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Phones 2nd Half 2016 - Which top phones on your radar ?
- Thread starter Tig Bitties
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Wait, I wasn't advocating making the corner out of glass. Reducing the top and bottom bezels by half would make me happy, and maybe the side ones a bit.
I must be one of the few that doesn't mind the bezels on my iPhones at all ...
There's no question the iPhone could do with less top/bottom bezel.
Regarding side bezels specifically, though, why are people so against edge screens? Genuinely curious. The edge technology allows for screens to fit into a smaller body. It's how the S7 Edge gets away with a 5.5" screen in the form factor it's in. I mean, look at this:
Less difference, but even when compared to the OnePlus 3:
As someone who enjoys the benefits that a phablet can bring, but not necessarily the size or form factor of phablets, this edge technology allows the best of both worlds. You get the larger screen and larger battery in a more manageable and one-hand friendly size. The S7E is my first phablet, and anytime I get the chance to try another phablet then go back to my own phone, I'm reminded of how amazing the form factor is. And it's largely in part thanks to the edge panel.
Is the concern about false palm touches? Those happen rarely. Is the concern about false finger touches when handling the device, say in landscape when watching something fullscreen? Sure, at first it was awkward, but once you learn how to handle it properly, it's no problem (same can be said about palm touches, too, actually). There's nothing here so challenging that none of us can adapt.
Doesn't novel technology typically have learning curves? This is no different.
If you don't like it, you don't like it. That's all fair. But if you haven't genuinely tried it and lived with it and learn to use it, you're not really giving edge screen technology the proper chance. The gains are superb. I've always argued that the edge software features are actually the least exciting thing about the Edge; rather, it's more the physical form factor, the way the screen pops, and the way it feels more natural sliding things out from the edge panels (like Android's slide out menus). That's where the real gain of the edge technology.
Perhaps this is one of those things, yet again, where people won't fully appreciate it until Apple does it (hello 2017 iPhone?). Just like what happened when 5+ inch screens started becoming popular with the introduction of the phablet smartphone. The concerns were similar. The learning curve was similarly challenging. I also believe that as edge panels become more prominent, the software will also get better at recognizing false touches. Just as today, software has adapted to larger devices and include features that help phablet phones be more usable one-handed.
Regarding side bezels specifically, though, why are people so against edge screens? Genuinely curious. The edge technology allows for screens to fit into a smaller body. It's how the S7 Edge gets away with a 5.5" screen in the form factor it's in. I mean, look at this:
Less difference, but even when compared to the OnePlus 3:
As someone who enjoys the benefits that a phablet can bring, but not necessarily the size or form factor of phablets, this edge technology allows the best of both worlds. You get the larger screen and larger battery in a more manageable and one-hand friendly size. The S7E is my first phablet, and anytime I get the chance to try another phablet then go back to my own phone, I'm reminded of how amazing the form factor is. And it's largely in part thanks to the edge panel.
Is the concern about false palm touches? Those happen rarely. Is the concern about false finger touches when handling the device, say in landscape when watching something fullscreen? Sure, at first it was awkward, but once you learn how to handle it properly, it's no problem (same can be said about palm touches, too, actually). There's nothing here so challenging that none of us can adapt.
Doesn't novel technology typically have learning curves? This is no different.
If you don't like it, you don't like it. That's all fair. But if you haven't genuinely tried it and lived with it and learn to use it, you're not really giving edge screen technology the proper chance. The gains are superb. I've always argued that the edge software features are actually the least exciting thing about the Edge; rather, it's more the physical form factor, the way the screen pops, and the way it feels more natural sliding things out from the edge panels (like Android's slide out menus). That's where the real gain of the edge technology.
Perhaps this is one of those things, yet again, where people won't fully appreciate it until Apple does it (hello 2017 iPhone?). Just like what happened when 5+ inch screens started becoming popular with the introduction of the phablet smartphone. The concerns were similar. The learning curve was similarly challenging. I also believe that as edge panels become more prominent, the software will also get better at recognizing false touches. Just as today, software has adapted to larger devices and include features that help phablet phones be more usable one-handed.
