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retta283

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Jun 8, 2018
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This is excellent, thanks for sharing. I noticed today that a few sites that I use broke for me on Firefox, so decided it was finally time to make the switch to something else. Seems to work pretty well, a few of the broken sites are working again. Reddit still is the same as it was on Firefox, with most of the buttons doing nothing. Other than that, seems to work well.
Screen shot 2020-03-28 at 11.49.32 AM.png
Really love this look. Firefox 3 theme and it really matches with Snow Leopard again. You could probably put on a Google Chrome theme from 2011-12 if you were running this on Lion/ML, and keep it in the era. You can also change the icon to Chrome/old Firefox, too.
 
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wicknix

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Yeah the new reddit layout gives it the finger. You can work around that by using the old layout which works fine : old.reddit.com

Cheers
 
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retta283

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Yeah the new reddit layout gives it the finger. You can work around that by using the old layout which works fine : old.reddit.com

Cheers
Wasn't aware that the old one was still available. Wish more sites did that, as the old designs for many of them were a lot smoother/cleaner.
 
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@wicknix & z970mp (& al.) Hopefully you're all getting bored locked in your prison cells cosy homes, so I can get hold of some of your attention with more weird stuff.

1. On this site , the video at the top only appears, and the inline links to footnotes and the Sources and References menu at the bottom are only active if "Firefox/" in the User Agent string is set no higher than "/53.9". I worked this out starting from AF's Default UA: setting it to "/54" or higher inhibits these features. Is there a way to tweak things so that sites like this one accept the pretence of a higher version? I had normally been using "Fx 60.9 / NT 6.3", as once recommended by wicknix I believe. The idea is to avoid ending up having to keep a database of which sites work with which UAs. Btw., this same site doesn't care which Mac OS X version is set in the string, so I've set it to 10.12.

2. Size of the Profile's places.sqlite file. I've mentioned some time back how at some point it had been growing and shrinking between 31.5Mb and 49.1Mb. A few days ago, it went back to 49.1Mb — literally in front of my eyes. When I saw it happen, I quit AF, replaced the Profile folder with a fresh back-up from only two minutes earlier, relaunched AF, and within seconds, the file's size went again from 31.5 to 41.9. Repeated the operation several times, then deleted a few Bookmarks and the History over 6 months, but this didn't change anything: it has stubbornly remained the same 41.9Mb. Which doesn't seem to hurt, I now see, but it's still mind-boggling to watch it grow without any action on my part, always by the same 10.4Mb increment (filled with what?) Any explanation?

3. More observations re: AF crashes & videos, in the wake of the exchanges you were both having a little while back. There's no way around it, the two are definitely connected: lately, I have still been experiencing about one crash a day, but not one that wasn't video-related.

Stating the obvious: there are videos that A. “belong” to the site they appear on, or B. are embedded from external providers (say, Vimeo). Either way, some videos a. start playing without being asked to; b. only play when you press the Play button; c. don't play, but “churn” (i.e. give you a revolving wheel or something similar); or d. don't play and stay put — apparently.

B+c seems to be the worse case in terms of hijacking CPU power and not releasing it when you press the Stop button, or even after closing the tab. This practically always leads to AF crashing when quitting it, seemingly because it's unable to clear up that excess CPU use.

Case in point. A couple of days ago I opened two separate tabs following links in an article. Both of them had embedded Twitter videos. The first one played the video, so when that was done and I had closed the tab, I could watch CPU use go back down to the lower 1 or 2-digit values that are normal when AF is “at rest”. The second one did not play, did not even show the wheel, so I gave up after pressing back and forth a couple of times to try to get it working. But CPU use remained above 100% as per the scenario above, granting me the expected crash.

There are other cases and a variety of combinations, but these ones, with Twitter, were quite exemplary. I could also add a subdivision according to what can be visualized in DownThemAll, between I. sites where the video consists of one single downloadable file, and II. sites where it consists of a bunch of small segments which, I guess, are chained to each other during playback, but are useless when you download them. How this particularity entwines with a/b/c/d above, I cannot tell, but possibly II. is more likely to refuse to start playing.

YouTube is a bit of a different case. Just as I usually open all external links I'm interested in in an article before looking into the single tabs (instead of going back and forth), I open all the links to the videos from a YouTube channel that I wish to see before downloading them from their respective pages. But, as explained a few posts ago, loading too many of them in one go was causing AF to crash, so I have tried to avoid doing that.

