Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Will there ever be a new large iMac (Pro)?
- Thread starter krazzix
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
[automerge]1595002716[/automerge]
I'm still pricing up my PC Tower build. Ooming and arhing...over whether I want to make it dual Boot Hack/Windows. Or just leave it 'pure darkside' PC Tower.
I would have thought we must be getting close to leaks re: a pending iMac...
Azrael.
[/QUOTE]
I thought that too but in all honesty think of the crappy Macbook Pros, there were all kinds of rumors at first (not even good ones) but nobody had a date and then poof refresh out of no where.
I'm still pricing up my PC Tower build. Ooming and arhing...over whether I want to make it dual Boot Hack/Windows. Or just leave it 'pure darkside' PC Tower.
I would have thought we must be getting close to leaks re: a pending iMac...
Azrael.
[/QUOTE]
I thought that too but in all honesty think of the crappy Macbook Pros, there were all kinds of rumors at first (not even good ones) but nobody had a date and then poof refresh out of no where.
I thought that too but in all honesty think of the crappy Macbook Pros, there were all kinds of rumors at first (not even good ones) but nobody had a date and then poof refresh out of no where.
[/QUOTE]
True.
But the iMac seems tied to 'lower power' components. Eg.? Lower clock 10 core intel. (See Intel event for Sept' 2nd.) And? RDNA2 event. In the latter case...there have been gpu leaks for the RDNA1+ respin (thermally better for an iMac enclosure...) and the RDNA2 6600M (also 'MAC') leaked. So these are probably worth waiting for as they increase the life span of an iMac under load.
That pegs both components around Sep. Intel and AMD to make their announcements 1st. Then Apple, we can only assume...will make their iMac announcement after.
September onwards. If tied to these more efficient components.
But I have to say. I'm feeling really impatient. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
I'm playing with the CyberPowerSystems PC Builder and Summer deals to see what permutations I can configure for PC vs Dual Hack/PC build. The latter is around £2k. The former is closer to £1250. Without monitor.
Azrael.
Recommended viewing for anybody curious about Apple Silicon and GPU.
He makes good videos in layman understanding. Kudos to him.
Showing...once again. It's all about a software needs for the user experience. Customising and tuning. With the same 'efficiency' hardware approach that made the iPhone and iPad compelling performers which beat down and beat out the competition.
Azrael.
This is worse than the wait for the (mostly disappointing) MacBook Pro 2016 redesign. But I'm loving this thread. All these video's y'all have posted the last few days have been informative for some one like that me that has an idea of the spec's I need for my profession, but doesn't necessarily know the why and how of the hardware strategies. Fun stuff.
-🦁-
-🦁-
Hopefully the resultant iMac won't be as bad as the 'keyboard' edition Macbook Pro with magnificent 'Tough Meh Strip.'
I get a good vibe about the pending iMac.
Some great videos in this thread showing the potential of future AS and iMacs.
It's good to learn new stuff.
Azrael.
Yes. 15 minutes to learn what I learned reading this-- a 235 page thread!
Steve was right and this still holds true for a lot of things. I've been saying this (even here) that most people are idiots. It doesn't take much to see it, you just need to turn on the news and there you have it.
There was this saying (forgot where it is from) to imagine how average person is quite dump and then to know that there is 50% people that are even dumber. (was it Carlin? not sure and also don't remember precisely the quote as I'm dumb too )
Anyway, Steve was right on that MS is McDonalds and so are other companies etc. And the really sad part is the fact that those 'pedestrian' people with no spirit have the most voting power in everything. Again, we don't have to go far because you guys have Trump, UK has Boris and so on and on.
When you give the crowd of sheep the voting power on everything then its up to the company (in this case Apple) to make it better even though the crowd is full of spiritless zombies. Voting with the wallet is the right thing to do and I just wish the intellect or common sense would win over bling & social status.
As Azrael and some others pointed out even Apple is guilty here as there are (and were) products that Apple is/was selling that they should have ZERO sales just to show Apple that its totally unacceptable to charge so this for outdated/old/wrong etc. tech.
