Monterey disappointment

[fisherking]

Just to echo what you're saying. Most people buy Macs to do very mundane tasks, e.g., browsing the web, watching videos, sending emails, organizing their photos. As long as their products can perform these tasks without hiccups, Apple has no incentive to change. The only strategy is to stick with a stable release, i.e., macOS from the previous year, and ride it out for as long as you can.

On the flip side of this, most people hardly ever use more than 10% of the new features that are introduced in a new macOS. There is really no reason for consumers to upgrade every year. This is not just Apple's problem. This is a problem with people conditioned to want the latest despite not having a need for it whatsoever.

To your point on "legacy install": people just have to stick with a stable release for as long as Apple is supporting it and then upgrade when absolutely necessary, i.e., every two years. Security updates are not 100% safe either. I have had a security update of Big Sur rendering my Bootcamp partition unbootable. If a security update can mess with your computer to this level, imagine how much damage a new release can do.

There is a family member who's still rocking a mid-2011 iMac after I upgraded the HDD with an SSD and it was more than sufficient. It can even run Windows 10 via Parallels Desktop at a very decent speed. Apple doesn't care if your workflow deviates from what they perceive as normal usage.

"Most people buy Macs to do very mundane tasks", "most people hardly ever use more than 10% of the new features"... am genuinely asking: where are you getting your facts? ie 'most people', '10%'....

 

[Reggaenald]

you should have done that with every previous OS (and you will need to that with every coming OS). complaining about the current OS is a macrumors forum tradition, and so much of this is simply the 2022 version of the complaints about previous OS versions.

while i agree that there are always issues (and worth discussing, and getting help with those issues), and i realize that bugs are a given at any time... i'd rather get help when i need it, offer help when i can, and use my macs to work, live... and get on with it.

but, for those who need to do it; whine away. whining always fixes everything...

Calling being disappointed with the OS of an expensive machine, made by a company that wants to be held to the highest standards and pretends to does so itself, and talking about it in the appropriate place (because doing so on Apple Communities will get your post removed) whining seems pretty unempathetic and not as though you’d genuinely want to help people, just those that don’t disagree with you.
Everyone here knows, or should know, that talking about it here doesn’t change much about the issue, but it does help the individuals cope with their rightful disappointment.
You’re obviously not the target audience of this thread and no one asked you about your negativ and generalising opinion and neither does anyone force you to stay, so, if you don’t like this discussion, don’t take part in it.

 

[Reggaenald]

are you saying that everyone has this issue? and it's been going on for 8 months? because no one i work with has mentioned it...

as always, i'm sorry some people are so offended by a point-of-view that isn't the same as theirs. i enjoy these conversations, and i enjoy sharing my opinion, and will continue to do so.

Great way to argue, using anecdotal evidence against anecdotal evidence.
Good to know you enjoy working against a discussion, very telling about you.
Calling people offended but you’re the first to say someone whines about a problem you don’t experience, classic.

 

[Reggaenald]

It seems that Apple is on a tick tock movement.

Catalina - Bad
Big Sur - Good
Monterey - Bad
Next 2022 OS - Good?

well this guy seems to be enjoying macOS for the most part, after all it is MUCH less buggier than Windows 11.

Big Sur was bad for me as well, choppy animations and many UI and graphics bugs, but I understand that for some it’s been a relief.

 

[Reggaenald]

It’s not even just macOS it’s the whole “ecosystem”.

AirPods aren’t doing the automatic switch.

Apple Watch doesn’t unlock the mac after doing a fast user switching.

iCloud Drive doesn’t sync so you risk that the person you share a folder with, updates a file that wasn’t synced to the latest version and overwrites it, making it a total joke and impossible to rely on, if not for sharing some dog videos instagram style maybe.

Continuity and handoff are a total mess, after a fast user switching they basically stop working. Problem present since Yosemite was released and partially fixed this year after over 120 mail exchanged with an apple engineer. Partially!

HomeKit is a mess. Ask Siri to turn on a light and it turns it off, devices not responding, scenes not setting because devices go offline and so on.

