Yosemite looks terrible!

[smoking monkey]

I flick seamlessly between Windows, Ubuntu Linux, OS X, iOS and Android with HTC Sense - so there's no need to force the idea of 'continuity' and 'unification' and force it down users' throats.

Not trying to implement uniformity across platforms that are for more synchronised than ever before, just feels like the silliest thing a company could do. Why wouldn't they try and make them more in sync? Why wouldn't Apple try and make their products work seamlessly together? Feels like an odd thing to complain about.

 

[smoking monkey]

I have checked out the SF font in various El Cap screenshots and the font is too light. I thought for sure Apple would give us a bold option. This is maddening!

There is an "increase contrast" option in Yosemite under accessibility. That acts like a de-facto bold in some situations. I'd assume it's still in EC.

 

[Paulk]

Funny, I was just going to ask if anyone had seen El Cap...

 

[Paulk]

Funny, I was just going to ask if anyone had seen El Cap...

That post was meant for dmj 102.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Surely Apple's sales would have decreased significantly if a significant portion of consumers had that problem?

You confuse platform sales with visual approval. Many people bought Windows 8.x but found they didn't like it compared to Window7. The fact their new computer came with Windows8 or they didn't bother to switch back to 7 and just "put up" with 8 doesn't mean that they actually LIKED it. And therein lies the difference. Given all the readability complaints alone for Yosemite (to the point where even Apple is changing their font) tells me Yosemite is far from a universal hit that some fan boys make it out to be any time anyone complains about something.

 

[Etan1000]

…there's no need to force the idea of 'continuity' and 'unification' and force it down users' throats. ….

True, but if they were going to do it, it seems they went in the wrong direction. Normally, continuity and unification involves raises the level of all products in a company's lineup to the level of their highest quality product; not reducing the level of all products to the level of their lowest quality product, as Apple has done, lowering OS X software to the level of iOS. It's pitiful.

Etan

 

[Etan1000]

There is an "increase contrast" option in Yosemite under accessibility. That acts like a de-facto bold in some situations. I'd assume it's still in EC.

Suggested and tried about a hundred pages ago in this thread.

Etan

 

[joedec]

Even Apple knows its ugly. I've been gripping about the poor quality and the fact the Apple stores modify the demos to hide this hideous piece, as of 10.11 its fixed.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/os-x-10-11-all-the-little-things.1890519/page-13#post-21436407

They should have just called Yosemite a Beta. This thing was never ready for prime time.

 

[smoking monkey]

Suggested and tried about a hundred pages ago in this thread.
Etan

And what if that poster didn't know about it or read 100 pages back?
So please leave your attitude at the login in page. It isn't needed or warranted, thank you very much.

 

[dmj102]

And what if that poster didn't know about it or read 100 pages back?
So please leave your attitude at the login in page. It isn't needed or warranted, thank you very much.

I haven't had time to respond to you smoking monkey. Yes, I've been posting on this thread starting about 100 pages back and throughout on HN legibility issues with Yosemite.

I don't have the time to gather all my posts for you to see. The first thing I did when I downloaded Yosemite (besides being shocked by the HN font) was to turn contrast and reduce transparency on. That in itself turned my dock to an especially ugly looking piece of ** and I had to download cDock. Turning off "Use LCD font smoothing" made matters worse.

I've tried other tips that I found on this forum and other tech websites. After many many hours which turned into months, nothing has worked. This was not the case with LG in Mavericks. The system font was crystal clear. I'm sick and tired of looking for a fix that Apple should fix. At least to give us a system font that we can choose from and not be stuck with HN light weight that causes eye strain.

I've sent in numerous feedback to Apple over the months and I'm tired of doing that too. So far, nothing has been done and I know Apple knows about it; and, I believe, most likely couldn't care less. Anyway, that's what I and others who have a problem with HN feel.

From the screenshots that I've seen of SF in El Cap on this forum, it doesn't look much better than HN in Yosemite. That's upsetting to me. Maybe lots of people with Yosemite don't care if the font isn't up to par or just grin and bare it, but I care.

 

[BigxMac]

I believe that just the fact that this forum exists with this many posts says "Hey Apple fix this". Lets face it. On this site we are a bunch of Apple fans, so when there is over 3,000 posts on a forum stating that your design is wrong from Apple fans maybe that says something.

 

[Etan1000]

And what if that poster didn't know about it or read 100 pages back?….

To answer your question, I surmise that in such case they will be terribly disappointed when they enthusiastically apply your remedy … and discover that it provides no cure.

Etan

 

[BigxMac]

The MacBook in the WWDC intro video seems to have been running Mavericks.

