Apple Pay Apple Pay in Germany

[Karma_isA_8itch]

There is no Tuesday the 12th

Last years event was rumored to be on the 12 th but this is very old news ;-)

Yep I made a mistake. I wanted to say cause keynotes generally happen on tuesdays or Wednesday’s and since Tuesday is 9/11 there is rumors about wednesday 12th to be the date.
[doublepost=1533920373][/doublepost]@sir-hd

Well I guess you should just switch banks and then look how friendly they are responding to you as soon as they get your letter that you cancel your account. there are Banks out there that really care about their customers seems Ing isn’t one of them.

 

[Mr-Fly]

Cause I do like the debit cards, to see the real actual balance...

Are you using a good Homebanking App? In my eyes seeing the actual balance is often a problem of a bad Homebanking solution.
Even if i have a credit card, I usually group them with the giro and can see the group balance. No problem with „seeing“ the balance.

 

[KarstenS]

Are you using a good Homebanking App? In my eyes seeing the actual balance is often a problem of a bad Homebanking solution.

For germany and iOS a good solution where you can group many banks together is Outbank.

 

[Alanin]

For germany and iOS a good solution where you can group many banks together is Outbank.

I used outbank earlier, and it sucks that you have to buy a new version every time... not that i don’t wanna pay for software, but that was kinda strange.

I use iFinance. But having a debit card being connected to the main account (with same bank) is just giving me a complete overview about my expenses and balance. No need to get another software just to keep the overview and doing banking with another one
[doublepost=1533936201][/doublepost]I don’t like to switch apps for doing banking stuff. Seing balance in one app, doing transfer in another one and getting the tan in a third one...

At the moment I have everything with ing diba and they have just one app where you to everything. Balance with all accounts (Tagesgeld, giro, stocks) and using their debit visa showing movements the second its payed at the shop. And on top of that you Even make Transfers with that app and authorise the Transfers.

 

[Mr-Fly]

But that’s exactly what I meant. You are using one Bank mainly and their app.
If you have more than one bank, that system sucks.
That’s why I always use a non bank app.
I use:
ing for stocks
DKB for main with more than one account (grouped into my account and the joint account)
N26
Revolut
Miles and More
Commerzbank (for local Access)

I try to use the best from all of the banks.
BTW. Banking4 is a one time Pay App.

 

[SenileBooster]

A multibanking app is just a multiplier for a possible data breach. I’d rather go with the hassle of switching apps as to trust a 3rd party with my backing credentials.

 

[Mr-Fly]

For me it depends on local HBCI vs. remote.
EG: Outbank and Banking4 use local, they connect the banks directly.
Finanzblick uses a kind of proxy and does not call the bank directly.
Most important for banks is the TaN Generation in my eyes. I would never use an app which combines. Ore of one TaN-Banks.
Tans are created mostly on a different device: transfer started on iPad, Tan generated on iPhone.

 

[Tobsen]

I use "HBCI mit Schlüsseldatei" with Commerzbank in MoneyMoney, so no TANs are needed.

 

[Mr-Fly]

I use "HBCI mit Schlüsseldatei" with Commerzbank in MoneyMoney, so no TANs are needed.

Ok, so it looks like MoneyMomey uses local download. As said, that's most important for me.

 

[-Maxim-]

Yep, a really bad response. I hate this saying "customer is king" (or I think you Germans also say "Kunde ist König", right?), because some take the liberty of thinking they are almighty and that the sun shines from their a**e. They also think they can treat employees like dirt. I hate that and have to side with shop assistants or call agents when that happens.

But in this case I don't like being treated like an idiot and expect a bank to respond to my emails and questions appropriately. I spent a lot of time writing a detailed and very friendly email to them and that response is not just putting me off banking with them, but has made me downright angry. If I had spammed them with hundreds or tens of emails: Ok. But not after one reply querying some of the points they responded to.

You could quote some of their answer and "go public" on twitter or other social media. Some pressure in public usually helps...

