Who has or is planning to get an electric car / EV Talk

[AlaskaMoose]

If you enjoy speed, electric wind every time. That instant acceleration and torque is so much fun.

Torque is a 2-edge sword, regardless of being an EV or ICE automobile. The more torque to the wheels, the faster fuel is burned, and the faster the battery is discharged. Since you seem to enjoy F1 racing, see what both F1 and FE race cars are capable of. The reason why an FE race car cannot reach the distance of the F1 race car is because to have a much denser battery in the FE one would make the car too heavy.

The average driver drives his or her automobile relatively safe or within/close to the speed limits, which in turn saves battery power (EV) and fuel (ICE automobile). But lest say that one can design two identical cars, one electric and the other with an ICE. Both weight about the same, and are aerodynamically equal. In this case the electric one can accelerate faster, but down the line on a non-stop race, the EV will run out long before the ICE one will run out of fuel.

If you enjoy fast acceleration form an average (non-sports) automobile, then EV is the answer.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Both gasoline and lithium-ion batteries can catch afire and burn. Gasoline needs, air, and a spark or flame (high heat) to catch afire, while EV batteries can ignite by high heat. Gasoline can also damage the environment and one's health if spilled, and so the electrolytes used in batteries. in addition, both produce hazardous fumes during a fire. The fumes produced by internal combustion engines as fuel burns also harms the environment, while EV's don't emit hazardous gasses like ICE automobiles do (a plus to EV's). Drilling for oil, natural gas, the ingredients used for batteries, and so on... harm the environment and affect the health of all the people involved in the process as well as those who use these products.

The idea of using any product other than gasoline, diesel, and some other fuels to reduce the amount of emissions from automobiles is a great idea, so I have no issues with EV's regardless. I am not opposed to EV's, but at the same time I don't ignore the fact that at the present time there ins't a battery that is "green." Their lack of emissions is a good thing, but there isn't a way to avoid environmental damage from building batteries, and combatting gasoline fires is quite easy compared to fighting lithium-ion battery fires.

The emissions from the boilers and furnaces used to heat our homes and buildings in a city, all harm the environment, and so does air travel. But see, we humans enjoy living comfortably and aren't going to stop traveling in aircraft that burn fuel and emit a great deal of hazardous gases, all around the world. That fact is that while aircraft emission calculations are done at a regional or national level, the international air travel and transportation emissions aren't added to the total emissions produced.

I rarely travel by plane. In fact aside from work I think I’ve travelled by plane twice. In total no more than 12 times in my lifetime. I particularly enjoyed the reduction in air travel during the pandemic. We are a long way off commercial EV planes or other clean air travel options. But as I don’t take holidays I’m probably doing my but there.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Torque is a 2-edge sword, regardless of being an EV or ICE automobile. The more torque to the wheels, the faster fuel is burned, and the faster the battery is discharged. Since you seem to enjoy F1 racing, see what both F1 and FE race cars are capable of. The reason why an FE race car cannot reach the distance of the F1 race car is because to have a much denser battery in the FE one would make the car too heavy.

The average driver drives his or her automobile relatively safe or within/close to the speed limits, which in turn saves battery power (EV) and fuel (ICE automobile). But lest say that one can design two identical cars, one electric and the other with an ICE. Both weight about the same, and are aerodynamically equal. In this case the electric one can accelerate faster, but down the line on a non-stop race, the EV will run out long before the ICE one will run out of fuel.

If you enjoy fast acceleration form an average (non-sports) automobile, then EV is the answer.

I usually enjoy F1. But not that disaster of a race end yesterday!
I don’t often drive fast or accelerate fast as I’ve grown out of that. But I think if I’d had an EV when I was 17 I’d have ended up in a ditch!
The acceleration brings a smile to my face when you need it.
But for sure it makes a difference to your range. Of course it does in an ICE car as well. I used to average around 50 mpg in my golf. Now my miles are measured in KWH. But as I’ve said I don’t spend a lot of time looking at that. I just drive it like a normal car. I don’t have to worry about the range so it’s a non issue.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Torque is a 2-edge sword, regardless of being an EV or ICE automobile. The more torque to the wheels, the faster fuel is burned, and the faster the battery is discharged. Since you seem to enjoy F1 racing, see what both F1 and FE race cars are capable of. The reason why an FE race car cannot reach the distance of the F1 race car is because to have a much denser battery in the FE one would make the car too heavy.