Does Samsung count the curved part of the screen part of its measurements? If so, I call BS. Not sure how that can be called usable screen real estate when all it does is distort the content, cause strange glares and amplify false touches.
EDIT: Especially on the Note 7. If it is not usable with the pen on the edges for notes or whatever, they shouldn't count it as part of the screen size.
EDIT: Especially on the Note 7. If it is not usable with the pen on the edges for notes or whatever, they shouldn't count it as part of the screen size.
For me it is just a case of the false touches. I find it makes nearly every time I use my edge a concerted effort rather than one which I'm just naturally doing. From the keyboard missing presses or scrolling and screen becomes unresponsive and I realise despite concerted effort a fraction of my hand has made contact and so I have to juggle more than I really want to.
It's also for me the issue of screen protectors. 3 edge devices in and I'm still looking for a good one I'm happy to use.
And yes watching movies in landscape I have dropped (slipped out of my hand) far more than any other device, or I press the screen accidentally and pause the video or cause the Ui overlay to show when I don't want it.
The false touch one could be solved with software, but so far despite multiple software updates - if anything I'm having more issues now with my edge 7 than I did initially.
The screen protector issue, after nearly 18 months of different Edge devices, still seems to be the most elusive to solve.
And 3 devices in s6 Edge / Edge + / S7 Edge - I've reached the point where other than the aesthetic benefits, I'm sick of the practicality issues I experience with it in daily use. A concern all the flat devices I've owned and used has never posed.
So regardless of who releases an edge device next, I would choose flat as a preference going forward. It's what works better for me.
Why wouldn't the screen size count? Of course the edges are responsive and usable. The edge panel software proves it usable. What do you mean by usable anyway? Just responding to finger presses? Cause I can still clearly see content on the edge screens.
Same with the note if it is an edge variant. Maybe the stylus can't, but your finger and eyes can. I don't believe the stylus will stop working the moment you run into the curve anyway. I think the question is more whether that's comfortable writing/drawing into the edge. Probably not.
People are also forgetting just how subtle the edge panels are. You're not exactly running off a cliff here.
I am, but I'm still not advocating a glass corner. Does any phone exist which actually has a glass corner?!? With that said, I only advocate no bezels if they can figure out how to fix stray touches from the hands. But as I said, I'd really be pretty satisfied if they just reduced the humongous top and bottom bezels. It's not just Apple that's guilty though, the 6p bezels are just as obnoxious.
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I would think they count as a technical measurement, but for me they don't count because they lack functionality. Text and such will be distorted, writing on there will not be feasible, etc. Sure you can make a case for having something there like favorite apps, contacts, a taskbar, etc., but you can do that on a flat screen as well. IMO we are actually getting a smaller screen, not technically but functionally.
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What purpose? Do you really need to put half your hand on either side of the phone while using it in landscape mode? The top/bottom bezels on my Note 5 are plenty big enough for my fat old hands. I definitely do get stray touches from the side bezels and only advocate slimming them down if the software keeps up in regards to the false touches. But I think the Note 5 bezels are pretty much perfect, occasional false touches with an incredible screen to phone size ratio.
What's interesting to me is that the bezels on the edge phones look thicker to me. I know it's only an optical illusion, but the curve draws attention and magnifies the bezels and makes them apparent to my eyes. These are just my personal opinions and preferences, I'm not trying to debate you. Just like everything else, I'll get used to it.
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As I've said earlier, very similar complaints when phablets were coming up...
No one is saying there should be absolutely no bezel at all. That'd be horribly impractical at this point in time. Speaker grills, sensors, etc.
Just that minimizing them has clear advantages that we're simply not used to yet. The software can continue to grow to accommodate, just as they've done for phablets.
Again, novel use of technology commonly has learning curves.
I can't say for sure the same thing that happened to phablets will happen with edge panels, but it could. As we know, even Apple may incorporate them in 2017.
