iOS 12 and planned obsolescence

[macintoshmac]

They apologise in the very first paragraph and then try to justify what they did.

"We’ve been hearing feedback from our customers about the way we handle performance for iPhones with older batteries and how we have communicated that process. We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down. We apologize. "

"To address our customers’ concerns, to recognize their loyalty and to regain the trust of anyone who may have doubted Apple’s intentions, we’ve decided to take the following steps"

To me, this is just a way of addressing the concerns of the users in the most politically correct way.

That being said, it is a very simple thing. They sell something that they made, with a view of how they want it to work, what they think would benefit customers. It is on customers to decide if they want it or not, not to make every product from every company similar in the way they work and look.

Hey Apple, I want the same customisation ability as Android? So... why choose Apple? Go with Android, it is ready to be taken!
Hey Android, I wish you had the security and privacy of iOS? Buy an Apple where privacy options default to dibbled to your benefit, unlike Android, where they default to enabled and you have to choose to stop them from sending data out.

Come on, man. Each and every post of yours is just one same thing rehashed. What are you even doing on this forum and site?

In my understanding, the throttle gate as you call it, was Apple's way of dealing with a battery that is not up to the mark. No one sees that they did not just let the phone die - they made a choice to work around the battery so that the phone remains usable. This was nothing about a way to get people to buy new phones.

Now, that said, the choice was right, but the handling was not - they could just start to make noises about battery performance and getting it replaced, quite like we get notifications in the Mac environment, but being a mobile device, it is important that battery, no matter how degraded, is able to sustain a device. SO, they reduced performance which would be restored once battery is replaced.

All they really needed to do was let customers know that the performance will be degraded here forth because of low battery capacity or whatever, but trust me, you of all would still have had issues with that solution.

So, at least, at their own expense and at a reduced price, they helped customers to new batteries. They did NOT have to do it. Buying an Apple device is not an entitlement to lifelong service or even a set number of years of use. Don't know why people behave like it is an entitlement.

If this was planned obsolescence, why would a replacement battery restore performance? Ever thought about that?

 

[Abazigal]

They apologise in the very first paragraph and then try to justify what they did.

"We’ve been hearing feedback from our customers about the way we handle performance for iPhones with older batteries and how we have communicated that process. We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down. We apologize. "

"To address our customers’ concerns, to recognize their loyalty and to regain the trust of anyone who may have doubted Apple’s intentions, we’ve decided to take the following steps"

That’s what I call the high ground manoeuvre. You take the first step of apologising even when you don’t think you are in the wrong to get it out of the way, and then move on to what you are going to do next. This way, you shift the focus to the solution and not the problem, and the people who keep fixating on this issue now seem petty in comparison.

Notice that the apology is also pretty generic, the same way the cashier at the fast food counter apologises for having kept you waiting even though it’s not really their fault. It’s just to soothe the tension and make the recipient feel better, but do not mistake it for an admission of guilt.

Apple may regret how the whole incident went down, but I honestly doubt they think they were wrong in implementing the throttling software the way they did.

 

[FeliApple]

Fair. And then you start complaining if there is a security issue, or the latest Candy Crush can't be downloaded.

Apple is damned if they do, damned if they don't. So they keep updating the phones until they physically can't handle the new code.

Of course! But I'll take it. I'll take the "fall". I'll take my security issues. I'll take lack of app compatibility. As I said, let me decide.
No, I will not complain. I am not complaining now (iPhone 6s and 9.7 iPad Pro on iOS 9, iPod Touch 5G on iOS...6). I acknowledge now - and have acknowledged this in tons of other threads - that my take will have drawbacks.
But what do I value the most? Performance and battery life. Let me have it. I will not complain to Apple if I have issues, I'll take it, because I made a decision. As it currently is, there is no decision to be made.

 

[Sciomar]

That’s what I call the high ground maneuver. You take the first step of apologising even when you don’t think you are in the wrong to get it out of the way, and then move on to what you are going to do next. This way, you shift the focus to the solution and not the problem, and the people who keep fixating on this issue now seem petty in comparison.

Notice that the apology is also pretty generic, the same way the cashier at the fast food counter apologises for having kept you waiting even though it’s not really their fault. It’s just to soothe the tension and make the recipient feel better, but do not mistake it for an admission of guilt.

Apple may regret how the whole incident went down, but I honestly doubt they think they were wrong in implementing the throttling software the way they did.

They didn't owe anyone an apology, it's their product and they can choose any life expectancy for it. We make the choice to support or not by buying or not buying it, people were unwilling to accept that truth and cried. We've started seeing this misplaced entitlement more and more, people think if they cry long enough and use social media to make their demands, they can get their way. Most users would've never noticed the throttling as an issue until some power users made it known, and then it became some overemphasized crime against humanity. The people who are fixated on it are very petty in expecting to be forever catered to.

Some devices just can't last forever unless you're willing to treat them a certain way; not overusing, proper charge cycles, not dropping into the ocean or from the top of a canyon while taking some selfie. Do you expect a mac from 20 years ago to be able to run the current os? No, that's just ludicrous. Software and hardware compatibilities are currently finite, they're designed around supporting each other. As time and software changes come, not all hardware is going to keep up. Apple was in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation versus the current entitlement mentality. They made the best decision in their eyes for their product lifecycle. We didn't sign any contractual agreement guaranteeing these devices to last any set number of years and there's no guarantee in the box for a 10 year warranty like there is with home appliances or vehicles. If we want that, we have to find another company that offers it. The throttling helped some devices to hold onto life for a little longer and certainly beat the phones just shutting down on their own until a new battery was bought.

