iPad Pro If we don't get Final Cut for the M1 iPad Pro at WWDC, I am closing the book on this experiment.

[Unregistered 4U]

I mean everything is down this year due to lots of issues even smartphones. The fact is Apple would not let go of the Mac like they did to the iPod.

Apple will keep making the Mac until it’s no longer selling in large enough numbers to make the Mac. Right now, with Apple Silicon that “lowest profitable number” has dropped compared to Intel machines. I’m thinking they could keep making the Mac even if they were only selling 5 million a year. Much below that, and they’ll put the last version of macOS on a modified iPad and let it ride out into the sunset.

 

[GuruZac]

So people are getting iPads Pro because they need all that M1 power to run Blender, Premiere Pro or Final Cut?

Oh, wait, it doesn’t run those or really anything comparable.

Please explain to me why anyone is choosing a $799+ Pro over other iPads if it’s not because of Apple marketing it as a “Pro” device and boasting about its high end features (that are pointless since it runs the same apps as the non-Pro iPads).

Nope. I buy iPad Pros to have 120Hz display, 12.9" canvas for the years of Notability use as a pre-med and medical student, and to use the better peripherals (now not the case with the iPad Air). I definitely wasn't trying to look cool, although, admittedly the iPad Pro with Magic Keyboard is a cool piece of kit. I also wanted miniLED display because my wife and I use my iPad Pro for movies and the display does look better.

 

[GuruZac]

Apple will keep making the Mac until it’s no longer selling in large enough numbers to make the Mac. Right now, with Apple Silicon that “lowest profitable number” has dropped compared to Intel machines. I’m thinking they could keep making the Mac even if they were only selling 5 million a year. Much below that, and they’ll put the last version of macOS on a modified iPad and let it ride out into the sunset.

I have been on this forum for almost 7 years and I think there is more enthusiasm about Mac than there has been since I've been here. I would argue Mac sales will only increase with all the new designs, new models (Mac Studio) Apple silicon, and macOS improvements. I know some don't like the direction macOS has gone, but I love it. I find it more consistent across devices without sacrificing any of the functionality, at least for my needs.

 

[Vjosullivan]

True, then again, the iPad was never meant for laptop replacement, but as an aide.

It's up to the customers to decide what it's for. It's up to Apple to support its customers.

 

[eqquito]

I see a kid using and iPad as more of an enhanced pen & paper notebook. Rather than a laptop. Also, notice the ad never calls the iPad a computer or laptop. That's cause it's not meant for that.

This backfired on Apple and it was too late when they realized it. Also, Microsoft and Samsung are giving Apple a run for their money since they have a full Operating System or DeX on a tablet about the same size as an iPad Pro.

 

[Vjosullivan]

´Pro’ is merely a moniker to show the best of the best. It’s laughable that people on a site like macrumours can’t see this.

Expensivest of the expensive is probably a better definition.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

This backfired on Apple and it was too late when they realized it. Also, Microsoft and Samsung are giving Apple a run for their money since they have a full Operating System or DeX on a tablet about the same size as an iPad Pro.

Microsoft and Samsung? I think both wish they had 1/5th the sales of the iPad. And, after researching the DeX, the only folks that bring up DeX are those that haven’t researched it.

 

[ApplesAreSweet&Sour]

It's up to the customers to decide what it's for. It's up to Apple to support its customers.

?

 

[sparksd]

Microsoft and Samsung? I think both wish they had 1/5th the sales of the iPad. And, after researching the DeX, the only folks that bring up DeX are those that haven’t researched it.

1/5th? Apple has about 54% of the tablet market, Samsung 28%.

https://gs.statcounter.com/vendor-market-share/tablet/worldwide

 

[Unregistered 4U]

I have been on this forum for almost 7 years and I think there is more enthusiasm about Mac than there has been since I've been here. I would argue Mac sales will only increase with all the new designs, new models (Mac Studio) Apple silicon, and macOS improvements. I know some don't like the direction macOS has gone, but I love it. I find it more consistent across devices without sacrificing any of the functionality, at least for my needs.

Oh, there’s no doubt there’s enthusiasm, the site’s name is MacRumors not iPadRumors after all But, enthusiasm here does not necessarily equate to more sales in the broader market. This year, while still not normal, is likely to provide some valuable insight into how many people that don’t currently own a Mac are interested in buying one (right now, that’s around 10 million a year).

 

[ApplesAreSweet&Sour]

This is just simply not true. We are living in the age of record Mac sales.

Everyone and their mother has some kind of MacBook in their home, most likely a 13” Air or some kind of Pro.

The M1 Frankensteined Intel Macs made for one of best selling lines of personal computers ever.

Amazing price and performance packaged in beatiful high quality designs.