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Regarding usable screen real estate, exactly how much are commands only made in the very far edges? Even scroll lists are not on the edge. The contacts abc list on the right sits just before the edge, maybe a little spillage. But it's not at all difficult to use/scroll. There's really not that much that's pushed all the way to the very edge that would become difficult to use thanks to the display. Not even the keyboard.
Having said that, yes the same thing can be accomplished with a flat screen. Which is why I argue the edge software features are actually the least exciting thing about the edge panels.
No one is saying there should be absolutely no bezel at all. That'd be horribly impractical at this point in time. Speaker grills, sensors, etc.
Just that minimizing them has clear advantages that we're simply not used to yet. The software can continue to grow to accommodate, just as they've done for phablets.
Again, novel use of technology commonly has learning curves.
I can't say for sure the same thing that happened to phablets will happen with edge panels, but it could. As we know, even Apple may incorporate them in 2017.
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Regarding usable screen real estate, exactly how much are commands only made in the very far edges? Even scroll lists are not on the edge. The contacts abc list on the right sits just before the edge, maybe a little spillage. But it's not at all difficult to use/scroll. There's really not that much that's pushed all the way to the very edge that would become difficult to use thanks to the display. Not even the keyboard.
Having said that, yes the same thing can be accomplished with a flat screen. Which is why I argue the edge software features are actually the least exciting thing about the edge panels.
@spinedoc77 said it right. Yeah, sure technically brag that you put more screen in a smaller form factor. But it is less overall screen real estate due to lack of functionality, especially on the note.
Given what they did on the previous note edge:
Are they just going to have more task bars that your really don't necessarily need to prevent using these areas?
It is a bit of a hack is all I am saying. I would guess many would rather have full use of all the screen area with the same size screen, but in a flat phone.
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I don't think the complaints were similar when phablets came out at all. I don't recall consumers complaining that the edges of the screen were distorted, that they had a lot of false touches, or being unable to write on the edges. For me I don't see it as a novel use of technology, just a gimmick to sell more phones. Now please understand that's MY opinion, if you find the edges useful I totally get it. We are different consumers and can't be carbon copies of each other, and basically we are all just debating our personal opinions, but we know each other so that's ok.
PS I am arguing for NO side bezels at all, and minimal top/bottom bezels but ONLY if the software can handle it and still be functional. I remember the rumor last year that the surface pro 4 would have software bezels, controlled by software. I don't see why that's not possible in the future. If the screen senses skin then there will be a bezel and the screen automatically resizes, or maybe it can be a toggle. But I suppose we are not there yet. But in the scope of today's technology I'm simply arguing against edge displays, and arguing for smaller top/bottom bezels.
It's cool. Fair arguments from all. To be clear, I'm not advocating you all switch your flat screen phones to edge panel ones. Just observing that at this point in time, I don't know how else you'd get all the benefits of a phablet into this form factor without edge screens. And that I just don't find the learning curve that steep.
At the same time, I fully understand if people find no use for such a thing. Novel technology is usually like this. And it may never take off like phablets did. Who knows. But there are signs that OEMs are going there, Apple included.
And as the software gets better, that learning curve will become smaller for all, too, I believe. Until then, all fair points.
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The s7 edge is not like that.
That's like me saying fingerprint scanners are no good by showing the atrix.
At the same time, I fully understand if people find no use for such a thing. Novel technology is usually like this. And it may never take off like phablets did. Who knows. But there are signs that OEMs are going there, Apple included.
And as the software gets better, that learning curve will become smaller for all, too, I believe. Until then, all fair points.
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The s7 edge is not like that.
That's like me saying fingerprint scanners are no good by showing the atrix.
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Well I thought that was how spen usage worked on the Note Edge. If not, then that is great. Because that looks like a waste of screen real estate.
"don't know how else you'd get all the benefits of a phablet into this form factor without edge screens."
But again, for me, if I want "all the benefits" of a large screen, then I'll buy a large screen and deal with the size.
