Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

kazmac

macrumors G4
Mar 24, 2010
10,103
8,658
Any place but here or there....
Apple's been doing this for years though. Their jargon and double speak is legendary, ditto their marketing department. If they didn't tweak the RAM settings for Procreate etc.(and Procreate issued a patch too), I wouldn't have bothered with an M1 iPad Pro, but they did. For my use, that's all I want.

I can understand people being upset/disappointed, I've been there. Now, I just focus on, Does it have the features I want? Yes? Consider buying it. If not, do not buy.

I know it's not that simple for some people. For me, I'll avoid ranting unless I have a valid reason now.
 
Last edited:

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
Your hope is unrealistic. Check out what is Windows 8 and how it failed.
Windows 8 failed because Microsoft made it a tablet-first OS on machines that were not tablets, and they did it without having any sort of tablet software ecosystem in place. They build an OS that was chasing after apps that they believed they could wish into existence, giving the OS a reason to exist.

I still remember the first time I booted up Windows 8 on my desktop and that horrid full-screen start menu full of giant tiles popped up to cover my entire screen. It was lunacy.

There is simply no comparison with the iPad, because the iPad already has the app ecosystem Microsoft always dreamed of. Suggesting that a more advanced iPad would fail because Windows 8 failed is just silly. Windows 8 failed because Microsoft build a playground no one wanted to play in and then forced it on everyone no matter how contextually inappropriate it was.

A lot of us don't want "macOS on iPad" we want "an iPad that works without a million ridiculous and arbitrary limitations."

Consider this. The 12.9" iPad Pro has literally the same internals as the MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, mini, and new iMac. Same CPU package, same RAM, same everything.

So, let's say I spend $2k+ on an iPad Pro, right? And it's awesome! And I love it! But then I realize that Scrivener for the iPad is just a pale imitation of Scrivener on the Mac, because of limitations inherent in iPad OS, and I can't do my work, maybe at all or maybe without jumping through a lot of ridiculous, arbitrary hoops.

In response, I put my $2k+ iPad Pro aside in frustration and pick up my MacBook Air that cost almost half as much, even though it has literally the same internals as the iPad, in order to accomplish a simple task that Apple has decided to make arbitrarily hard or impossible for the sole purpose of forcing me to buy the MacBook Air in the first place.

Apple -- and many of the people here -- say, "Well, buy both. Or just buy one or the other."

To which I and many others say, that's absurd. You've given me two devices that are functionally identical and yet you won't let me use one of them to its potential because of reasons no one can ever quite elucidate beyond, "Because they don't want you to."

The iPad Pro is capable of doing anything a Mac is and more, but Apple kneecaps it, charges more for it, and tells us it's for our own good.

What Apple is actually saying: "Oh, you need more functionality? Well, we could unlock that functionality on the device you already own, but we'd rather sell you this identical device in a slightly different physical enclosure that doesn't suffer from the limitations we impose on the one you bought!"

There is no reason at all the iPad Pro couldn't run the full version of any piece of Mac software at this point except that Apple has decided that they'd rather sell me two expensive devices instead of one. That's it, end of story, full stop. And they'll do it while patting themselves on the back about how green and environmentally responsible they are, to boot.

Ask yourself this: if it's okay to run iOS and iPad OS apps on the Mac, why not the other way around? If I've got an M1 with 16GB of RAM, what difference should it make whether it's enclosed inside an iPad or a MacBook?

Of course, I'm not angry at Apple about it. They don't owe me a device that makes logical sense or is better for the environment. But I'm not going to pretend they're not full of crap, either.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,991
20,174
UK
I think it confirms apple will not be making it put for a PC. It will give something as close as you can get.

IPadOS could do with windows but if you want that you really need a Mac.

Chances of them doing something like dex simply isn’t happening I guess
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4sallypat

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
I think it confirms apple will not be making it put for a PC. It will give something as close as you can get.

IPadOS could do with windows but if you want that you really need a Mac.

