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jackietreeh0rn

macrumors regular
Apr 13, 2018
212
239
120 Hz displays have been around for what, 2-3 years now?

I know it won't make any difference for the layperson, and this is mostly a tech enthusiast gripe, but still, it is disappointing to know Apple couldn't get 120 hz displays shipped.(I'm aware they were one of the first when they brought it to the iPad, and that the iPhone 12 pros are going to have LEDs which bring in different challenges from LCDs and that there will be major battery issues and that they chose to prioritize that over the refresh rate. Still.)
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,495
120 Hz displays have been around for what, 2-3 years now?

I know it won't make any difference for the layperson, and this is mostly a tech enthusiast gripe, but still, it is disappointing to know Apple couldn't get 120 hz displays shipped.(I'm aware they were one of the first when they brought it to the iPad, and that the iPhone 12 pros are going to have LEDs which bring in different challenges from LCDs and that there will be major battery issues and that they chose to prioritize that over the refresh rate. Still.)

Sure, 120Hz It’s a ‘semi-big‘ deal to some people in here, but do consumers really care about the ‘Fluid-in-motion’ selling point, when there’s millions of other people in the world that probably have no idea what 120Hz even is, nor care to (Sorta like how Live-photos, 3D Touch was pushed to the wayside), when the one percenters on sites like this are the ones that do care. Why should Apple be in any type off rush to put something out when the emphasis will be on the camera, the battery technology/improvements, LiDAR, Apple glasses, etc.

I’m not dismissing this technology, but I’m also being a ‘realist‘ in the sense that it generally isn’t that big of a deal, and I’d rather have Apple perfect this technology when it’s ready, -versus- ‘Putting it out because because a few member say so.’
 
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bobmans

macrumors 6502a
Feb 7, 2020
598
1,751
120 Hz displays have been around for what, 2-3 years now?

I know it won't make any difference for the layperson, and this is mostly a tech enthusiast gripe, but still, it is disappointing to know Apple couldn't get 120 hz displays shipped.(I'm aware they were one of the first when they brought it to the iPad, and that the iPhone 12 pros are going to have LEDs which bring in different challenges from LCDs and that there will be major battery issues and that they chose to prioritize that over the refresh rate. Still.)
I think if 120Hz isn't coming that either
A. Apple wasn't satisfied with the tradeoffs, Apple likely wants top-of-the-line 120Hz displays and possibly the 120Hz displays had some drawbacks compared to their best-in-class 60Hz displays (10bit, bright, no smudging at lower brightness, battery life, color accuracy, etc...)
B. They just can't supply enough of the 120Hz displays, you got to remember that Apple isn't just a company that creates a phone that's going to sell 500k-1m units. They need a lot of these displays and these displays have to be manufactured and there has to be enough capacity.
C. Combination of A and B.

People always say that Apple is late to adopt new tech (which is true), but Apple only launches a few phones/year and sells a lot of those. Some tech just isn't ready to be manufactured on such a large scale that it can be put inside an iPhone.

Apple most likely wants an LTPO panel so they can have a Promotion-like display (variable refresh rate between 1-120Hz). Even though Apple developped LTPO and owns the patents on it, currently the only phones with that technology are the Samsung Galaxy Note Ultra (and Fold 2) and those phones have display issues on lower brightness (green tint, black bars). I don't think Samsung has the capacity this year to manufacture enough for an iPhone or maybe the quality just isn't there yet.

It's easier to create a phone and source components for that phone if you're only going to be selling 1million units/year compared to selling basically 5m+ units in the launch weekend.


120Hz would be nice to have but it has to be done well so I rather not have it then have a half-baked version of it. It's a tech-enthusiast feature in my opinion and the only thing I've ever seen youtubers say about it is "omg look how smooth it scrolls through my settings app".

