Surface Pro 4 vs iPad Pro and the future of pro tablets

[MissionMan01]

Again, I think it depends on where you are coming from. I use the iPad pro like a Cintiq, a Cintiq is a pro device that costs the same as the IPP so why is the IPP any less pro?

For many artists I know who use it, the latency is far better for drawing than a Surface.

So pro depends on who you are and what you expect it to do

 

[Wiesenlooser]

Again, I think it depends on where you are coming from. I use the iPad pro like a Cintiq, a Cintiq is a pro device that costs the same as the IPP so why is the IPP any less pro?

For many artists I know who use it, the latency is far better for drawing than a Surface.

So pro depends on who you are and what you expect it to do

I agree, the iPad Pro is the best alternative to a Cintiq - I actually feel like it is better than what Wacom currently offer. Microsoft must have been really surprised by the quality of the Apple Pencil, because it is way better than the Surface Pro Digitizer.

However - the Surface Pro feels more 'pro' in a way that it is much more versatile. Simply because there is just so much you can do. You got the full office suite, you have full CS, etc.

I also feel like the Surface Pro has a better size. The Ipad Pro just feels a tad too much to me. I really like the iPad Pro, but the size.... I wish it were an inch smaller.



Besides... the keyboard kickstand combo just feels FAR more sophisticated than the smart keyboard.

So yes... the iPad Pro is the best device for artists... I study business administration, but used to study industrial design aswell and I really like to draw. So all in all I think the Surface Pro line has the best package... the only thing I would really miss is Paper and Adobe sketch...

 

[sracer]

I find it amusing there are those who actually prefer ios over a full fledged windows10. Too each their own, but I'll take a full OS almost every time. In my opinion this isn't even a fair vs. The Surface eats the ipp for breakfast.

For some who can't think beyond "one OS to rule them all" I can see where it would be amusing. It ultimately comes down to "the right tool for the job" for the rest of us.

There are times when a mobile OS on a tablet is superior to a desktop OS. Instant-on, standby time measured in weeks, optimized for touch, etc. I have a few Windows 10 tablets... when they go to sleep (not connected-standby) it is no longer "instant on". Windows 10 decides to update the tablet at the most inopportune times and while those updates can be scheduled they cannot be permanently declined. The lack of a quantity of quality touch-optimized Modern UI apps means that I have to resort to using desktop apps with magnified UI elements. I did that back in 1999 with Windows tablets, and I'd rather not have to go "back to the future".

The Surface may "eat the iPP for breakfast" and that can be important if breakfast is a priority, but as a tablet it makes a poor one, far inferior to the iPad (pro or otherwise).

 

[Abazigal]

I find it amusing there are those who actually prefer ios over a full fledged windows10. Too each their own, but I'll take a full OS almost every time. In my opinion this isn't even a fair vs. The Surface eats the ipp for breakfast.

You are right about one thing - to each their own.

http://www.speirs.org/blog/2015/12/22/all-in-on-ipad-pro

This guy is intending to use his iPad pro as his replacement PC, and he lays out his reasons for why he prefers it that way. He acknowledges there are still some stuff an iPad still can't do, but by and large, the pros outweigh the cons for him here.

 

[MikeAK]

For some who can't think beyond "one OS to rule them all" I can see where it would be amusing. It ultimately comes down to "the right tool for the job" for the rest of us.

There are times when a mobile OS on a tablet is superior to a desktop OS. Instant-on, standby time measured in weeks, optimized for touch, etc. I have a few Windows 10 tablets... when they go to sleep (not connected-standby) it is no longer "instant on". Windows 10 decides to update the tablet at the most inopportune times and while those updates can be scheduled they cannot be permanently declined. The lack of a quantity of quality touch-optimized Modern UI apps means that I have to resort to using desktop apps with magnified UI elements. I did that back in 1999 with Windows tablets, and I'd rather not have to go "back to the future".

