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Yosemite looks terrible!
- Thread starter OldGuyTom
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How likely is it that you would recommend OS X Yosemite to a friend or colleague?
I changed my signature to steer people to the poll.
Agendas
My agendas are probably not unusual. They might be summed up with these three quotes from recent months:
Apple has the ability to realise all three wishes without displeasing any liker or lover of Yosemite.
Generally
I'd like to see more evidence of free-thinking – of individuals not taking marketing materials and so on at face value.
Apple's uses of the phrase 'content-focused', for example –
I changed my signature to steer people to the poll.
Agendas
My agendas are probably not unusual. They might be summed up with these three quotes from recent months:
- I'd like Apple to demonstrate the potential for Yosemite to be the best – sooner rather than later
- I want the best OS on my Mac
- Apple, please, cut the crap
Apple has the ability to realise all three wishes without displeasing any liker or lover of Yosemite.
Generally
I'd like to see more evidence of free-thinking – of individuals not taking marketing materials and so on at face value.
Apple's uses of the phrase 'content-focused', for example –
The volume/brightness things definitely look uglier to me. The little increment notches look like they were designed for Mac OS 9 and this is without changing contrast/transparency
Polls and stuff
First and foremost: feedback to Apple.
Vote, if you like, in any/all of the following
I'm now less prepared to defend individuals such as Ive (see below), but I can't yet run with the "take his fall and be gone" wish. Did I read somewhere, maybe within the past week, that he recently had a tough time of some sort?
I can't imagine him being the sole author. That said, articles such as the one below don't portray him as particularly co-operative:
Jony Ive shakes up Apples software design group, iPhone interface creator Greg Christie departing | 9to5Mac (2014-04-09)
An outline of Ive's role as Senior Vice President, Design is presented amongst Apple's Leadership pages. Leadership for multiple teams, direction for Human Interface (HI) software teams across the company and so on is there something horribly wrong within one or more of those teams? I doubt it, but I can't judge.
Apples Jonathan Ive in Conversation with Vanity Fairs Graydon Carter (2014-10-16, referred from Full video from Vanity Fair Jony Ive interview on design, Steve Jobs, and more now available | 9to5Mac) I'd like to listen to that, with a clear head, to tell whether a recent furious rant about Ive's work on Yosemite was over the top.
First and foremost: feedback to Apple.
Vote, if you like, in any/all of the following
- How likely is it that you would recommend OS X Mavericks to a friend or colleague?
- How likely is it that you would recommend OS X Yosemite to a friend or colleague?
- How likely is it that you would recommend iOS 8.x to a friend or colleague?
I'm now less prepared to defend individuals such as Ive (see below), but I can't yet run with the "take his fall and be gone" wish. Did I read somewhere, maybe within the past week, that he recently had a tough time of some sort?
I can't imagine him being the sole author. That said, articles such as the one below don't portray him as particularly co-operative:
Jony Ive shakes up Apples software design group, iPhone interface creator Greg Christie departing | 9to5Mac (2014-04-09)
An outline of Ive's role as Senior Vice President, Design is presented amongst Apple's Leadership pages. Leadership for multiple teams, direction for Human Interface (HI) software teams across the company and so on is there something horribly wrong within one or more of those teams? I doubt it, but I can't judge.
Apples Jonathan Ive in Conversation with Vanity Fairs Graydon Carter (2014-10-16, referred from Full video from Vanity Fair Jony Ive interview on design, Steve Jobs, and more now available | 9to5Mac) I'd like to listen to that, with a clear head, to tell whether a recent furious rant about Ive's work on Yosemite was over the top.
I DL it on my MB Air, hated the look so I'm holding off on my iMac. I found this to at least make the dock look halfway decent (at least to me).
http://osxdaily.com/2014/10/29/get-3d-dock-in-os-x-yosemite/
http://osxdaily.com/2014/10/29/get-3d-dock-in-os-x-yosemite/
Saturday hairy knuckles
A few days ago I posted the harshest, meanest thing I have ever written in public – it named someone at Apple. Every night since then, I slept on a variety of things. Every day I quietly wondered whether I should retract or edit the offending post.
Today, Saturday, lunchtime, pleasantly chilled out … after a few hours' reading I think I begin to understand why I reacted so strongly in that post. In a nutshell: something that I feared more than three months ago (something that I wrote about in this topic) became evident … in a way that I had failed to predict.
Yeah. Expect the number of bookmarks at https://www.diigo.com/list/grahamperrin/tentenlooksbad to exceed six hundred this weekend. It'll not be evident from that list, but I suspect that damage to customer loyalty – from developments such as Yosemite – is far greater than Apple might have predicted.
Insult customers' intelligence, expect insulting reactions. The worst of Yosemite was designed by a bloody monkey. Apple, give me something that makes me want to not drag my knuckles across a 'fresh, streamlined' interface.