Chances of them doing something like dex simply isn’t happening I guess
That makes no sense to me. There's no reason the iPad Pro couldn't dual boot macOS. None at all. If Apple is so dead seat against having a touch interface on a macOS device, shut off the touchscreen when the iPad is booted into macOS, I don't really care. For me, I'd rather have one device.

That's the Holy Grail Microsoft has been chasing for twenty years, but they could never get there. Apple could, but they choose not to. The iPad Pro is so close to being the only device I need (aside from my phone, of course), and it's galling that the only reason it's not the only device is need is because Apple wants to sell me a Mac.

Also, they allow Macs to run iOS apps (often quite poorly) and have even cobbled together an interface to get around not having a touchscreen, so why won't they put some of that effort into allowing Mac apps to run on the iPad Pro? The answer is as simple as it is obvious: you're not going to skip buying an iPhone because you can run an iPhone app on your Mac, but you might skip buying a Mac if you could run Mac apps on your iPad.

Like I said in a previous comment, it's all about forcing you to buy two identical devices because they'd decided to hobble one of them with silly, arbitrary limitations. And they do it while crowing about how they care so much about the environment.
 

spiderman0616

Suspended
Aug 1, 2010
5,670
7,499
It would be good if Apple would make an app like photoshop and give photoshop some competition.

Well Gimp is better than nothing but not as good as photoshop.

Make it for the iPad pro and Mac.
Affinity Photo and Designer are both far better than Gimp and on par with Photoshop. They’ve been available and fully featured on iPad for years. I’ve used both a lot and they’re fantastic. It’s just that the mass market doesn’t seem to know or care. This is why Apple doesn’t push the iPad any harder—it’s pointless.

I think that the vast majority of people still think of the iPad as that device you sit on the couch with and flip through your photos. It’s hard to mentally erase that line between a traditional laptop and a tablet. There’s really not THAT much difference between what most people do with either device.
 

spiderman0616

Suspended
Aug 1, 2010
5,670
7,499
Many people on this thread are completely missing the point of why there’s an M1 chip in the iPad. It has nothing to do with macOS and everything to do with unification of ALL the hardware and software Apple makes. Almost everything they announced yesterday was cross-platform and cross-functional. THAT is why there’s an M1 in the iPad.
 

sparksd

macrumors G4
Jun 7, 2015
10,014
34,371
Seattle WA
Affinity Photo and Designer are both far better than Gimp and on par with Photoshop. They’ve been available and fully featured on iPad for years. I’ve used both a lot and they’re fantastic. It’s just that the mass market doesn’t seem to know or care. This is why Apple doesn’t push the iPad any harder—it’s pointless.

I think that the vast majority of people still think of the iPad as that device you sit on the couch with and flip through your photos. It’s hard to mentally erase that line between a traditional laptop and a tablet. There’s really not THAT much difference between what most people do with either device.

Agree. Most people I know who use an iPad are using it for email, browsing, reading, and YouTube.
 

PBG4 Dude

macrumors 601
Jul 6, 2007
4,363
4,645
Many people on this thread are completely missing the point of why there’s an M1 chip in the iPad. It has nothing to do with macOS and everything to do with unification of ALL the hardware and software Apple makes. Almost everything they announced yesterday was cross-platform and cross-functional. THAT is why there’s an M1 in the iPad.
There’s an M1 in the new iPad pros because Apple gets them cheaper in bulk. Why make a different chip just for iPad pros when they can just put the M1 SoC in there.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,991
20,174
UK
That makes no sense to me. There's no reason the iPad Pro couldn't dual boot macOS. None at all. If Apple is so dead seat against having a touch interface on a macOS device, shut off the touchscreen when the iPad is booted into macOS, I don't really care. For me, I'd rather have one device.

That's the Holy Grail Microsoft has been chasing for twenty years, but they could never get there. Apple could, but they choose not to. The iPad Pro is so close to being the only device I need (aside from my phone, of course), and it's galling that the only reason it's not the only device is need is because Apple wants to sell me a Mac.