I can’t walk into a home or classroom anywhere without seeing some kind of M1 Mac. They’re everywhere.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

1/5th? Apple has about 54% of the tablet market, Samsung 28%.

https://gs.statcounter.com/vendor-market-share/tablet/worldwide

First, I stand corrected, though I’d still say that Samsung is not giving Apple much of a “run” with those sales numbers. Second, OH WOW! Microsoft is in the 6% of “other”? Sheesh!

 

[sparksd]

Everyone and their mother has some kind of MacBook in their home, most likely a 13” Air or some kind of Pro.

The M1 Frankensteined Intel Macs made for one of best selling lines of personal computers ever.

Amazing price and performance packaged in beatiful high quality designs.

I can’t walk into a home or classroom anywhere without seeing some kind of M1 Mac. They’re everywhere.

Walk into our house and you won't see any Macs.

 

[rui no onna]

Walk into our house and you won't see any Macs.

This used to be true for us.

Now, there’s the M1 Mac mini and MacBook Air to check out what’s on the other side. The MBA is pretty much collecting dust while I’d get occasional complaints about the Mac mini. Reckon I’d just replace the mini with a Windows 11 desktop during the holiday sales if the family’s still not happy. Will probably just use the mini as Plex server or something.

 

[sparksd]

This used to be true for us.

Now, there’s the M1 Mac mini and MacBook Air to check out what’s on the other side. The MBA is pretty much collecting dust while I’d get occasional complaints about the Mac mini. Reckon I’d just replace the mini with a Windows 11 desktop during the holiday sales if the family’s still not happy. Will probably just use the mini as Plex server or something.

I always felt they were overpriced - why I stayed away. I remember when my R&D group picked up a Mac in '84. I checked it out and thought it was nice until I looked at the price we paid - $2500 (or about $6500 in 2022 dollars). And that was a bargain compared to the Lisa we also had.

 

[MayaUser]

if i dont get Maya for the ipad, im done, i will look for the M2 ipad pro
The hardware is "pro" for the ipad....and there are a lot of apps that makes this ipad pro as well
But again, you cant have all the apps on the same platform..

 

[rui no onna]

I always felt they were overpriced - why I stayed away. I remember when my R&D group picked up a Mac in '84. I checked it out and thought it was nice until I looked at the price we paid - $2500 (or about $6500 in 2022 dollars). And that was a bargain compared to the Lisa we also had.

Felt the same for the most part.

However, the M1 MBA was completely fanless and silent which is a major, major draw for me so I tried it out.

The Mac mini was around the same price as the Intel NUC build I was considering after adding the cost of Windows Pro license. The desktop was mostly just used for watching YouTube on a 27” monitor anyway plus some light Excel for budgeting. The hand-off feature and integration with iOS devices is definitely convenient. Ultimately though, we’re more used to Windows plus Apple recently keeps messing up iCloud/Safari sync so the ecosystem has gotten less appealing.

 

[sparksd]

Felt the same for the most part.

However, the M1 MBA was completely fanless and silent which is a major, major draw for me so I tried it out.

The Mac mini was around the same price as the Intel NUC build I was considering after adding the cost of Windows Pro license. The desktop was mostly just used for watching YouTube on a 27” monitor anyway plus some light Excel for budgeting. The hand-off feature and integration with iOS devices is definitely convenient. Ultimately though, we’re more used to Windows.

Yeah, at this point in my life the price differential has become mostly irrelevant but I just don't see any reason or advantage to switching to the Apple ecosystem; Windows has been working just fine for me.

 

[Digitalguy]

1/5th? Apple has about 54% of the tablet market, Samsung 28%.

https://gs.statcounter.com/vendor-market-share/tablet/worldwide

these statistics can vary wildly based on the provider. I don't consider Statcounter the most reliable, at least worldwide, it probably reflects more the US market (it does not even include large makers like Lenovo)
Anyway based on IDC, for instance, Apple has 31.5% of the market and Samsung 21.1% https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS49064522
But 3 big (and well-known) providers seem to agree on similar data, Statista, https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held-by-tablet-vendors/ Strategy Analytics https://news.strategyanalytics.com/...-Tablet-Market-Growth-in-Q1-2022/default.aspx
and Canalys https://canalys.com/newsroom/worldwide-tablet-shipments-Q1-2022
Therefore I'd say the 39% for Apple vs 20% for Samsung are the most realistic figures

 

[Digitalguy]

First, I stand corrected, though I’d still say that Samsung is not giving Apple much of a “run” with those sales numbers. Second, OH WOW! Microsoft is in the 6% of “other”? Sheesh!