The only thing I'm worried about is that there's not going to be enough to differentiate the non-pro models from the pro-models.
Both are rumoured to come in 6.1inch sizes, both will have OLED, same resolution. What will be the difference?
Slightly better screen on the pro model (which only tech-enthusiasts will talk about? a telephoto camera that most people don't care about? A LiDaR sensor that still has to prove it's usefulness? Stainless steel body instead of aluminium making the phone extra heavy?
Apple will need to come up with something compelling to differentiate the pro models from the non-pro models because from the current rumours I'm not too exited to go for the pro model instead of the regular.
 
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Ramrod82

macrumors regular
Jun 29, 2010
206
91
This is very disappointing!! I’m not looking for miracles out of battery life nowadays, but with that said and play around with friends Note 10 and 9 I’m trying out the 20 ultra. I waited a couple years but just to keep a phone for iMessage and FaceTime is a silly now. Android was poor in past but now they have made leaps and bounds. Apple needs to play catch up outside the Face ID!
 

Sikh

macrumors 6502a
Mar 8, 2011
548
320
This is very disappointing!! I’m not looking for miracles out of battery life nowadays, but with that said and play around with friends Note 10 and 9 I’m trying out the 20 ultra. I waited a couple years but just to keep a phone for iMessage and FaceTime is a silly now. Android was poor in past but now they have made leaps and bounds. Apple needs to play catch up outside the Face ID!

I would rather not have apple play catch up against someone who brags about QHD on a phone and then 120hz but you cant use 120hz in QHD on the Note 20 Ultra. I would rather have a real good implementation instead of a half ass implementation.

So far any other implementation of a high refresh rate screen has been "we do 90 to 120 but we default to 60 because 90 or 120 will suck a lot of battery and you have to acknowledge that before you switch to it". I think its a bunch of ******** that companies brag about features but they are definitely optional.

Apple instead released promotion and the battery estimates were based off you running promotion and not "hey here's a 120hz screen but we default to 60 and our battery estimates are for 60 so it SEEMS like battery life is great until you turn 120hz on".

If apple does wait to include 120hz this year, im sure its because of the quality of the screens at the amount they need and/or battery life concerns. I would rather have a finished feature rather than a half ass one.
 

bobmans

macrumors 6502a
Feb 7, 2020
598
1,751
I would rather not have apple play catch up against someone who brags about QHD on a phone and then 120hz but you cant use 120hz in QHD on the Note 20 Ultra. I would rather have a real good implementation instead of a half ass implementation.

So far any other implementation of a high refresh rate screen has been "we do 90 to 120 but we default to 60 because 90 or 120 will suck a lot of battery and you have to acknowledge that before you switch to it". I think its a bunch of ******** that companies brag about features but they are definitely optional.

Apple instead released promotion and the battery estimates were based off you running promotion and not "hey here's a 120hz screen but we default to 60 and our battery estimates are for 60 so it SEEMS like battery life is great until you turn 120hz on".

If apple does wait to include 120hz this year, im sure its because of the quality of the screens at the amount they need and/or battery life concerns. I would rather have a finished feature rather than a half ass one.
I fully agree with your post.
Apple is a company doesn't ship specs, they ship features and experiences.
They probably don't want to ship a phone with a "120Hz display" (60/120Hz), they want to ship a phone with a "Promotion display" (1-120Hz).
Apple doesn't play the number game, they play the feature game.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,993
20,176
UK
I know people will want make excuses for this but it’s poor really not having it. You can say well the comp doesn’t do it at QHD but much rather have the option...apple giving you no option is very apple and why they don’t give the user a choice.

enough of apple trying to perfect it crap....i used this in the past and it was just down to being a apple loyalist. Give me 1080p 120hz over full resolution at 60hz any day of the week.

apple don’t even real real QHD anyway so won’t even be as high of a resolution as android’s flagships anyway.

11 pro users won’t really have much reason to upgrade unless a slightly better camera is important.

apple ditched pro motion due to display issues not battery life from all reports.
 