Also, they allow Macs to run iOS apps (often quite poorly) and have even cobbled together an interface to get around not having a touchscreen, so why won't they put some of that effort into allowing Mac apps to run on the iPad Pro? The answer is as simple as it is obvious: you're not going to skip buying an iPhone because you can run an iPhone app on your Mac, but you might skip buying a Mac if you could run Mac apps on your iPad.

Like I said in a previous comment, it's all about forcing you to buy two identical devices because they'd decided to hobble one of them with silly, arbitrary limitations. And they do it while crowing about how they care so much about the environment.

Well yeah this is all about profit. Apple making it possible to use mac apps will make them realise some will just ditch their mac. MKBHD even said this in a video.
 

spiderman0616

Suspended
Aug 1, 2010
5,670
7,499
There’s an M1 in the new iPad pros because Apple gets them cheaper in bulk. Why make a different chip just for iPad pros when they can just put the M1 SoC in there.
That too. And the A14 itself already isn’t a ton different than the M1. These things are like super computers in our pockets.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gusping

gusping

macrumors 68020
Mar 12, 2012
2,020
2,307
There’s an M1 in the new iPad pros because Apple gets them cheaper in bulk. Why make a different chip just for iPad pros when they can just put the M1 SoC in there.
And it’s an A14X underneath anyway.
 

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
Well yeah this is all about profit. Apple making it possible to use mac apps will make them realise some will just ditch their mac. MKBHD even said this in a video.
The thing is, in my case crippling iPad OS to force me to buy a Mac is not helping their profits. Right now I have a 10.5" iPad Pro from 2017 that they've given me no reason to upgrade. I'm not willing to pay that much money for a slightly better screen to watch Netflix on while I work out, or to surf the web in bed or whatever, and given my workflow and the limitations of iPad OS, that's about all an iPad is good for in my case.

I figure my current iPad will still be able to surf the web a little bit and play Netflix videos for a good long time to come, and until they do something to make iPad OS less horrible, I have no interest in upgrading.

My other device is a 2018 15" MacBook Pro. For many years a software package I can't live without was Mac-only, but they've recently released a Windows version, and I keep a Windows machine around for gaming, so ... who knows. Maybe my time in the walled garden is nearing its inevitable end.
 

Bug-Creator

macrumors 68000
May 30, 2011
1,785
4,717
Germany
In response, I put my $2k+ iPad Pro aside in frustration and pick up my MacBook Air that cost almost half as much, even though it has literally the same internals as the iPad,

Lets be real, a 1k MBA does not have the same spec as 2k iPP.

And lets be even more real, if you spent 2k on an iPP to upgrade the storage/RAM beyond what you actually use just on the whim that something big might be released and than getting all knotted up when it does not happen on the specific date you insist it had to happen ... OR !!!! .....

?‍♂️
 

gusping

macrumors 68020
Mar 12, 2012
2,020
2,307
The thing is, in my case crippling iPad OS to force me to buy a Mac is not helping their profits. Right now I have a 10.5" iPad Pro from 2017 that they've given me no reason to upgrade. I'm not willing to pay that much money for a slightly better screen to watch Netflix on while I work out, or to surf the web in bed or whatever, and given my workflow and the limitations of iPad OS, that's about all an iPad is good for in my case.

I figure my current iPad will still be able to surf the web a little bit and play Netflix videos for a good long time to come, and until they do something to make iPad OS less horrible, I have no interest in upgrading.

My other device is a 2018 15" MacBook Pro. For many years a software package I can't live without was Mac-only, but they've recently released a Windows version, and I keep a Windows machine around for gaming, so ... who knows. Maybe my time in the walled garden is nearing its inevitable end.
Well said. I’m in a similar position as well. I recently built a gaming pc, which is funnily enough 100 times more reliable than my Mac mini running Big Sur (horrible horrible horrible). If it wasn’t for the little things like AirDrop i would ditch my Mac tomorrow and soak up the goodness of a 5900X and RTX 3080. At least until the M4X came out ;)
 

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
Lets be real, a 1k MBA does not have the same spec as 2k iPP.