The Surface may "eat the iPP for breakfast" and that can be important if breakfast is a priority, but as a tablet it makes a poor one, far inferior to the iPad (pro or otherwise).

Apple kool-aid drinker till the end

 

[MikeAK]

You are right about one thing - to each their own.

http://www.speirs.org/blog/2015/12/22/all-in-on-ipad-pro

This guy is intending to use his iPad pro as his replacement PC, and he lays out his reasons for why he prefers it that way. He acknowledges there are still some stuff an iPad still can't do, but by and large, the pros outweigh the cons for him here.

Good for him. The ipp is as glorified tablet

 

[Abazigal]

Good for him. The ipp is as glorified tablet

And some people are more comfortable with getting work done on a tablet sporting a mobile OS than a full-fledged PC. Is that so hard to understand and accept?

 

[MissionMan01]

Apple kool-aid drinker till the end

Or maybe you just don't get that everyone doesn't have the same requirements

 

[Radon87000]

And some people are more comfortable with getting work done on a tablet sporting a mobile OS than a full-fledged PC. Is that so hard to understand and accept?

Whatever work the Mobile OS can do,the desktop OS will always do it better

 

[Abazigal]

Whatever work the Mobile OS can do,the desktop OS will always do it better

Which has already been proven wrong. Otherwise, those people would never have switched to an iPad for their work.

 

[Shanghaichica]

The surface pro is probably better because it runs a computer OS and you can use it as a laptop if your computing needs are moderate. However the pro is a better tablet and I wouldn't like to use the surface as a tablet. I think they both have limitations. Despite saying this if I was going to buy one I'd buy the pro as I prefer iOS and I don't want a Windows laptop. My preference is to keep things separate so I have a MacBook Air and an iPad Air 2. I see it as having the best of both worlds and avoiding windows in the process.

 

[Radon87000]

Which has already been proven wrong. Otherwise, those people would never have switched to an iPad for their work.

Switched for convenience.Not full time productivity.I use myiPad with keyboard for some Excel sheets on the Tube.But the moment I reach the workplace,I need a real OS to get the job done

 

[MRU]

Switched for convenience.Not full time productivity.I use myiPad with keyboard for some Excel sheets on the Tube.But the moment I reach the workplace,I need a real OS to get the job done

It depends how you define productivity. I know a couple of writers who only have iPads & separate keyboards. The device works for them alone. There is no right or wrong - it is entirely dependent on each persons usage and needs, thus blanket statements about one or the other, + assumptions on productivity don't really amount to a hill of beans at the end of the day because the very definition of productivity is liquid.

 

[aw3524]

Switched for convenience.Not full time productivity.I use myiPad with keyboard for some Excel sheets on the Tube.But the moment I reach the workplace,I need a real OS to get the job done

"I don't understand it and it's pointless for me, so it's pointless for everyone!"

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[spinedoc77]

For some who can't think beyond "one OS to rule them all" I can see where it would be amusing. It ultimately comes down to "the right tool for the job" for the rest of us.

There are times when a mobile OS on a tablet is superior to a desktop OS. Instant-on, standby time measured in weeks, optimized for touch, etc. I have a few Windows 10 tablets... when they go to sleep (not connected-standby) it is no longer "instant on". Windows 10 decides to update the tablet at the most inopportune times and while those updates can be scheduled they cannot be permanently declined. The lack of a quantity of quality touch-optimized Modern UI apps means that I have to resort to using desktop apps with magnified UI elements. I did that back in 1999 with Windows tablets, and I'd rather not have to go "back to the future".

The Surface may "eat the iPP for breakfast" and that can be important if breakfast is a priority, but as a tablet it makes a poor one, far inferior to the iPad (pro or otherwise).

That depends and is quite situational. Instant on isn't an issue, but it's a valid point if that 1 1/2 seconds matter, which it can if you are doing this all day long. Updates can certainly be deferred, although not permanently unless you do an extremely easy register hack. Although I'd opine that forced updates are much better for security.