A few days ago I posted the harshest, meanest thing I have ever written in public – it named someone at Apple. Every night since then, I slept on a variety of things. Every day I quietly wondered whether I should retract or edit the offending post.
Today, Saturday, lunchtime, pleasantly chilled out … after a few hours' reading I think I begin to understand why I reacted so strongly in that post. In a nutshell: something that I feared more than three months ago (something that I wrote about in this topic) became evident … in a way that I had failed to predict.
Yeah. Expect the number of bookmarks at https://www.diigo.com/list/grahamperrin/tentenlooksbad to exceed six hundred this weekend. It'll not be evident from that list, but I suspect that damage to customer loyalty – from developments such as Yosemite – is far greater than Apple might have predicted.
Insult customers' intelligence, expect insulting reactions. The worst of Yosemite was designed by a bloody monkey. Apple, give me something that makes me want to not drag my knuckles across a 'fresh, streamlined' interface.
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Observe the customer recensions in the Mac App Store for Yosemite. In Switzerland almost 20% rated Yosemite with one single star. I even suspect that Apple censors many of the negative feedbacks there. At least my feedback was deleted instead of published.
The statistics of GoSquared shows almost no growth in Yosemite adoption. As it's weekend time and some might try their luck with Yosemite, the adoption spikes near 30% for the first time. But it's very likely this number will fall again.
I think Apple is well aware of these facts.
Ignoring initial rush, slope is about 0.79% per day.
Should hit 50% by Dec 5 or so, unless there's a large population of what Apple would call "incurable reactionaries."
Usability or GTFO
Customers first – usability first
Yes and no; that stupidity is in a minority, not Apple-wide. Paraphrasing my earlier suspicion: it may be that the hands of the many good people are tied by direction and leadership elsewhere. If just a tiny minority of people within the company are primarily responsible for products that cause disloyalty and damage to reputation, then maybe the worst offender within that group is what a discerning customer would call "a misinformed leader".
First cure the software. Then – only then – consider the possibility that some customers are a sickness. Taking inspiration from the language of a repeatedly disappointed group of hundreds of developers, maybe this – from any customer who suffers an awkward or painful experience as a result of Yosemite – should be the plea to any misinformed leader:
If anyone at Apple wishes to judge a user's fitness to use a software product, then that judgement must not involve software that is critically bugged.
Adoption rates, star ratings and customer reviews
https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=20319126#post20319126 for more on the GoSquared measurements.
I make it a little under thirteen percent at the time of writing (101 of 790 star ratings). My maths isn't what it used to be so please correct me if I'm wrong.
At https://itunes.apple.com/ch/app/os-x-yosemite/id915041082?mt=12 it's remarkable that all three featured reviews are negative – two reviewers don't like Yosemite, one hates it. As far as I can tell (with Google Translate) none of those reviewers' negative criticisms relates to looks, so I'll not quote them here.
Customers first – usability first
Yes and no; that stupidity is in a minority, not Apple-wide. Paraphrasing my earlier suspicion: it may be that the hands of the many good people are tied by direction and leadership elsewhere. If just a tiny minority of people within the company are primarily responsible for products that cause disloyalty and damage to reputation, then maybe the worst offender within that group is what a discerning customer would call "a misinformed leader".
First cure the software. Then – only then – consider the possibility that some customers are a sickness. Taking inspiration from the language of a repeatedly disappointed group of hundreds of developers, maybe this – from any customer who suffers an awkward or painful experience as a result of Yosemite – should be the plea to any misinformed leader:
Usability or GTFO
If anyone at Apple wishes to judge a user's fitness to use a software product, then that judgement must not involve software that is critically bugged.
Adoption rates, star ratings and customer reviews
https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=20319126#post20319126 for more on the GoSquared measurements.
I make it a little under thirteen percent at the time of writing (101 of 790 star ratings). My maths isn't what it used to be so please correct me if I'm wrong.
At https://itunes.apple.com/ch/app/os-x-yosemite/id915041082?mt=12 it's remarkable that all three featured reviews are negative – two reviewers don't like Yosemite, one hates it. As far as I can tell (with Google Translate) none of those reviewers' negative criticisms relates to looks, so I'll not quote them here.
Stay in More
Jony needs to stay in more
There are more things in heaven and earth than the palate of crayons in the local burger bar
Jony needs to stay in more
There are more things in heaven and earth than the palate of crayons in the local burger bar
I took a look at the boring video and was left unimpressed with Mr. Ive. In particular, I find it amazing that someone who stated he really didn't understand computers has now managed to work his way into not only UI design, but software design as well. I also don't like some of the engineering staff "purges" that seem to accompany Yosemite and iOS. It seems to me more like an egomaniac has "sold" Tim Cook on his idea that he knows best.