And lets be even more real, if you spent 2k on an iPP to upgrade the storage/RAM beyond what you actually use just on the whim that something big might be released and than getting all knotted up when it does not happen on the specific date you insist it had to happen ... OR !!!! .....

?‍♂️
The CPU, GPU, and RAM in the iPad Pro is just the same as what you find in the Mac lineup.

And, I don't know why you'd think I expected anything from Apple, today or any other day. I read all those stories about how iPad OS 15 was going to give everyone puppies and rainbows and ice cream with sprinkles and laughed, because I knew all along it was a horrible joke people were playing on themselves.

I don't own any M1 devices, and I'm debating whether I ever will.
 

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
Yup, and yet so many people keep raising their expectations to unreal levels that Apple cannot hope to satisfy
I don't mean this to be insulting or combative, but that line gave me a chuckle, coming as it does from a moderator on a site that breathlessly regurgitated every little crumb of a rumor that sought to puff those people up, and will happily do so again at the next earliest opportunity.

You sound a bit like a drug dealer, mocking people for using so many drugs.
 

James Godfrey

macrumors 68020
Oct 13, 2011
2,068
1,710
I have always seen the iPad as a large formation of the iPhone, yes it is slowly and I mean SLOOOOWWWWLY departing from being a ‘large iPhone’ to being its own device in its own right.

For many users the iPad is perfect for their use case and is the only device they need other than their phone, just as much as many people are perfectly fine with a baseline MacBook Air or Pro

The problem is if they make the iPad too capable with software, it will likely destroy their low end Mac sales, and from a business perspective I can see exactly why they wouldn’t want too much advancement with the iPad.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gusping

Mockletoy

macrumors 6502a
Sep 26, 2017
622
1,922
Gothenburg, Sweden
I have always seen the iPad as a large formation of the iPhone, yes it is slowly and I mean SLOOOOWWWWLY departing from being a ‘large iPhone’ to being its own device in its own right.

For many users the iPad is perfect for their use case and is the only device they need other than their phone, just as much as many people are perfectly fine with a baseline MacBook Air or Pro

The problem is if they make the iPad too capable with software, it will likely destroy their low end Mac sales, and from a business perspective I can see exactly why they wouldn’t want too much advancement with the iPad.
Which is fine, and even make sense, but then you have Apple running "what's a computer?" ads and doing everything they can to suggest that the iPad can be your everything device, when in fact they're working diligently behind the scenes to keep that from being true. It just strikes me as super shady, especially now that the iPad and the Mac are internally identical for the first time ever.
 

Bug-Creator

macrumors 68000
May 30, 2011
1,785
4,717
Germany
but then you have Apple running "what's a computer?" ads and doing everything they can to suggest that the iPad can be your everything device,

Just because it can't be that for you doesn't it can't be true for other people. Heck if I look at what I do with computers that can't be classified as "dealing with IT for the purpose of dealing with IP" hobby I would have 0 problems going iPad only, heck even without keyboard/trackpad.
 

Ludatyk

macrumors 603
May 27, 2012
5,967
5,139
Texas
Well yeah this is all about profit. Apple making it possible to use mac apps will make them realise some will just ditch their mac. MKBHD even said this in a video.
Facts. I know it's a cliché thing to say... and as much as I enjoy being an iPad user, but I wish Steve Jobs was alive. iPad is being held back in favor of keeping the status quo.
 

spiderman0616

Suspended
Aug 1, 2010
5,670
7,499
I don't mean this to be insulting or combative, but that line gave me a chuckle, coming as it does from a moderator on a site that breathlessly regurgitated every little crumb of a rumor that sought to puff those people up, and will happily do so again at the next earliest opportunity.

You sound a bit like a drug dealer, mocking people for using so many drugs.
I wasn't going to say it, but......yeah.

Macrumors is far from the only offender, but rumormongering is where their bread is buttered, and they're one of the best at it. It's a racket.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.