The lack of apps depends on what you are doing. Certainly the most "tablet" like apps, browsing through pictures, watching videos, browsing the internet, etc are JUST as good on a windows tablet than iOS. Even the cross device experience is just as good, and in my opinion better. When you want to do something more powerful then what happens to me often is I get frustrated at this or that functionality the app version doesn't have and would rather rely on the full program. Once again this is where the consumers use may differ, they may have a mission critical app they need on iOS. I never thought dumbing down the UI was the right answer, and we only succeeded in dumbing down consumers so now they can't even figure out a start page or how to press an x. Windows 10 has the better approach, coming from the exact opposite side. The changes they have made to their UI are quite nice and quite tablet friendly. The ability to scale on a program to program basis also lets you use legacy programs quite easily with touch. Finally there is the keyboard, if you are leaning forward to do something fairly intensive and need the choices a full OS program provides then the keyboard can definitely make that experience that much more satisfying.

So yeah, I disagree about the part of missing functionality in windows apps unless it's something somewhat specialized. For me the perfect example is google voice, and the main reason I won't use a windows mobile phone (or an iOS phone). So I totally understand if someone on iOS has that "killer app" they cannot live without. Otherwise I just don't buy the argument that MS is missing any functionality as a "tablet" that the ipad has.

 

[Sunsenista1984]

Personally I had the surface pro 4 for two weeks and give it back because of :

-Windows Hello is bugged when wake up from sleep
-Video crashing on chrome Firefox
-Battery is horrible 5-6 hours max and I'm kind because not doing much...
-Ventilo on every time I use chrome

Well the device was more expensive than my MacBook Pro and had some serious issues that I cannot tolerate. I wanted to try and I got my answer I am back to the pro without any regrets

 

[kis]

Personally I had the surface pro 4 for two weeks and give it back because of :

-Windows Hello is bugged when wake up from sleep
-Video crashing on chrome Firefox
-Battery is horrible 5-6 hours max and I'm kind because not doing much...
-Ventilo on every time I use chrome

Well the device was more expensive than my MacBook Pro and had some serious issues that I cannot tolerate. I wanted to try and I got my answer I am back to the pro without any regrets

so you returned it because:

- a feature that you don't even have on your Mac is buggy (which others say works perfectly fine, btw.)
- because two 3rd party apps are poorly designed

I can understand the battery life thing, but this might actually have to do with the Chrome issue. I've been using Windows 10 computers off and on, and I agree, Chrome on Windows sucks (and also on Mac, to same extent). Almost seems like Google is doing this on purpose. Scrolling has never been fixed, for example. Works buttery smooth on Edge and most other apps, but is a stuttering mess on Chrome. Firefox, however, has always worked perfectly fine for me, including video.

Have you even tried trouble-shooting your issues before you returned it?

 

[sracer]

Apple kool-aid drinker till the end

You must be new here.

 

[mi7chy]

People are still debating this? Simply SP3/4 are superset of the other as it can do what the iPP can do plus more. It's like comparing a car to a bicycle. They're both transportation but the car is the superset.

 

[aw3524]

People are still debating this? Simply SP3/4 are superset of the other as it can do what the iPP can do plus more. It's like comparing a car to a bicycle. They're both transportation but the car is the superset.

People are still debating this? Simply Swiss Army knives are a superset of the other as it can do what my kitchen knife set/garage toolbox can do plus more. It's like comparing a car to a bicycle. They're both transportation, but the car is the superset.

 

[spinedoc77]

People are still debating this? Simply Swiss Army knives are a superset of the other as it can do what my kitchen knife set/garage toolbox can do plus more. It's like comparing a car to a bicycle. They're both transportation, but the car is the superset.