I'm no apologist for them, but I am a realist. I wanted my SE to keep working as it did the day I bought it, but I knew that just wasn't going to be the case so I bought a new phone. I loved that form factor compared to current offerings, oh well, time to move on.

tl;dr: people need to quit crying and expecting to be catered to

 

[AsherN]

Of course! But I'll take it. I'll take the "fall". I'll take my security issues. I'll take lack of app compatibility. As I said, let me decide.
No, I will not complain.

And for everyone of you there are 100 other who will complain.

 

[I7guy]

I do not believe in allowing a phone to run an OS it can’t handle. The Core 2 Duo from 2010 will never run today’s software smoothly so forcing it to, is stupidity.

"Can't handle" is anecdotal. My ipad 2 "can handle' IOS 9.3.5.

I am okay with average perormance but it’s below average. Basic apps takes ages and ages to load on an iPhone 6. The keyboard has input delay. Safari is a complete dog on it.

Your iphone 6 has issues. My iphone 6 before I got rid of it was fine on later ios release.

If Google and Microsoft can support multiple versions of their operating system with security fixes, Apple can as well. Allow downgrades and support iOS older versions.

This is a straw-man.

The thing is Tim Cool loves those flashy marketing charts at the keynote which is why Apple doesn’t do it.

The reality is that fragmentation can actually be a good thing because each device runs the OS it is best suited for. If I try to run Android P on a Nexus 6P it’s no going to run well which is why Google allows a downgrade option.

Downgrade, currently, is not apples business model. Isn't under Cool and wasn't under Lobs.

Do you want me to post the court documents of aTouch Disease or Apple’s apology letter to customers on throttlegate?

Sure you gonna prove that apple can be sued for any reason. That technote sure didn't look like an apology to me about power management. More looks like an apology about the state of litium ion batteries.

It ain’t cheating until you get caught and Apple knows this. In the unlikely event they get caught, write an apology letter, toss in a few freebies and get on with business. Worked for Samsung, NVIDIA and Apple themselves.

Getting caught by the government get's you big fines. If you believe apple would lie to the government and lie to it's customers to gain something insignificant. That's on you.

Let’s summarise. I posted the videos as my evidence of planned obsolescence.

The videos showed nothing.

You countered with a belief that you think the videos can be manipulated.

When you said they were "absolute proof". What constitutes "proof" is a low bar indeed.

The same applies to your argument. So you have nothing to dismiss my evidence except for a belief(no proof) that the videos have human error and cheating.

So until you can counter the evidence I posted with facts and not beliefs and what ifs no way to progress this discussion.

The benchmarks have already been discredited as according to them there was zero slowdown between iOS 6 and iOS 10 in 5 years which is improbable as according to PC World Windows 10 is slower than XP but benches the same.

Except I believe apple and you don't. The way it stands these "theories" cannot be proved or disproved. That's not proved and not disproved, except for these things.
1. Apple says it knows about these memes and is categorically untrue.
2. Multiple factual benchmarks prove otherwise (the YT videos are mostly inconclusive it you take into account operator error and the entire manipulation aspect of it.)
4. ios 12 is addressing underlying o/s bottlenecks.
5. Apples financials proves people who buy their products don't buy into this. A customer doesn't buy your product if they believe the company they are buying from, screwed them on their last purchase. So while there may be churn, it's not really evident in the numbers. (Or apples brand is so strong, apple believes they can screw over their customers and their customers will come back like disciplined dogs.)

 

[Radon87000]

To me, this is just a way of addressing the concerns of the users in the most politically correct way.

That being said, it is a very simple thing. They sell something that they made, with a view of how they want it to work, what they think would benefit customers. It is on customers to decide if they want it or not, not to make every product from every company similar in the way they work and look.

Hey Apple, I want the same customisation ability as Android? So... why choose Apple? Go with Android, it is ready to be taken!
Hey Android, I wish you had the security and privacy of iOS? Buy an Apple where privacy options default to dibbled to your benefit, unlike Android, where they default to enabled and you have to choose to stop them from sending data out.

Come on, man. Each and every post of yours is just one same thing rehashed. What are you even doing on this forum and site?

In my understanding, the throttle gate as you call it, was Apple's way of dealing with a battery that is not up to the mark. No one sees that they did not just let the phone die - they made a choice to work around the battery so that the phone remains usable. This was nothing about a way to get people to buy new phones.

Now, that said, the choice was right, but the handling was not - they could just start to make noises about battery performance and getting it replaced, quite like we get notifications in the Mac environment, but being a mobile device, it is important that battery, no matter how degraded, is able to sustain a device. SO, they reduced performance which would be restored once battery is replaced.

All they really needed to do was let customers know that the performance will be degraded here forth because of low battery capacity or whatever, but trust me, you of all would still have had issues with that solution.