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SmugMaverick

macrumors 6502a
Aug 31, 2017
911
2,596
UK
I know people will want make excuses for this but it’s poor really not having it.

11 pro users won’t really have much reason to upgrade unless a slightly better camera is important.

This

There is no excuse for not having this, it's not new tech to Apple either so it's quite disgraceful.

I have the 11 Pro and was planning on grabbing the 12 Pro but if it's just a frame change and slight camera improvement then I won't be dropping a $1000+ again on these penny pinchers.

The Pixel 5 is going to have 90hz, reverse wireless charge, larger battery, true edge to edge display, flagship camera and only $649 so might give it a try for a bit if all these so called "leakers" are right.

Gurman is a fraud who deletes his tweets when he's wrong and Prosser just makes **** up, Kuo also has a terrible track record and just says stuff thats clearly coming in the next few years.
 

Abazigal

Contributor
Jul 18, 2011
20,399
23,907
Singapore
I know people will want make excuses for this but it’s poor really not having it. You can say well the comp doesn’t do it at QHD but much rather have the option...apple giving you no option is very apple and why they don’t give the user a choice.

enough of apple trying to perfect it crap....i used this in the past and it was just down to being a apple loyalist. Give me 1080p 120hz over full resolution at 60hz any day of the week.

apple don’t even real real QHD anyway so won’t even be as high of a resolution as android’s flagships anyway.

11 pro users won’t really have much reason to upgrade unless a slightly better camera is important.

apple ditched pro motion due to display issues not battery life from all reports.

You are essentially making the same mistake that every other Apple naysayer over the past few decades (and especially the last decade) have.

They tend to cover an industry, then they attempt to draw a link to Apple from time to time. I feel this tends to lead to error and inaccurate analysis, because you are comparing Apple too much to other companies, and you are not allowing Apple’s unique attributes to speak for themselves or recognise how Apple is able to set themselves apart from the competition.

We are not the ones who started hyping up this feature as some sort of “must-have” in smartphones, knowing that the next iPhone likely won’t have it, then going on to declare said iPhone a failure when it doesn’t. It gets more ludicrous every time I think about it.

Rather, I maintain that the best way of covering Apple is to begin with Apple. You have to focus with Apple, and then you move outwards. You start with Apple, and then you analyse the industry that Apple operates in. Instead, what I see a lot of people still do today is that they just treat Apple as any other company. But Apple does a lot of things differently, and if all you are doing is simply comparing Apple to everyone else and then go “Hey, Apple isn’t following what everyone else is doing, so I don’t think whatever Apple is doing is going to work”, I think they go down the wrong path.

Apple will do just fine. You will see. You will all see.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Nehalem
Dec 15, 2010
30,993
20,176
UK
You are essentially making the same mistake that every other Apple naysayer over the past few decades (and especially the last decade) have.

They tend to cover an industry, then they attempt to draw a link to Apple from time to time. I feel this tends to lead to error and inaccurate analysis, because you are comparing Apple too much to other companies, and you are not allowing Apple’s unique attributes to speak for themselves or recognise how Apple is able to set themselves apart from the competition.

We are not the ones who started hyping up this feature as some sort of “must-have” in smartphones, knowing that the next iPhone likely won’t have it, then going on to declare said iPhone a failure when it doesn’t. It gets more ludicrous every time I think about it.

Rather, I maintain that the best way of covering Apple is to begin with Apple. You have to focus with Apple, and then you move outwards. You start with Apple, and then you analyse the industry that Apple operates in. Instead, what I see a lot of people still do today is that they just treat Apple as any other company. But Apple does a lot of things differently, and if all you are doing is simply comparing Apple to everyone else and then go “Hey, Apple isn’t following what everyone else is doing, so I don’t think whatever Apple is doing is going to work”, I think they go down the wrong path.

Apple will do just fine. You will see. You will all see.

