Yosemite looks terrible!

[Etan1000]

I can understand the guilt after the fallout, however his point is still valid, the problem is the people who only read the sound bites and article title and it spins out of control. I seriously doubt most responders even read the entire post.

He stated in the "original" article and I quote;

"The problem seems to be quite simple: they’re doing too much, with unrealistic deadlines.

We don’t need major OS releases every year. We don’t need each OS release to have a huge list of new features. We need our computers, phones, and tablets to work well first so we can enjoy new features released at a healthy, gradual, sustainable pace."

This is a fair appraisal and I think deep down we all know its true.

I agree, and we also don't need to have existing features "temporarily removed" from iWork applications while they promise they are working to make them "greater" - that is an asinine marketing strategy! You can't "temporarily" remove features from software that users rely on for productivity and expect users to be happy about it and remain dependent and loyal.

If they haven't yet figured out how to make some existing features of their applications work with Yosemite, then it was premature to release Yosemite.

Etan

 

[grahamperrin]

Apple’s Software Quality Decline (orientation)

Apple’s Software Quality Decline

… something more serious than BI …

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=20560301#post20560301 and below.

Here's his take-back on WORDS. …

https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=20566483#post20566483 for more.

General talk of Apple software, not specific to the looks of Yosemite, may be better suited to that Apple Software Quality Decline topic.

 

[George Dawes]

Agree 100%

Yosemite is really terrible , just as well it's free , it's not worth a penny

 

[GerritV]

I agree, and we also don't need to have existing features "temporarily removed" from iWork applications while they promise they are working to make them "greater" - that is an asinine marketing strategy! You can't "temporarily" remove features from software that users rely on for productivity and expect users to be happy about it and remain dependent and loyal.

If they haven't yet figured out how to make some existing features of their applications work with Yosemite, then it was premature to release Yosemite.

Etan

Couldn't agree more. The iWork bundle has become a joke with so many features removed. Temporarily my @$$

 

[Omega Mac]

Couldn't agree more. The iWork bundle has become a joke with so many features removed. Temporarily my @$$

I've a B2B mac supplier and they've kinda done the same thing as APPLE. Degraded their product. Released updates that break so much and it's even more serious if you use it to run a business. I've also heard of this in other cloud based accounting options. User end up losing feature after they make the switch. The great cloud swindle in many cases.

You would almost suspect Apple plan to bring back the missing features (is this this market research led) allow you purchase an upgrade version via the app store or some monthly billing model which so many companies are jumping on the software as a service model and is really annoying the hell out of me. I think it's going to hand the open source community the baton unwittingly.

Since the pay for software is becoming bloated, unreliable and even counter productive in the real world.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

Is it just me, or is the Apple Support Communities web site deleting posts that reflect negatively on Yosemite? I swear to God I saw a post on it complaining about some of the visual effects of the new fonts and translucency and it looks like it was deleted. I didn't bookmark it but I tried searching with the same search strings I had before and it seemed gone.

Do they have a habit of doing this?

Yes I had a post deleted about the Safari 5 dns prefetching issue that Caroline Sammat deleted.

----------

Its a very small fraction of people that launch successful startups, of course this guy gets Business Insiders attention. Marco Arment is not only a valley insider, but he has won big, his opinion matters.

Of course, I also agree with him.

Indeed so do I.

 

[Partron22]

Yes I had a post deleted about the Safari 5 dns prefetching issue...

Pretty brutal? I'd expect that if they're doing it, they'd go strategic rather than tactical. Don't want to get the outrage meter ticked too high and all.

 

[grahamperrin]

Feedback about design: perceptions of our peers and prioritisation by Apple

Under Apple Seeds OS X Yosemite 10.10.2 Build 14C94b to Developers:

Feedback to Apple

If you're not a developer, then aim for either (a) https://appleseed.apple.com/ for the public beta or (b) http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html for one-way feedback about the OS.

I hope people that use these tools are giving feedback on real issues and not flat design sucks or Finder icon is ugly.
__________________
"When we se something huge and powerful we aspire to make it small and meaningful."— Jony Ive 

… Ever since Yosemite DP1, I bet 40% or more of the "bug" reports are just complainers telling them how much they hate the new design and how ugly everything is. Pathetic people abusing a system to enhance the user experience.

… "Design Complaints aka Junk"
__________________
13" MacBook Pro Retina (Mid - 2014), 2,6GHz, 8GB RAM, 128GB SSD, OS X Yosemite 10.10.2 | iPhone 6 Silver, 16GB, Unlocked | iPad Mini Retina, 64GB, Silver

– two Retina devices there. Maybe Erastopic is amongst the ~eight percent of users with a Retina-only environment for OS X, in which case he/she may be insensitive to the problems experienced by many of the users who had, or have, Yosemite on at least one non-Retina device.