So, at least, at their own expense and at a reduced price, they helped customers to new batteries. They did NOT have to do it. Buying an Apple device is not an entitlement to lifelong service or even a set number of years of use. Don't know why people behave like it is an entitlement.

If this was planned obsolescence, why would a replacement battery restore performance? Ever thought about that?

Actually it was their own fault why the batteries were behaving the way they did as a batch of batteries on the 6,6s and 7 were defective and customers are entitled to a free replacement for a manufacturing defect but instead of doing a repair program they resorted to a profit-friendly move of slowing down the system as a repair program would hit their profits. My iPhone 6 battery wear was 78-80% iirc last year when I got the battery replaced but it was not throttling while some of the 6s were starting to throttle at 85% health

In the meantime they quietly fixed the issue on the iPhone X and 8 where Apple specifically state that they are unaffected by this defect. I have devices from 2012 which have heavy battery wear. My Nexus battery is probably at 60% wear by now but it never shuts down or throttles. This was not a li-ion battery limitation. It was a defect exclusive to some iPhones.

Yes, merely issuing a notification would not satisfy me if my phone battery deteriorated to that extent so fast as its not my fault, Apple had a defective batch. But I would still take that over what Apple did.

Also no one knew a battery replacement would solve the problem. It was only after a random guy did an experiment and posted the results on Reddit did everyone figure out what was going on. I, in my wildest dreams, cannot fathom that a battery replacement can increase performance. The solution was out of this world. If only Apple had told everyone what was going on, then it wouldnt be planned obsolescence at all.

That’s what I call the high ground manoeuvre. You take the first step of apologising even when you don’t think you are in the wrong to get it out of the way, and then move on to what you are going to do next. This way, you shift the focus to the solution and not the problem, and the people who keep fixating on this issue now seem petty in comparison.

Notice that the apology is also pretty generic, the same way the cashier at the fast food counter apologises for having kept you waiting even though it’s not really their fault. It’s just to soothe the tension and make the recipient feel better, but do not mistake it for an admission of guilt.

Apple may regret how the whole incident went down, but I honestly doubt they think they were wrong in implementing the throttling software the way they did.

Of course I know the apology isn't sincere and is just a courtesy but even thats a big thing considering they didnt even do that for Touch Disease. Apple is not at all sorry for what they did because its likely that move resulted in increased sales. When a phone slows down, people buy a new one. The model affected was primarily a 2 year old iPhone 6s and most contracts were getting over by then.

But an apology is an apology nonetheless irrespective of how its given. No one likes to apologise or admit they were wrong and that applies in spades to a company like Apple.

They didn't owe anyone an apology, it's their product and they can choose any life expectancy for it. We make the choice to support or not by buying or not buying it, people were unwilling to accept that truth and cried. We've started seeing this misplaced entitlement more and more, people think if they cry long enough and use social media to make their demands, they can get their way. Most users would've never noticed the throttling as an issue until some power users made it known, and then it became some overemphasized crime against humanity. The people who are fixated on it are very petty in expecting to be forever catered to.

Some devices just can't last forever unless you're willing to treat them a certain way; not overusing, proper charge cycles, not dropping into the ocean or from the top of a canyon while taking some selfie. Do you expect a mac from 20 years ago to be able to run the current os? No, that's just ludicrous. Software and hardware compatibilities are currently finite, they're designed around supporting each other. As time and software changes come, not all hardware is going to keep up. Apple was in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation versus the current entitlement mentality. They made the best decision in their eyes for their product lifecycle. We didn't sign any contractual agreement guaranteeing these devices to last any set number of years and there's no guarantee in the box for a 10 year warranty like there is with home appliances or vehicles. If we want that, we have to find another company that offers it. The throttling helped some devices to hold onto life for a little longer and certainly beat the phones just shutting down on their own until a new battery was bought.

I'm no apologist for them, but I am a realist. I wanted my SE to keep working as it did the day I bought it, but I knew that just wasn't going to be the case so I bought a new phone. I loved that form factor compared to current offerings, oh well, time to move on.

tl;dr: people need to quit crying and expecting to be catered to

I think when I pay $700+ for an iPhone I am entitled to a phone which lasts a reasonable amount of time without slowing down. The iPhone 6 is 4 years old but performs like a computer a decade old. I think thats unreasonable. I can't even count on yearly releases not affecting performance. I upgraded my iPad Pro last September to iOS 11.0 and my battery life tanked and stuttering was noticeable in many areas of the OS amplified by the 120hz refresh rate. To have a barely 6 month old tablet perform in this manner is unacceptable. I downgraded back to 10 and today this tablet still runs like a champ. The same battery life, the same performance and I have no doubt the performance and battery life will remain unaffected even after 5 years if I do not upgrade.

Apple should have announced the battery replacement program the moment they got to know a batch of iPhones were affected. That was the right thing to do.

"Can't handle" is anecdotal. My ipad 2 "can handle' IOS 9.3.5.

So since its anecdotal, we should all have a choice to remain on a version we like. Why should I be forced to accept your standards of a usable tablet? I sold off the iPad Mini because it was unusable by my standards

Your iphone 6 has issues. My iphone 6 before I got rid of it was fine on later ios release.