In some cases it seems to me, particularly with respect to those items regarding window and application control, that Mr. Ive is single handedly re-writing standards that have been in place for decades. That would be nice...
...if he knew what he was doing. I don't think he does.
If you don't like it, don't use it or upgrade. There we go, world peace achieved. No dramas.
Have a lovely evening everyone
The most intelligent comment in here to date.
I was thinking something polar opposite when I read that post. Some of us are tired of being told to basically "shut up" about negative comments on OS X by the fanatical crowds that would have loved the update no matter *WHAT* it looked like (sorry but it's the truth). Sadly, ignoring it won't make it go away. Apple needs to be absolutely inundated with negative feedback towards Jony Ive's "Crayon World" OS update. It's HIDEOUS and something I'd expect from Fisher Price, not Apple. Steve Jobs may have megalomania in common with Jony, but Steve was a black turtle-neck shirt kind of guy, not a Hawaiian shirt kind of guy. It's hard to imagine Steve going with Jony's vision of the future instead of the Scott Forestall one (that existed while Steve was there) when Yosemite and iOS7/8 are the visual end result. Unfortunately, Mr. Cook might very well be a Hawaiian shirt kind of guy and no amount of feedback in the world may help other than the bottom line and then I could imagine Cook simply declaring the personal computer "dead" rather than imagine it has to do with bad taste. Look at the music industry. They've been crying for ages that it's piracy's fault sales are down when in fact it's actually because today's "music" (if you can call it that even) sucks that sales are down.
If you don't like it, don't use it or upgrade. There we go, world peace achieved. No dramas.
Have a lovely evening everyone
A carelessly dismissive lazily sarcastic post such as the one above from pjv1990 occasionally gains a terse response that's intended to encourage a more selfless approach.
pjv1990: HT2186
Rewind three months:
Please comment on the bad things in OS X 10.10 that have, for some customers, not become tolerable with the passing of time.
Guess what? It's not going to change, like it or not. So it's simple, REALLY SIMPLE. Either accept it and get on with the programme or don't use the damn OS.Put up or shut up. No matter how much you bitch, moan or insult other users like me for a perfectly reasonable response to your childish and quite frankly, pathetic irrationality. The design will not change, that's why I said what I said. It's COMMON SENSE. No one is forcing you or anyone to use 10.10, it's your choice so don't moan about it, complain or attack others for the choices that YOU'VE made. It's that freaking simple.
What you are saying is the equivalent of this 'Gah, I really hate shellfish as I'm highly allergic... I think I'll keep eating shellfish!'
'OH MY GOD, I'm never eating shell fish again, that was a dreadful night in hospital... Garson! Pass me the shellfish! Bah! It's awful and my face is swelling at an alarming rate! Never again!'
MacRumors news and rumors you care about
It's not unusual for Mac users to have a passion for Apple products, OS X in particular. We care about the state of the product. Expect zero, or near-zero tolerance to be shown where it appears that a writer's sole purpose is to gain amusement by adding to the troubles of people who are already troubled in this case, troubled by Apple's operating system for the Mac. It's normal to report offenders to moderators; I encourage that approach. I sometimes lack the temperament that might be associated with a moderator.
I ceased using Yosemite weeks ago. Mavericks is preferred. Neither of things required guesswork.
To borrow a phrase (recall that pjv1990's opening contribution to a seventy-one page topic, where people are already troubled, was sarcastic and dismissive): "The most intelligent comment in here to date". Without sarcasm, with thanks to vBulletin: pjv1990 is now simply listed as ignored. Terse use of 'HT2186' was ineffective so I'll explain: it's an Apple Support article reference.
Back on topic: software choices and requirements
http://support.apple.com/HT2186 Don't install a version of Mac OS X earlier than what came with your Mac
It's reasonable to assume that a large number of purchasers of new Macs that require Yosemite will dislike or hate the operating system. Not necessarily for its looks, but it's clear from the helpful contributions of many people to this topic that the design and looks of OS X 10.10 are genuinely troublesome for some customers.
It's not unusual for Mac users to have a passion for Apple products, OS X in particular. We care about the state of the product. Expect zero, or near-zero tolerance to be shown where it appears that a writer's sole purpose is to gain amusement by adding to the troubles of people who are already troubled in this case, troubled by Apple's operating system for the Mac. It's normal to report offenders to moderators; I encourage that approach. I sometimes lack the temperament that might be associated with a moderator.
I thank you
I ceased using Yosemite weeks ago. Mavericks is preferred. Neither of things required guesswork.
To borrow a phrase (recall that pjv1990's opening contribution to a seventy-one page topic, where people are already troubled, was sarcastic and dismissive): "The most intelligent comment in here to date". Without sarcasm, with thanks to vBulletin: pjv1990 is now simply listed as ignored. Terse use of 'HT2186' was ineffective so I'll explain: it's an Apple Support article reference.