Siri doesn’t recognise a voice all in a sudden while two minutes earlier it was ok.

Airdrop fails if you let the screen turn off while transferring. So if you transfer a long video you need to make sure you keep tapping on the screen on both phones to avoid failure.

iMessage same, if you record a voice message and the display turns off the recording stops. It improved a bit after I busted their balls for two months, now at least it keeps the recording, it used to get deleted.

Personal hotspot often doesn’t see that your phone is in proximity and you need to open the iPhone settings to wake it again.

You listen to something on AirPods, your partner puts on another pair of AirPods and the audio gets directed there, as if a person could put on 2 sets of AirPods together.

Mac runs out of battery and shuts down like if you pulled the plug on a desktop. Nothing gets saved, all lost.

Random reboots while in sleep mode overnight on MBA M1.

HomePod volume fluctuating for no reason.

HomePod not reacting to hey Siri sporadically.

HomePod not able to play playlists that I created and saved in my library saying they don’t exist.

Initiating directions from Apple Watch fails to reroute. Useless device.

The UI to text on Apple Watch is so bloated that it is just easier to get the phone also to text OK.

Apple TV interface running at like 15 fps.

Switch user on Apple TV and you still see the photo library of the main user. What do you create two users for?

Apple fitness often doesn’t detect Apple Watch while using it on Apple TV. Need to reboot tv, watch and iPhone, takes longer to start a workout that doing it. Tried a full reset of Watch and tv, after a week I had the same issue.

iPhone with dual sim configuration still doesn’t let you turn off incoming calls for one sim only. You can turn off the line and then lose the data connection too.



I could go on for three days..

I know the pain. I eventually stopped filling but reports because they always said that there are no similar reports, even if they’ve been discussed on places and reported before, and some obvious things just don’t get fixed at all (persistent Touch Bar issues, for example).
But the feedback app is a joke imo anyway. Remember last year when there was a post welcoming people and giving advice on filling reports and ending with they’ll post more stuff as summer goes on? They never continued 🙄 -_-

 

[MajorFubar]

The last great MacOS was Snow Leopard...change my mind.

 

[fisherking]

Calling being disappointed with the OS of an expensive machine, made by a company that wants to be held to the highest standards and pretends to does so itself, and talking about it in the appropriate place (because doing so on Apple Communities will get your post removed) whining seems pretty unempathetic and not as though you’d genuinely want to help people, just those that don’t disagree with you.
Everyone here knows, or should know, that talking about it here doesn’t change much about the issue, but it does help the individuals cope with their rightful disappointment.
You’re obviously not the target audience of this thread and no one asked you about your negativ and generalising opinion and neither does anyone force you to stay, so, if you don’t like this discussion, don’t take part in it.

sorry i did not realize that you were in charge here. and again, also sorry that some ppl are SO offended by an alternative, or opposite, point-of-view.

there's nothing wrong with being disappointed with monterey (or, for that matter, a new mac, or your iphone, or a new belt you bought, or whatever), but there is discussion, and there is whining; discussion is SO much more useful.

 

[Schismz]

The last great MacOS was Snow Leopard...change my mind.

I understand Apple's marketing plan has them locked into annual releases because it's important to kick another macOS out the door to align with iOS updates, but it would be wonderful if they focused on at least fixing regressions and addressing stability problems. Snow Leopard demonstrated that at least Apple under Steve Jobs understood there was a need to clean up the wreckage and legacy cruft once in a while, instead of sweeping it all under the carpet forever.

Two excellent and long-running resources for power users were BareFeats and MacPerformanceGuide. Since Rob's death and the end of Barefeats, there's seemingly just Lloyd. While Lloyd often seems far angrier then I am, his site has been great resource for workarounds to various issues over the years. He has a very long-running, meticulously documented collection of angst with regards to Apple's various OS releases:

Pages for “Apple Core Rot”

macperformanceguide.com

FWIW: 2 additional resources which are usually really good.