The average driver drives his or her automobile relatively safe or within/close to the speed limits, which in turn saves battery power (EV) and fuel (ICE automobile). But lest say that one can design two identical cars, one electric and the other with an ICE. Both weight about the same, and are aerodynamically equal. In this case the electric one can accelerate faster, but down the line on a non-stop race, the EV will run out long before the ICE one will run out of fuel.

Sure they run out of fuel at different moments in time. No argument there with that particular scenario. Now if in the real world human beings should do endurance races without stopping. They need to go to the bathroom, have a drink, stretch their legs etc. As I say; in my experience my bladder needs to stop before the EV. Typically a s small break every 2 hours or 200miles. During that short stop whilst I go to the WC, get a drink etc the car chargers up again with plenty of fuel for the next stop.

it is a theoretical issue by those without real experience, not an actual issue.

If you enjoy fast acceleration form an average (non-sports) automobile, then EV is the answer.

Oh please, what a lot of stereotypical nonsense. Why are you even hanging out in this thread unless to just share fake news?

 

[Septembersrain]

Okay so you can carry extra gas. What do you carry if you run out of electricity? Better yet, people with *very* old cars could still be driving after an EMP. Cash for clunkers got many chips.

Nobody wants to think of pre electricity days but....

 

[Apple fanboy]

Okay so you can carry extra gas. What do you carry if you run out of electricity? Better yet, people with *very* old cars could still be driving after an EMP. Cash for clunkers got many chips.

Nobody wants to think of pre electricity days but....

I’ve never had to carry extra petrol.
Same for electricity.
Non EV owners think about that all the time.
Actual EV owners just drive. The time I save every month by not having to go to the petrol station (as well as the money!) is great. My car just charges whilst I’m working. For most it charges whilst they are sleeping.
It’s great.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Sure they run out of fuel at different moments in time. No argument there with that particular scenario. Now if in the real world human beings should do endurance races without stopping. They need to go to the bathroom, have a drink, stretch their legs etc. As I say; in my experience my bladder needs to stop before the EV. Typically a s small break every 2 hours or 200miles. During that short stop whilst I go to the WC, get a drink etc the car chargers up again with plenty of fuel for the next stop.

it is a theoretical issue by those without real experience, not an actual issue.

Oh please, what a lot of stereotypical nonsense. Why are you even hanging out in this thread unless to just share fake news?

I’m afraid the older I get, the more comfort breaks I need!

 

[Septembersrain]

I’ve never had to carry extra petrol.
Same for electricity.
Non EV owners think about that all the time.
Actual EV owners just drive. The time I save every month by not having to go to the petrol station (as well as the money!) is great. My car just charges whilst I’m working. For most it charges whilst they are sleeping.
It’s great.

I have seen multiple towed.

My husband I think made a few calls himself. My point was it's easier to get a person a gas can. Poor people might need transportation and electricity run vehicles with blackouts is a bloodbath waiting. Sri Lanka.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I have seen multiple towed.

My husband I think made a few calls himself. My point was it's easier to get a person a gas can. Poor people might need transportation and electricity run vehicles with blackouts is a bloodbath waiting. Sri Lanka.

Strange. In the UK it’s very rare to see them towed. Almost never according to the AA and RAC (two biggest breakdown companies in the Uk). I guess I’m the US they must not understand how they work. You’d have to be quite stupid to run out of petrol or electric.
I’m not in Sri Lanka. But if we want to help all the people of the planet out we need to ditch fossil fuels. Especially for personal transportation.

 

[diamond.g]

I have seen multiple towed.

My husband I think made a few calls himself. My point was it's easier to get a person a gas can. Poor people might need transportation and electricity run vehicles with blackouts is a bloodbath waiting. Sri Lanka.