Back on topic: software choices and requirements
http://support.apple.com/HT2186 Don't install a version of Mac OS X earlier than what came with your Mac
It's reasonable to assume that a large number of purchasers of new Macs that require Yosemite will dislike or hate the operating system. Not necessarily for its looks, but it's clear from the helpful contributions of many people to this topic that the design and looks of OS X 10.10 are genuinely troublesome for some customers.
A few more links relating to usability, statistics etc.
Bookmarked a few days ago, I haven't had time to read them but at a glance they could be interesting/useful. Not all OS-oriented, some relate to web design … still, thought-provoking …
How common are usability problems?: MeasuringU (2010)
Performance Satisfaction and Perception Satisfaction: MeasuringU (2010)
97 Things to Know about Usability: MeasuringU (2010)
A Brief History of the Magic Number 5 in Usability Testing: MeasuringU (2010)
5 Second Usability Tests: MeasuringU (2010)
10 Things to Know about Usability Problems: MeasuringU (2011)
8 Ways to Show Design Changes Improved the User Experience: MeasuringU (2011)
Nine misconceptions about statistics and usability: MeasuringU (2012)
How Can You Measure UX without Observing Users?: MeasuringU (2014)
What Does Statistically Significant Mean?: MeasuringU (2014)
Bookmarked a few days ago, I haven't had time to read them but at a glance they could be interesting/useful. Not all OS-oriented, some relate to web design … still, thought-provoking …
How common are usability problems?: MeasuringU (2010)
Performance Satisfaction and Perception Satisfaction: MeasuringU (2010)
97 Things to Know about Usability: MeasuringU (2010)
A Brief History of the Magic Number 5 in Usability Testing: MeasuringU (2010)
5 Second Usability Tests: MeasuringU (2010)
10 Things to Know about Usability Problems: MeasuringU (2011)
8 Ways to Show Design Changes Improved the User Experience: MeasuringU (2011)
Nine misconceptions about statistics and usability: MeasuringU (2012)
How Can You Measure UX without Observing Users?: MeasuringU (2014)
What Does Statistically Significant Mean?: MeasuringU (2014)
Well no, you guess what.... The thread title is " Yosemite looks terrible "
We're here to discuss, complain and make fun of the so called " Elegant design that feels entirely fresh, yet inherently familiar; Yosemite the OS that changes the way you see your Mac"
Ironically it changed the way we see our Mac
You're indirectly asking us to close the thread, go get a life and suffer with an OS that can only look even worse the next year.
This might not change for Apple with Yosemite BUT they might go back to the old UI in the next release. ( remember the start Button in Windows 8 ? Well guess what... Microsoft brought it back ) [ logic, common sense, will, hope, desire, wish, optimism, faith, expectation etc.. ]
One thing I'm sure about, you're in the wrong thread. Try Maybe here ? https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1757644/
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As of 10:00PM November 8, 2014, here are the 2 highest and 2 lowest ratings of Yosemite in the App Store:
Highest Ratings:
5 stars: 9724
4 stars: 780
Total: 10504
Lowest Ratings:
1 star: 2103
2 stars: 837
Total: 2940
Neutral Rating:
3 stars: 708
Total review count: 14152
The ratio of "lovers" to "haters" is 10504/2940 is 3.57
Dissatisfaction rate is (sum of lowest ratings)/(Total Reviews)*100
or
((2940/14152)*100) = 20.77%
In other words, slightly over 1 in 5 users dislikes Yosemite. I would say that's a high dissatisfaction rate. Several of us have been predicting this based on some of the surveys done on MacRumors.
Maybe Apple ought to quit listening to their marketing "wizards" and come over to this site, where opinions aren't edited out, and find out what's going on.
Highest Ratings:
5 stars: 9724
4 stars: 780
Total: 10504
Lowest Ratings:
1 star: 2103
2 stars: 837
Total: 2940
Neutral Rating:
3 stars: 708
Total review count: 14152
The ratio of "lovers" to "haters" is 10504/2940 is 3.57
Dissatisfaction rate is (sum of lowest ratings)/(Total Reviews)*100
or
((2940/14152)*100) = 20.77%
In other words, slightly over 1 in 5 users dislikes Yosemite. I would say that's a high dissatisfaction rate. Several of us have been predicting this based on some of the surveys done on MacRumors.
Maybe Apple ought to quit listening to their marketing "wizards" and come over to this site, where opinions aren't edited out, and find out what's going on.
This type of hateful spiteful insulting post is what I was talking about above. It seems some not only can't stand anyone that disagrees with their view, they actively both insult those people and then accuse those people of being the ones that are doing it.
It's this type of post that makes me embarrassed to tell others I use a Mac. Come see how awesome our community is!
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