My iPhone 6 already went through a checkup last June when I replaced the battery. It was perfect. I have handled iPhone 6 at work and they perform similar

Sure you gonna prove that apple can be sued for any reason. That technote sure didn't look like an apology to me about power management. More looks like an apology about the state of litium ion batteries.

The first paragraph has the words "We apologise". They may have done it grudgingly, unwillingly,furiously, bitterly but they used those 2 words. This is what they say before that "We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down" This is what hue say after that.

'First and foremost, we have never — and would never — do anything to intentionally shorten the life of any Apple product, or degrade the user experience to drive customer upgrades. Our goal has always been to create products that our customers love, and making iPhones last as long as possible is an important part of that. "

The context is clear.

Can you also explain to me why the iPhone X,8 and the 5s are unaffected by the throttle? Do they use a unique battery technology which is why they arent affected?

Getting caught by the government get's you big fines. If you believe apple would lie to the government and lie to it's customers to gain something insignificant. That's on you.

Look, NVIDIA straight up lied to its customers by saying the GTX 970 has 4GB VRAM when it was 3.5GB. The CEO even issued an apology letter to the customers and 3 years later they are still pulling shady stuff with the 1060 where the 3GB variant has fewer TMUs and CUDA cores and is slower but this isnt disclosed in their advertising. The average customer thinks the only difference is the VRAM. During the batterygate fiasco of the Note 8, Samsung did 2 recalls knowing full well the issue wasnt going to be fixed well in advance iirc.

The current status- These companies are making record profits and have decimated the competition. Apple's lies are not that much worse in retrospect. Apple has even more mindshare than the above companies. They have nothing to worry about. Cheating is the name of the game nowadays

The videos showed nothing.

The videos showed iOS 7 was faster than iOS 11

When you said they were "absolute proof". What constitutes "proof" is a low bar indeed.

But it being a low bar is subjective. We could both look at 2 sets of evidences and be convinced to different degrees.
You still dont have facts to establish why its not proof. What is wrong with that video? Where is the manipulation?

1. Apple says it knows about these memes and is categorically untrue.

And asking Apple is just like asking an accused whether he has committed a crime.

A third party investigation with no vested interests would be more truthful

Multiple factual benchmarks prove otherwise (the YT videos are mostly inconclusive it you take into account operator error and the entire manipulation aspect of it.)

But this is again your belief. I could just as well point out that Apple could have manipulated the benchmarks into being higher on the newer iOS version. Load times are the only way to find out

For example, this recent test.

https://www.cnet.com/news/ios-12-beta-on-an-old-iphone-5s-how-much-faster-is-it/

Task How much faster was iOS 12?
Launching Mail 0.25 second
Launching Safari (completely loading CNET.com) 3.5 seconds
Launching Maps Identical
Slide to take a photo from lock screen 0.5 second
Keyboard comes up (in Messages) 1 second
Share sheet comes up (in Safari) 1 second
Siri completing a request 0.5 second

Launching apps like Safari and Mail were noticeably faster in the iOS 12 beta, but the difference in others, including Weather and Maps, was hardly visible.

Apple's claim during the keynote was that the share sheet comes up twice as fast when the system is under load. We found that the share sheet came up much faster than it did on iOS 11, even when there were no other apps open. However, this result wasn't always consistent -- after running it several times in a row, iOS 11.4 mostly caught up to the beta.



This is what I call evidence. Cant be manipulated and done by a third party

5. Apples financials proves people who buy their products don't buy into this. A customer doesn't buy your product if they believe the company they are buying from, screwed them on their last purchase. So while there may be churn, it's not really evident in the numbers. (Or apples brand is so strong, apple believes they can screw over their customers and their customers will come back like disciplined dogs.)

Or maybe their strategy works because the competition is lacking in some way or the other. Androids have excellent phones but no tablet or watch. Microsoft has an excellent tablet but no phone or watch. Apple has a good phone and an excellent tablet and a Watch. So if you desire an complete ecosystem, you have no choice in the matter honestly.

And yes I agree with you that their brand insulates them from damage. If Samsung got away with that battery issue, throttlegate and slowdowns are nothing for Apple.

 

[mrochester]

Also no one knew a battery replacement would solve the problem. It was only after a random guy did an experiment and posted the results on Reddit did everyone figure out what was going on. I, in my wildest dreams, cannot fathom that a battery replacement can increase performance. The solution was out of this world. If only Apple had told everyone what was going on, then it wouldnt be planned obsolescence at all.

It's clear you have absolutely no idea what planned obsolescence is.

An action is either planned obsolescence or not. It can't change it's status based on whether you've heard about it or not.

 

[macintoshmac]

For example, this recent test.

https://www.cnet.com/news/ios-12-beta-on-an-old-iphone-5s-how-much-faster-is-it/

Task How much faster was iOS 12?
Launching Mail 0.25 second
Launching Safari (completely loading CNET.com) 3.5 seconds
Launching Maps Identical
Slide to take a photo from lock screen 0.5 second
Keyboard comes up (in Messages) 1 second
Share sheet comes up (in Safari) 1 second
Siri completing a request 0.5 second

Launching apps like Safari and Mail were noticeably faster in the iOS 12 beta, but the difference in others, including Weather and Maps, was hardly visible.