I don't like to do that either but sometimes that's the only way to get proper customer service nowadays. I once tried to get a problem solved with private emails to customer service for weeks (several emails back and forth) and it didn't work. Customer service got unfriendly. Posted on social media and not even 2 days later the problem was solved.
I know the situation here is a bit different but I telling the bank that you're not satisfied with their customer service is a valid point.

 

[4254126]

So, looks like Commerzbank/Comdirect will join in. Our dear Apple Pay friend (and journalist) Rudolf Linsenbarth, who accurately predicted the launch of Google Pay and Apple Pay (and says he has a contact in one of the banks - I assume it is Comdirect and/or Commerzbank), also tweeted recently that one of the direct banks Comdirect / ING / DKB will launch Apple Pay and the others will probably follow soon.

Today, Commerzbank and Comdirect gave an interview to DPA: https://www.heise.de/newsticker/mel...auch-Partnerschaft-mit-Apple-Pay-4133975.html

On a side note: Very interesting numbers from Comdirect regarding sign-ups for Google Pay -> 10.000 customers have signed up (for Google Pay) in just a few weeks. Not bad... Other banks such as ING would rather "watch and analyse".

I honestly can't see Commerzbank/Comdirect NOT launching on Apple Pay. I have a investment account with Comdirect, so could quickly open an account with them. I was also thinking about Commerzbank, as I could make a full switch from Sparkasse (and use their network of branches for cash deposits). I'm sure we haven't seen all the launch partners yet, the pressure is only just starting to build up on other banks...

 

[docfred]

10.000 out of 3,4 million, or about 200 a day. And about 50.000 transactions. which means, every Google Pay User only paid five times on average. Not quite a success story compared to the hype in social media and news papers.

I would wait about a year and then compare Google Pay, Apple Pay and the apps of BVR and DSGV. This would be very interesting.

My bet:
Apple Pay will have a much higher adoption rate than Google Pay.

 

[4254126]

No official confirmation, but this guy has been right about everything concerning Apple Pay this year: Rudolf Linsenbarth confirming via Twitter, that DKB will most certainly launch Apple Pay. Fits with what @DKB_Regulatory has been tweeting: "Lasst euch überraschen!" Also, Commerzbank and Comdirect are due to announce launching on Apple Pay in early September. With those three banks I would be more than happy!

The only thing I'm interested in: Will Girocard be ready for an Apple Pay launch in September/October? I can't see Apple settling purely for a launch with credit cards esp. in Germany. What would be great would be if banks started issuing MasterCard & VISA debit cards. I would switch away from Girocard right away and would prefer to use Apple Pay in daily usage through a debit card. There is hardly any reason to still use Girocard and the situations where it is required are getting less and less now, I find. And when I am in Germany I usually spend my time out in sticks in the south-west. To be honest: Contactless and MC/VISA acceptance is great here. Only place where I still need to grab some cash is the local bakery. Apart from that: I go all-in with Apple Pay. You can't even do that in the UK due to the silly £30 contactless limit (even with Apple Pay) which many retailers and shops still have.

 

[SenileBooster]

Rudolf also said that he would be surprised to hear about an ApplePay launch for Germany at the 07/31 earning call. Just saying.

https://twitter.com/holimuk/status/1024347484607459328?s=21

N26 -> MasterCard Debit
Deutsche Bank -> MasterCard Debit
Consorsbank -> Visa Debit
DKB -> Visa Debit

to name a few afaik there are more but those are the first to come to my mind.

 

[4254126]

DKB -> Visa Debit

The first three banks you mentioned are, apart from Commerzbank (MC Debit) the only ones that have a proper debit card by either MC or VISA. The DKB VISA is a regular credit card. The added benefit is, that you can top it up from your current account and use the credit you have on it.

ING also has a VISA "Debit", but it's actually chipped (and states clearly on the card) as a credit card. Transactions are withdrawn from the current account about 3-4 days later. So I would sort of put that in the debit card field as well. It will be interesting to see if these banks all push for these new debit cards as a replacement for the Girocard... We'll see.