Microsoft is generally not included. Surface devices count as laptops, not tablets, based on their OS

 

[EastHillWill]

these statistics can vary wildly based on the provider. I don't consider Statcounter the most reliable, at least worldwide, it probably reflects more the US market (it does not even include large makers like Lenovo)
Anyway based on IDC, for instance, Apple has 31.5% of the market and Samsung 21.1% https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS49064522
But 3 big (and well-known) providers seem to agree on similar data, Statista, https://www.statista.com/statistics/276635/market-share-held-by-tablet-vendors/ Strategy Analytics https://news.strategyanalytics.com/...-Tablet-Market-Growth-in-Q1-2022/default.aspx
and Canalys https://canalys.com/newsroom/worldwide-tablet-shipments-Q1-2022
Therefore I'd say the 39% for Apple vs 20% for Samsung are the most realistic figures

Did some googling and here are the countries those numbers apparently reflect:

• Asia/Pacific (excluding Japan and China) (available for 15 countries)
• Canada
• Central and Eastern Europe (available for 16 countries)
• Japan
• Latin America (available for 19 countries)
• Middle East and Africa (available for 26 countries)
• PRC
• United States
• Western Europe (available for 16 countries)

That makes the figures more credible, IMO. If it was just the US, I'd believe that 32% of folks have iPads, but I'd be shocked if 21% had Samsung tablets. I'd guess that here in the states Fire tablets outsell Samsung ones, and probably by a wide margin, with Apple in a comfortable first place.

 

[Digitalguy]

Did some googling and here are the countries those numbers apparently reflect:

• Asia/Pacific (excluding Japan and China) (available for 15 countries)
• Canada
• Central and Eastern Europe (available for 16 countries)
• Japan
• Latin America (available for 19 countries)
• Middle East and Africa (available for 26 countries)
• PRC
• United States
• Western Europe (available for 16 countries)

That makes the figures more credible, IMO. If it was just the US, I'd believe that 32% of folks have iPads, but I'd be shocked if 21% had Samsung tablets. I'd guess that here in the states Fire tablets outsell Samsung ones, and probably by a wide margin, with Apple in a comfortable first place.

Statcounter has always been all over the place since they are only based on their own cookies and definitely not all websites use Statcounters for statistics. So 54% is definitely a big exaggeration when compared to other providers. But I understand it can feel good for the ego of Apple fans.... Anyway it's not the point here, the point is that Apple is around twice as much as Samsung anyway, just not over half of the market....

 

[jav6454]

This backfired on Apple and it was too late when they realized it. Also, Microsoft and Samsung are giving Apple a run for their money since they have a full Operating System or DeX on a tablet about the same size as an iPad Pro.

Agreed, Apple has missed the opportunity to make the iPad OS more powerful. They have been, to an extent, complacent in using the iPhone's OS to run the show and it will help, but to an extent.

 

[jav6454]

It's up to the customers to decide what it's for. It's up to Apple to support its customers.

Yes to a point, that's true, but using it for intentions other than what was designed is just asking for frustration.

 

[threesixty360]

The thing is, people are talking about the iPad as if it shouldnt exist. I find it mind blowing. I always here the same “niche” users talking about the iPad as failure because it doesnt run Final Cut pro or some other niche app. I’m thinking, do you actually know how many Final Cut Pro users are actually out there? Do you really think sales would go through the roof on IPads because Final Cut Pro would run on it?

Its a very small percentage of the population that run these apps. Microsoft Office was the most significant software release ever on the Ipad if we are talking about sales boosts. Other than that, the market has spoken. Apple releasing FCP on the iPad will not make a whole load of niche pro app developers immediately rush to port other pro apps. If they haven’t done it by now, they aren’t doing it.

And they aren’t doing it for various reasons. Most of all, the users they want to sell to who will spend hundreds of dollars on one app for work are primarily computer based and rely on computer based workflows. Any pro users uses multiple tools along with their main product. They all need to be there too. They may also rely on multiple drives, monitors etc.. So who will these pro app sellers sell their software to if they put in on the iPad pro?

And that brings us to the main reason. Kind of innovators dilemma. Ableton cant sell Live for 300 dollars+ on an iPad. No one would spend that amount. iOS prices are not Mac prices. So what would be the point? There are only so many users who would want that niche app. So they would be losing tons of money by making an iPad version. It’s the same for many pro apps.

If Apple makes FCP for iPad Pro it will be a marketing exercise rather than some true attempt to move everyone over to the iPad. And the reality is if you buy a MacBook Air instead of an iPad Pro then Apple is very happy to sell you that instead. The house still wins!

The IPad sells more units than the mac. I think they 17m ipads in q4 2021 vs 7m macs. We also know that some customers are never going to spend more than 400 dollars for a machine. So the Mac can never replace the units sold by the iPad. There are far more things that the iPad can be used for than the mac can in a real practical sense. So all this talk about the iPad Pro being useless and it being a failure I just dont get. I suppose people just resent their being a “pro” badged iPad because they don’t perceive value in it. But having high end in any product line is always a thing. Why should you be annoyed at that?

Why would you be annoyed at the great screen? The form factor? Etc.. I just find all this talk weird.

In an odd way, If the Mac didnt exist for some reason I could get by on a PC. But if my iPad with iOS disappeared, I dont think there is anything to really replace that.