Yosemite looks terrible!

[joedec]

The iTunes mini player on OS X? These days, people usually complain about Apple's 'dumbing down' of apps. At the very least, the mini player has never been more functional and yet can be configured to look very minimalistic:

The basic problem at Apple is they can't seem to distinguish between large and small. Does the Mini-player need to do everything the full application does? Have you seen pricing info displayed in Mini-player yet, that's really garish.

One the other hand, make no mistake, they are undoubtably dumbing down larger apps everywhere on Macintosh. Most notably Aperture, iWork, Final Cut Pro, Airport Utility ...

 

[thewap]

The falt v skeumorph always seemed like a false dichotomy too me.

Ive is not the customer and to so ill consider the customer by placing your design ego bias ahead it is very serious thing indeed. Ive was a designer who aided the person who thought about the customer but that persons input is sadly gone.

Clearly Cook doesn't think about the customer. He thinks about the bottom line and the share price.

So is anyone at Apple thinking about the customer anymore and the end user end experience and not putting their specialist area of expert specialisation i.e. cart before the horse.

In other words they'll need to get their heads out of their own arses soon enough. I hope it's not too late.

One could also imagine that since Apple's re-birth under Cook and Ive, that emphasis was placed on eradicating any design influence created by Forstall, or customer priority policies under Jobs. Therefore the *rush*.

 

[joedec]

One could also imagine that since Apple's re-birth under Cook and Ive, that emphasis was placed on eradicating any design influence created by Forstall, or customer priority policies under Jobs. Therefore the *rush*.

That's a terrifying thought. Jobs for all is faults, was very customer focused. Apple did pay a fair amount of attention to customer feedback and reacted accordingly.

As its been said many times, Steve Jobs could be superfluous and anal retentive but, that's why the quality was so good. I hate the thought that without him cracking the whip over there people can't seem to deliver a quality product. We all thought it can't be one person, its in the DNA of the workforce. Time will tell.

 

[Omega Mac]

The basic problem at Apple is they can't seem to distinguish between large and small. Does the Mini-player need to do everything the full application does? Have you seen pricing info displayed in Mini-player yet, that's really garish.

One the other hand, make no mistake, they are undoubtably dumbing down larger apps everywhere on Macintosh. Most notably Aperture, iWork, Final Cut Pro, Airport Utility ...

Somewhere in Apple people sit around a table starting in one direction:

"Hey wouldn't it be just the best if we ask some of the "Sales & Marketing" boys and girls to review our cool new flat UI!"

 

[joedec]

Somewhere in Apple people sit around a table starting in one direction:

"Hey wouldn't it be just the best if we ask some of the "Sales & Marketing" boys and girls to review our cool new flat UI!"

You know they are using Apple Retail employees for reviewing Beta, exclusively in some cases.

This is ridiculous, first off they are not necessarily technically qualified, second how critical are they really going to be? An entry level employee might not be willing to take much risk evaluating the product, no matter how bad it is.

 

[Omega Mac]

That's a terrifying thought. Jobs for all is faults, was very customer focused. Apple did pay a fair amount of attention to customer feedback and reacted accordingly.

As its been said many times, Steve Jobs could be superfluous and anal retentive but, that's why the quality was so good. I hate the thought that without him cracking the whip over there people can't seem to deliver a quality product. We all thought it can't be one person, its in the DNA of the workforce. Time will tell.

I've looked at this intently for some months now and mostly since i started reviewing this thread it has helped me a lot.

This is exactly what's missing.

I didn't know too much about Steve Jobs or his story (and I still don't know too much) or the qualities he brought to the Apple in truth but I did respond to the end piece and that was a 2008 iMac with Leopard and then very quickly Snow Leopard. I saw parallels in how he viewed the world in my own way of thinking. In fact identical in many instances. I'm not blowing my own trumpet but I was able to identify with that world view and I know form my own experience people simply by and large do not perceive this way and that's actually ok.

It's demonstrated in this thread. I see it everyday in how the world ticks and tocks along.

So I thought what has happened, what is now gone that was once there that made things work and you've got the point too.