At times of excitement it's easy to overlook or forget Apple's plea for help:

We want to collect feedback from our customers to improve the overall quality of our products. With your help, we can test in many different environments. Your feedback about your experience with our products will impact Apple's future success. ​

They can report it all, it's for apple to prioritise the severity of the issues. In most cases severity 1 ones get picked up to be fixed and all the request about design etc ignored. You can look at that crap once you fix the top priority ones. …

It does make sense to prioritise, and some of the problems with design may be most severe.

To anyone who imagines that Apple classifies as 'crap' all other customer feedback about design

Please review Apple's words at the AppleSeed web site, then reconsider. Hint:

• some of those words may be visible only after signing out.

Interests in design, concerns about consistency

Erastopic's interests include web-design, app-design and photography, and that interest in design includes annoyance about the designs of icons of some applications – and a wish for people to have the same opinions:

… icons …

… Why would this annoy people you might ask.. Well because when something undergoes such a big make-over it's important to make the make-over everywhere to not make it feel inconsistent. …

I hope I'm not alone on this.. It's starting to annoy me.

That's not entirely consistent with Erastopic's more recent observation – "Design Complaints aka Junk".

If you wish for shared opinions about design, then please either:

• accept that your own complaints, about icons, were junk; or
• refrain from junking all other opinions except your own; refrain from describing groups of people as pathetic; respect the opinions of other users of the operating system

– thank you.

 

[ZVH]

The Icon that Epitomizes Yosemite

If you want to see the icon that is the epitome of Yosemite, do the following:

1. Boot up Yosemite
2. Once booted, launch System Preferences
3. Look at the icon for Date & Time

The icon for Date & Time is the epitome of Yosemite. It looks stupid. It looks like it's deliberately trying to appeal to 3 year olds.

 

[b0fh666]

why? it's just a clock and a calendar over it... chill man.

yesterday i think i experienced my first 'yosemite wifi problem', was downloading some stuff (~10mbps) and the wifi disconnected and would not connect back to the AP no matter what... had to turn wifi off and back on to reconnect.

AP is tplink n570 (TL WDR4300) running stock firmware, macbook 9.1

 

[thejadedmonkey]

The icon for Date & Time is the epitome of Yosemite. It looks stupid. It looks like it's deliberately trying to appeal to 3 year olds.

Nahh, if you want to see the epitome of Yosemite, go to accessibility settings and enable "Increase contrast", then check out the airport dropdown menu in the menubar.

I can't even fathom how crap like this gets past Apple.

 

[tkermit]

The icon for Date & Time is the epitome of Yosemite. It looks stupid. It looks like it's deliberately trying to appeal to 3 year olds.

Seems like that would be a rather sophisticated 3 year old.

 

[joedec]

If you want to see the icon that is the epitome of Yosemite, do the following:

1. Boot up Yosemite
2. Once booted, launch System Preferences
3. Look at the icon for Date & Time

The icon for Date & Time is the epitome of Yosemite. It looks stupid. It looks like it's deliberately trying to appeal to 3 year olds.

Not to be contrary but the Mission Control icon would take this award, that was drawn by a three year old

 

[Partron22]

Looks like Yosemite adoption may be plateauing around 40%.
Decline curve of Mavericks has certainly flattened out.
There may actually be a substantial fraction of Mac users rejecting the Yosemite update.
There's precedent for this sort of behavior in both Windows and Android worlds.
KitKat is pretty nice!

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Under Apple Seeds OS X Yosemite 10.10.2 Build 14C94b to Developers:

"Ever since Yosemite DP1, I bet 40% or more of the "bug" reports are just complainers telling them how much they hate the new design and how ugly everything is. Pathetic people abusing a system to enhance the user experience"

- two Retina devices there. Maybe Erastopic is amongst the ~eight percent of users with a Retina-only environment for OS X, in which case he/she may be insensitive to the problems experienced by many of the users who had, or have, Yosemite on at least one non-Retina device.

I've looked and looked and looked for these quoted comments from this person in this thread and the one you mentioned and found neither. So unless they were removed, I have no idea where you're dragging comments in from. I don't really think it's totally appropriate to bring in comments from other threads and comment on them here as the person cannot defend themselves and it feels like it's trying to drag this thread onward when there's no actual comments being made here about it.

I do disagree that using a feedback system to complain about the looks is abuse. It is, after all, the system we're FORCED to use if we are ever to buy a new Mac or upgrade our OS. People have a right to complain if they hate it. I have refrained from "upgrading" (and not just due to looks; it sounds as if it's also slower and buggier and that is unacceptable to me when it has no features that interest me. I actually liked Mountain Lion better than Mavericks for that matter except for the improved multiple monitor support (that still doesn't go far enough since it won't migrate side docks to the other monitors for some odd reason that they don't seem to want to address. It makes even less sense now that the bottom dock looks more like the side docks).

