Will there ever be a new large iMac (Pro)?

[qap]

I bought a top iMac 2019 i9 Vega48, SSD, 64Gb RAM, ecc... on January and I remember a lot of people was saying “don’t buy it, upgrade is coming, etc...” and..... here we are, so, if you need it, buy it.

I wrote this on: Feb 19, 2020

For the iMac it's hard to see a redesign in this year, maybe late 2020 but there are no new CPU from intel, and the nw Intel Comet Lake are aspected to be released on April/may, so the new iMac will arrive later this year or in 2021.

As I said 5 months ago: “I don’t think Apple will release any new iMac before late 2020 or early 2021”.
And if it will be true that the new iMac will be ARM, I’m more happy with my purchase because I will wait at least 8/12 months to upgrade (in order to have some bugs fix in macOS and hardware well tested)

 

[anthony13]

I bought a top iMac 2019 i9 Vega48, SSD, 64Gb RAM, ecc... on January and I remember a lot of people was saying “don’t buy it, upgrade is coming, etc...” and..... here we are, so, if you need it, buy it.

I wrote this on: Feb 19, 2020


As I said 5 months ago: “I don’t think Apple will release any new iMac before late 2020 or early 2021”.
And if it will be true that the new iMac will be ARM, I’m more happy with my purchase because I will wait at least 8/12 months to upgrade (in order to have some bugs fix in macOS and hardware well tested)

Right on. I never understand the ‘there’s an upgrade coming’ argument. What does that matter? There’s always an update coming. These machines are finite items. I buy today, I’m buying again in a few years. It’s not like I’m stuck with some insane performance disadvantage because i buy one version earlier?

And these arguments constantly miss the point; what if a person needs a new machine today? Thats far more valuable than a promise of a new machine in ‘3rd quarter’. For people that make a living using these machines, its about compatibility, reliability, and efficiency.

There is no one right answer. The influx of people claiming “WHY WOULD ANYONE BUY AN INTEL MAC NOW” really don’t seem to understand the realities of certain industries. For some, it’s very smart to wait for an ARM iMac. For others, it’s really valuable to buy this rumored last intel iMac. Both are correct. Computers aren’t about bragging rights. Computers fulfill a purpose. What’s yours?

 

[qap]

Yes I agree with you.

There is no one right answer. The influx of people claiming “WHY WOULD ANYONE BUY AN INTEL MAC NOW” really don’t seem to understand the realities of certain industries. For some, it’s very smart to wait for an ARM iMac. For others, it’s really valuable to buy this rumored last intel iMac. Both are correct. Computers aren’t about bragging rights. Computers fulfill a purpose. What’s yours?

I think if you’re a power user and you can’t decide to wait for ARM or buy now, the best thing would be to buy the Apple developer kit with ARM Mac Mini and see how it works, check the progress of macOS during the summer, how the developers are re-compiling the apps, how Rosetta2 works, etc... then make your choice, but I think this will be a bit complicated to access to the developer Mac Mini.

So, if you need it: buy it (now), if you buy it “for pleasure”, wait and see the updates.

 

[iPadified]

No need for that, based on power/1W. Maybe for the mac pro yes, 200W is a given, but for imacs and macbook pros..around 45W-65W is more than enough. They want a slim imac but with far better thermals so 65W +120W dGpu is more then enough for the bigger imac

You are right, but I got a little bit tired of people binning Mac chips with iPhone/iPad chips. Those 200W included the GPU by the way. I think the dGPU are history. Many says that the 8 core Apple GPU has about 1TFLOPS, so make it 80 core=60W chip (?). Perhaps that chip will be too big to produce.

 

[Ballis]

Im guessing redesign will be for ARM only now. So the Q3 Intel will be the old design and uninspired.

I guess Ill squeeze a couple of more months of use out of my 2007 iMac and make the jump straight to ARM. Id prefer 27 but I manage with 24 today so I guess that will have to do

 

[Manfredi]

I do not want to seem a bore, but I warned before that ....
___


Source link please?


Now there’s even less chance that this will happen. It makes no sense to do a global redesign for the sake of one of the latest generation of Intel, to again change the structure for Silicone. Unless they can unify it, which is also unlikely.

I did not play Tomb Raider, but didn’t you think that the graphics there were much worse than in the regular version?


Gone into a binge?

definitely WORSE!!!!
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Im guessing redesign will be for ARM only now. So the Q3 Intel will be the old design and uninspired.