So what Steve said is true and it does apply to Apple too sometimes.
Fusion drives, bending iPads, keyboards, 6 years waiting for update on the trash can just to get shown the finger by Apple as that base config is a joke etc.
But hey, what do I know? Im just dumb
There was this saying (forgot where it is from) to imagine how average person is quite dump and then to know that there is 50% people that are even dumber. (was it Carlin? not sure and also don't remember precisely the quote as I'm dumb too
) Anyway, Steve was right on that MS is McDonalds and so are other companies etc. And the really sad part is the fact that those 'pedestrian' people with no spirit have the most voting power in everything. Again, we don't have to go far because you guys have Trump, UK has Boris and so on and on.
When you give the crowd of sheep the voting power on everything then its up to the company (in this case Apple) to make it better even though the crowd is full of spiritless zombies. Voting with the wallet is the right thing to do and I just wish the intellect or common sense would win over bling & social status.
As Azrael and some others pointed out even Apple is guilty here as there are (and were) products that Apple is/was selling that they should have ZERO sales just to show Apple that its totally unacceptable to charge so this for outdated/old/wrong etc. tech.
So what Steve said is true and it does apply to Apple too sometimes.
Fusion drives, bending iPads, keyboards, 6 years waiting for update on the trash can just to get shown the finger by Apple as that base config is a joke etc.
But hey, what do I know? Im just dumb
I think better days are coming at Apple.
There won’t be Fusion drive in AS imac.
As for bending things, when handled carefully, there is no problem at all.
Keyboards problems are in the past now.
Just like overheating problems and thermal throttling too.
Mac Pro is a niche market. You don’t have to worry about this.
AS will revolutionize how Apple can control the hardware it sells. Seriously, there is absolutely no point to buy any Intel Mac right now knowing the bright future that Apple is going to have with a majority of its products in less than a year.
There won’t be Fusion drive in AS imac.
As for bending things, when handled carefully, there is no problem at all.
Keyboards problems are in the past now.
Just like overheating problems and thermal throttling too.
Mac Pro is a niche market. You don’t have to worry about this.
AS will revolutionize how Apple can control the hardware it sells. Seriously, there is absolutely no point to buy any Intel Mac right now knowing the bright future that Apple is going to have with a majority of its products in less than a year.
Last edited:
I expect (and I think Kuo said it) that within Q3 2021 MacBook Pro 14, 16 and MacBook Air 13 will be all on Apple Silicon.
And I expect the next iMac 24 to be at least on par with current Intel 10 core offering regarding performance.
Ok so Q3 2021 for all the laptops .. thats good .. so that would mean the mac pro would be into 2022.
Also im sure the 24" imac will be blazing fast .. with apple apps .. as far as anything else .. not so sure.
Yeah Mac Pro will be the last in line for the transition. They need tu mature up the AS.
The rest will need optimization for sure and recompile in ARM, but it won’t be that long. Real good applications will do it very fast to keep competition high.
Just caved in and bought a base iMac Pro for $3250 on eBay. I'm very excited for the new AS Macs, was fully planning on purchasing after WWDC but with the 27" version still a ways out, my 2012 retina mbp is not cutting it and unfortunately couldn't wait any longer.
Last edited:
@Azrael9 "Adobe can keep their 2nd rate rent ware in my books. I'm on the superior tech' of Affinity and I aint looking back."
The problem for creative professionals is that the Adobe suite is the industry accepted standard. For all is flaws it is still what is used in that market almost without exception. Yes the absurdly high price of a sub is crazy (but for pro's making a living out of it probably not) and it is certainly irritatingly bloated, but there is no alternative. The Affinity apps are fine for home use scenarios and have potential but they are not used professionally. I have tried Affinity apps and they are equally frustrating/irritating but yes, cheaper.