Frankly, it amazes me how USELESS the feedback/bug report system is. They won't acknowledge your feedback or add it to a known list and so it jus seems that bugs that go reported go IGNORED for all time. I've told them multiple times that NFS isn't recognized by their "sleep token" system as a reason to not go to sleep (i.e. another computer or AppleTV using XBMC is using my Mac Mini to access its storage for tv/movies/pictures/etc.) and thus I CANNOT let my Mac Mini sleep EVER or it will go to sleep right in the middle of a tv show or movie in the other room from the XBMC computer or ATV. It will recognize AFP and SMB access to not go to sleep but for some reason doesn't care if you're using NFS. What's the point is supporting it if they don't do it correctly? Oh yeah, they want to keep that "UNIX" badge. Otherwise, I doubt it would get any support what-so-ever. They dumped it from "SERVER" (another reason I won't "buy" it again even though my Mini came with it; it's freaking USELESS for many tasks and SMB support is still very poor and won't work with older versions to this day correctly. I get a "free" upgrade to Mavericks and horrible Yosemite, but I have to pay for Sever EVERY YEAR until the end of time when all they do is REMOVE features??? (i.e. NFS *used* to be supported in Server) Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

The problem is that you can't take Apple's software seriously anymore. They remove power features and make everything crappier (less features, more bugs and an uglier interface) and dump some pro software altogether (e.g. Aperture) and REFUSE to offer even Safari updates anymore to older versions of the OS *PERIOD*. You now have to upgrade the entire OS every single time to get a new Safari. Ridiculous. I don't want my software updates dependent on some BUGGY NOT READ YET FOR PRIME TIME OS that Apple heaps upon us because they vowed to have a new major OS version available at least once a year. It would be far better to update every other year and have stable software than every year and constantly and unendingly having UNSTABLE BUGGY SOFTWARE. It just works is fast becoming a slogan for Apple hardware and not in a good way, but a satirical get a good laugh from this kind of way.

 

[grahamperrin]

OT: links and attribution

I've looked and looked and looked for these quoted comments …

Wherever you see (within a quote styled by vBulletin):

Originally Posted by {username} >
…

– the arrow > is a link to the post from which the quoted text was taken. At the time of writing, those links to work; the posts are present. Each person quoted should have received an automated quote notification (unless the person chooses to never be notified of quotes).

 

[ZVH]

Start sending letters to Tim Cook. For some sneaky reason I suspect complaints about the OS may not be reaching him.

Better yet, find out who's on the board of directors and principal investors and start sending complaints to them!.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Start sending letters to Tim Cook. For some sneaky reason I suspect complaints about the OS may not be reaching him.

I think you answered your own question there. You can send all the emails you want to the President for that matter. He won't read them. He'll never even get them. I don't suspect it's much different with CEOs. Jobs apparently liked to read random emails sometimes and reply (well MAYBE it was him), but Cook seems very different. Make friends with some lackey at Apple and hope Cook has lunch with him some day and can bring it up.

Better yet, find out who's on the board of directors and principal investors and start sending complaints to them!.

They might listen if you own Billions in stock....

 

[joedec]

I think you answered your own question there. You can send all the emails you want to the President for that matter. He won't read them. He'll never even get them. I don't suspect it's much different with CEOs. Jobs apparently liked to read random emails sometimes and reply (well MAYBE it was him), but Cook seems very different. Make friends with some lackey at Apple and hope Cook has lunch with him some day and can bring it up.



They might listen if you own Billions in stock....

A little off topic but I sent mail to Steve Jobs and got a call back from the product group at Apple. He had a policy that all email, that wasn't just crazy, was responded to. Of course he had staff to do most of that.

No one knows what Tim Cook does with his "unsolicited" email.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

A little off topic but I sent mail to Steve Jobs and got a call back from the product group at Apple. He had a policy that all email, that wasn't just crazy, was responded to. Of course he had staff to do most of that.

No one knows what Tim Cook does with his "unsolicited" email.

Well, I just noticed on my 2nd Gen AppleTV that there's a new Bond package set (all 23 movies). I just wanted to check what they were charging ($99 according to iTunes it seems) and it told me I had to update to AppleTV Sofware 7.0.2 to access that page. OK. I checked software update and it says I'm up to date. After some searching (thank you Apple for not helping), it seems they quietly discontinued software support for Gen2 units at 6.x. If it gets any updates, they will be separate 6.x updates.