Enough choice from the beginning and one of those banks will take my business (if DKB doesn't launch for some reason). Exciting times!

 

[SenileBooster]

In the end it is all about how clearing works.
The Fidor SmartCard ist Credit chiped too but is cleared like a debit. So best of both worlds.

 

[Focalor]

In the end it is all about how clearing works.
The Fidor SmartCard ist Credit chiped too but is cleared like a debit. So best of both worlds.

May the terminals not have some errors/problems with this?

 

[KarstenS]

May the terminals not have some errors/problems with this?

Boon. is also tagged as Credit, but internal it works like a Debit.

 

[4254126]

Boon. is also tagged as Credit, but internal it works like a Debit.

You sure? Last time I checked it comes up as a Prepaid card. And it doesn't work offline. I tried to buy a sandwich with boon. on my last BA flight and usually use Apple Pay with my HSBC Visa Debit without any problems. But with boon. it wouldn't work (as it also requires and online connection to authorise the payment and check the balance). Also explains why I have sometimes had some problems with acceptance abroad, yet my MC / VISA credit or debit cards worked fine (even in Apple Pay).

 

[KarstenS]

You sure?

When I pay with boon. in Apple Pay or in online shopping, the wording on the bill is "MASTERCARD".
When I use my Mastercard Debit of my bank, the wording on the bill is "MASTERCARD Debit".

 

[4254126]

When I pay with boon. in Apple Pay or in online shopping, the wording on the bill is "MASTERCARD".
When I use my Mastercard Debit of my bank, the wording on the bill is "MASTERCARD Debit".

Oh, right. Yeah, that doesn't mean much. It depends on what the terminal spits out. My bunq Maestro sometimes reads "Maestro Debit" or "Maestro contactless". I have checked the boon. card and it is "chipped" (as we don't have a physical card it's more difficult to tell) as a prepaid card. Explanation why that is so and how you can test: See above. BTW the Revolut cards are the same: That's why they don't work with 24/7 petrol stations that have a pay at pump service.

 

[KarstenS]

Oh, right. Yeah, that doesn't mean much. It depends on what the terminal spits out. My bunq Maestro sometimes reads "Maestro Debit" or "Maestro contactless". I have checked the boon. card and it is "chipped" (as we don't have a physical card it's more difficult to tell) as a prepaid card. Explanation why that is so and how you can test: See above. BTW the Revolut cards are the same: That's why they don't work with 24/7 petrol stations that have a pay at pump service.

Another thing is one McDonalds, where I'm eating from time to time.

Regular Mastercard works.
Boon. with Apple Pay works.
But the terminals doesn't accept my Debit Mastercard.

 

[SenileBooster]

Another thing is one McDonalds, where I'm eating from time to time.

Regular Mastercard works.
Boon. with Apple Pay works.
But the terminals doesn't accept my Debit Mastercard.

This is weird. Maybe it is only an offline POS and your Debit doesn’t support offline payments.

 

[KarstenS]

This is weird. Maybe it is only an offline POS and your Debit doesn’t support offline payments.

I've never seen a offline POS in Germany. As Girocard and ELV are the most popular cashless payments here, which don't work offline, I don't think such terminals are existing here at all. This one is definitively online, as I can instantly see the payment within the boon. and my onlinebanking app.

 

[SenileBooster]

I've never seen a offline POS in Germany. As Girocard and ELV are the most popular cashless payments here, which don't work offline, I don't think such terminals are existing here at all. This one is definitively online, as I can instantly see the payment within the boon. and my onlinebanking app.

There are more then enough POS Terminals with offline functionality here. And Girocard as well as ELV do work offline in the first place, just when your card is not eligible for offline payments or offline payments are not configured the payment is handled online.

In the case of your debit however I do think then that it is just a misconfigurated terminal. Happens often enough or problems with the payment processor. Who knows.