I wish the pro graphics world would move away from Adobe but just can't see that dominance change anytime soon. Maybe Apple should buyout Affinity and do a Final Cut job on Adobe?
Anyway, back to the iMac vapourware discussion...
The problem for creative professionals is that the Adobe suite is the industry accepted standard. For all is flaws it is still what is used in that market almost without exception. Yes the absurdly high price of a sub is crazy (but for pro's making a living out of it probably not) and it is certainly irritatingly bloated, but there is no alternative. The Affinity apps are fine for home use scenarios and have potential but they are not used professionally. I have tried Affinity apps and they are equally frustrating/irritating but yes, cheaper.
I wish the pro graphics world would move away from Adobe but just can't see that dominance change anytime soon. Maybe Apple should buyout Affinity and do a Final Cut job on Adobe?
Anyway, back to the iMac vapourware discussion...
One of the issues I have is figuring out which computer is the best to purchase. I'm getting constant feedback from Adobe users as what is the "best" mac to use in order to run Adobe Premiere. I'm teaching a class in the fall where I will teach kids Adobe. I wish someone could actually out right say yea this or that will work with Premiere. Kind of annoying since this is the program I'm not an avid user. I've used Final Cut etc. and have no worries about learning and teaching it. Just nervous to spend my hard earned cash on something that will be choppy. I would have bought the Macbook Pro 13" high spec version but everybody is saying to stay away because it doesn't have a dedicated graphics card.@Azrael9 "Adobe can keep their 2nd rate rent ware in my books. I'm on the superior tech' of Affinity and I aint looking back."
The problem for creative professionals is that the Adobe suite is the industry accepted standard. For all is flaws it is still what is used in that market almost without exception. Yes the absurdly high price of a sub is crazy (but for pro's making a living out of it probably not) and it is certainly irritatingly bloated, but there is no alternative. The Affinity apps are fine for home use scenarios and have potential but they are not used professionally. I have tried Affinity apps and they are equally frustrating/irritating but yes, cheaper.
View attachment 934882
I wish the pro graphics world would move away from Adobe but just can't see that dominance change anytime soon. Maybe Apple should buyout Affinity and do a Final Cut job on Adobe?
Anyway, back to the iMac vapourware discussion...
It's tricky with Adobe, a high end graphics card and a fast scratch disk are mandatory but in my experience a large amount of RAM helps. But they don't really run that well on any Mac, its almost like a poorly optimised port. Unfortunately you just have to throw a lot of money at a Mac to get good Adobe performance, that's all there is to it.
To sum up: reduce traffic between system components over slow busses will provide better performance. That is not new, but the proposed solution in AS is very new (well sort of). AS capabilities just illustrates that the 40-50 years old modular PC concept is just not cutting edge anymore.
Hello Rbfinch,
The one thing you can almost 'guarantee' with Adobe? Is that it won't be 'optimised' for Mac.
Final Cut is suppose to be way easier to learn. It's £300. Wayyyy cheaper than it used to be at launch. It's a bargain. And seems to offer greater efficiencies Apple put into the hardware. (I expect this will increase with AS software. See the noteworthy A12z rendering 3x 4k streams on an 'AS' Mac. Software? Meets tuned hardware, folks.)
One of the reasons why Steve Jobs' Apple bought Final Cut was they were fed up of Adobe's 2nd rate attitude to Mac software. And that was way back then.
I'd suspect Premiere would probably work better on a PC with Nvidia Cuda tech'. (Somebody else could probably chime in here...)
I'd avoid a Macbook 13 inch with its iGPU. It's highly mediocre. I'd say you'd be needing a 5k iMac. More room for video preview AND controls to see what you're doing. 580, isn't enough for super smooth video play back from some YouTube videos I've seen. At least a Vega 48.
I suspect the next gen Intel iMac with the T2 chip will have video encoding acceleration. ...and that, coupled with the 'beefed' up 'last year's' gpu (5700 variant...) will give you butter smooth video play back.
iGPU doesn't have to be rubbish. But on the Macs...I have no idea what Apple are doing with the crap iGPU in 21 inch iMacs...13 inch Macbooks and Mac Minis. Save money, probably.