 

[BigxMac]

Accidental duplicate post and I can't delete it :/

 

[ZVH]

As an FYI, I got sick and tired of looking at the bad joke known as Yosemite. Aside from my gripes about translucency, I can't stand the whitewashed display.

I have about 20 different display configurations that all worked with everything prior to Yosemite, but when I attempted to calibrate my external display, which is a huge, non-Apple display, and worked with every other OS X release before I CANNOT properly set some of the display extremes. I cannot calibrate some of the extremes in the last 2 steps prior to setting the contrast.

This is more evidence that the testing done has been bad and improper, as far as I'm concerned. No wonder it looks OK on a native MacBook Pro display but looks like crap on anything outside of the Apple world.

Dear Apple: If you're listening, and I doubt it, will you PLEASE put someone in charge of GUI design that at least has an ounce of experience? PLEASE??????

This is getting ridiculous.

 

[grahamperrin]

I rarely ran Yosemite. Test purposes, nothing else. Prerelease builds, without feedback from me; I decided long ago to not condone development of something that was, in part, essentially horrific.

… After reading Apple's page for 10.11, I realised that listening to, or watching, the keynote would be a waste of time for me. …

Two of Apple's screenshots, alone, successfully killed my curiosity about El Capitan. With that killing, the likelihood of me revisiting Yosemite plummets close to zero.

… numerous feedback to Apple over the months and I'm tired of doing that too. So far, nothing has been done and I know Apple knows about it …

To those who thought Apple takes feedback serious: Keep On Dreaming.

The feedback is taken seriously.

Beyond the areas of receipt of feedback: something, somewhere in Apple must be horribly wrong.

I flick seamlessly between Windows, Ubuntu Linux, OS X, iOS and Android with HTC Sense - so there's no need to force the idea of 'continuity' and 'unification' and force it down users' throats.

Well said.

maddening!

Why wouldn't Apple try and make their products work seamlessly together?

I suggest seamlessness without horror; without causing madness. Apple: try that, why don't you?

Normally, continuity and unification involves raises the level of all products in a company's lineup to the level of their highest quality product; not reducing the level of all products to the level of their lowest quality product, as Apple has done, lowering OS X software to the level of iOS. It's pitiful.

Whilst I can not feign familiarity with modern versions of iOS, I do agree that Apple has spoilt the greatness of OS X.

Time to start a "El Capitan looks terrible!" thread...

I'll not start it, but I'll quietly watch any topic of that type.

Time, too, for a fork of OS X; and time to open source more of OS X 10.9. I can wish for those things, but in the Apple Developer area (take a look – discussions have become public) I see surprisingly little technical discussion of the OS.

If asked, I would vote for simply changing the name of the existing thread, maybe to
"Yosemite AND El Capitan look terrible."

If that happens – if this topic broadens to include 10.11 – then it should move away from the 10.10 area, to the broader OS X area.

 

[Etan1000]

As an FYI, I got sick and tired of looking at the bad joke known as Yosemite. Aside from my gripes about translucency, I can't stand the whitewashed display.

I have about 20 different display configurations that all worked with everything prior to Yosemite, but when I attempted to calibrate my external display, which is a huge, non-Apple display, and worked with every other OS X release before I CANNOT properly set some of the display extremes. I cannot calibrate some of the extremes in the last 2 steps prior to setting the contrast.

This is more evidence that the testing done has been bad and improper, as far as I'm concerned. No wonder it looks OK on a native MacBook Pro display but looks like crap on anything outside of the Apple world.

Dear Apple: If you're listening, and I doubt it, will you PLEASE put someone in charge of GUI design that at least has an ounce of experience? PLEASE??????

This is getting ridiculous.

ZVH - Please post also to Apple's feedback form.
Thanks, Etan

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

True, but if they were going to do it, it seems they went in the wrong direction. Normally, continuity and unification involves raises the level of all products in a company's lineup to the level of their highest quality product; not reducing the level of all products to the level of their lowest quality product, as Apple has done, lowering OS X software to the level of iOS. It's pitiful.

While I agree with your premise, it doesn't follow reality in the sense that you couldn't currently bring iOS up to OSX's level without essentially having a notebook on your hands. Uniformity therefore requires that OSX be brought down to the basement to make it "iOS compliant" and this is the source of much frustration with many standard apps. It seems they will become even more standardized with El Capitain. Only Metal gives me any hope that there will be a solid improvement worth considering losing visual appeal in trade.