Not too many people have the visionary capacity for the customer or end user (even to define your end user who is yet to be is a great task and ability). He had it. No one can do it alone but you don't need a visionary workforce you need "Grade A" players as Jobs put it because you want "Grade A" product and your customers will pay "Grade A" price. If everyones a visionary overall they can not produce their piece of the puzzle for you to fulfill your vision. While he didn't hit the Grade A everytime product wise he did reach a zenith with MacOSX but not forgetting the foundational legacy.

Yes it was one person supported by many. That's why he had to come back.

One thing I discovered which I never knew was that Tim Berners Lee was woking on a Next OS when he created WWW at cern, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Berners-Lee

I'm really only now only beginning to truly appreciate the proportion of Steve Jobs influence on the world.

If people can't use your product it wasn't desinged with them in mind.

That a total visionary failure.

The most fatal of all failures you can imagine (but only if you're a visionary).

Get it?

 

[joedec]

I've looked at this intently for some months now and mostly since i started reviewing this thread it has helped me a lot.

This is exactly what's missing.

I didn't know too much about Steve Jobs or his story (and I still don't know too much) or the qualities he brought to the Apple in truth but I did respond to the end piece and that was a 2008 iMac with Leopard and then very quickly Snow Leopard. I saw parallels in how he viewed the world in my own way of thinking. In fact identical in many instances. I'm not blowing my own trumpet but I was able to identify with that world view and I know form my own experience people simply by and large do not perceive this way and that's actually ok.

It's demonstrated in this thread. I see it everyday in how the world ticks and tocks along.

So I thought what has happened, what is now gone that was once there that made things work and you've got the point too.

Not too many people have the visionary capacity for the customer or end user (even to define your end user who is yet to be is a great task and ability). He had it. No one can do it alone but you don't need a visionary workforce you need "Grade A" players as Jobs put it because you want "Grade A" product and your customers will pay "Grade A" price. If everyones a visionary overall they can not produce their piece of the puzzle for you to fulfill your vision. While he didn't hit the Grade A everytime product wise he did reach a zenith with MacOSX but not forgetting the foundational legacy.

Yes it was one person supported by many. That's why he had to come back.

One thing I discovered which I never knew was that Tim Berners Lee was woking on a Next OS when he created WWW at cern, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_Berners-Lee

I'm really only now only beginning to truly appreciate the proportion of Steve Jobs influence on the world.

If people can't use your product it wasn't desinged with them in mind.

That a total visionary failure.

The most fatal of all failures you can imagine (but only if you're a visionary).

Get it?

I get that Steve's taste resonated with people, yourself and mine. Apple was often draconian but I agreed with logic behind the decisions so I liked them, a lot.

The point about visionaries is they don't deliver what the market wants, they deliver what they need.

Henry Ford said it best "If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses."

 

[Etan1000]

You know they are using Apple Retail employees for reviewing Beta, exclusively in some cases.

This is ridiculous, first off they are not necessarily technically qualified, second how critical are they really going to be? An entry level employee might not be willing to take much risk evaluating the product, no matter how bad it is.

I'm shocked to learn that about their beta testing! Only seasoned, technically inclined, long-time Mac users with no other connection to the company should be doing beta testing!

Etan

 

[yep-sure]

I just downgraded to Mavericks, which is one of the best decisions I have made.

It runs SO much better, and is so much more reliable than Yosemite.

Anyway, on topic, I have to admit that the first thing I noticed when I downgraded (about 2 hours ago) was how dated Mavericks looked.

That lasted about 15 minutes, now I love it again. Not only is it so much easier on the eyes (no more eye strain woohoo!), the fonts, the menus, the icons, it all just looks so much more professional, and is so much more enjoyable to use. I do think Safari is dated on Mavericks, after using it on Yosemite, but I'll trade the better performance for the new look Safari any day.

My Mac actually feels and runs like a Mac again!

 

[Natzoo]

Guys don't be mad at apple, they can't innovate anything. sorry to be mean but I've been with apple since 2004 and i just want to see a refresh. But yosemite is great by how i can use my phone on my laptop, but its just not innovative.