Apple's claim during the keynote was that the share sheet comes up twice as fast when the system is under load. We found that the share sheet came up much faster than it did on iOS 11, even when there were no other apps open. However, this result wasn't always consistent -- after running it several times in a row, iOS 11.4 mostly caught up to the beta.



This is what I call evidence. Cant be manipulated and done by a third party

First off, there is just no satisfying you, anything that Apple does or not.

Also, the 2x faster share sheet was specific to some older models, not across the spectrum. And, good luck trying to compare the betas. Only Apple knows which beta revision made the 2x improvement. They also stated the comparison over some iOS number, don't know if it was 11. Also, it is probable that this is what they are gunning for in the end.

My point is, don't cite the money in the bank. Money in the bank does not buy time, money in the bank does not help in making better customers who will readily agree to 2-3 years delay in software like it used to be some years ago. Today, they just want a feature a day sort of. Why? Because, hello one trillion dollar company. Cut them some slack. Each of your posts is either lambasting Apple or replying to someone who responds to your post.

 

[I7guy]

[..]
So since its anecdotal, we should all have a choice to remain on a version we like. Why should I be forced to accept your standards of a usable tablet? I sold off the iPad Mini because it was unusable by my standards

You have to take this up with apple. However why should I be forced to accept your standards of a usable device? Which is what all this is about. Andecdotal and circumstantial.

My iPhone 6 already went through a checkup last June when I replaced the battery. It was perfect. I have handled iPhone 6 at work and they perform similar

There are others who claim their iphone 6 was perfectly usable.

The first paragraph has the words "We apologise". They may have done it grudgingly, unwillingly,furiously, bitterly but they used those 2 words. This is what they say before that "We know that some of you feel Apple has let you down" This is what hue say after that.

'First and foremost, we have never — and would never — do anything to intentionally shorten the life of any Apple product, or degrade the user experience to drive customer upgrades. Our goal has always been to create products that our customers love, and making iPhones last as long as possible is an important part of that. "

The context is clear.

Can you also explain to me why the iPhone X,8 and the 5s are unaffected by the throttle? Do they use a unique battery technology which is why they arent affected?

Apple has been more forthcoming under Cook than ever under Jobs and this proves it. Nobody said they handled this in the best manner possible, but there is no proof this was malicious.

Look, NVIDIA straight up lied to its customers by saying the GTX 970 has 4GB VRAM when it was 3.5GB. The CEO even issued an apology letter to the customers and 3 years later they are still pulling shady stuff with the 1060 where the 3GB variant has fewer TMUs and CUDA cores and is slower but this isnt disclosed in their advertising. The average customer thinks the only difference is the VRAM. During the batterygate fiasco of the Note 8, Samsung did 2 recalls knowing full well the issue wasnt going to be fixed well in advance iirc.

The current status- These companies are making record profits and have decimated the competition. Apple's lies are not that much worse in retrospect. Apple has even more mindshare than the above companies. They have nothing to worry about. Cheating is the name of the game nowadays

I don't know why NVIDIA is being discussed in this thread. Two separate companies doing different things. I trust apple more than these other companies. You, however, are free not to. Doesn't change my opinion.

The videos showed iOS 7 was faster than iOS 11

No they didn't. They showed ios 11 was not slower by all metrics. There is quite the difference.

But it being a low bar is subjective. We could both look at 2 sets of evidences and be convinced to different degrees.
You still dont have facts to establish why its not proof. What is wrong with that video? Where is the manipulation?

There is no evidence either way. All one could say is not faster and not slower.

And asking Apple is just like asking an accused whether he has committed a crime.

A third party investigation with no vested interests would be more truthful

But this is again your belief. I could just as well point out that Apple could have manipulated the benchmarks into being higher on the newer iOS version. Load times are the only way to find out

For example, this recent test.

https://www.cnet.com/news/ios-12-beta-on-an-old-iphone-5s-how-much-faster-is-it/

Task How much faster was iOS 12?
Launching Mail 0.25 second
Launching Safari (completely loading CNET.com) 3.5 seconds
Launching Maps Identical
Slide to take a photo from lock screen 0.5 second
Keyboard comes up (in Messages) 1 second
Share sheet comes up (in Safari) 1 second
Siri completing a request 0.5 second

Launching apps like Safari and Mail were noticeably faster in the iOS 12 beta, but the difference in others, including Weather and Maps, was hardly visible.

Apple's claim during the keynote was that the share sheet comes up twice as fast when the system is under load. We found that the share sheet came up much faster than it did on iOS 11, even when there were no other apps open. However, this result wasn't always consistent -- after running it several times in a row, iOS 11.4 mostly caught up to the beta.



This is what I call evidence. Cant be manipulated and done by a third party




Or maybe their strategy works because the competition is lacking in some way or the other. Androids have excellent phones but no tablet or watch. Microsoft has an excellent tablet but no phone or watch. Apple has a good phone and an excellent tablet and a Watch. So if you desire an complete ecosystem, you have no choice in the matter honestly.

And yes I agree with you that their brand insulates them from damage. If Samsung got away with that battery issue, throttlegate and slowdowns are nothing for Apple.

None of what you say constitutes any proof of anything. It was factually proven ios 9 was faster than ios 8 in certain aspects. That apple is taking that paradigm further and saying ios 12 is now being more optimized is great for the consumer. Just not indicative of any malicious attempt at anything. It just indicates apple is optimizing the bowels of the operating system further than it has in the past.