Mac Troubleshooting Summary

With over four thousand articles here about Macs and their problems, it can be tricky to know where to look first. Here’s a selection of starting points for troubleshooting and solving issues…

eclecticlight.co

https://mrmacintosh.com (already mentioned in this thread)

 

[MajorFubar]

I honestly don't get the need for these annual releases. MacOS has got so huge and unwieldy now that it's really not humanly possible to keep adding new features and changing things at such a pace without stuff breaking, and what we're witnessing now is the result of doing that for about a decade.

 

[exoticSpice]

Monterey size is 12.3 GB or something close to that. That is BIG. Even Windows is only 5.4GB.
Windows 11 is smaller than macOS 12, never thought you see that huh.

Mojave was only 6GB, when did it double?

 

[Reggaenald]

FWIW 2019 Mac Pro shipped with Catalina with no possibility to downgrade to Mojave since it did not contain the needed drivers for hardware. Catalina was a dumpster fire of an OS, with roughly half the updates introducing really annoying problems, and the other half, kinda, sorta, mostly okay.

Big Sur has given me no real issues, but running with 28 cores & 384GB RAM so it can waste resources in peace and I don't really notice.

Apple's OS quality has walked off a cliff, but, on the flipside, nobody has stopped buying it, they just had their best Q in history despite supply-chain problems and WW III starting, and their stock has done nothing but print money for me. Apple's stock used in lieu of a bank still results in $1 of purchasing power, being worth roughly $1 a year later, and then some, vs. the fiat currency of $USD which is worth less and less every month, so... Apple actually has very little reason to fix problems or pay attention to their software quality, because people just keep buying the hardware anyway.

As a user of their products: not thrilled, its become something I just tolerate. The hardware keeps improving at a very rapid pace... their software keeps getting more and more unstable, while adding little of value other than endless dumb features, while the core OS falls apart/doesn't ever get fixed, and the complexity just keeps growing. Remaining on a legacy install is only viable for 2 years, before security patches stop coming, at which point it's probably a very poor idea to expose your computer to anything except your own network.

As a shareholder: very happy with the company.

Therefore: nothing is likely to change, because people keep buying it.

Considering a lot of the people that bought new Macs were new to macOS itself and probably just believed the marketing and „reputation“, it’s very possible that if Apple continues their QC trends, especially software, people will eventually complain loudly.

 

[Reggaenald]

sorry i did not realize that you were in charge here. and again, also sorry that some ppl are SO offended by an alternative, or opposite, point-of-view.

there's nothing wrong with being disappointed with monterey (or, for that matter, a new mac, or your iphone, or a new belt you bought, or whatever), but there is discussion, and there is whining; discussion is SO much more useful.

Oh the irony

 

[fisherking]

Oh the irony

what irony? would be great if you'd explain that.

either way, we're getting way off track here, and i (for one) would rather discuss the topic of this thread...

 

[AltecX]

Monterey size is 12.3 GB or something close to that. That is BIG. Even Windows is only 5.4GB.
Windows 11 is smaller than macOS 12, never thought you see that huh.

Mojave was only 6GB, when did it double?

Not only that but it used to be you could Install and update a Mac in the time it took to Install Windows. Now a freaking Mac or iOS update takes so long that I can do a full Windows install in that same time. I can do a Windows 10 to 11 update faster than I can install a 0.1update on MacOS from Reboot to Desktop. Even when the Mac has a faster SSD.

 

[Reggaenald]

what irony? would be great if you'd explain that.

either way, we're getting way off track here, and i (for one) would rather discuss the topic of this thread...

I was thinking about spelling it out, but I see little value in that. If you don’t get it yourself, telling you wouldn’t be worth my time.
However if you want an example, you talk about discussion the topic of the thread, which is that Monterey is disappointing, by arguing against basically everyone that encounters a problem. Your „arguments“ are basically repetitions of each other. You say people are offended by opposing points of view while yours remains as “I don’t see a problem, many others probably won’t either, stop whining”, and not just in this thread. It’s the same thing whenever I see you in a thread discussing macOS and quality or something similar.
You talk about me being in charge while you can’t let it go that people have issues that you don’t, also you’re all about “let’s talk about the topic, I hope these comments get removed”.
Even now, you could have let it go, but you didn’t. Don’t tell me I did the same, I know I did. But for different reasons.