It's kind of like not being able to get newer Safari versions for Mavericks without updating to Yosemite except at least there I don't have to buy new hardware, but since I don't want Yosemite (for stated reasons in this thread), I cannot get newer versions of Safari, which is why I stopped using all Apple software for Mail and Browsing. My ability to use a newer Browser or Email should not be tied to entire OS updates, IMO. So I use Firefox and Thunderbird (but even there I had to do some busy work to get Firefox to look like it used to since the new "Chromed" interface is hideous, IMO. (I use Noia Fox Theme with Classic Theme Restorer and Tabs Mix Plus with a nice weather panel in the bottom Add-on Bar (that they wanted to remove as well). It seems people can't leave near PERFECT interfaces the hell alone for some reason.

 

[joedec]

Well, I just noticed on my 2nd Gen AppleTV that there's a new Bond package set (all 23 movies). I just wanted to check what they were charging ($99 according to iTunes it seems) and it told me I had to update to AppleTV Sofware 7.0.2 to access that page. OK. I checked software update and it says I'm up to date. After some searching (thank you Apple for not helping), it seems they quietly discontinued software support for Gen2 units at 6.x. If it gets any updates, they will be separate 6.x updates.

It's kind of like not being able to get newer Safari versions for Mavericks without updating to Yosemite except at least there I don't have to buy new hardware, but since I don't want Yosemite (for stated reasons in this thread), I cannot get newer versions of Safari, which is why I stopped using all Apple software for Mail and Browsing. My ability to use a newer Browser or Email should not be tied to entire OS updates, IMO. So I use Firefox and Thunderbird (but even there I had to do some busy work to get Firefox to look like it used to since the new "Chromed" interface is hideous, IMO. (I use Noia Fox Theme with Classic Theme Restorer and Tabs Mix Plus with a nice weather panel in the bottom Add-on Bar (that they wanted to remove as well). It seems people can't leave near PERFECT interfaces the hell alone for some reason.

Apple is relentless about getting us onto the next OS. I have a similar issue, I have a huge investment in time and effort in Aperture and would prefer to stay on it. Keeping in mind they are still selling a lot of Aperture, its still in the top paid grossing in the App Store. However, not only did Apple stop development but they no longer ship Digital Camera RAW updates except for, surprise, surprise, Aperture on Yosemite. I can almost guarantee the new Photo solution will be Yosemite only also.

This is exactly why my old enterprise customers never wanted to go with a single vendor. It too easy to get trapped into marching lock step to that vendors every wish.

 

[MagnusVonMagnum]

Apple is relentless about getting us onto the next OS. I have a similar issue, I have a huge investment in time and effort in Aperture and would prefer to stay on it. Keeping in mind they are still selling a lot of Aperture, its still in the top paid grossing in the App Store. However, not only did Apple stop development but they no longer ship Digital Camera RAW updates except for, surprise, surprise, Aperture on Yosemite. I can almost guarantee the new Photo solution will be Yosemite only also.

This is exactly why my old enterprise customers never wanted to go with a single vendor. It too easy to get trapped into marching lock step to that vendors every wish.

I remember that digital camera RAW updates were one of the few things I still got on my PPC server years after they stopped all other support (save iTunes which thankfully worked up until about 2012 when I bought the Mini). The worst thing is Apple is like 10x richer now than then and the support has gotten 10x worse in terms of shelf life. I can only assume greed has risen off the charts, possibly due to Apple making so much money that it's gotten the attention of certain billionaires who are trying to influence everything Apple does (for share splits, etc.)

"Hey you guys could be making even MORE money! I'm now one of your biggest shareholders. You WILL make more money!" etc. etc.

Yeah, they act like screwing over their customers with less and less support, etc. has NO effect on loyalty, etc. They're wrong. I'm seriously considering a PC for my next computer depending on how Windows 10 turns out. I've been all Apple for almost a decade now. Sorry, but my loyalty isn't free.

 

[F1Mac]

If you want to see the icon that is the epitome of Yosemite, do the following:

1. Boot up Yosemite
2. Once booted, launch System Preferences
3. Look at the icon for Date & Time

The icon for Date & Time is the epitome of Yosemite. It looks stupid. It looks like it's deliberately trying to appeal to 3 year olds.

And how would you want it then? A Tag Heuer watch? Rolex? Casio? Timex?

 

[pickaxe]

And how would you want it then? A Tag Heuer watch? Rolex? Casio? Timex?

I'm not sure what his problem with the icon is but that clock definitely looks hilariously bad and amateurish. Go to Date & Time Preferences to see a larger version.

 

[FrtzPeter]

I just spent a few days on Yosemite and I really do have to admit is really looks like it should have been named something like "Kiddies Corner."

Very poorly thought out. Very childish looking.