Each of us has beliefs, however proving something beyond a shadow of a conspiracy has never been proven, according to what constitutes "proof".

 

[Sciomar]

I think when I pay $700+ for an iPhone I am entitled to a phone which lasts a reasonable amount of time without slowing down. The iPhone 6 is 4 years old but performs like a computer a decade old. I think thats unreasonable. I can't even count on yearly releases not affecting performance. I upgraded my iPad Pro last September to iOS 11.0 and my battery life tanked and stuttering was noticeable in many areas of the OS amplified by the 120hz refresh rate. To have a barely 6 month old tablet perform in this manner is unacceptable. I downgraded back to 10 and today this tablet still runs like a champ. The same battery life, the same performance and I have no doubt the performance and battery life will remain unaffected even after 5 years if I do not upgrade.

Apple should have announced the battery replacement program the moment they got to know a batch of iPhones were affected. That was the right thing to do.

You didn't pay over $700 for an iPhone 6, and from the rest of your posts you are clearly into over-exaggerating. What we think and reality are often two different things. Also different are people's definition of what is reasonable.

I recommend giving iOS 12 a try on your iPad, I have the 10.5 and am very happy with the new beta release, subjective but my iPad "runs like a champ".

They handled the battery replacements well enough, but nothing will be fast enough or good enough for the self-entitled.

 

[FeliApple]

And for everyone of you there are 100 other who will complain.

I don't care. Those who complain can update. Give me the choice.

 

[Radon87000]

You have to take this up with apple. However why should I be forced to accept your standards of a usable device? Which is what all this is about. Andecdotal and circumstantial.

Which is why I say there should be a downgrade option and fragementation was good

There are others who claim their iphone 6 was perfectly usable.

Who are these others? Did you ask them relative to 8.4.1?

Apple has been more forthcoming under Cook than ever under Jobs and this proves it. Nobody said they handled this in the best manner possible, but there is no proof this was malicious.

I do not remember the Jobs era very well but were refunds issued? Were older devices slowed down?

I don't know why NVIDIA is being discussed in this thread. Two separate companies doing different things. I trust apple more than these other companies. You, however, are free not to. Doesn't change my opinion.

I am giving you examples of these companies to show, if they can lie and earn record profits so can Apple. The bigger the company, the easier it is to get away with it

No they didn't. They showed ios 11 was not slower by all metrics. There is quite the difference.

Let me put it this way. Was performance entirely maintained on iOS 11 compared to iOS 7?

None of what you say constitutes any proof of anything. It was factually proven ios 9 was faster than ios 8 in certain aspects.


That apple is taking that paradigm further and saying ios 12 is now being more optimized is great for the consumer. Just not indicative of any malicious attempt at anything. It just indicates apple is optimizing the bowels of the operating system further than it has in the past.

Each of us has beliefs, however proving something beyond a shadow of a conspiracy has never been proven, according to what constitutes "proof".

Not going over this again. If the benchmarks are factual, so are the YT videos. If YT videos can be manipulated so can the benchmarks. Likelihood of Apple manipulation is higher because they need higher sales
[doublepost=1530388792][/doublepost]

First off, there is just no satisfying you, anything that Apple does or not.

Also, the 2x faster share sheet was specific to some older models, not across the spectrum. And, good luck trying to compare the betas. Only Apple knows which beta revision made the 2x improvement. They also stated the comparison over some iOS number, don't know if it was 11. Also, it is probable that this is what they are gunning for in the end.

My point is, don't cite the money in the bank. Money in the bank does not buy time, money in the bank does not help in making better customers who will readily agree to 2-3 years delay in software like it used to be some years ago. Today, they just want a feature a day sort of. Why? Because, hello one trillion dollar company. Cut them some slack. Each of your posts is either lambasting Apple or replying to someone who responds to your post.

Some here seem to think Apple is doing no wrong with their strategy and P/O does not exist. When you have devices which clearly have slowed down since purchase and when this is pointed out on the forums, we are accused of imagining things, of course some Apple bashing is bound to occur. They aren't saints contrary to what some here believe. In fact, no company is.

The iPad Pro Gen 2 and iPhone X perform admirably on iOS 10 and 12 respectively but 3 years from now, if I continue updating them they will be slowed down like the iPhone 6 was because of more features. Whats the point of having ultra fast processors and better NAND storage if all it takes is 3 short years to bring them to their knees. I still haven't gotten over the fact.

My laptop's Geekbench score is lower than the iPhone X but its never slowed down like how the iPhone does on new versions of Windows 10

 

[Radon87000]

There’s a thread on Reddit with 400 upvotes on how the iPhone 6 performance has dramatically improved on iOS 12. Prior there were lots of lockup’s and freezes on iOS 11 but clearly the guy is lying as it benches the same.

https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/8u0lu6/ios_12s_performance_is_phenomenal/

 

[FeliApple]

There’s a thread on Reddit with 400 upvotes on how the iPhone 6 performance has dramatically improved on iOS 12. Prior there were lots of lockup’s and freezes on iOS 11 but clearly the guy is lying as it benches the same.

https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/8u0lu6/ios_12s_performance_is_phenomenal/

I saw a few there stating that battery life is... Even worse on iOS 12 on the 6s! I read here that my 6s on iOS 9 lasts 8 hours and should expect 6 if updated. Even lower? How far down is it going to go?
Maybe it is because it's a beta, but I hope that changes, because this sucks for 6s owners who update...