I hardly think a good workaround to putting a large screen in a smaller form factor is this:
That is the Note 7. Those edges make a constantly unusable glare with any light in the room. That would drive me nuts that I could't just tilt my screen away from the glare. And look at how awkwardly they have to grip that phone.
I had the Note 1. I never felt like it was impractical as one of the first phablets, especially with the spen. It was just bigger. Just like a tablet is bigger.
I personally don't think Edge screens will catch on. I think they are a samsung thing (maybe apple too because of what those two like to do). I am all for less bezels. Note 5 bezels were very nice.
I personally love the benefits of a phablet in a manageable size. I know I'm not the only one.
As for the video, understand that that video was taken at a setting where the lights are bright. And you're looking at the device through a camera recording, too. It'll catch glare like that; there's even a ton of glare on the flat portion of the screen, too.
In real life use, I've personally never had such glaring issues (see what I did there?) indoors or outdoors. Like I said, people who haven't really given the edge screen a chance and lived with it, and are just literally finding videos with flaws, well, there's not much that can be said.
As I've said earlier, there's no agenda here. I couldn't careless if others prefer flat screens. The edge panel is novel and people's preference to avoid it are perfectly fine.
Whether it takes on or not, who knows. Hard to predict these things. But my point still stands, for those who want the benefits of a phablet without having to "deal with the size," I don't know any other way. The learning curve, I find, isn't as steep as people think and should only continue getting better as the technology and software mature.
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Yeah that video really shows the edge portions as being wasted space IMO. I get the argument that technically we are getting more screen size in a narrower package because of the edges, but if that extra screen space is wasted then it doesn't seem to matter. I also don't agree with it being a "learning curve". In some positions there is just no way to grip the phone without your hands touching the screen, depending on how fat your hands are I suppose. But this even happens on my Note 5 occasionally if I hold it in one hand, I may get a false touch on the sides. It's only occasional so it's acceptable, but I'm worried how bad it will be on the N7. But it hasn't been released yet and I'm hoping Samsung will pleasantly surprise me and will have taken care of those issues.
Anyhoo I think it's time for me to stop crying about the edges, looks like they are here to stay. The phone looks incredible in that video and I will adjust to it no matter what. In any event any phone released now is just a stop gap for next years foldable screens!!
I have no doubt it will sell well, Samsung is like Apple, people eat up whatever they feed them. And it is awesome that people have choices to buy what they want!
I don't think I am just finding flaws in videos. The glare is a part of the design. I mean, just look at the rendering for the note 7:
https://twitter.com/evleaks/status/755490597595648001
They drew a glare on the curve to emphasis it. They purposely want that glare to show that it is a curved design.
Yes, but you can tilt a flat screen a tiny bit to get out of the light. An edge is reflecting the light quite a bit more more from many angles.
I guess I'm just not following why the edge panels are considered "unusable" or wasted space. It's still being used. It can be used by the finger and by the eyes. The edge of the screen still responds to touches. Besides, you typically don't need to be touching so far off the edge anyway; commands aren't typically pushed that far to the left or right.
These are pics taken quickly with an iPhone 5S in pretty dim light, so pardon the quality, but help explain to me... what commands do you see that seem unreachable or unusable due to the edge screen in the few examples below?
If you don't prefer edge panels, nothing wrong with that, but to say they're unusable? Again, not trying to convince anyone to change their screens, just that some of the concerns seem born more from inexperience than anything else. Yes, there is a learning curve, and yes, there are compromises to fitting such a screen into such a small body. One of them being false touches which, as I've said, do occur occasionally -- as they do on larger phablets. I've definitely had false palm presses when using a friend's Note in the past or an iPhone Plus. A less wide device actually aids with false touches.
But anyhoo, here are the examples. I don't see anything that is "unusable" to me.
(cropped for obvious reasons).
These are pics taken quickly with an iPhone 5S in pretty dim light, so pardon the quality, but help explain to me... what commands do you see that seem unreachable or unusable due to the edge screen in the few examples below?