Up to now, I wasn't getting the users' comments, just a churning wheel instead. I don't have a Google account, it wouldn't have mattered if it hadn't been distinctly slowing down the single page's loading. Using one cookie extension to replacing "Cookies denied…" with the default "1st party allowed etc." while “self-destructing YouTube's cookies after closing its tabs” with another extension, has taken care of this, so now the comments load immediately.

Not that it's foolproof: I still have had one case since of patiently loading one by one 6 or 7 YouTube tabs… and having AF crash after they were all done.

Happy (self-) isolation!
 

wicknix

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Unfortunately (or fortunately as i'm still able to pay my bills) i'm still working, so i don't have any "extra" free time from covid-19. Anyway, i still have no idea about places.sqlite. Only mozilla devs would be able to answer that one. However, as i mentioned in one of our PM's, i did find a 5 year old bug that never made it in to PM27 or AF concerning too many tabs with videos crashing the browser. It should make it in to the next AF release.


Cheers
 
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z970

macrumors 68040
Jun 2, 2017
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@RobJos I was always home-based, so the Coronaryvirus hasn't much affected my load either.

I see a lot of information in your post; all gathered from observation, trial and error, and the drive of an inquisitive mind.

That's all perfect fodder to start another Wiki, you know. Maybe one about optimal user agents for different tasks, certain about:config switches for specific use cases, or other adjustments to try to get the Web to behave differently.

Otherwise, my only suggestion for the video issue you described is to try experimenting around with different autoplay settings in about:config. That might give you favorable results with what you're trying to do.
 
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BurntSourdough

macrumors newbie
Apr 6, 2020
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Sorry but I don't have the patience to read every comment on every page and I do not mean to sound ungrateful for your efforts but why base Arctic Fox on Pale Moon rather than Firefox? Wouldn't that be a huge limiter on what you're able to acomplish and when and leave security updates and bug fixes always behind everyone else? I mean isn't the point to be a new browser for old Macs not a slightly less old browser for old Macs? If the reason is just to avoid having to personally remove some bloat of FF such as Pocket wouldn't Waterfox make a more modern starting point than PM? Though I am not sure if that's more stable than Basilisk but I assume it is. I have very little programming knowledge but PM from what I know of it just sounds like it would get in the way how it's based on fairly old FF codes and has some of it's own personal coding.

Also I had seen mentions of TFF but there is another browser I've heard of called Leopard-Webkit which is self explanatory what it's based on and meant for. I haven't used it yet personally though.
 
@RobJos I was always home-based, so the Coronaryvirus hasn't much affected my load either.

I see a lot of information in your post; all gathered from observation, trial and error, and the drive of an inquisitive mind.

That's all perfect fodder to start another Wiki, you know. Maybe one about optimal user agents for different tasks, certain about:config switches for specific use cases, or other adjustments to try to get the Web to behave differently.

Otherwise, my only suggestion for the video issue you described is to try experimenting around with different autoplay settings in about:config. That might give you favorable results with what you're trying to do.
More or less same situation here, z970mp. Thanks to both of you, and good to hear that you are among the lucky ones. Not like that friend of mine whose only keyboard broke down, so he's now waiting for the spare (that's in a so-called “developing country”). Or like the girls whose trade is reputedly the oldest in the world.

As for your kind suggestions for my future, I'd like to point out that there's a substantial difference between observing and reporting on the one hand, and experimenting on the other. Like, if under certain conditions my car acts funky on the freeway, I'll try to take notes and, especially as I don't know anything about its guts, I'll dutifully report to my good mechanic. Who will get her hands dirty. I know, crashes on computers are not quite the same as with automobiles, but they're a hassle, a big one at times.

As for the specific Wiki you're suggesting, it's beyond my abilities, but if you do come across one, or a similar endeavour, by all means let us know about it.
[automerge]1586168555[/automerge]
Sorry but I don't have the patience to read every comment on every page and I do not mean to sound ungrateful for your efforts but why base Arctic Fox on Pale Moon rather than Firefox? Wouldn't that be a huge limiter on what you're able to acomplish and when and leave security updates and bug fixes always behind everyone else? I mean isn't the point to be a new browser for old Macs not a slightly less old browser for old Macs? If the reason is just to avoid having to personally remove some bloat of FF such as Pocket wouldn't Waterfox make a more modern starting point than PM? Though I am not sure if that's more stable than Basilisk but I assume it is. I have very little programming knowledge but PM from what I know of it just sounds like it would get in the way how it's based on fairly old FF codes and has some of it's own personal coding.