 

[I7guy]

Which is why I say there should be a downgrade option and fragementation was good



Who are these others? Did you ask them relative to 8.4.1?



I do not remember the Jobs era very well but were refunds issued? Were older devices slowed down?




I am giving you examples of these companies to show, if they can lie and earn record profits so can Apple. The bigger the company, the easier it is to get away with it


Let me put it this way. Was performance entirely maintained on iOS 11 compared to iOS 7?



Not going over this again. If the benchmarks are factual, so are the YT videos. If YT videos can be manipulated so can the benchmarks. Likelihood of Apple manipulation is higher because they need higher sales
[doublepost=1530388792][/doublepost]
Some here seem to think Apple is doing no wrong with their strategy and P/O does not exist. When you have devices which clearly have slowed down since purchase and when this is pointed out on the forums, we are accused of imagining things, of course some Apple bashing is bound to occur. They aren't saints contrary to what some here believe. In fact, no company is.

The iPad Pro Gen 2 and iPhone X perform admirably on iOS 10 and 12 respectively but 3 years from now, if I continue updating them they will be slowed down like the iPhone 6 was because of more features. Whats the point of having ultra fast processors and better NAND storage if all it takes is 3 short years to bring them to their knees. I still haven't gotten over the fact.

My laptop's Geekbench score is lower than the iPhone X but its never slowed down like how the iPhone does on new versions of Windows 10

Doesn’t seem the needle was moved on this conversation not one molecules worth.
[doublepost=1530393947][/doublepost]

There’s a thread on Reddit with 400 upvotes on how the iPhone 6 performance has dramatically improved on iOS 12. Prior there were lots of lockup’s and freezes on iOS 11 but clearly the guy is lying as it benches the same.

https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/8u0lu6/ios_12s_performance_is_phenomenal/

So 400 out of probably multiple tens of millions is a great representation.

 

[Sciomar]

Some here seem to think Apple is doing no wrong with their strategy and P/O does not exist. When you have devices which clearly have slowed down since purchase and when this is pointed out on the forums, we are accused of imagining things, of course some Apple bashing is bound to occur. They aren't saints contrary to what some here believe. In fact, no company is.

The iPad Pro Gen 2 and iPhone X perform admirably on iOS 10 and 12 respectively but 3 years from now, if I continue updating them they will be slowed down like the iPhone 6 was because of more features. Whats the point of having ultra fast processors and better NAND storage if all it takes is 3 short years to bring them to their knees. I still haven't gotten over the fact.

My laptop's Geekbench score is lower than the iPhone X but its never slowed down like how the iPhone does on new versions of Windows 10

Devices will slow down with time, software changes, and component degradation. That is the nature of current technology, until we get into quantum computing and self healing components, then who knows!! I would absolutely love it if my old 8086 or even 486sx could run Windows 10, I mean it was a beast of a processor in it's day so why shouldn't it?

The devices aren't completely crippled and they're certainly not limping along from these recent updates, why are people running benchmark tests on a silly mobile phone? Build yourself a real machine for benchmarking and leave the mobile devices to social media and storing cheesy selfies. What actual app are you using on the phone that, along with the recent iOS, has caused the device to completely cease functioning?

I could care less about the bashing of Apple, they're a public company and are subject to scrutiny from the inept masses. I do however dislike misinformation and over-exaggeration, it's all too commonplace these days and it's annoying. I'm not old enough to be the "get off my lawn type" but I am troll enough to step on those who deserve it.

 

[Radon87000]

Doesn’t seem the needle was moved on this conversation not one molecules worth.
[doublepost=1530393947][/doublepost]
So 400 out of probably multiple tens of millions is a great representation.

I can find many more actually. But then they are all lying according to your logic. Also doesn’t take all of the tens of millions to identify a problem. I doubt throttlegate affected that many yet Apple acknowledged the problem.
[doublepost=1530420044][/doublepost]

I saw a few there stating that battery life is... Even worse on iOS 12 on the 6s! I read here that my 6s on iOS 9 lasts 8 hours and should expect 6 if updated. Even lower? How far down is it going to go?
Maybe it is because it's a beta, but I hope that changes, because this sucks for 6s owners who update...

The battery life on iOS 12 for me is better on the X but I haven’t yet yet checked it on my 7 Plus and 6 but I don’t think it would make much of a difference. Apple almost halved the battery of my 7 on iOS 11 and my X lasts as long as my 7 Plus did on iOS 10 and that’s with the crazy efficiency of the A11 Bionic.

I don’t think things will change much on the battery side of things. Just the performance will improve.

 

[Radon87000]

Devices will slow down with time, software changes, and component degradation. That is the nature of current technology, until we get into quantum computing and self healing components, then who knows!! I would absolutely love it if my old 8086 or even 486sx could run Windows 10, I mean it was a beast of a processor in it's day so why shouldn't it?

