Windows 11

[grmlin]

Fantastic, as I had no choice I installed it (after a backup) and of course it failed after doing it's thing for two hours or something. LOL

I hate this, I'm probably stuck now with an update blocking every other update eventually releasing. Guess I'll deal with the annoying as f windows update messages until that's fixed Will do some of the mentioned fixes related to the error but the last time I encountered something like that, I reinstalled Windows.

 

[grmlin]

so, I installed it and yeah, it's the same thing as before that looks a bit different.

The widgets thing though, lmao. That feels absolutely terrible. Not smooth, reloads all the time, clearly not finished.

 

[nickdalzell1]

I've been running the Insider build on my HP laptop (AMD Ryzen 5, Radeon Vega graphics, 8GB RAM, 250GB SSD) for a while now and It's actually more responsive and faster than it was on Windows 10. Scrolling is especially a lot smoother now.

On my gaming rig, everything performs much better especially games. I no longer feel like I have to overclock my CPU or GPU as much as before, either.

The UI has gotten some minor revisions through updates, and a few bugs (although most are resolved, currently there's a volume bug where the system tray icon shows it muted or low when it's not) but overall I'm quite happy with it. The Your Phone app finally works now, and doesn't feel like a half-made attempt at Continuity/handoff (Although it probably has more to do with my S20 FE being more supported than my Galaxy S5!)

EDIT: there's a new 'chat' app that got installed via last update, that looks an awful lot like the macOS Facetime app at least in its icon design. Never used it, or know if it's worth using, since all my messaging needs are satisfied via SMS for years.

 

[grmlin]

Used it some more, it's even worse than I thought. New annoyances because of the UI changes, even more inconsistencies now and all the old stuff is still there unchanged like nothing happened in the last 20 years.
Also tried the new touch interface/gestures because someone on this board said it can replace an iPad now. lmao, it's such an inferior experience.

 

[grmlin]

I don't know what it is with Microsoft and it's qa, but this is kinda hilarious tbh. I know it's a beta, but they should have noticed during development that there simply isn't enough room for buttons like this inside the notification popups?

 

[maflynn]

I know it's a beta, but they should have noticed during development that there simply isn't enough room for buttons like this inside the notification popups?

It is a beta and we do need to keep that in mind and also the fact that the language is non-English. I'll try to look at the various pop-ups on my installation later today but if I was a betting man, I'd say its not going to be an issue.

 

[maflynn]

I've already gotten used to the new way which is more organized since everything is under one place so maybe easier for new users to Windows.

I'm getting there, I seem to be developing a love/hate relationship with the start menu. I do love the way it looks, and how it works, for the first panel, but anything not on the first panel is a bit more of an annoyance.

 

[nickdalzell1]

Personally I like that they kept the 'old stuff'. Maybe I'm just old fashioned but there is such a thing as 'change for the sake of change' which is ALWAYS a bad idea. If it ain't broke and all that.

Can't say the same for OS X Yosemite or even Big Sur. Too much change, removing 32 bit support, etc. No thanks. I'm not as adverse to updates with Microsoft (yet) like I've been with Apple (and Android) for years.

I have always hated the start menu, ever since Windows 95. I always preferred the Program Manager since everything was a click away. I actually had hopes Windows 8 would be the modern take on it, but alas. So I still pin all my common apps to the taskbar (unlike my boss who still has the work PC littered with hundreds of icons across two monitors, I always hate having to use that PC)

The search icon is a nice alternative to using it, too. I'll never understand everyone's marriage to the start menu today. For years everyone HATED it.

 

[pshufd]

Windows 11 sounds nice for the GUI changes. I'm not thinking about upgrading any time soon though. This is one where I'll wait for the release version. I would throw it on my old system but my old system isn't supported (at least not that I'm aware of).

 

[nickdalzell1]

There's always a way to override it. Windows ME for better or worse could be installed on 'unsupported' hardware via a simple MS-DOS command.

 

[grmlin]

I'm getting there, I seem to be developing a love/hate relationship with the start menu. I do love the way it looks, and how it works, for the first panel, but anything not on the first panel is a bit more of an annoyance.

Still weird, there is just so little space for three buttons side by side

Another question: why do most open windows not show the new tiling manager when hovering the maximize button? I thought that’s a system wide feature?

 

[robotica]

There's always a way to override it. Windows ME for better or worse could be installed on 'unsupported' hardware via a simple MS-DOS command.

They could freeze you out of updates tho, I hope there is a path but not if it means crippling security for everyone else.

 

[nickdalzell1]

Personally, I'd be happy to be frozen out of updates. I don't care for them. Tends to break stuff, render systems unbootable, or change what should be left well enough alone. I'd be happy if it were just for security and changed nothing otherwise.

But then I run antivirus software that makes up for any lack of 'updates' and aren't stupid and certainly don't lust for porn or pirated software, either.

As for the new tiling manager not appearing on all apps, I can only suspect it's because certain apps don't yet support it, much like certain Android apps can't be shown in split-screen unless you override it in dev options.

 

[grmlin]

So, one huge bummer is the new window tiling feature of Windows 11. Looks like most 3rd party apps don't use the native window controls and the tiling isn't available for them. That makes this feature absolutely useless, unless Microsoft still releases a version that applies the tiling menu to ALL window menus.
But I doubt it, it's most likely the applications that use some custom window frame/actions.