 

[Etan1000]

I just downgraded to Mavericks, which is one of the best decisions I have made.

It runs SO much better, and is so much more reliable than Yosemite.

Anyway, on topic, I have to admit that the first thing I noticed when I downgraded (about 2 hours ago) was how dated Mavericks looked.

That lasted about 15 minutes, now I love it again. Not only is it so much easier on the eyes (no more eye strain woohoo!), the fonts, the menus, the icons, it all just looks so much more professional, and is so much more enjoyable to use. I do think Safari is dated on Mavericks, after using it on Yosemite, but I'll trade the better performance for the new look Safari any day.

My Mac actually feels and runs like a Mac again!

May I ask how long had you been using Yosemite before you switched back - Hours?; Days?; Weeks?; Months?

I'd like to do it but I'm afraid everything I've added since would be so screwed up!

Etan

----------

Guys don't be mad at apple, they can't innovate anything. sorry to be mean but I've been with apple since 2004 …

Doing what?

In what department?

 

[yep-sure]

May I ask how long had you been using Yosemite before you switched back - Hours?; Days?; Weeks?; Months?

I'd like to do it but I'm afraid everything I've added since would be so screwed up!

I had been using Yosemite since the first official release on the App Store, so October 16th I believe, 3 months all up.

I just backed everything up to a portable HD, completed an Internet Recovery, and am now in the process of copying back about 200 GB worth of Music, Photo's, Documents, etc..

 

[Partron22]

From January 8, 2015:

Looks like Yosemite adoption may be plateauing around 40%.

Here we are on January 19, and it's still stuck around 40%. Mavericks usage curve is distinctly on the rise.

 

[joedec]

Thanks for the report. Hopefully we'll see some motivation to fix all the bugs and poor graphics.

 

[tkermit]

That's what we've been talking about in this thread for the last 100+ pages.

If we'd really be talking about the declining quality of OS X, meaning an increase in bugs, the thread title would be kind of a misnomer. That also is not at all what the OP is about. In reality, what's been discussed is things such as how horrible the date and time icon looks, or how much people miss the 3D dock and glossy icons... (among other aspects concerning the new look)

 

[Etan1000]

If we'd really be talking about the declining quality of OS X, meaning an increase in bugs, the thread title would be kind of a misnomer. That also is not at all what the OP is about. In reality, what's been discussed is things such as how horrible the date and time icon looks, or how much people miss the 3D dock and glossy icons... (among other aspects concerning the new look)

With all due respect, you are unilaterally redefining "declining quality" by limiting it to "software bugs" whereas many comments here have been referring to such things as eyestrain due to changes Apple has made to system fonts, screen displays, etc. plus a perceived loss of intuitiveness in the redesign of icons and symbols, etc. and, taken together, which have caused many users to report here that they struggle in carrying out their workloads in their employment and/or enjoyment of use at work or home. To those of us suffering, that also constitutes "declining quality" - a decline from the standards which Apple set for itself and which drew us to Apple products in the first place. In particular, those of us like myself, who have been with Apple since the introduction of the Mac, feel that we have standing to vocalize our complaints both here and to Apple, and to consult with and commiserate with each other, when our perception is that things aren't going right.

Of course, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it seems a little off-base to ridicule other peoples' discomfort and struggles with Yosemite via reductio ad absurdum, merely because you are among those more fortunate.

As for whether or not the discussion is consistent with the thread's title, it seems a little late to be raising that issue on pages 100+, don't you think? If the moderators felt the comments were off-topic, I assume that would have been dealt with way back when.

Respectfully, Etan

 

[Omega Mac]

I get that Steve's taste resonated with people, yourself and mine. Apple was often draconian but I agreed with logic behind the decisions so I liked them, a lot.

The point about visionaries is they don't deliver what the market wants, they deliver what they need.

Henry Ford said it best "If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses."

Yes very good faster horses! Ha ha!