If folks are not using the sat nav so the EV can precisely tell them how much energy they have at a given point and if they will have enough to make it to their destination, I can see people running out prematurely. Especially if you are going over 55-60 mph for a long distance.

 

[Apple fanboy]

If folks are not using the sat nav so the EV can precisely tell them how much energy they have at a given point and if they will have enough to make it to their destination, I can see people running out prematurely. Especially if you are going over 55-60 mph for a long distance.

To be honest the way to drive an EV on a long journey is to calculate where you are going to stop. Have a plan A a plan B etc. there are so many apps that make this so easy for you. You just plan your stops with some reserve for your plan b etc. it’s so simple. The car will tell you when it’s running into a problem. It would be like driving around with the fuel light on in an ICE and doing nothing about it.
It’s really not rocket science.

 

[diamond.g]

To be honest the way to drive an EV on a long journey is to calculate where you are going to stop. Have a plan A a plan B etc. there are so many apps that make this so easy for you. You just plan your stops with some reserve for your plan b etc. it’s so simple. The car will tell you when it’s running into a problem. It would be like driving around with the fuel light on in an ICE and doing nothing about it.
It’s really not rocket science.

Yeah, to be fair, the US EPA fuel economy tests are not great for EV's. Really they should just switch to a pure 90 mph cold weather (0 C/ 32 F) highway test. Because no one seems to care about the distance you can travel doing city stuff (which is going to be greater then the highway anyways).

100% of the time when someone asks how far you can go on a single charge they mean how far on the highway doing 90 mph in the brutal cold (or towing) can you go, lol.

 

[quagmire]

Honestly I have no issues in helping out people informing them about EV’s, if it’s genuine. EV’s are not practical for everyone today.

You lose me when there is an agenda behind it, especially if it is political. Or just come in with what if scenarios that come off as agenda/fear driven based vs genuine questions.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Honestly I have no issues in helping out people informing them about EV’s, if it’s genuine. EV’s are not practical for everyone today.

You lose me when there is an agenda behind it, especially if it is political. Or just come in with what if scenarios that come off as agenda/fear driven based vs genuine questions.

Absolutely. The first thing people talk about are all the edge cases. But if we bought ICE cars in the same way, then nobody would ever buy anything!
They are not perfect. They do not suit everyone. They can’t be used for all scenarios. They aren’t cheap.

But there are plenty of people who just won’t switch because of an impossible set of (unrealistic) circumstances they dream up. Let’s put it this way. How many EV owners do you know who took it back and bought an ICE car? Less than 1% I’m sure. I’ve never met one. Yet all the ICE owners tell you they don’t work.

 

[MattG]

Not yet, will wait until the next time we move (in the next 2-3 years), plus by then there will likely be at least one generation newer. All I know is it will be something other than a Tesla; probably a VW or Toyota.

 

[cardfan]

Too rural here. It’s not even a possibility yet. To be honest I don’t see me ever buying one.

 

[cyb3rdud3]

Yeah, to be fair, the US EPA fuel economy tests are not great for EV's. Really they should just switch to a pure 90 mph cold weather (0 C/ 32 F) highway test. Because no one seems to care about the distance you can travel doing city stuff (which is going to be greater then the highway anyways).

100% of the time when someone asks how far you can go on a single charge they mean how far on the highway doing 90 mph in the brutal cold (or towing) can you go, lol.

The EPA test and the European different one are just for comparison between vehicles. They do not replace your own driving conditions.

In my personal experience keeping a steady speed has much more impact on range than the speed itself. I’ve done some very high speed runs in Germany with no material impact.

 

[Apple fanboy]

My EV will perform best below 60 mph. But accelerating slowly and using the regenerative braking help the most.
But I don’t really worry about it. I just drive sensibly anyway these days. It’s been years since I was a boy racer!

 

[BigMcGuire]

My EV will perform best below 60 mph. But accelerating slowly and using the regenerative braking help the most.
But I don’t really worry about it. I just drive sensibly anyway these days. It’s been years since I was a boy racer!