Why is it you argue so much about problems other people have and how impacting they are and that it’s bad to just talk with others about it? MacRumors isn’t just for techies troubleshooting, otherwise the comments would be disabled on Front Page posts.

 

[fisherking]

I was thinking about spelling it out, but I see little value in that. If you don’t get it yourself, telling you wouldn’t be worth my time.
However if you want an example, you talk about discussion the topic of the thread, which is that Monterey is disappointing, by arguing against basically everyone that encounters a problem. Your „arguments“ are basically repetitions of each other. You say people are offended by opposing points of view while yours remains as “I don’t see a problem, many others probably won’t either, stop whining”, and not just in this thread. It’s the same thing whenever I see you in a thread discussing macOS and quality or something similar.
You talk about me being in charge while you can’t let it go that people have issues that you don’t, also you’re all about “let’s talk about the topic, I hope these comments get removed”.
Even now, you could have let it go, but you didn’t. Don’t tell me I did the same, I know I did. But for different reasons.

Why is it you argue so much about problems other people have and how impacting they are and that it’s bad to just talk with others about it? MacRumors isn’t just for techies troubleshooting, otherwise the comments would be disabled on Front Page posts.

if you make a statement without any explanation, the statement has no real value. i asked what you meant because i did not want to assume your intent, i wanted to understand it.

i have never said this: " “I don’t see a problem, many others probably won’t either, stop whining”. monterey, like every OS before it, has bugs, issues.

but i stand by my point: that discussion, requests for help, and offering help serve everyone better than whining and ranting.

 

[Reggaenald]

if you make a statement without any explanation, the statement has no real value. i asked what you meant because i did not want to assume your intent, i wanted to understand it.

i have never said this: " “I don’t see a problem, many others probably won’t either, stop whining”. monterey, like every OS before it, has bugs, issues.

but i stand by my point: that discussion, requests for help, and offering help serve everyone better than whining and ranting.

It was not a quotation, obviously…

“if you make a statement without any explanation, the statement has no real value” is that so? Who are you to determine that value? Just because you don’t understand it, doesn’t mean no one will. Just because you don’t value it, doesn’t mean no one will.
If you don’t understand the irony of your own words it’s no wonder you don’t value a statement mentioning it.
You determine a bunch of online strangers on one of many websites talking about their experience with a certain piece of software “whining” because you see no value in their interactions.
Your statement is to get life with the problems and don’t vent. It’s common, so it’s ok and there’s no more to it. That’s also not a statement with much value, is it?
Your initial point about that one dude saying he’s gonna email this thread to Federighi and Cook I can understand, that’s a silly idea bound to fail, but we’ve long moved on from that it seems.
Degrading an entire thread because some Joe’s and because you feel the need to talk with others about one’s experience is rude, period.
You’re free to enjoy the people and their comments in here whatever way you like, but making apparent you don’t see reason for their dialogues and calling them whiners or whatever, sorry but this is just not your place to be.

 

[Reggaenald]

The last great MacOS was Snow Leopard...change my mind.

Not gonna.

Mac
OS
Snow
Again!

 

[fisherking]

It was not a quotation, obviously…

“if you make a statement without any explanation, the statement has no real value” is that so? Who are you to determine that value? Just because you don’t understand it, doesn’t mean no one will. Just because you don’t value it, doesn’t mean no one will.
If you don’t understand the irony of your own words it’s no wonder you don’t value a statement mentioning it.
You determine a bunch of online strangers on one of many websites talking about their experience with a certain piece of software “whining” because you see no value in their interactions.
Your statement is to get life with the problems and don’t vent. It’s common, so it’s ok and there’s no more to it. That’s also not a statement with much value, is it?
Your initial point about that one dude saying he’s gonna email this thread to Federighi and Cook I can understand, that’s a silly idea bound to fail, but we’ve long moved on from that it seems.
Degrading an entire thread because some Joe’s and because you feel the need to talk with others about one’s experience is rude, period.
You’re free to enjoy the people and their comments in here whatever way you like, but making apparent you don’t see reason for their dialogues and calling them whiners or whatever, sorry but this is just not your place to be.