AS hardware can't come soon enough.
Azrael.
Last edited:
Succinct but sweetly said.
Azrael.
[automerge]1595082949[/automerge]
High gpu. Ram. And yes, a large scratch disk... Makes sense.
And a large screen for Adobe's interface clutter.
Aye. You have to throw money at a Mac to get good performance. Full stop.
Azrael.
@Azrael9 "Adobe can keep their 2nd rate rent ware in my books. I'm on the superior tech' of Affinity and I aint looking back."
The problem for creative professionals is that the Adobe suite is the industry accepted standard. For all is flaws it is still what is used in that market almost without exception. Yes the absurdly high price of a sub is crazy (but for pro's making a living out of it probably not) and it is certainly irritatingly bloated, but there is no alternative. The Affinity apps are fine for home use scenarios and have potential but they are not used professionally. I have tried Affinity apps and they are equally frustrating/irritating but yes, cheaper.
View attachment 934882
I wish the pro graphics world would move away from Adobe but just can't see that dominance change anytime soon. Maybe Apple should buyout Affinity and do a Final Cut job on Adobe?
Anyway, back to the iMac vapourware discussion...
I am being 'somewhat' harsh on Adobe. But their history on Mac and their rentware is somewhat abrasive and, funnily enough, I feel somewhat abrasive in return.
There was a time when a PowerMac and a copy of PS4 would only be pried from my cold, dead hands. (A dream set up...once upon a time...with system 7.5...)
Our view of 'truth' depends greatly upon our 'point of view.' Points of awareness having perceptual experiences. I'm less inclined to the 'group think' of any given aware. I guess I live with a lot of questions.
If you work for a creative company and they say you're using Photoshop. I guess you're going to use Photoshop if your boss/company tells you so.
Likewise. If the college maintains the 'postage stamp' concensus that the 'creative course' is using 'Photoshop'...then I guess the students are using Photoshop. (And the other Adobe apps? And all the £££ that goes with this...)
For independent business? Smaller shops? Single artists?
But there are alternatives now. And this has been the case for sometime, now. So in that sense, Photoshop is not the only 'standard' of 'good' software.
Many creative professionals, certainly individuals who can think for themselves and seek to wrench themselves from the high prices 'monopoly' 'standards' charge...have many alternatives. Most of these alternatives can 'write' to the PS file format. And compatibility is high. It's just an image format and some layers, folks.
And if you want to 'break free...' (and you're getting older...)
Then new software is always a 'pain' to use as we like the comfort of established workflows. Human beings are inherently lazy in many ways. Especially when you have to go through the 'adjustment' period of learning software. But fundamentally, most 'Photoshop' apps work the same way. It's not rocket science to learn something new.
Affinity's Apps. Used by an increasing number of professionals.
How many? How about 2 million of them? Technologically innovative. Fast. Powerful. Take advantage of the gpu. No subs. No rent. Great videos which can teach you just about anything you want to do image wise.Clip Studio. A terrific drawing and inking app with sound painting capabilities. A comic book 'standard' that outstrips PS in many, many ways.
Painter 2020+. Natural media painting.
Procreate. The mobile graphics painting 'standard' which is the 'hot sex' of painting on a tablet.
I've seen plenty of work done on all these apps by professionals who have relegated Photoshop or cast it aside completely. They're the professionals who are creating their own paradigms.
I could go on...(please, Azrael...stop...we get it...mercy...no more...)
We have to be part of the solution if we want to break monopoly 'standards' and abuses. Our choices effect our reality. We accept or make change. That's part of the appeal of the Mac platform. Think Different?
The days of Photoshop being the only kid in town are over. Especially in the era of iPads, mobile power and more potent SoC tech'. The old Adobe and M$ hedgemoney have been cast aside by a myriad of solutions that got on the App' store 1st. And if they want to compete on AS Macs? They'll have to compete. As there are numerous other image apps and 'office' choices.