Yes. Those of us who have to drive in Southern CA early in the morning know that the I-10 and the I-15 - you have to be doing 90+ in the left lanes or you're going to get shot (ok maybe not that bad, but ...).

I noticed the range on our M3 dropped 10-15 miles as it adapted to our driving style. I initially thought it was battery degradation but it has stayed this way for 6 months now.

Driving 60 mph - we will add miles to the range counter. I once did a test and (safely) drove 50-60mph behind a semi just for fun and did not see the range counter drop for almost 15 miles.

When my wife and I drive in stop and go traffic, we see the range counter divided by half. So a 50 mile trip may only use 30-40 miles on the range.


Like your previous posts, I'm now and old man (36 (soon to be 37)). I find more enjoyment watching my EV use 10% of its acceleration capacity to keep up with traffic (my EV can do 0-60 in 3.6 seconds). I love watching that regen go green as I go down hills and come up to stoplights. I really have no desire to "race" just for the fact that it takes us 1 hour to charge 5 miles (15amp 110v). lol.

 

[quagmire]

I noticed the range on our M3 dropped 10-15 miles as it adapted to our driving style. I initially thought it was battery degradation but it has stayed this way for 6 months now.

The estimated range does not account for driving style. It's simply how much power is available divided by the EPA rated consumption. So it losing 10-15 miles is either degradation or the BMS losing calibration over time.

 

[diamond.g]

The estimated range does not account for driving style. It's simply how much power is available divided by the EPA rated consumption. So it losing 10-15 miles is either degradation or the BMS losing calibration over time.

What he said... (at least for Tesla's) the trip meter on the other hand will (sorta) account for your driving style (per trip).

 

[BigMcGuire]

The estimated range does not account for driving style. It's simply how much power is available divided by the EPA rated consumption. So it losing 10-15 miles is either degradation or the BMS losing calibration over time.

There is a lot of opinion out there so I appreciate your info. I have mostly stayed away from the Tesla forums as I don't have the energy to interact with them LOL.

I've got a 2018 Tesla Model 3 LR AWD.

When we first got the car it was 289 I think. It dropped to 278 pretty quickly after we got it, and a month later settled into about 274-276. Been that way since late March. Obviously Tesla now makes it difficult to see your max charge, without actually max charging (which we almost never do). .

 

[diamond.g]

The EPA test and the European different one are just for comparison between vehicles. They do not replace your own driving conditions.

In my personal experience keeping a steady speed has much more impact on range than the speed itself. I’ve done some very high speed runs in Germany with no material impact.

They don't, but they can give an approximation. Just like how folks are told if it is cold (and you do not have a heat pump heater) you will lose 40% of your range in the winter. Or 50% if towing (or more if cold). That ends up surprising folk.

Now not every EV has this issue though, so as usual YM(K)MV.

 

[BigMcGuire]

What he said... (at least for Tesla's) the trip meter on the other hand will (sorta) account for your driving style (per trip).

Yeah we've noticed the pull down trip usage estimator is REALLY accurate these days. I used to be able to beat the % it thought I'd get home with, now it's spot on every single time. So much fun.

 

[BigMcGuire]

Okay so you can carry extra gas. What do you carry if you run out of electricity? Better yet, people with *very* old cars could still be driving after an EMP. Cash for clunkers got many chips.

Nobody wants to think of pre electricity days but....

When I first got my EV I was EXTREMELY nervous about running out of battery. My wife can attest to this. I freaked out and made sure to charge way before we even had 100 miles left. lol. Soon, though, I adapted and lost all worry - at least with my EV, it would calculate when and where I needed to charge and would very clearly warn me if I was trying to go somewhere that would result in any hint of running out of power. This really helped my range anxiety. Also, I learned that driving speed limit or slower resulted in some noticeable range extensions, lol.

I always wondered about EMPs. My life is so reliant on computers - I'd be ruined if an EMP went off from that fact alone. lol. Reminds me of War of the Worlds - It's the solenoid! Haha. (I know just enough about cars to change my own oil, that's it).