I guess Ill squeeze a couple of more months of use out of my 2007 iMac and make the jump straight to ARM. Id prefer 27 but I manage with 24 today so I guess that will have to do

so do you guys still think that after yesterday's WWDC all focused on ARM... they will introduce "new" Intel on iMac...?? if yes, this means that iMac will be the last iMac with ARM...

Hoping for an iMac 24inch with ARM and a lot of RAM and hoping for Adobe totally rebuilt for ARM Mac...!!!

 

[JLOAKS]

So Tim said at the end there's some Intel-based Macs still in the pipeline that are going to be released. Why would they release Intel-based Macs at the same time ARM Macs will start to be sold (Q3/Q4 2020)?

If they release the updated iMac with Intel internals, isn't it buying a dead man walking computer with a 2 year death sentence?

 

[Successful Sorcerer]

definitely WORSE!!!!
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so do you guys still think that after yesterday's WWDC all focused on ARM... they will introduce "new" Intel on iMac...?? if yes, this means that iMac will be the last iMac with ARM...

Hoping for an iMac 24inch with ARM and a lot of RAM and hoping for Adobe totally rebuilt for ARM Mac...!!!

They said they want to move to ARM completely in two years. Since they probably start with the lower end machines with less power they might release higher end iMacs with intel. Maybe they'll update the iMac pro a last time but I don't think there'll be a new ±24" iMac with intel.

Adobe has been working hard on their iPad apps and want to release a Photoshop with all desktop functions soon. So they have enough knowledge by now and probably put in extra effort with this switch to ARM in mind.
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So Tim said at the end there's some Intel-based Macs still in the pipeline that are going to be released. Why would they release Intel-based Macs at the same time ARM Macs will start to be sold (Q3/Q4 2020)?

If they release the updated iMac with Intel internals, isn't it buying a dead man walking computer with a 2 year death sentence?

I think they need the extra time to develop a higher end version of their CPU for macs with more power. This way they also give pros more time to change their workflow and update their apps.

 

[lowfreq]

So no new iMacs...that stinks..my late 2014 iMac is getting wonkier and wonkier...its always had problems with freezing and random restarts but it's getting worse. was hoping to replace it this summer. darn...

is fall a reasonable time to expect an update now?

 

[krell100]

is fall a reasonable time to expect an update now?

Refreshed Intel iMacs will probably be available soon (Jul-Sept) If we extrapolate from the keynote comments Timmy made. An ARM iMac (24"?) may arrive by the end of the year, but thats a guess. I'd hold out for an ARM Mac but if you're desperate then its a case of grabbing whatever is available when you need it?

 

[Cassandle]

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That's packing *SOME* tech' into 'Apple Silicon.'

This augurs well for Mac ARM.

I was blown away by the Metal 2 Tomb Raider demo on the A12z.

And the Mac Mini. What's this? A Mac Mini Dev' machine with 16 gigs of ram, 512 gigs SSD for £500 WITH 'THAT' Tomb Raider Demo level of iGPU?!!! :OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

Can Intel iG on the Mac Mini do that? (Stares into space...*)

And 3 '4k' files running...on a Mac 'ARM' Mini? Can an Intel Mac Mini do that? :O

Azrael.

Do we know that the demo was actually running on the Mac Mini dev kit? And not some other, more powerful machine? I wouldn't be getting my hopes up of playing games like Tomb Raider on a Mac Mini just yet.

 

[askunk]

Yes, Federighi explicitly said that. We've seen an A12z driving an XDR screen (@1080p) and producing about 30fps (it didn't feel faster than that) with Rosetta 2. I'd say a good result but I am still going to go for an intel mac, for the moment.

I will switch to AS with the 2nd or 3rd gen of macs. I wanna see all my apps moving to ARM first. My past two transitions have been a pain in the ASs... no intention to repeat that.
I'm pretty sure intel macs will be supported by Apple until 2027/28 (when the 2020 models will become obsolete) and that there will be a good used market for them at least for the next 4-5 years.

 

[gusping]

I am interested in how BTO upgrades will work on ARM Macs. Will they essentially be the same or similar SoC, just clocked higher? I can't imagine they'd have more than 3 or 4 versions for the future ARM iMac lineup.

 

[iPadified]

I took another look at the only interesting part (except scribble) and I am still amazed that A12Z+16 Gb RAM at all can do what they showed. My MPB -2014 (of MP 2013) would not be able to handle that scene i Maya and fans would go absolutely crazy and then they add some shaders... The Tomb raider game run on emulation is nearly as impressive. Finally Excel might run adequately on a Mac.

