They are not used often and when they are used they mostly run at a steady moderate rpm to power the drivetrain. Maintenance costs are low due to the low mileage that is put on them. On my Volt, it keeps track of run time and calculates a life for oil and lets you know when it is time for an oil change. About 18-20 months seems to be about typical right now. This is not a case where 2 drive trains are twice as likely to need servicing.

You are correct about the engines of today. Just look at some of the relatively old Toyota Prius all over the US. These cars may not be powerful. I lot of people talk about all the maintenance required for ICE vehicles, but where I live at I perform the maintenance myself and haven't had any expensive maintenance in any of my vehicles: motorcycle, Yamaha UTV (a 2-seater), Honda ATV, Toyota RAV4 V6, Toyota Tundra, Toyota Corolla, boat with a Honda 150-HP jet engine, an a 2001 Silverado truck that shows somewhere around 216,000 miles on the odometer.

Oil and filter changes are done once per year. Also, wiper blades, cabin filter, and engine air filter (the engine air filters are replaced every other year). My wife and I don't drive very much.

This is the 6th generation Prius (still ugly, but it does have more HP):