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44267547

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Has anyone preordered an Aptera? https://aptera.us. I think it looks amazing, and if the promise of 40 miles/day solar charging is true then I would literally never need to charge this car! I also LOVE the futuristic design - almost all cars on the road today are ugly in my opinion. However, my wife thinks the Aptera looks completely impractical and ridiculous, and she says she wouldn't be caught dead even riding in one!
When you look at such a stark design of what Aptera is offering, you don’t buy it necessarily for looks, you’re buying it for the efficiency. I mean, it’s such a radical design, it makes it almost really difficult to find it attractive, because it’s like nothing we’ve seen on the road before, so I can understand for those who might say ‘that’s hideous’, however; for those who see the greater cause of the environment and cost savings, looks probably don’t matter here.

That said, I like what the company is selling and it’s a small crew of guys who have a strong vision, and at a $30,000 starting price point, it doesn’t seem totally unreasonable. My concern would be, I would need to see loads of road test before I would invest in something like this, with how it handles in snowy terrain, or an extremely windy environment when traveling at speeds of 70 mph or greater, does it become unbalanced?, crash tests ratings/scores, ect.

What’s interesting, you can can actually invest (A minimum buy in of a $1000) in this company direct through their website, probably giving the investor even a glimpse of the future roadmap of various timelines/updates.

It’s definitely worth paying attention to see where this company leads.
 

AlaskaMoose

macrumors 68040
Apr 26, 2008
3,594
13,436
Alaska
So? Compared to insane (And continual rising costs) with fuel prices at $4.91 PG, I’d rather pay for the far lesser of a cost with EV charging.
The cost of fuel as being "high or low" affects you depending on how much you earn versus how much you spend. Everything we buy is based on needs and wants. In the US the high/low cost of fuel affects the entire economy, so every market product and service becomes more expensive when the price of fuel goes up.
 

JohnR

macrumors regular
Sep 4, 2007
220
97
Elizabethtown, Kentucky
Thanks. I’ll make sure to do that. And it will be sitting outside under a car port.

My big concern is, is that I live on a dead-end street, and I requested the vehicle be delivered to my driveway, but I fear that the driver will park the delivery truck/trailer at the end of the street (Because he would have to Drive in reverse approximately a quarter mile), unload and drive the car through the salt/brine that’s on the road to get to my driveway. I want to install vehicle protection on the paint before it’s driven on salted roadways, and I tried calling, and…… the driver doesn’t speak any English. So that’s a problem.
are you going to install the PPF yourself? I have it on mine, I had a friend help but it's still not nearly looking as good as a professional job. I ask because if you aren't, then you gotta get it to a shop.

Also, you say you got it from a dealer...so you are buying it used?

Also, and I may have missed the post, but plaid or long range? I rode in a plaid and wow.....amazing..except for the back seat. Getting in and out of it wasn't the greatest.
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,495
are you going to install the PPF yourself?
Yes. I have all the necessary supplies, custom LED lighting in my garage, and I was trained years back, but I’ve been ‘extreme detailing’ cars for the better part of 14 years. If you want to see evidence of any of my work, click on my ‘media photos’ in my profile, and you’ll see exactly how good I am, and/or visit the ‘car thread’, where you can see a lot of my work peppered in that thread throughout the years as well, from anything including a custom New-Edge Cobra, 700 HP Camaro SS, multiple Mustangs, the list goes on. I can even ceramic coat wheels. I actually just ceramic coated my neighbors hood on his Ram 1500 last fall as a favor.

Altogether, once I’m done with ceramic/PPF on a vehicle, I’ll invest a total of probably ~10 to 12 hours from decontaminating the paint, then full prep before the application stage, and then of course, I can then stage the wheels without them having to be removed off the vehicle, but it’s a longer process or the car won’t be driven probably for about a week when that happens.

Also, you say you got it from a dealer...so you are buying it used?
Nope. New. A gentleman that was older purchased the car direct from Tesla, placed a custom order that was 9 months in a que, passed away, the vehicle was sold from the family to a dealership, then I sold my 18’ 392 Scat Pack to make way for an EV —v.s.— dealing with the fiasco of ordering and playing the waiting game.