Excellent analogy! The ipad to me is like the swiss army knife, it has limited functionality but can perform many things, but not as well as a full kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc. What's amazing to me though is that Microsoft did indeed cram a full sized kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc into the package of an ipad without the compromises.

 

[MRU]

Excellent analogy! The ipad to me is like the swiss army knife, it has limited functionality but can perform many things, but not as well as a full kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc. What's amazing to me though is that Microsoft did indeed cram a full sized kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc into the package of an ipad without the compromises.

Unless poorer battery life, and issues such as a lot of windows apps still not optimised for high DPI leaving them broken or impractical to use on the device. The fact that n-trig technology used has less pressure sensitivity than wacom or Apple Pencil. There is always, always, some compromise....

It's where that compromise lands that will decide the more practical device for the user and many compromises may not affect user A, whilst they plague user B.

Before the iPad Pro even existed or was rumoured, I had already bought the Surface Pro 2 and subsequently switched to a Note 12.2 because for the things I wanted it for, in theory it should have been the perfect device, however in practice it wasn't.

The Surface devices are fantastic but they still have compromises. Just as the iPad Pro or any other device has some compromise.

There is no perfect device, but there are devices more suitable for our specific needs / utilisation. That does not make the other device any the less decent or more suitable for someone else.

 

[MissionMan01]

Excellent analogy! The ipad to me is like the swiss army knife, it has limited functionality but can perform many things, but not as well as a full kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc. What's amazing to me though is that Microsoft did indeed cram a full sized kitchen knife, garage toolbox, etc into the package of an ipad without the compromises.

You clearly haven't used the Surface. It's a crap tablet, so they didn't cram everything in it.

I'd say you got the analogy wrong. The iPad pro is the toolbox (it's not a hybrid, it's just a tablet and it's a good tablet), the MacBook Pro is the kitchen knife, the Surface Pro is the Swiss Army knife trying to be both. In doing so, it's a crap tablet but a good laptop and a great hybrid. But there are better laptops and better tablets out there.

 

[Fthree]

i don't fully understand why people "need" a full OS to do things on a tablet. Apps are what are used to simplify things and the IPP/IPAir2/IP'all perfects the ability to use them. The surface is too choppy and not smooth in its deliverance.

 

[darkgremio]

I can vouch for this issues with the Surface Pro 4 as well. I got some key detrimental issues that scare me in both performance portability realm of things. I travel frequently and I thought the whole tablet/laptop thing sounds real neat, I play World of Warcraft on my downtime in the hotel room. Well the Surface 4 can handle playing World of Warcraft quite fine, but the issues go beyond that.

I have had countless issues with spontaneous battery drain, I would wake the Surface from sleep and see my battery dwindled down from 100% to 17% quite frequently. This is worrisome for someone like me who flies frequently and sometimes does not always have access to an outlet.

I have tried countless fixes (battery sleep studies, disabling services and Windows Hello!, updating graphics card drivers, and complete reformat with manual driver installation) with no luck the battery still drain in sleep mode. I am reluctant to put the Surface in hibernate mode, it should function as Microsoft said it would! Personally the attempted steps I have taken to try to remedy this battery issue has taken me past the point of worrying why I should have any confidence in the reliability of the Surface 4 as both a tablet and a laptop. I have tower computer at home, which is a considered a "Gaming PC" so this is just a temporary extension. Unfortunately my experience with the Surface Pro 4 goes beyond battery issues as well, there's driver issues where they crash frequently. This is due to the volatile driver sets Microsoft uses for the Surface. I have also had screen issues with a fluctuating dead pixel affect, and of course the nasty light bleed as well.

The Surface Pro 4 is great if you look past the deep software issues and Microsoft's relaxed initiative to fix these problems. It's so frustrating I have decided to keep my Macbook Retina and supplement that as my main computer when traveling. I most likely will return the Surface Pro and go with an iPad Pro, so I can use it on a plane and consume media without having to worry about spontaneous battery drains and such.