I really hope Microsoft can force apply this feature to all applications, it's doa otherwise

 

[nickdalzell1]

I'd rather they leave it alone. I can't think of one reason why tiling or snapping would be useful, I'm just so used to having them all overlap or using maximize, minimize and so on. Works fine.

Multiple desktops also exist and are more useful than forcing every app to tile or snap as if it were on a tablet or mobile phone.

 

[pshufd]

I'd rather they leave it alone. I can't think of one reason why tiling or snapping would be useful, I'm just so used to having them all overlap or using maximize, minimize and so on. Works fine.

Multiple desktops also exist and are more useful than forcing every app to tile or snap as if it were on a tablet or mobile phone.

Windows 10 virtual desktops are awful if you have multiple monitors. Apple's implementation is just unbelievably superior. And it's been around for well over a decade. Unfortunately Microsoft bundling in virtual desktops has killed the third-party virtual desktop software developers so there aren't a lot of good options there.

Virtual Desktop is one of the big reasons why I prefer macOS.

 

[nickdalzell1]

As for multiple monitors, what a mess! I am so used to having one large screen myself, and the work PC has two--both desktops littered with hundreds of icons (because boss hates start menu and doesn't know what 'pinning to taskbar' means) and the way the mouse constantly and unintuitively shifts between them I agree it sucks.

But virtual desktops allow one monitor to keep your work apps separate from your internet apps and from your other misc apps, sure. works great since you're not confined to one screen size worth of space for them all

Only thing snapping makes sense for is CCTV monitoring and mobile devices. But of course I'm old fashioned. I'd really love for Windows 3.1's program manager to return and ditch the annoying start menu entirely. In fact, having the program manager would make more sense re: snapping/tiling since that's how it organized all its program groups. Everything a click away. No more nested menus.

 

[grmlin]

Snapping is essential for me if you use an ultra wide for example. I use fancy zones from MS to do that. And I’ll keep doing so if MS doesn’t fix this new feature

 

[grmlin]

One more thing that shows just how little MS changed under the hood. It is Windows 10 with a different style, nothing else. Two examples.

First, I still have the problem that after sleep the ui scaling glitches out and my full screen windows are not full screen anymore but smaller. I have to set the scaling back and forth to fix it globally or resize all windows separately.

Also, a bug that hunts me for so many years now, it is hard to believe. I'm using German as the systems language. I only use US keyboards though, as I can't stand any other layout for programming. So I changed the keyboard layout and use ONLY THAT. (US International Alternate).

But still, after all these years living with that bug, I still see 3 keyboard layouts that also change randomly by itself!!! in the language menu.

I don't know, I'm sorry if I'm annoying, but I lost all hope in this software really. Microsoft still is in full denial mode, they don't fix their stuff, they just add new things on top of the mess below. I have many problems with MacOS, that's why I'm using a Windows machine right now lol. But this is just on another level.

 

[mi7chy]

Good sign if true that Windows 11 runs better on older devices like the 2008 Thinkpad x200 since it'll extend the life for several more years. Have the same laptop that'll be one of the first to upgrade.

Update: Went through with installing build 22000.100 then updated to .120 on the 2008 Thinkpad x200. Supposedly RTM is in October so current builds are near final and hopefully the workaround still works. Usable but not as lightweight as Linux.

 

[grmlin]

Good sign if true that Windows 11 runs better on older devices like the 2008 Thinkpad x200 since it'll extend the life for several more years. Have the same laptop that'll be one of the first to upgrade.

These old machines are supported or is there a of community patch or something that removes the hardware requirements

 

[minik]

I just received the ThinkPad X1 Nano yesterday, tempted to install the current Windows 11 preview.

 

[nickdalzell1]

Michael MJD installed the leaked build on some old Core2Duo laptop by hacking the installer files in some sort of editor. It performed horribly until all he did was put an SSD in there. Night and day difference.

 

[MiniApple]

If you were an Windows Insider when they announced Win11 you can install the Preview on non supported hardware (example on a device with an unsupported Intel processor) with the caveat to have to revert back to Win 10 (full fresh install) once Win11 comes out officially later this fall (likely in October).
That's the official line.

Lots of discussion, but nothing specific as of yet, if Microsoft will actually enforce the hardware limitations actively or if they allow you to install Win11 manually on an unsupported device anyway If you click away a performance warning banner etc.

I've started to look into Linux just in case, as I won't revert back to Win10.

ChromeOS is out for me because of Google, don't like MacOS (look, feel, use) despite the awesome M1 Mini, while Windows disappoints yet again (They cancelled the modern, legacy free, safer, lightweight 10X)

IF iPadOS would have just some very basic screen resolution support (less black bars) when connected to a monitor, that would suffice for me too.

 

[nickdalzell1]

I'd love to move to Linux (most of my gaming needs are satisfied there on one of my gaming PCs) but I'm struggling to find a skeuomorphic distro out there that doesn't involve tons of compiling source code or command line hacks. Just want a skeuomorphic one out the box, apps and all. That's not a lot to ask. Certainly one exists?

PearOS used to exist but it got replaced by Elementary OS which is too flat nowawdays. I did one time have a more recent Ubuntu build doing a great impression of OS X Mountain Lion at least in the icons, toolbars, browser UI and traffic light area, along with dock, but no apps with the skeuo. No notes, music, etc. Most themes only go skin deep. Even that attempt took hours.