If you don't prefer edge panels, nothing wrong with that, but to say they're unusable? Again, not trying to convince anyone to change their screens, just that some of the concerns seem born more from inexperience than anything else. Yes, there is a learning curve, and yes, there are compromises to fitting such a screen into such a small body. One of them being false touches which, as I've said, do occur occasionally -- as they do on larger phablets. I've definitely had false palm presses when using a friend's Note in the past or an iPhone Plus. A less wide device actually aids with false touches.
But anyhoo, here are the examples. I don't see anything that is "unusable" to me.
(cropped for obvious reasons).
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That green coloring on the edges would drive my screen calibration OCD insane. That just sold me more on how ridiculous the edge screen is.
Yep, glare is an issue on any screen, and more so when there are curves. Not denying it. Just that it isn't such a problem in daily use. How much light are you under at any given time? And again, check out the screens I posted. It's not like a little glare at the edges suddenly renders them unusable. If it's purely about visibility, well, even that, what are you missing when there is glare on the edges? Not much since the edges aren't that pronounced and there aren't exactly many commands that far to the left/right. There simply isn't any significant content on those edges. Even the slide out edge software features slide outward more toward the center.
Personally, I rather deal with the occasional glare than dealing with the size of a phablet, which is something you have to deal with everytime you pick up your device. A little glare once in a rare while versus constantly having to handle a large phablet? I'll take the former.
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I honestly don't even notice it majority of the time. I'm only ever reminded of it when people point it out in pictures like this.
Again, the point there is simply to show that the edge panels aren't "unusable" by any definition I can comprehend.
If you don't like edge screens, ain't nothing wrong with that. It just seems to me a lot of these concerns are born from inexperience.
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I'm firmly in the same camp as @Surf Donkey and @spinedoc77. I find the curved edges as a gimmick that allows Samsung to proclaim larger display in a smaller footprint. Yes, the S7 edge has 5.5" of display but as I personally also find the portion under the curve basically unusable, in reality the functional portion of the display is closer to 5.1-5.2" (I'm estimating of course, don't have a phone and ruler in front of me). At this point you now have a display comparable in width (maybe actually narrower) to the standard S7 in a larger footprint, with worse ergonomics.
I have no issues with the edge features--some great options, however you don't need the curved edges to implement them. Curved displays certainly can have their place and benefit (i.e. smart watches, other IOT)--I just don't think the edges of smartphones is the place for them. And I hope Apple isn't following suit as rumored on their 2017 iPhone, but as @spinedoc77 stated, they very well may be here to stay and if so, I'll just have to adjust.
I have no issues with the edge features--some great options, however you don't need the curved edges to implement them. Curved displays certainly can have their place and benefit (i.e. smart watches, other IOT)--I just don't think the edges of smartphones is the place for them. And I hope Apple isn't following suit as rumored on their 2017 iPhone, but as @spinedoc77 stated, they very well may be here to stay and if so, I'll just have to adjust.
My sister has an S7. I've used both side by side. There's a very noticeable difference in screen size between the two both in how it feels, what you see, etc.
Prior to committing to the Edge, I also handled the S7 and the Edge together a lot to compare. As you know, I'm a "medium" size smartphone user and value one handed use.
[doublepost=1469031132][/doublepost]Once again, the iPhone that could've been: http://www.phonearena.com/news/This...egedly-an-exact-copy-of-the-real-deal_id83362
It's not that they are unusable as some may have put it, although they may be to their individual style and needs. It's that it's sub-optimal, whether the text gets distorted, there is a glare there, you can't write there or it doesn't make sense to write on a curve, you have less grip area, you are prone to many more false touches, etc. Of course this will vary from person to person, and we are all just espousing our personal use of the device, when in reality that will vary greatly from user to user. So for some it's important to have a narrower device, and for others it's important to retain the SAME functionality the flat portion of the screen has all the way to the edges.