 

[ssong]

The big question is, for me at least, if Apple has a reason to ditch amd for dGpu....no matter how powerful A chips and their iGpu are...still cant match those 120W and up dGpu...and based on rumours apple is not making any stand alone gpu's. And since Amd let apple full access to their Gpu segment, i dont see any reasons to remove that from upcoming big imacs and from the 16" Mbp... I bet the A chips will be significant better vs Intel cpu+igpu for the smaller Macbook airs and for the smaller macbook pro, but for the larger macs, they still, and we still need those dGpu

Apple began working on proprietary GPU tech about 2 years ago when they dropped imagination tech (you know the guys who’s stock tanked shortly after that announcement) and in the devs state of the union address there was a decent amount of emphasis on the GPU powers of the A chip so I wouldn’t be surprised if they went truly independent
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No need for that, based on power/1W. Maybe for the mac pro yes, 200W is a given, but for imacs and macbook pros..around 45W-65W is more than enough. They want a slim imac but with far better thermals so 65W +120W dGpu is more then enough for the bigger imac

The chip design team said they’d be releasing a dedicated family of Mac SoCs and they put emphasis on the scalability of their chips

 

[Cassandle]

The Apple Silicone demo has got me really excited for the ARM macs. I may eek out my MBP 2011 a little longer and wait for the ARM iMac. Just need to decide whether an iPP is also needed in the meantime!

 

[ondert]

Intel should be in panic mode right now but what about AMD? Apple was always like a top priority customer for AMD.

 

[Jamacfer]

I wond

I would expect the first AS Mac to be a MBA or Mac Mini. Doubt It'll be an iMac.

I do think the first one will be the iMac ARM 24”.

 

[Dosing]

I do think the first one will be the iMac ARM 24”.

Likewise. I think we're going to see a 24" iMac in Q4 and potentially a 30" companion to it in Q3 2021 (or thereabouts) once they've had a little more time to put some laptops out.

If I can fix my 2011 MBP, I may hold off until a larger screen ARM iMac comes out about (although 1st gen makes me nervous). Logic being native from Day 1 is a huge draw for me - here's just hoping manufacturers get on board ASAP.

 

[satchmo]

Why are we assuming the ARM Mac shipping by the end of the year is even an iMac? It could very well be the MBP 13/14”.


The last Intel iMac could be updated next month and sadly it might even be early 2021 before we get the redesigned ARM iMac.

 

[iPadified]

Intel should be in panic mode right now but what about AMD? Apple was always like a top priority customer for AMD.

If they do it right, the whole PC industry should be in panic mode. Apple has build lots of hardware accelerators for efficacy instead of relying on more general purpose CPU/GPU. The modularity of this SoC is enormous. Some other gossip from the 3D world suggest that Apple might create large memory pools also using ultrafast SSD to complement RAM on the SoC.

Mac ARM transition?

Discussion topic from the Foundry Community under Modo Forums - Modo - Mac Specific

community.foundry.com

Hope we soon get a teardown of the developers unit but the developers are probably under NDA.

 

[ssong]

I am interested in how BTO upgrades will work on ARM Macs. Will they essentially be the same or similar SoC, just clocked higher? I can't imagine they'd have more than 3 or 4 versions for the future ARM iMac lineup.

I’m kinda picturing a simpler BTO process of

Mac Mini - Mac 24 - Mac 32 - Mac Pro

Mac Mini and Mac 24 to share a SoC variety (low to mid) and Mac 32 and Mac Pro to share an SoC variety (mid to high)

so 3 AS SoCs total across the lineups

with RAM and storage options but I’m curious to see how meaningful RAM is going to be at this stage... they may even just make RAM a standard amount and only give storage options


In a way this transition to AS kinda throws a lot of preconceptions about computers out the window given they were all set on a world of x86 based Intel processors.

We’ve seen how the relative performance of A series chips go against the Android counterparts in iPhones and there hasn’t ever really been too much of a need for more RAM on iOS devices. I’m cautiously hopeful that Apple may be able to bring that kind of efficiency into AS Macs as well which would really eliminate the need for too much RAM being needed (for most users).

If the Mac Pro is intended to move over to AS as well then the MPX modules may paint a way forward for how Apple plans to cater for higher end professional use cases. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the new AS Macs come with MPX.

So it would essentially split the desktop lineup to...

Everyday user with display - Mac Mini
Everyday user with no display - Mac 24
Everyday user with larger display needs / enthusiast user - Mac 32
Professional users - Mac Pro

I could also picture some of the MPX modules being offered as a BTO on the Mac 32. Like an option to add an Apple Afterburner card to the Mac 32. Depends on the maximum performance of the Mac 32 though.