Also, and I may have missed the post, but plaid or long range?
Model S-Long Range. Which saves about $30,000-ish of a difference with the Plaid having that third additional motor.
 
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44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,495
The arrival:

I haven’t had a chance to drive it, as you can see why with snow and salt all over the roads. The delivery driver drove it through salt after he unloaded it from the trailer, (Even as I requested him not to), so now I have to wash the car completely, then prep it for pre-detail and ceramic coat in a 3-stage process, which will probably take a total of about 2 weeks give or take. So it probably won’t be driven until we can hit warmer temps and the salt is off the road. In the meantime, it’s fun to look at, there’s lots to learn here as you can see with the new steering yoke.

The only thing I’ve noticed so far, is that the interior does have some type of ‘synthetic metal-ish odor’, which I don’t know if it’s normal or not, just my first initial observation, but everything else is perfect. (And OMG, no panel gaps.:D)

Once the car is detailed, and we find some nicer weather with the sun out more, I’ll get some more detailed pictures, but these will suffice in the meantime.

But Yes, I love it.:cool:
70C683A3-BCFD-4577-ABD6-7FFD3D85C56A.jpeg
767BDF84-1DA1-4B95-B07A-FE4AE1886B47.jpeg
C9ED954D-13B4-4613-903B-95C8BEDB9622.jpeg
9437A8AE-D03A-470B-9086-84148EB18D61.jpeg
8295819E-24AC-4D6F-A88C-D90BEBABA8FA.jpeg
 
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jaymc

macrumors 6502a
Nov 10, 2012
511
269
Port Orchard, WA
‘Charging for free’ will soon end
Don’t be fooled by the perk EV owners are currently enjoying
I’ve already seen paid charging
Got a 9 year old P85+ and supercharging is free for the life of the car (along with the steaming and mapping package). Charging at home is about $5 to fill it up at 11¢/kWh. Has 67,000 miles on so far and the only repair is the drivers side door handle. Also updated to LTE and MCU2. No complaints at all.
 
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44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
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@uller6

I researched more into the ‘Aptera’, and after further investigating it, I think this vehicle really isn’t designed for every climate, even if the manufacture makes it appear that way. This EV is totally geared towards warm climate annual environments only.

And here’s why:

The ‘Alpha’ (Beta Model) has a really low ground clearance with the fenders as you can see in the below photo, I have no idea how that would be practical if this vehicle were to be driven over roadways that have imperfections with potholes/crevices, and then factor in any type of snow/or even hitting a patch of water. However, one of the founders did say that the final production model will have an additional 5 inches sitting higher than photoed here.

AF75FF35-9B9F-4259-9A77-578B7D02763B.png



Additionally, the Aptera only weighs a total of ~1,700 pounds. So it wouldn’t take much to probably throw this vehicle off, even with the batteries being mounted under the front seats based off designers comments. [There’s two versions available, front-wheel-drive and all-wheel drive. The all-wheel-drive version will achieve a 3.5s 0-to-60 time. The top speed for this vehicle is leveled at 110 mph.]

However, the founders mentioned that when they tested the Aptera, they tried to ‘roll’ it on a track, and had difficulty even doing that, but I still question at what speeds, and wind playing a factor.

C8CECF11-785A-4234-BF42-EF9DCEC1D15F.png



It’s also worth noting that the batteries and drive motors are all liquid cooled, so I think that’s a huge positive -versus- being air-cooled, which is far more inconsistent.


This being a beta vehicle as shown, this below photo of the ‘Frunk’ has a lot of open exposure with electric cables, that I would expect to be covered, but this is something that would be a concern if it’s not.

9512406A-FCF8-45BC-B320-A91CB7E93402.png




And the reason I think this is not an every day climate vehicle, is because of the lightweight variable of the vehicle and then when you look at the front fenders, I imagine lots of water or snow could easily impact how the vehicle handles, especially if snow were to be lodged where the drive motors are that are built into the actual fender/wheel area:

The founders claimed that the drive motors will be enclosed and will not be openly exposed like this beyond beta vehicle:
6ADD1C5C-B59E-4E37-8DC2-84BE349B1137.png


I thought this was a really unique feature on Apteras website, it actually lets you select a ‘Sun zone’ of where you live and then it will show you how much sun exposure your state/region predominantly has, so that helps the selection if this type of vehicle would be appropriate for the buyer:
DC249966-9117-4BBE-8955-A10D680E4FF1.png