 

[Paulk]

While I agree with your premise, it doesn't follow reality in the sense that you couldn't currently bring iOS up to OSX's level without essentially having a notebook on your hands. Uniformity therefore requires that OSX be brought down to the basement to make it "iOS compliant" and this is the source of much frustration with many standard apps. It seems they will become even more standardized with El Capitain. Only Metal gives me any hope that there will be a solid improvement worth considering losing visual appeal in trade.

This for me is the longer-term nub of the issue, the drive to bring "OS X down to the basement to make it "IOS compliant"". I had to look up Wikipedia to find Metal (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_(Apple_API)), as I don't have access to IOS.

 

[blucolar]

That’s where Apple went wrong MagnusVonMagnum. They should have continued to add features to OS X versions Pages, Keynote, Numbers and just had a “save as” for making a copy iOS compliant. This would have been the intelligent path to take, more choice. So those who actually work on documents and presentations on the train or away from home could do so. As is now, if you open an older Pages doc you put a lot of sweat in, the formatting and fonts all go away and you are left with a mess. Really with the advent of SSDs Apple should include an uninstaller with their Apps. My family has a multitude of Macs, and iPhones and iPads, and all major work is still done on the desktop Macs at home, not from the “sent from my iPhone”. I could go on about my opinion of Yoesmite, but I got another call about how to go back to Mavericks. Be Cool.

 

[grahamperrin]

Uniformity

… Uniformity therefore requires that OSX be brought down …

Reduction of software, thinness of hardware, and so on. What follows should come as no surprise; I can share the essence, but not the details, without fear of breaking any nondisclosure agreement (NDA).

Greater uniformity

Apple plans to achieve this greatness through production of things such as:

• the 6" x 3" iMac
• the 7" x 3" iMac Plus
• the 25" x 20" iPhone
• the 26" x 21" (27" diagonal) iPhone Plus

– and to complement those gold standards in uniformity of size, there'll be an entirely new category of thin device. You'll just love it.

Eco, system; Apple ecosystem with a uniform OS X sub-system. Superior, sub-superior; refine, reduce, Handoff, Handoff Plus … handover your money then weep at what's in front of you whilst shareholders laugh all the way to the bank.

 

[grahamperrin]

That’s where Apple went wrong MagnusVonMagnum.

To readers who are familiar with this long topic, it probably goes without saying that @MagnusVonMagnum is aware of the various wrongnesses presented by Yosemite and El Capitan. (Newbies such as @blucolar may be unfamiliar with our styles of writing; my irony is not always as obvious as in the post above, and so on.)

… sick and tired of looking at the bad joke known as Yosemite …

Apple Ecosystem Plus members may take a uniform approach to ridicule of things that deserve ridicule. I remind myself to focus on the sorry state of the user interface, not on the Apple people who are commonly associated with the design of the UI.

 

[ZVH]

ZVH - Please post also to Apple's feedback form.
Thanks, Etan

I will post to Apple (again) because that's not just me complaining to them I'm telling them they've got a bug.

I've noticed that on smaller displays, particularly those on Apple laptops, Yosemite isn't nearly as offensive. I still don't like it but it might explain why some like it an others hate it. On a laptop the "magic of translucency" is at least tolerable and much less offensive, and the smaller sizes of the icons and everything else isn't that noticeable.

Put it on a big display and "kiddy's hour" icons become childish looking and with the display apparently unable to scale it's native response properly, I suspect we get the translucent overkill that so many are complaining about.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

That’s where Apple went wrong MagnusVonMagnum. They should have continued to add features to OS X versions Pages, Keynote, Numbers and just had a “save as” for making a copy iOS compliant.

I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm simply presenting Apple's reasoning for "uniformity" over advanced versions in OSX compared to iOS. I personally despise some of the changes that have been made to OSX, whcih is why I'm still using Mavericks. Frankly, I'd still be using Mountain Lion if it weren't for the improvements made to dual-monitor support. As I said, Metal may be the only thing that convinces me to move to El Capitain. Improved speed in the GUI and/or gaming would be a worthwhile improvement, assuming it works out that way in the future (i.e. current games won't likely see much, if any improvement as they would still use OpenGL).

 

[smoking monkey]

I haven't had time to respond to you smoking monkey. Yes, I've been posting on this thread starting about 100 pages back and throughout on HN legibility issues with Yosemite.

I don't have the time to gather all my posts for you to see.

Haha... and I certainly wouldn't read them all if you did! No offence.

It was supposed to be a helpful little tip. that's all. Not just for you, but anybody on this thread. Not everybody has been reading since the start, so if it's helped somebody then that's great. If it didn't, then it didn't.

I've also been on this thread a long time, but you probably don't know that and I don't expect you to know that. And even though I disagree with a lot of what's been posted, I still find reading about it interesting and often I find little tidbits that improve my ability to use my computer.