Can’t wait for October now I’m definitely expecting a Mac event in mid October, probably about a week before the formal release of macOS Big Sur with the focus on AS Macs and the first AS Macs being available for pre-order that week and shipping with Big Sur the week after.
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If they do it right, the whole PC industry should be in panic mode. Apple has build lots of hardware accelerators for efficacy instead of relying on more general purpose CPU/GPU. The modularity of this SoC is enormous. Some other gossip from the 3D world suggest that Apple might create large memory pools also using ultrafast SSD to complement RAM on the SoC.

Mac ARM transition?

Discussion topic from the Foundry Community under Modo Forums - Modo - Mac Specific

community.foundry.com

Hope we soon get a teardown of the developers unit but the developers are probably under NDA.

Tear downs are explicitly prohibited AFAIK but I’d love for one of the peeps with a machine to try run Crysis on a VM

 

[pldelisle]

Forget AMD GPUs. They signed the end of AMD too by announcing switch to ARM. Metal works even better on Apple’s SoC. The software advantage will probably compensate for the hardware.

And forget too a 200w chip. ARM is more efficient than this, even if you put a GPU on the chip.

 

[gusping]

I’m kinda picturing a simpler BTO process of

Mac Mini - Mac 24 - Mac 32 - Mac Pro

Mac Mini and Mac 24 to share a SoC variety (low to mid) and Mac 32 and Mac Pro to share an SoC variety (mid to high)

so 3 AS SoCs total across the lineups

with RAM and storage options but I’m curious to see how meaningful RAM is going to be at this stage... they may even just make RAM a standard amount and only give storage options


In a way this transition to AS kinda throws a lot of preconceptions about computers out the window given they were all set on a world of x86 based Intel processors.

We’ve seen how the relative performance of A series chips go against the Android counterparts in iPhones and there hasn’t ever really been too much of a need for more RAM on iOS devices. I’m cautiously hopeful that Apple may be able to bring that kind of efficiency into AS Macs as well which would really eliminate the need for too much RAM being needed (for most users).

If the Mac Pro is intended to move over to AS as well then the MPX modules may paint a way forward for how Apple plans to cater for higher end professional use cases. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the new AS Macs come with MPX.

So it would essentially split the desktop lineup to...

Everyday user with display - Mac Mini
Everyday user with no display - Mac 24
Everyday user with larger display needs / enthusiast user - Mac 32
Professional users - Mac Pro

I could also picture some of the MPX modules being offered as a BTO on the Mac 32. Like an option to add an Apple Afterburner card to the Mac 32. Depends on the maximum performance of the Mac 32 though.

Can’t wait for October now I’m definitely expecting a Mac event in mid October, probably about a week before the formal release of macOS Big Sur with the focus on AS Macs and the first AS Macs being available for pre-order that week and shipping with Big Sur the week after.
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Tear downs are explicitly prohibited AFAIK but I’d love for one of the peeps with a machine to try run Crysis on a VM

Seems sensible, thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Looks like I will be keeping my Mac mini for at least another 2 years or so, until mid-high level ARM Macs are have been truly tried and tested.

I too am excited for Q4. New iPhone and Watch (which I will almost certainly get), plus new ARM and Intel Macs. Lovely! Bring it on.
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Forget AMD GPUs. They signed the end of AMD too by announcing switch to ARM. Metal works even better on Apple’s SoC. The software advantage will probably compensate for the hardware.

And forget too a 200w chip. ARM is more efficient than this, even if you put a GPU on the chip.

I've told you before, they will ramp the power right up and hit 6Ghz clock speeds. Come on Pldelisle, I expect more from an educated man such as yourself.

 

[Kjs100]

New: Kuo: 24-Inch iMac With New Design to Launch in Fourth Quarter of 2020

Reads to me as:
- refreshed Intel-based iMac in the third quarter of 2020
- redesigned 24-inch ARM iMac in the fourth quarter of 2020

The new Kuo article doesnt actually state that the 24" iMac is ARM, however this looks very much like the 24" Arm iMac that Kuo said, on Sunday, would follow "the refresh of existing Intel ‌iMac‌ in 3Q20". This could possibly mean a 24" Arm iMac by October/ November.

If Kuo is correct, I'll be surprised if Apple refresh the 21.5 intel iMac in Q3 only to then release a 24" ARM iMac in Q4, which would surely eat up most of the 21.5" intel's iMac's sales?

Im wondering if Apple will just release a refreshed/redesigned? 27" intel iMac in Q3. When Tim Cook said Apple had intel iMacs in the pipeline, he may have been referring to the 27" iMac and the iMac Pro (a mini-LED iMac Pro was rumoured by Kuo around March/April to be released by the end of the year).