Lastly, I watched Jay Leno‘s hands-on with the Aptera, and my thoughts of the biggest drawback/concern with this vehicle, would be with the 1.)Vibration, which is something you will notice when they’re driving the vehicle in the video, 2.) The interior noise from hearing the drive motors, which sounds like there’s not much sound dampening in such a small vehicle that is likely not very well insulated from the outside environment/exterior noise. 3.) This would probably be very jarring ride if you hit a pothole or you live in an area that has poor infrastructure with the road quality, in which in the Detroit area, this vehicle would be totally impractical and unreasonable just based off those three points alone above.

It’s a neat ride, but I feel like this is something that’s more geared towards a consistently sunny environment, to really take advantage of not having to charge, and excellent road quality to avoid the vibration and uncomfortable ride quality.

Here’s a link to a hands-on drive from Jay’s channel if you’re interested in watching it:

 
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uller6

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2010
1,074
1,793
@uller6

I researched more into the ‘Aptera’, and after further investigating it, I think this vehicle really isn’t designed for every climate, even if the manufacture makes it appear that way. This EV is totally geared towards warm climate annual environments only.
Wow! This is an awesome analysis, thank you very much for your insights! I'm hoping that they manage to deal with weatherization better in the final production models, especially since I don't have a garage :) I'll keep an eye on this closely, but it does look like my wife is right: "that's the least practical car [I've] ever seen."
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,495
Does anybody here have a pre-order in for the Ford Lightning? Or am I the only one? (Lariat Edition).

I’m hearing in Canada is escalating their orders ahead of schedule with customers receiving models 4 months ahead of schedule, which I don’t know if the U.S will also be ahead of schedule possibly.
 

pshufd

macrumors G4
Oct 24, 2013
10,155
14,579
New Hampshire
I've watched a few reviews of the Toyota EV. It's basically a RAV4 EV. I'll take a look at one the next time I'm at the dealership if they have any. The range is pretty disappointing. Toyota is going to launch a total of seven models so I'll keep an eye out for sedans.
 

44267547

Cancelled
Jul 12, 2016
37,642
42,495
I've watched a few reviews of the Toyota EV. It's basically a RAV4 EV. I'll take a look at one the next time I'm at the dealership if they have any. The range is pretty disappointing. Toyota is going to launch a total of seven models so I'll keep an eye out for sedans.
I looked into Toyotas full EV. No thanks. The styling is probably some of the worst I think right now in the market of any EV, the range is average, the standard is FWD, that lacks adequate power, the materials inside the cabin are very early year 2000 Toyota-ish .

I originally had invested into a RAV4 Prime (The MSRP inflation is totally unjustifiable with prices near/above ~$10k for a ‘mid consumer crossover), which is primarily an EV, but also can use the ICE motor as a secondary option if needed. I think they’re amazing vehicles, the reliability and power is excellent, and you can choose from two trim models with the XE or XSE for the more luxury variant. (<— Which that trim has the highest inflation.) The power/torque is exactly the same for both models, you’re really just choosing more features on the XSE.

********************

Matt Maran (One of the top YouTube auto-reviewers) does an outstanding job with reviewing Toyotas EV, which he was kinda- sorta impressed, but also not really. He reviewed the front wheel drive model.

 
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diamond.g

macrumors G4
Mar 20, 2007
11,478
2,700
OBX
I looked into Toyotas full EV. No thanks. The styling is probably some of the worst I think right now in the market of any EV, the range is average, the standard is FWD, that lacks adequate power, the materials inside the cabin are very early year 2000 Toyota-ish .

I originally had invested into a RAV4 Prime (The MSRP inflation is totally unjustifiable with prices near/above ~$10k for a ‘mid consumer crossover), which is primarily an EV, but also can use the ICE motor as a secondary option if needed. I think they’re amazing vehicles, the reliability and power is excellent, and you can choose from two trim models with the XE or XSE for the more luxury variant. (<— Which that trim has the highest inflation.) The power/torque is exactly the same for both models, you’re really just choosing more features on the XSE.

********************

Matt Maran (One of the top YouTube auto-reviewers) does an outstanding job with reviewing Toyotas EV, which he was kinda- sorta impressed, but also not really. He reviewed the front wheel drive model.

Inadequate power? It has the same base HP as the base ID.4 which no one has complained doesn't have enough power.
 

diamond.g

macrumors G4
Mar 20, 2007
11,478
2,700
OBX
We don’t all need lots of power. I grew out of needing cars with that years ago. I’m more interested in sustainability than 0-60. Most sensible people are.
I understand why (some) EVs come with big power (fights the golf cart mentality). Really having an EV having lots of power does come at a cost, but it isn't as bad as petrol vehicles.
 
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Apple fanboy

macrumors Ivy Bridge
Feb 21, 2012
57,094
56,144
Behind the Lens, UK
I understand why (some) EVs come with big power (fights the golf cart mentality). Really having an EV having lots of power does come at a cost, but it isn't as bad as petrol vehicles.
It’s not. The 0-60 in the one I have on order is quicker than anything I’ve owned before. But the fact that it’s better for the environment, uses recyclable materials and also drives and looks nice inside is a big plus for me. Certainly more important than top speed. Our limit here is 70mph. Going much faster than that will just leave you with a driving ban.
 
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SalisburySam

macrumors 6502a
May 19, 2019
928
816
Salisbury, North Carolina
Here in North Carolina, the highest speed limit is on some portions of Interstate highways, and is 70mph. Out west, there are many areas with limits of 80mph and even 85mph. You can guess the actual speeds drivers go on those highways.
 

BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
9,832
14,032
On the I-10, 15, 210, etc - if you're not doing 85+ in the left three lanes you're going to piss someone off (assuming there's no traffic). In a Tesla Model 3 I've noticed that range drops significantly above 70mph but the car does 80+ so effortlessly. I imagine if I drove quite a bit slower I'd have to charge a lot less. lol. But one advantage of the Tesla is carpool lane and sometimes you have to do 90+ just to keep up with the person in front of you (that's with CHP screaming by you as long as you're going close to the flow of traffic).

While having a fast 0-60 is nice, if I had to do it over again, I'd trade that in for range. Our M3 LR AWD had a 289 range on it when we bought it used. But it has a 3.6 0-60. As it adapted to our driving, it's now at 272 miles range.

I think you can get a M3 LR RWD with 18' tires that does 359 miles or more. 5.5? second 0-60.

My wife’s solution to this is to run the accelerator in chill mode. Slows down the car significantly.
 
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diamond.g

macrumors G4
Mar 20, 2007
11,478
2,700
OBX
On the I-10, 15, 210, etc - if you're not doing 85+ in the left three lanes you're going to piss someone off (assuming there's no traffic). In a Tesla Model 3 I've noticed that range drops significantly above 70mph but the car does 80+ so effortlessly. I imagine if I drove quite a bit slower I'd have to charge a lot less. lol. But one advantage of the Tesla is carpool lane and sometimes you have to do 90+ just to keep up with the person in front of you (that's with CHP screaming by you as long as you're going close to the flow of traffic).

While having a fast 0-60 is nice, if I had to do it over again, I'd trade that in for range. Our M3 LR AWD had a 289 range on it when we bought it. But it has a 3.6 0-60. As it adapted to our driving, it's now at 272 miles range.

I think you can get a M3 LR RWD with 18' tires that does 359 miles or more. 5.5? second 0-60.

My wife’s solution to this is to run the accelerator in chill mode. Slows down the car significantly.
Sometimes I wonder if having a two speed transmission for the higher speeds would be worth it.
 
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BigMcGuire

Cancelled
Jan 10, 2012
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14,032
Sometimes I wonder if having a two speed transmission for the higher speeds would be worth it.
I'm reading Elon Musk by Ashlee Vance and I'm about half way through it. Looks like the first Teslas had a 2 speed transmission but had a lot of problems with it. <shrug> - all I know is, for me? Going from a Civic to a used Tesla Model 3 LR AWD with acceleration boost was ... yeah. Big big difference. It's a good thing I got this when I did cuz any younger and I'd probably be getting in trouble all the time. lol. Just hoping you have that power makes driving so very different. Is it necessary? Nope. Is it awesome? Yep.
 
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