I'll be using eg. Affinity on my own professional project as a professional. I won't be held hostage to fortune on rentware. 2D or 3D or anything else wise.
The new kid is in town. Cheaper. Quicker. More seductive. More powerful..?
Learn....to use the power...of the dark side.
Azrael.
Last edited:
If it was well engineered, it would work on either CUDA or Metal.
I would expect so.
...and for a far cheaper price.
Azrael.
[automerge]1595085177[/automerge]
The consumer Macs will probably be done in 7 months from the 1st available consumer AS Mac. £££ = Mac laptops. That and the 24 inch iMac will cover most of the Mac sales and profits.
I'd say the 'big' iMac gets done inside the year (by next fall 2021.)
The Mac Pro may (or not) squeak inside the year. Or early 2022. It's inconsequential in sales. In fact, the iMac 24 will beat the intestines out of the entry Mac Pro model.
What's it up against? An 8 core Xeon (meh...) and a low end R580 gpu? And last gen PCIE vs the new unified throughput of the AS?
To all intents and purposes the transition will be over by next June 2021. With only the iMac large screen being of any significance after. And that will likely drop with an AS15 (sometime after the iPhone 13's A15 drops in Sep'...)
Azrael.
Last edited:
Steve was right and this still holds true for a lot of things. I've been saying this (even here) that most people are idiots. It doesn't take much to see it, you just need to turn on the news and there you have it.
There was this saying (forgot where it is from) to imagine how average person is quite dump and then to know that there is 50% people that are even dumber. (was it Carlin? not sure and also don't remember precisely the quote as I'm dumb too
Anyway, Steve was right on that MS is McDonalds and so are other companies etc. And the really sad part is the fact that those 'pedestrian' people with no spirit have the most voting power in everything. Again, we don't have to go far because you guys have Trump, UK has Boris and so on and on.
When you give the crowd of sheep the voting power on everything then its up to the company (in this case Apple) to make it better even though the crowd is full of spiritless zombies. Voting with the wallet is the right thing to do and I just wish the intellect or common sense would win over bling & social status.
As Azrael and some others pointed out even Apple is guilty here as there are (and were) products that Apple is/was selling that they should have ZERO sales just to show Apple that its totally unacceptable to charge so this for outdated/old/wrong etc. tech.
So what Steve said is true and it does apply to Apple too sometimes.
Fusion drives, bending iPads, keyboards, 6 years waiting for update on the trash can just to get shown the finger by Apple as that base config is a joke etc.
But hey, what do I know? Im just dumb
The Mac Prophet and Founder, High Priest Steve Jobs...holds Apple to account. Even now.
He gave us the iMac at £1000 (a bit more than that...). The iPhone at £400 (was it?) The iPad at £399.
Could you imagine that happening with flag ship products under Cook? *
The custodian, and Sith Lord of the Supply Chain, Tim Cooks...has certainly added 'alot' of money to the bank balance Steve Jobs built. Whether that was through products or interation, incrementalism and jacking up prices...
I like the Mac OS. It's still the heart beat of the Apple Steve Built. (ASB.) It's ironic that AS stands for Apple Silicon. It could stand for Steve's Apple or Apple Steve.
My point. If Mac OS were freely released on 'PC generic' hardware...I wouldn't buy Apple's over priced and underspecced kit of prescribed choices designed to upsell their profit margins.
As someone that has 'given' £13 thousand plus to Apple's mountain of cash...I feel sufficiently qualified to be critical of their mediocre Mac desktop fodder which Master Cook has precided over. (After all, 'The iPad is the only computer you'll ever need.' With it's tiny 12.9 screen. 'No.')
AS Macs are a chance of redemption for the last ten years.
Azrael.
From 'The Conspirators.' (Where a Mr. Devlin notes, 'Politics makes liars of us all.')
Some say the Politcians are just 'sales people.' Who for we may ponder.
Last edited: