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Other Eye-strain while using iPhone X and up
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I do have to say that it is disappointing that this is the fourth OLED generation and the most we get in the way of a solution is possibly a 60Hz mode on iPhone 12 Pro that’s active between 21-50% brightness. I haven’t seen it confirmed that the other iPhone 12 models have the same 60Hz mode, which Notebookcheck said attempts to mitigate the PWM as much as possible, although I would assume that the standard iPhone 12 would as well if they use the same panel.
iPhone 12 Pro Max is basically everything I’ve wanted in an iPhone since I was a kid, with an all-screen design and OLED display.
Keep in mind I was the type of kid that would visit the Sony store in NYC to look at their $2500 11” OLED television, which at the time was cutting-edge, and also the type of kid that sold his Nintendo DS and Zune on eBay at 12 to be able to afford the first-generation iPhone.
It is a shame because the phone itself would be fantastic if there was a way to disable the PWM. I’m not opposed to trying a smaller phone, especially if the mode that’s “similar to DC dimming” is exclusive to the 6.1” Pro model. At this point I would upgrade just to be able to get a phone without flickering, so if iPhone 13 switches to LTPO and that does the most to mitigate the effects that we’ve seen so far then I would likely go back to upgrading every year instead of holding onto iPhone 12 for 2-3 years.
Few products make me as happy as a new iPhone, and I especially loved iPhone X, so as much as I enjoy using iPhone 12 Pro Max there’s no way I’d be able to use a phone that causes me to fight through migraines to be able to use it. The more concerning part is that those migraines last all-day. It’s mind-blowing to me that so many people are able to use these phones without any headaches or migraines when it causes so many issues for me, but I’ve been using iPhones for 4-6 hours a day for 13 years since I was a kid and I’ve always been sensitive to changes in the display in that every generation I would compare the display to the older model and notice any differences in color temperature, contrast, etc. — and my observations would always be accurate. For example, I noticed the black level being higher on iPhone 8 Plus compared to iPhone 7 Plus and also the same on iPhone 11 vs iPhone XR. Also the warmer color temperature on iPhone 3G vs the original iPhone. I wasn’t even aware PWM would be an issue once Apple switched to OLED.
I would like to see a solution sooner rather than later. I’d order an iPhone 12/12 Pro to compare and to see how well the 60Hz mode works but I hate going through multiple phones, especially since I most likely won’t be able to keep any of them. It’s frustrating because the Pro Max would a be fantastic phone if only staring at the display didn’t cause migraines and tension headaches, and there’s still no option in Accessibility.
iPhone 12 Pro Max is basically everything I’ve wanted in an iPhone since I was a kid, with an all-screen design and OLED display.
Keep in mind I was the type of kid that would visit the Sony store in NYC to look at their $2500 11” OLED television, which at the time was cutting-edge, and also the type of kid that sold his Nintendo DS and Zune on eBay at 12 to be able to afford the first-generation iPhone.
It is a shame because the phone itself would be fantastic if there was a way to disable the PWM. I’m not opposed to trying a smaller phone, especially if the mode that’s “similar to DC dimming” is exclusive to the 6.1” Pro model. At this point I would upgrade just to be able to get a phone without flickering, so if iPhone 13 switches to LTPO and that does the most to mitigate the effects that we’ve seen so far then I would likely go back to upgrading every year instead of holding onto iPhone 12 for 2-3 years.
Few products make me as happy as a new iPhone, and I especially loved iPhone X, so as much as I enjoy using iPhone 12 Pro Max there’s no way I’d be able to use a phone that causes me to fight through migraines to be able to use it. The more concerning part is that those migraines last all-day. It’s mind-blowing to me that so many people are able to use these phones without any headaches or migraines when it causes so many issues for me, but I’ve been using iPhones for 4-6 hours a day for 13 years since I was a kid and I’ve always been sensitive to changes in the display in that every generation I would compare the display to the older model and notice any differences in color temperature, contrast, etc. — and my observations would always be accurate. For example, I noticed the black level being higher on iPhone 8 Plus compared to iPhone 7 Plus and also the same on iPhone 11 vs iPhone XR. Also the warmer color temperature on iPhone 3G vs the original iPhone. I wasn’t even aware PWM would be an issue once Apple switched to OLED.
I would like to see a solution sooner rather than later. I’d order an iPhone 12/12 Pro to compare and to see how well the 60Hz mode works but I hate going through multiple phones, especially since I most likely won’t be able to keep any of them. It’s frustrating because the Pro Max would a be fantastic phone if only staring at the display didn’t cause migraines and tension headaches, and there’s still no option in Accessibility.
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Same. Been using iPhones since the 4, and I've always loved getting the new one every year. It's really frustrating being stuck on the 8 for the foreseeable future, (I can't even use the XR or 11), I really wish Apple would take pity on us and address this issue 😐
Truth be told I absolutely love iPhone 12 Pro Max, just as I loved iPhone X despite all of the issues. The stainless steel body makes it feel like a piece of fine jewelry, and the OLED display is closer to perfect in terms of color, contrast, and viewing angle. The problem is that I have to essentially medicate myself to be able to use it.
I have a long list of observations from further use of iPhone 12 Pro Max so I’m going to detail them all below:
The more time I spend with iPhone 12 Pro Max the more I grow accustomed to it and am able to use it, but I still have issues focusing on text and notice the occasional migraine/headache (at least once per minute) even while typing this. I feel like my brain tries to adjust to the flicker, and this is what causes migraines that are prevalent after use and persist for hours. Probably not smart for long-term use. As much as I’d like to, I really don’t see myself using this phone for the next year or two.
I do notice the improved color and contrast on the display, since on iPhone X it bothered me from a perfectionist standpoint that the black coating on the glass didn’t make it appear as dark as the black bezels, so it didn’t blend in as seamlessly as it could have. Really the next consideration for them with the display is to finally eliminate PWM.
HDR 4K Dolby content looks and sounds absolutely amazing on the device itself. The experience is better than the average theater, and certainly significantly better than the LED Samsung TV in my living room. It’s smart for them to add an OLED display to every iPhone device since it makes movies and games that much more enjoyable.
I’ve recently purchased an iPad Air, which I was enjoying until I started using iPhone 12 Pro Max. Suddenly the display looks dull in comparison and the stainless steel build feels more premium than the aluminum design.
Pro-level phones shouldn’t have PWM, and that could be enough to justify the price difference. I’ve come up with a long list of potential solutions in the past. I assume that if a brightness controller exists that could solve this issue, then they don’t find that it’s worth the cost to implement it which is disappointing. Even if they only added a pricey brightness controller i.e. to the Max models it could be a start.
I’ve noticed that while the Reduce White Point setting in Accessibility made the colors and contrast on iPhone X pop even more, it just makes them appear off on iPhone 12 Pro Max and has no real utility. I believe Apple designed a PWM implementation specifically for this setting with no benefit to mitigating the effect and there is no reason to enable it for those affected by PWM. This is also a testament to the more vibrant display.
If I ended up keeping iPhone 12 Pro Max I know this phone would take over my life and I’d have to treat my headaches/migraines on a nearly 24/7 basis, which is disappointing since I would love to use a flicker-free version. Speaking of, I feel like I would immensely enjoy a PWM-free version of iPhone 12 Pro Max since I do feel like the phone itself could improve my quality of life. As much as I’m trying to live outside of my phone the features and design make me happy, migraines aside.
P.S. I had no issues with iPhone 11, but I still felt it was too much of a a compromise. The OLED models are so much better.
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By all means try an iPhone 12 but personally I found it just as bad as the X, XS, 11 Pro with regards to instant reaction resulting in a migraine. The 12 Pro Max less so. I don't believe Apple really has done anything to mitigate PWM.
Their priority appears to be colour and contrast while avoiding screen burn - and trying to keep within a set of tolerances in what seems like a continues stream of inconsistent manafactuering quality. Did you get a overly yellow/red/green screen, or something nearer white?
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I probably won’t since it’s just wishful thinking that the 60Hz mode would be enough to eliminate migraines.
Did you try keeping iPhone 12 Pro between 21-50% brightness? In theory that could make it usable if it was similar enough to DC dimming since the higher brightness would only be used while outdoors.
It is kind of odd being able to see the text flicker while typing this on iPhone 12 Pro Max at 25% brightness.
I’d say it’s more yellow, which is to the proper specification. I originally thought it looked overly yellow with Night Shift enabled, but I’ve since adjusted. Personally I prefer a warmer display.
I had the standard 12 and I use my devices with auto brightness. I'm not trying to jump through hoops to fit to a device, the device has to fit with me. My eyes hated it so it was quickly returned.
I'm equally crushed I've been unable to use any OLED iphone but I can't keeping doing this dance personally. If a device can make you feel ill it has no place in your life. But I could care less it is OLED, it's just because this is what is in the flagships, and I want the best Apple has to offer.
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Night shift and True Tone seems like a joke, almost like Siri. I read what Apple intended with these features but they don't deliver. Why would I want my screen to look dark and tea stained orange? I personally prefer cool whites but every year the display gets yellower and yellower. But I've equally seen the overly red/yellow displays and the nasty green/yellow ones. I don't really get the love for OLED on a small handheld device as you cannot escape the instant colour shift.
Give me an LCD Pro Max and I'd be very happy.
But I'd overlook the OLED flaws (my opinion) if I could use the iPhones with it, so I could have the top spec model. The XR and 11 are flawed to me as they have an 828p display and I can see the drop in resolution so I'm not settling for that.
So for me, 2021 is now the time to try an Android phone to see if it is infact Apples spec, given to Samsung, that is creating an unusable display. I really don't want to leave iOS but until Apple correct the problem, or bring an alternative display.....I need a new modern phone.
Sorry to hear the 12 Pro Max is a no go, well unless you plan on having a regular headache?
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It’s frustrating because while it still gives me migraines and headaches I also enjoy this device probably more than anything I’ve purchased all-year. I really enjoy these new iPhones, which is understandable considering that I’ve been an iPhone enthusiast since the original keynote. The stainless steel design and OLED display make it feel like something special.
iPhone 8 Plus is probably my least favorite out of every iPhone, but it has modern features like True Tone and wireless charging so I suppose I’ll be stuck with it until 2024.
I personally enjoy the display shifting to an even warmer color temperature, and I’ve adjusted to it so it doesn’t look obviously yellow. I have it enabled at the default setting on all of my iOS devices.
I may give iPhone 12 Pro Max a chance for a little while longer, but I already know the most likely outcome. It’s simply not practical to continue using a phone that causes regular headaches.
I’ve read that the average person picks up their phone 28 times per day, so there’s no way that somebody who’s sensitive to PWM would be able to use an OLED iPhone without it affecting their daily life. It’s still surprising to me that there aren’t more people out there that are sensitive to the flickering, and that people can even use these phones without chronic headaches.
Apple could make a LCD display with a 458ppi and best-in-class black levels/contrast (the latest MacBook Pro has an excellent display) but it still wouldn’t look as good as OLED, and I believe we‘re past that point especially as it requires a larger design footprint. It would be better for them to invest in new flicker-free display technologies.
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Hey all,
I finished the survey I mentioned in this post^ (Thanks to MichaelSD for assisting with some questions
) The goal is to help us catalog our issues and potentially identify some kind of pattern or solution. If you have the time, it'd be really helpful if you guys could fill it out. As soon as we have a good amount of responses, I can post the data so we can discuss the results.I've also cross-posted this in a few other eye strain threads (The XR, X, & MacBook strain ones) to see if there's some kind of common link. If we get enough data, perhaps we could share it with Apple directly?
Apple Eye Strain Survey
This form is designed for Apple users who have specific eye strain issues with iPhones, iPads, and Macs. Some potential causes for this eye strain may be PWM, Temporal Dithering, LCD Inversion, or some other unknown issue. The goal of this survey is to gather data on these issues and potentially...
forms.gle
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I know that for me it’s definitely the PWM. I don’t have issues with any other Apple products, including iPhone 11.Hey all,
I finished the survey I mentioned in this post^ (Thanks to MichaelSD for assisting with some questions
I've also cross-posted this in a few other eye strain threads (The XR, X, & MacBook strain ones) to see if there's some kind of common link. If we get enough data, perhaps we could share it with Apple directly?
Apple Eye Strain Survey
This form is designed for Apple users who have specific eye strain issues with iPhones, iPads, and Macs. Some potential causes for this eye strain may be PWM, Temporal Dithering, LCD Inversion, or some other unknown issue. The goal of this survey is to gather data on these issues and potentially...
I must be in a very small group since I can visibly see the flickering quite a bit often. The display on iPhone 12 Pro Max is fantastic otherwise and the feel of the phone in the hand is second to none, which it makes it all the more painful that I’m still waking up with migraines because of it.
I‘ve heard of some people adjusting to the flicker over time, but I don’t think that’s going to happen for me. It’s so much more comfortable staring at my 8+ or iPad Air.
No, I don't think there is any adjusting to it. I currently have the 11Pro Max and get mild symptoms. My symptoms are much better than when I used the XS Max and X. I've been using the 11PM for exactly a year, and my symptoms haven't gone away. It's bearable, but I would prefer zero symptoms. I just ordered a 12 Pro Max and going to try that, if that doesn't work out, then try the 12 Pro.
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I got my daughter an 11, and thankfully she doesn’t take after me where that lcd screen inexplicably gave me a headache. Sucks to be on an 8+, but that’s my only option right now besides Android
I am considering trying iPhone 12 Pro only because it apparently has a 60Hz mode at lower brightnesses that doesn’t seem to be on iPhone 12 Pro Max. There’s a one-month turnaround on online orders so it may be worth waiting to see what further improvements are made on iPhone 13, although I am a fan of the design this year.
The funny part is this quote is from 2009 in reference to iPhone 3GS.
Apparently I’ve wanted OLED in an iPhone for a very long time, meanwhile we have it on iPhone 12 and I’m still fighting through migraines to be able to use it.
Don't. That seems like a bad idea for your physical and mental health in my opinion. I equally want to use the latest and greatest but is it really worth the risk and hassle?
You've tried what apple has to offer for 2020/2021 and it hasn't worked out. Many of us in the same boat sadly.
No device designed to make your life easier should have a negative impact on your quality of life. It is just a phone/tablet at the end of the day and there are other products on the market.
Absolutely correct.
I've been very happy with the latest iPhone SE. I love the size. I've also been trying to make the phone be a less relevant part of my life so when the inevitable happens, it won't be so hard to move to a non-PWM Android phone.
Agreed. I had the same thought last night: that at the end of the day it’s just a phone and it’s not worth compromising mental/physical health over it.
I still do think iPhone 12 Pro may do enough over the Max to be the most usable OLED iPhone to date, but I can’t confirm without testing it. That’s not to say it wouldn’t cause headaches, and I probably should wait until migraines aren’t even a consideration. I suppose I’m getting slightly impatient.
If it wasn’t for this issue I’d probably still be upgrading annually, and these past four generations of iPhone are by far the nicest Apple has ever made. Part of me wishes I had owned a gold iPhone XS and a Midnight Green iPhone 11 Pro, but there are people out there still rocking iPhone 4’s so I’m probably looking at it from the wrong perspective.
I’ve been considering the iPhone SE since I tried it in an Apple Store when it came out and it has the best LCD Apple’s ever shipped on an iPhone in terms of color/contrast (which Notebookcheck’s measurements back up).
I’m just trying to be mindful of returns since I’m not sure once I get my hands on one I’d want to trade my 8+ for it. I wouldn’t mind as much trying 2-3 different iPhones this year if I knew for a fact I’d be keeping one.
There are definitely variances between every model. While I’ve stayed away from OLED models even in store demos, I did notice that I was able to use an iPhone 11 Pro for a few seconds without getting the instant migraine I would on iPhone 11 Pro Max.
The higher PWM frequency on iPhone 12 Pro along with the 60Hz mode makes me want to try it, but I’m not sure the outcome would be any different. There are also other considerations beyond frequency such as amplitude, and iPhone 12 Pro seems to be the best in this regard as well.
I’m using iPhone 12 Pro Max to type this now and I notice fewer migraines the more I become accustomed to it so I’d probably keep it if it didn’t still cause migraines after use. It’s not as bad as iPhone X where I’d go to bed and still have a constant migraine, although I do find myself waking up with a migraine/headache. Migraines are still unavoidable for me with this display, even after staring at a notification for a second.
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My 8+ feels clunky and outdated. Next year is probably the last year I can realistically use it. I’m pretty sure the se 2 plus will never release, so it’s back to android most likely.
I don't think this outfit is very good at recording accurate readings as they been caught out misreading the rate for the 11 Pro but this info has been shared so many times its never been corrected.
But 100% agree these rates are very low and the reason it's a huge issue for those sensitive (and I'm starting to think more people are affected but don't know it's there phone/tablet/monitor which is the cause).
I don't hate my 7 Plus, in fact I prefer it's form factor over the fat 11. But I do wish I had newer hardware that was faster with better speakers and camera.
I'm looking to the S21 Plus or Ultra in the new year, if I can handle the PWM on one of these phones I'm all in and will also get a Galaxy watch.
A damn shame especially with the new M1 chips appearing as I would be on a 12 Pro Plus, Apple Watch 6 and Macbook Pro if I could use the new iPhones. With that missing piece I'm not investing into Apple anymore.
SE Mark 3 will come but it will likely be built are around the XR, 11 parts in 2022.