The devices aren't completely crippled and they're certainly not limping along from these recent updates, why are people running benchmark tests on a silly mobile phone? Build yourself a real machine for benchmarking and leave the mobile devices to social media and storing cheesy selfies. What actual app are you using on the phone that, along with the recent iOS, has caused the device to completely cease functioning?

I could care less about the bashing of Apple, they're a public company and are subject to scrutiny from the inept masses. I do however dislike misinformation and over-exaggeration, it's all too commonplace these days and it's annoying. I'm not old enough to be the "get off my lawn type" but I am troll enough to step on those who deserve it.

I wonder when these phones will reach the performance level of mid range and above computers where the slowdown could take decades to settle in. I have an old MacBook from 2013 which is low end to mid range by today’s standards but Windows upgrades haven’t affected its performance much at all. It takes at least a decade of software upgrades to slow down a high end computer.

I can understand a slowdown after 9-10 years but currently it takes just 4-5 years to slow down an iPhone which is in my opinion too small a life cycle for a device costing as much as a computer nowadays.

Apps and games run fine on the 6 when loaded. Real Racing 3 race load times still take the same amount of time they did on iOS 8. So does Asphalt and Monument Valley. The Main problem is the overall feel of the phone running the OS is sluggish. Loading demanding apps itself has shown a 5-7 seconds increase and Safari tabs get flushed out of memory faster than they used to. Popping up the keyboard has a delay and when I type in iMessage after the keyboard pops up the key presses are not recognised and after 1 second the key presses are recognised simultaneously. It all just kills the experience. I wonder how it’s possible that the device runs a graphically demanding game like Real Racing 3 the absolute same as it did originally but the operating system performance shows such a bug decline.

 

[EEzycade]

Apple certainly has their issues, dont they. And i think ios 12 did fix lots of things that were wrong with ios 11. I also think that we will see bigger and better improvements in ios 13. IOS 12 was just IOS 11 2.0 haha

 

[mrochester]

I wonder when these phones will reach the performance level of mid range and above computers where the slowdown could take decades to settle in. I have an old MacBook from 2013 which is low end to mid range by today’s standards but Windows upgrades haven’t affected its performance much at all. It takes at least a decade of software upgrades to slow down a high end computer.

I can understand a slowdown after 9-10 years but currently it takes just 4-5 years to slow down an iPhone which is in my opinion too small a life cycle for a device costing as much as a computer nowadays.

Apps and games run fine on the 6 when loaded. Real Racing 3 race load times still take the same amount of time they did on iOS 8. So does Asphalt and Monument Valley. The Main problem is the overall feel of the phone running the OS is sluggish. Loading demanding apps itself has shown a 5-7 seconds increase and Safari tabs get flushed out of memory faster than they used to. Popping up the keyboard has a delay and when I type in iMessage after the keyboard pops up the key presses are not recognised and after 1 second the key presses are recognised simultaneously. It all just kills the experience. I wonder how it’s possible that the device runs a graphically demanding game like Real Racing 3 the absolute same as it did originally but the operating system performance shows such a bug decline.

You’re forgetting the 90s where £1000 PCs had to be replaced every couple of years to keep up with software and hardware progression (and £1000 in the 90s is more money today).

Smartphones are simply in that phase now.

 

[macintoshmac]

Some here seem to think Apple is doing no wrong with their strategy and P/O does not exist. When you have devices which clearly have slowed down since purchase and when this is pointed out on the forums, we are accused of imagining things, of course some Apple bashing is bound to occur. They aren't saints contrary to what some here believe. In fact, no company is.

Agreed!

 

[I7guy]

I can find many more actually. But then they are all lying according to your logic. Also doesn’t take all of the tens of millions to identify a problem. I doubt throttlegate affected that many yet Apple acknowledged the problem.
[doublepost=1530420044][/doublepost]
The battery life on iOS 12 for me is better on the X but I haven’t yet yet checked it on my 7 Plus and 6 but I don’t think it would make much of a difference. Apple almost halved the battery of my 7 on iOS 11 and my X lasts as long as my 7 Plus did on iOS 10 and that’s with the crazy efficiency of the A11 Bionic.

I don’t think things will change much on the battery side of things. Just the performance will improve.

The debating tatic of "let me use google search as proof" to find at least one, is not what one calls "proof". If that were the case the loch ness monster would be real. There was no issue with power management. Guess what? it's still there, however you are now free to have your phone turn off. That's called an enhancement in the parlance of software development.

ios 11.4.1b4 has awesome battery life on my 6s. It has taken a bit longer than usual to iron out the issues with an ios release.

However, nothing has been proven about the malicious part about obsolescence, other than some types of loose conspiracy theory.

 

[Radon87000]

You’re forgetting the 90s where £1000 PCs had to be replaced every couple of years to keep up with software and hardware progression (and £1000 in the 90s is more money today).

Smartphones are simply in that phase now.

Maybe. But 3 years is too low imo. The apps themselves aren’t getting more demanding either. Games like Infinity Blade run the same as before. It’s just the OS which is the problem.

 

[mrochester]

Maybe. But 3 years is too low imo. The apps themselves aren’t getting more demanding either. Games like Infinity Blade run the same as before. It’s just the OS which is the problem.

Well most iOS devices last longer than 3 years as it is now. My dad still has an iPhone 5S!