Also I had seen mentions of TFF but there is another browser I've heard of called Leopard-Webkit which is self explanatory what it's based on and meant for. I haven't used it yet personally though.
I can only say something about Waterfox, a truly excellent browser that requires OSX 10.7 and higher. Two years ago a version that could run under Snow Leopard was being promised by the developer, but it never materialized. So a year ago I found out about AF. Waterfox still doesn't have a 10.6 version.
 
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wicknix

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Long story short... snow leopard is in the same boat as tiger and leopard. It's just too old, and it's sdk is too old to build anything more "modern". Firefox dropped 10.6 support back in 2016. Pale moon still supported 10.6 until mid 2018. It made more sense to use the 2 year newer patched up code base than 4 year old FF45/48 code. Waterfox, basilisk, etc will never build or run on 10.6. They all require 10.7 or higher. Leopard WebKit was meant for 10.5 powerpc and hasn't worked on 10.6 in probably 5-6 years. So, it's this, or nothing. ;)

Cheers
 

BurntSourdough

macrumors newbie
Apr 6, 2020
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So what prevented Waterfox or any other modern browser (for lack of a better term) from ever getting a Snow Leopard release even though they said they would do it? Is it the chipsets that hold development back for browsers or is it the OS itself? So that means AF had to be stuck on a patched old code otherwise it would require going on it's own path which is too time costly? Am I understanding correctly? That's fine though as long as security updates are made for the worst exploits asap as they appear and as long as it's stable and not running worse than the last release of Firefox that runs.

Well there also is Roccat apparently but as far as Firefox fork based browsers sure only one.
 

wicknix

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Roccat really isn't an updated "browser". It's a front end for WebKit. So basically, it still uses safaris built in WebKit engine, which in snow leopards case is ancient. If you use roccat on 10.15 it would use 10.15's built in webkit, which is current.

The snow leopard OS, it's xcode and sdk (used to build software), are just too old and lacking the stuff needed to build newer FF or it's variants. So backporting FF bug fixes, security updates etc is what we are left with. It's not perfect, but it's the only currently maintained browser available for 10.6 (Other than tensixfox, but that's still just plain FF45 without tenfourfox updates).

Cheers
 
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BurntSourdough

macrumors newbie
Apr 6, 2020
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Ah I see. Thanks for explaining.

Did PM or your AF fix this small security major privacy issue I found in Firefox some years back? I'm not sure if it was a bug or a poorly designed feature. What I discovered was FF when it created screen shot thumbnails of pages visited for use on the top sites page they were stored to a folder somewhere and stayed there always and forever. I had found thousands of images of what seemed to be every website ever visited and had to manually delete them. Only way as a normal user to solve that preventing more from being made was to break the thumbnail screenshot function in about:config by adding some boolean or string, I forgot what since I can't find it anymore as some update in the past must have erased it. This workaround resulted in top sites lacking images for them but there must have been a better fix on the code level. Do you know what I'm talking about?
 
So what prevented Waterfox (…) from ever getting a Snow Leopard release even though they said they would do it?
My 'topence: not a clue. I know that the developer intended to, but apparently he just gave up. You'd have to ask him.
Did PM or your AF fix this small security major privacy issue I found in Firefox some years back? I'm not sure if it was a bug or a poorly designed feature. What I discovered was FF when it created screen shot thumbnails of pages visited for use on the top sites page they were stored to a folder somewhere and stayed there always and forever. I had found thousands of images of what seemed to be every website ever visited and had to manually delete them. Only way as a normal user to solve that preventing more from being made was to break the thumbnail screenshot function in about:config by adding some boolean or string, I forgot what since I can't find it anymore as some update in the past must have erased it. This workaround resulted in top sites lacking images for them but there must have been a better fix on the code level. Do you know what I'm talking about?
Thanks for this, very interesting indeed. There's a member of my family who uses Waterfox. Just yesterday, as we were discussing file sizes in the Profile folders of Firefox forks, she discovered in her own profile a 47Mb file, larger than anything else in there, by the name of favicons.sqlite — a preposterous size when you know how much an .ico file actually fills: it must have kept the .ico of every single site visited since the beginning of time. She erased it and after launching Waterfox again it rebuilt itself to a modest 5Mb, the minimum necessary to function I suppose.