i sent you a PM, hoping we could discuss things outside of this thread. apparently, you prefer to do this publicly; a waste of everyone else's time. how is your behavior ok, but mine isn't?

and if you say "oh the irony", and i ask for clarification... you could have explained your thoughts in one sentence, instead of insullting me for not knowing what you meant (i still don't get it).

again, i stand by everything i said, even if you don't personally understand my intent. 'oh the irony' indeed.

 

[mxrider88]

I know the pain. I eventually stopped filling but reports because they always said that there are no similar reports, even if they’ve been discussed on places and reported before, and some obvious things just don’t get fixed at all (persistent Touch Bar issues, for example).
But the feedback app is a joke imo anyway. Remember last year when there was a post welcoming people and giving advice on filling reports and ending with they’ll post more stuff as summer goes on? They never continued 🙄 -_-

Yep, too proud to say that there are many people complaining about something.

 

[mxrider88]

I was thinking about spelling it out, but I see little value in that. If you don’t get it yourself, telling you wouldn’t be worth my time.
However if you want an example, you talk about discussion the topic of the thread, which is that Monterey is disappointing, by arguing against basically everyone that encounters a problem. Your „arguments“ are basically repetitions of each other. You say people are offended by opposing points of view while yours remains as “I don’t see a problem, many others probably won’t either, stop whining”, and not just in this thread. It’s the same thing whenever I see you in a thread discussing macOS and quality or something similar.
You talk about me being in charge while you can’t let it go that people have issues that you don’t, also you’re all about “let’s talk about the topic, I hope these comments get removed”.
Even now, you could have let it go, but you didn’t. Don’t tell me I did the same, I know I did. But for different reasons.

Why is it you argue so much about problems other people have and how impacting they are and that it’s bad to just talk with others about it? MacRumors isn’t just for techies troubleshooting, otherwise the comments would be disabled on Front Page posts.

Just ignore this fisherking guy, he is probably Craig Federighi under cover anyways.
He commented after each of my posts in the last year or two but I haven’t seen him commenting when I opened threads about an issue I was trying to solve.
I just ignore him, let him stump his feet by himself. Don’t feed him..

😉

 

[fisherking]

Just ignore this fisherking guy, he is probably Craig Federighi under cover anyways.
He commented after each of my posts in the last year or two but I haven’t seen him commenting when I opened threads about an issue I was trying to solve.
I just ignore him, let him stump his feet by himself. Don’t feed him..

😉

if i post 'after each of your posts' there must be a reason.

and if you actually search the forum, you will find that i (mostly) post ideas to help out, or ask for help when i need it. but i do call out whining and ranting often, only to point out that discussing and describing issues will potentially resolve said issues (as opposed to accomplishing nothing).

if you're more comfortable whining about things than actually fixing them, enjoy that 😉

 

[Icelus]

Monterey is utter crap. Since it came out whenever I have a VPN running Finder will not create icons for newly downloaded or newly created/saved files. It requires either a reboot or logout/login to get Finder working again.
Started with .0, never got fixed.

Did you try to relaunch Finder?

1. Hold the Option key on your keyboard.
2. Right-click on the Finder icon in your Dock.
3. Click Relaunch.

 

[HDFan]

5x cfprefsd
18x com.apple.audio.SandboxHelper
4x com.apple.geod
6x containermanagerd
17x distnoted
67x MTLCompilerService
7x PlugInLibraryService
6x trustd
16x VTEncoderXPCService

My numbers on an Intel iMac:

cfprefsd 4x
com.apple.audio.SandboxHelper 16x
com.apple.geod 2x
containermanagerd 4x
distnoted 20x
MTLCompilerService 4x
PlugInLibraryService 10x
trustd 5x
VTEncoderXPCService 8x

 

[exoticSpice]

Windows is in very a sorry state

Windows will get better. MS actually does bug fixes and performace updates.