That's kind of like where intel stepped in to fix computing for awhile in the 90's and early 00's when you had a machine driven by windows, all the increased power in the world didn't really equate to a better product or experience (but is what people thought they wanted or so marketing told them) and exactly where Jobs didn't go until he needed to but only as a requisite of fulfilling the vision, pragmatic sure, once it's get the job done which is manifesting the vision!

Want is where marketing hangs out IMHO and fools around.

Finding what people need takes vision. You see what people can not see, their own actual needs in a moment or context and as they grapple with what they thought they wanted and it often causes them pain/inefficiency. Along comes your iteration of their need as something tangible be it a product or a way of doing things and many other things in-between and bingo things change.

One thing Job experienced in his life at a very young age was getting to see the Xerox GUI as a teenager. That's one of those in the right place at the right time moments in hindsight explains the trajectory thereafter.

It inspired and opened up the avenue of potential in his mind. The way I look at things for his life that was suppose to happen for him. We all get those moments big and small in our lives. It simply depends how open we are to them and how we handle it.

Change always comes form the outside. Most of commerce and business is mimicry when you dilute it down, i.e. it's all derivative of the "want" industry which because more pollution that people will ever admit but that's another story for another forum... or is it?

 

[grahamperrin]

You know they are using Apple Retail employees for reviewing Beta, exclusively in some cases. …

As far as I know: not for OS X.

(Beta testing of iOS is off-topic.)

… i.e. it's all derivative of the "want" industry which because more pollution that people will ever admit but that's another story for another forum... or is it?

It's off-topic.

 

[treichert]

As far as I know: not for OS X.

They have been seeding pre-release versions of OS X to retail employees at least since Mavericks.

 

[grahamperrin]

They have been seeding pre-release versions of OS X to retail employees at least since Mavericks.

Sorry, I should have been clearer: not exclusively to retail employees. Over to https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1392196/ for further discussion …

 

[typicaluser]

Is it online and public? If so, please provide a link – thanks.

Here is the link, http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XODc0NTk5NjQw.html. It's in Chinese.

 

[GerritV]

The basic problem at Apple is they can't seem to distinguish between large and small. Does the Mini-player need to do everything the full application does? Have you seen pricing info displayed in Mini-player yet, that's really garish.

One the other hand, make no mistake, they are undoubtably dumbing down larger apps everywhere on Macintosh. Most notably Aperture, iWork, Final Cut Pro, Airport Utility ...

Oh boy, this is one fugly piece of miniplayer. YUCK

 

[OldGuyTom]

I made the first post in this thread over six months ago. Who would have thought this would be one of the most visited posts on the site. I think it's safe to assume I'm not the only one that dislikes Apple's recent design trends.

I looked at GoSquared and it looks like Yosemite's rise has pretty much leveled off at 40%, which is still pretty high. The curve shows what might be a reverse migration back to Mavericks occurring, but it's so small and over such a short period of time it might just be an oddity.

 

[joedec]

Oh boy, this is one fugly piece of miniplayer. YUCK

To add insult to injury, the controls are dark and lighten when you mouse over. This is opposite of the norm, even for 10.10.

----------

I made the first post in this thread over six months ago. Who would have thought this would be one of the most visited posts on the site. I think it's safe to assume I'm not the only one that dislikes Apple's recent design trends.

I looked at GoSquared and it looks like Yosemite's rise has pretty much leveled off at 40%, which is still pretty high. The curve shows what might be a reverse migration back to Mavericks occurring, but it's so small and over such a short period of time it might just be an oddity.

You were just the guy who said "The Emperor has No Clothes"

 

[grahamperrin]

Luo Yonghao (Smartisan) the comedian?

… He went ahead to reveal that there happened to be some designers at Smartisan who had connections with designers at Apple. And according to information inside Apple, the sharp turn to flat UI could only be attributed to Ive’s strong taste for flat. …

Here is the link, http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XODc0NTk5NjQw.html. It's in Chinese.

Thanks, but the video will not play for me. Or plays less than two seconds, then pauses for twenty … and so on.

He reportedly "… made a name for his company with product announcements that resemble stand-up comedy routines …" so I'm sceptical about the third-hand/fourth-hand reports of insider information.