So: Long Live The Wicknix and his concern for removing all unnecessary and disreputable crud!

@wicknix: curiosity, does AF stash the .ico information in places.sqlite too — maybe together with each single bookmark and history item?
 

BurntSourdough

macrumors newbie
Apr 6, 2020
10
0
For some weird reason the Github page won't load on my Mac unless I go through a proxy and when i try to download it Google Drive gives me an error unless i get off the proxy hah

Okay so on 10.6.8 Intel processor Arctic Fox won't let me install adons from Pale Moon. What gives? I only tried with a few themes including ones specifically suggested to use with no luck and will maybe try uBlock origin later once I understand what version I'm supposed to install.

If I find any time I may attempt to make a new icon for AF unless I find a suitable one already made.

@RobJos
In my case it was a folder with ordinary png or possibly jpg files and if I recall right I found it in a location away from other Firefox files. Sadly I can't recall but it was possibly in a temp folder. I guess that maybe changed to that favicins.sqlite file in later versions but I can't be sure. It's possible going by name that file contains the website icons that appear in the tabs but I couldn't imagine it getting that large easily if that was just it because they are so small. Upon looking up again what I possibly originally did you or your friend can disable the thumbnail screen by going to about:config right-click on the page and create a new boolean pref and name it browser.pagethumbnails.capturing_disabled then set to true.
 
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Okay so on 10.6.8 Intel processor Arctic Fox won't let me install adons from Pale Moon. What gives?
No problem with my SnL. I don't have the time to go through them all right now, but take a look af my posts #312 (some have changed since) and #750. Or do a search on this thread for “addon(s)”.
I only tried with a few themes including ones specifically suggested to use with no luck and will maybe try uBlock origin later once I understand what version I'm supposed to install.
v. 1.16.4.20
@RobJos
Upon looking up again what I possibly originally did you or your friend can disable the thumbnail screen by going to about:config right-click on the page and create a new boolean pref and name it browser.pagethumbnails.capturing_disabled then set to true.
Thanks, I'll pass the info. Although it seems that it would keep any favicons (is that the same as thumbnails?) from being recorded, and, well, they're kind of useful…
 

wicknix

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@BurntSourdough you need the versions released for v27 (not 28 or 29). For instance, the theme MacMoon, on the lower right of the page it says "addon releases (version history)", click that, then look for the ones made for 27. Same for any extension. In this case version 2.3.0 was the last compatible version.
addons.png

Cheers
 

BurntSourdough

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Apr 6, 2020
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@BurntSourdough you need the versions released for v27
Oh oops. So that is what went wrong. Seems to work now. Is AF going to be perma stuck on being equivalent of version 27 of PM or is that just where you're at in development right now? Since I'm not sure how much PM differs in code from FF at this point of it's development. Though you're keeping security up to date through various means if I understand correctly.
 

wicknix

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PM27 was the last to work on 10.6, so we are unable to advance to 28 or the upcoming 29 code base. Basically AF is pretty much equivalent to tenfourfox. Not only in code base similarities, but patches and security fixes.

Cheers
 
@ Giuliano C: maybe of interest to you? ViewTube +, v.2020.03.01, which has to be imported after installing the Greasemonkey for Pale Moon 3.31.4 addon, is an extra to ViewTube that allows you to download videos from sites like these:

video.repubblica.it
gelocal.it
video.corriere.it
altoadige.it
ilfattoquotidiano.it
mediasetplay.mediaset.it

youreporter.it

I haven't had a chance to try it yet, but if it works as well as ViewTube itself, there should be no problem.
 
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bobesch

macrumors 68020
Oct 21, 2015
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I've installed openSUSE Tumbleweed/KDE today on my early 2008 MacBookPro4,1 A1260 running in a virtual machine with Fusion,
and I was quite amazed about the responsiveness in this certain situation.
The KDE desktop offers the option to nearly switch off most graphical effects. XFCE might be even faster ...?
Has anyone tried the openSUSE Tumbleweed PPC-version on a PowerBookG4?
 
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