All you can do is compare to the competition as that’s what you base tech on. iPhones have never had the top end tech when they should. For the average user it doesn’t matter but to call a phone pro it needs to have pro features in a timely manner. You shouldn’t need to wait 2-3 years for the £1100-1500 phones to get top end features.

Apple will be just fine of course they make great products. The iphone 12 will be a massive success as it’s a great Balance of hardware and software with top of the line chip for 700-800 price point.

For what the pro line costs people are getting mugged off really for the price. The fact reverse wireless charger might be a feature they add this year when this has been around a good 2-3 years already. A simple feature which to me isn’t that important as I’ve not used it once since i got my note ultra but it’s nice to have i guess.

People who truly care about technology do care and those who want the top end features don’t want to need to wait years when it’s available now.

For the average user all this doesn’t matter but the average user isn’t on forums like this.
 

Marlon DLTH :)

macrumors 6502
Mar 4, 2020
410
761
They also used it on non LTPO panels...and still do.
Nope, the S20 phones had a notably worse battery life when you were using 120hz. They also had color calibration issues.

If Apple will use a 120hz display, they want it to work perfectly and with no compromises. That’s only possible with an LTPO panel.
 
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CrazyForCashews

macrumors 65816
Apr 1, 2018
1,048
2,759
What if Apple is planning to reserve the 120Hz display on their rumoured port-less iPhone? Or the so called "iPhone Ultimate."

Port-less, FaceID, TouchID, smart connector, and the absolute best tech? Will probably have the ultimate price as well.
 

EM2013

macrumors 68020
Sep 2, 2013
2,490
2,326
I know people will want make excuses for this but it’s poor really not having it. You can say well the comp doesn’t do it at QHD but much rather have the option...apple giving you no option is very apple and why they don’t give the user a choice.

enough of apple trying to perfect it crap....i used this in the past and it was just down to being a apple loyalist. Give me 1080p 120hz over full resolution at 60hz any day of the week.

apple don’t even real real QHD anyway so won’t even be as high of a resolution as android’s flagships anyway.

11 pro users won’t really have much reason to upgrade unless a slightly better camera is important.

apple ditched pro motion due to display issues not battery life from all reports.
Honestly the last couple years have been boring updates. X->XS->11 & now 11->12

Just like the 6-8
 
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janeauburn

macrumors 65816
Nov 22, 2015
1,315
2,234
no one but Apple knows for sure.


 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
35,165
25,338
Gotta be in it to win it

Bad news, good news?

- The good news is the iphone 12 has entered production,
- the bad news is the panel is 60hz.
 

Obi-WannaDraw

Suspended
Sep 9, 2020
118
160
South, East and West of You
If you don't game does it even matter?
I really hope that’s the only people complaining about it. I’ll never understand the obsession with things like this, including what the benchmarks are on handheld devices. I remember playing Angry Birds when it didn’t run super smooth, here I am 10 years later and I survived through that level of devastation. ?
 

The-Real-Deal82

macrumors P6
Jan 17, 2013
17,321
25,479
Wales, United Kingdom
Bad news, good news?

- The good news is the iphone 12 has entered production,
- the bad news is the panel is 60hz.

It’s only really bad news for those looking to buy the Pro models and absolutely feel they can’t do without it. The funny thing is I’ve seen complaints by people here who have claimed they won’t be upgrading unless the iP12P has 120Hz so will continue using their current 60Hz iPhones for another year.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
35,165
25,338
Gotta be in it to win it
It’s only really bad news for those looking to buy the Pro models and absolutely feel they can’t do without it. The funny thing is I’ve seen complaints by people here who have claimed they won’t be upgrading unless the iP12P has 120Hz so will continue using their current 60Hz iPhones for another year.
I guess for some it's a make or break feature. However, the pattern happens year after year...if you can hold out for another year, one would get a phone with more features at about the same price. But then one would potentially lose out on using a phone with a feature one would find useful.
 
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